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Diabl0658 posted:Dont take blood on a pretender for a blood nation, its a waste of points unless you want a blood bless. Try a regular lich with astral and death magic. Except it's Ulm and you don't have blood+death on anything else.
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Apr 25, 2015 04:03
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Blood is cheap to empower into though, 50 slaves isnt much compared to 50 gems
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Apr 25, 2015 04:07
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Ulm HAS to take blood on a pretender. Also as Ulm you're totally happy to patrol your cap if that starts your vamp engine early. GET THAT ENGINE ONLINE Seriously there is no good reason to not take blood on your god, you have Black Priests to make your armies invincible in the early midgame and you want to be rolling in vampires and thralls ASAP otherwise. Source: I have won every game I've played as LA Ulm I Love You! fucked around with this message at 04:19 on Apr 25, 2015 |
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Apr 25, 2015 04:09
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Diabl0658 posted:Blood is cheap to empower into though, 50 slaves isnt much compared to 50 gems For the price it costs to empower enough to summon vamps you could have 2 vamps.
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Apr 25, 2015 04:09
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Oh yeah i keep forgetting they have vampires at blood 0. Please listen to people that are not me.
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Apr 25, 2015 04:23
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Diabl0658 posted:Blood is cheap to empower into though, 50 slaves isnt much compared to 50 gems Cheap or not, it's still a significant delay on mass vampire summons.
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Apr 25, 2015 05:56
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The great wall of Lemur is complete! None shall pass! (if only I could build underwater forts)
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Apr 25, 2015 11:05
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Get a nature mage, theres a nature spell that grows a kelp fort in an underwater province.
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Apr 25, 2015 11:21
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My big fight (EA, Agharta vs Mictlan) finally happened... and he won.  He had lots of buffed Jaguars, as I already knew.     My blade winds did decent damage but weren't enough to stop him, and my great Olms even divided in four groups usually attacked the same targets (his group of foul spawns and after his MR16 Ozelots mosly). I had a pair of spell scripting mistakes (typical) and in the previous turn I forgot to change the use of gems so I blew off the few gems I had which I had planned to use in this battle against a smaller enemy. The worst wasn't losing my summons and melee troops, I can recover from that (and I killed 140 jaguars, which is also a noticeable loss for him). The worst was seeing my big group of Olms attacking once their 10 shots were spent. All my frontline was erased, but even then the rout didn't trigger so they went forward, and died. 110 of them. Against a stronger and more numerous enemy. :S  Which thinking about it, it was my mistake of recruiting so many, I should have done 30% less Olms and 30% more melee troops, precisely because they were so many the general retreat didn't trigger. It was a long fight, he casted Rain in turn 3 and the rain stopped before the fight ended. Still, now I have Maws of the Earth, and I didn't lose mages. Maybe I can still recover from the loss with that...
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Apr 25, 2015 13:21
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Chairman Pow! posted:I will be the pretender. Pool of blood looks tempting, but I have always heard you shouldn't blood hunt in your capital. It looks like I want a rainbow mage to get blood/death/astral plus some growth scales to support my blood economy Other people have given good advice but just a heads up disciples game are big on early aggression. Yes you want BD to get the vampire engine started asap but you should probably get those paths on a combat chasis and leave the dormant immobile scales build to a nation on your team who needs the least help protecting themselves from invasion. You also want to be planning ahead of time what globals your team will contest, and probably set yourself up to cast them since your rp on LA Ulm will be insane as the game proceeds. You can get a D3B3W7 dog of the underworld, which would be my choice for vampires + casting VW with your insane rp. Cast VW early enough and convince everyone to leave LA Ulm alone = you win. That's just one example, but I'd pair that kind of strategy with LA Atlantis instead of midgard so you know you'll have the W income to overcast it heavily. Anyways the easiest way to lose as Ulm is to go greedy for endgame and not have a plan to deal with, like, dual bless Mictlan Atlantis team rushing you after year 1.
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Apr 25, 2015 14:19
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Holy crap you guys, thank you so much for all the awesome advice! I will definitely go disciple and let Midgard go for an asleep with good scales for us.
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Apr 25, 2015 15:16
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Boing posted:The great wall of Lemur is complete! Gee, if only someone else had noticed that you had about 1000 forts going up and helped attacked you while you were still weak. That would have been great. 
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Apr 25, 2015 15:52
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Slaan posted:Gee, if only someone else had noticed that you had about 1000 forts going up and helped attacked you while you were still weak. That would have been great. Good news, forts don't really make lemurs that much stronger anyway.
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Apr 25, 2015 16:28
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 RIP Snakes
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Apr 25, 2015 18:31
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Boing posted:The great wall of Lemur is complete! While I disapprove of your choice of nations, I do approve of fortspam. 
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Apr 25, 2015 18:40
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Kitfox88 posted:I do approve of fortspam. Same.
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Apr 25, 2015 19:03
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Slaan posted:Gee, if only someone else had noticed that you had about 1000 forts going up and helped attacked you while you were still weak. That would have been great. Yeah i mean the counter to this is still "temple your provinces" im not really sure why anyone cares about Lemurs building forts
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Apr 25, 2015 19:06
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Was the f9s9 jaguar bless tailored toward killing me, Lemuria, specifically?
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Apr 25, 2015 19:34
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No. I went F9 for the bless and S9 for wishes if I survived to late game. I went after you because gently caress Lemuria/Ermor.I Love You! posted:Yeah i mean the counter to this is still "temple your provinces" im not really sure why anyone cares about Lemurs building forts Taking Lemuria's provinces are a pain in the rear end without forts. There are no supplies there and no rewards for doing it. With a fort on it, it makes taking it even worse because you have to stick an army to knock down the door. And because of the free pop spawn, there are almost certainly troops inside the fort, so you can't just leave a small force of militias sitting there as they will get wrecked. Taking Lemuria on in a war goes from lovely to really, really lovely. VVV That. Slaan fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Apr 25, 2015 |
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Apr 25, 2015 20:02
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Having actually played a game against fort-spam Lemuria to completion it sounds like you all are seriously under-estimating how much breaking through freespawn fortspam is going to suck. Unless he can be ignored and the necessary thrones claimed elsewhere. Fortspam with domkill nations isn't a strategy for breaking your opponents' armies. It breaks their will to continue playing the game. Which is really what playing Lemuria/Ermor is all about
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Apr 25, 2015 20:16
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Slaan posted:Gee, if only someone else had noticed that you had about 1000 forts going up and helped attacked you while you were still weak. That would have been great. All of the forts in the world won't help him attack his neighbors effectively though. He will have a really lovely line of stuff that separates the map and only a madman would try to go through it.
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Apr 25, 2015 23:14
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Nuclearmonkee posted:All of the forts in the world won't help him attack his neighbors effectively though.
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Apr 25, 2015 23:20
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It's not good though.
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Apr 25, 2015 23:30
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It isn't. I'd rate it as "bad".
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Apr 25, 2015 23:53
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jBrereton posted:Yeah other than all that freespawn and stuff. Sloppy Milkshake posted:It's not good though. Wrap it up domkillailures
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Apr 25, 2015 23:53
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Ghosts don't have a siege penalty which makes it really irritating to breach unless you're playing as LA Agartha with tons of sappers or have a gigantic doomball of demons.
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Apr 26, 2015 00:04
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They can also summon poo poo-loads of Good luck! edit: I think shadows have poo poo strength, so they're not very good at rebuilding walls. tooterfish fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Apr 26, 2015 |
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Apr 26, 2015 00:12
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Don't attack lemur land then jesus christ this isn't even hard, don't attack them. Just dompush. Who cares if their forts are hard to take DONT ATTACK THEM. They are bad and once you have research their thugs are useless just loving stand there until they go away
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Apr 26, 2015 00:49
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Getting them to leave is the hard part and Lemur's dominion tends to be to high compared to other nations. Especially if they own a few thrones.
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Apr 26, 2015 02:39
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amuayse posted:Getting them to leave is the hard part and Lemur's dominion tends to be to high compared to other nations. Especially if they own a few thrones. You don't want them to leave. Why would you want them to leave? That doesn't even make sense. I'm not sure what people aren't getting. Lemur has no blood sac in LA, an age of massive blood. They can be surrounded with temples and priests and their dom won't spread. Lemur does NOT have a particularly great domscore typically because they have to take a bless/awake god to do anything, and having a high score does shitall anyway unless you are stubbornly refusing to build temples and priests, in which case it's 100% your fault for getting run over. A few mages with anti-undead spells and they can't even expand through brute force. Every player just keeps temples up on their border and waits for them to die, JUST LIKE WITH A WATER NATION. If you have somehow let them balloon out of control that is entirely due to really bad play decisions on top of enormous mistakes. Lemur are hands-down one of the weakest nations, if not the weakest, in the game and have massive exploitable handicaps but if you absolutely refuse to build temples around them and leave them alone you can certainly lose through sheer force of will. I Love You! fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Apr 26, 2015 |
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Apr 26, 2015 03:05
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They can't preach with undeads either so unless they get a high priest, the best they can do is make h1 priests for 60g and try to preach with those. It is a nation that will unironically spam telestic animates someplace to try and avoid losing their dominion on a thing.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:17
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It's because you want their thrones and it's not easy preaching through their temples and forts since they have literally nothing else to spend money on.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:17
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amuayse posted:It's because you want their thrones and it's not easy preaching through their temples and forts since they have literally nothing else to spend money on. Yes it is because preach is focused and temples are not. With a decent number of h2s you can preach a province from black candle dom10 to your dom in a couple turns.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:18
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amuayse posted:It's because you want their thrones and it's not easy preaching through their temples and forts since they have literally nothing else to spend money on. Maybe don't let them grab enough thrones early on to make a difference? Also preaching is much stronger than temples as is blood sac so no theres no way they have enough temple checks to press their dom if you are paying attention past the very early game. And they can't even preach so they're hella hosed. Like I count 23 temples in that map posted, that is loving kid's stuff and there's no way you can't outpreach/temple/blood sac that poo poo especially considering they are surrounded on all sides by people. If Lemuria (who has an almost nonexistent income) can build 20 forts you definitely can have build up a good body of temples by that point. I mean it's possible it's too late to do poo poo about it so unless some blood nation rises up and takes over maybe you should just bow down to ghostly leaders. I Love You! fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Apr 26, 2015 |
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Apr 26, 2015 03:20
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what is blood sac I get that it has something to do with blood magic but
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Apr 26, 2015 03:26
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I Love You! posted:Maybe don't let them grab enough thrones early on to make a difference? People don't want to fight lemuria early game because its a losing strategy. You lose troops which cost gold and lemuria lost nothing. Thus, they don't stop Lemuria from expanding and Lemuria is able to grab a few thrones. Then, nobody wants to attack Lemuria because all the population is dead, there are forts everywhere and there are other enemies to deal with; Lemuria is free to pick off provinces from guys engaged in combat with others. Suddenly, Lemuria controls 1/5 thrones and needs to be dealth with, but is, again, really annoying to fight against. So the remaining one or two powers launch an assault on Lemuria. But as Lemuria has freespawn and forts, horrors don't do poo poo, thugs/SC taken provinces can be taken back quickly, and the billion ghosts in their castles mean you need to keep an army around to actually beat down the gate. An army which is now unable to guard your borders against the ghosts attacking broadly across your entire front, and which costs gems to upkeep via food items and battle magic to deal with all the ghosts. Eventually the player gives up unless they do really well, because attacking Lemuria is terrible at all levels of the game. It has the same problem as the water nations- fighting it is a long, annoying slog that benefits absolutely nobody and which can be recovered from easily. Lemuria is weak on paper, but quite strong in the metagame because of normal player psychology. They don't win games, they just outlast them.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:29
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Goons are amazing at being distracted by Lemuria while someone else wins the game.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:31
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I did win a game as Atlantis where I won by doing literally nothing but cap the thrones from AI players while all the other major powers tried to fight Lemuria due to an early Burden of Time. I didn't fight Lemuria at all and I was glad for that.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:34
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Slaan posted:People don't want to fight lemuria early game because its a losing strategy. You lose troops which cost gold and lemuria lost nothing. Thus, they don't stop Lemuria from expanding and Lemuria is able to grab a few thrones. Then, nobody wants to attack Lemuria because all the population is dead, there are forts everywhere and there are other enemies to deal with; Lemuria is free to pick off provinces from guys engaged in combat with others. Suddenly, Lemuria controls 1/5 thrones and needs to be dealth with, but is, again, really annoying to fight against. So the remaining one or two powers launch an assault on Lemuria. But as Lemuria has freespawn and forts, horrors don't do poo poo, thugs/SC taken provinces can be taken back quickly, and the billion ghosts in their castles mean you need to keep an army around to actually beat down the gate. An army which is now unable to guard your borders against the ghosts attacking broadly across your entire front, and which costs gems to upkeep via food items and battle magic to deal with all the ghosts. I guess maybe this is what happens when all of the people playing are really, really bad at decision-making
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Apr 26, 2015 03:40
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Babe Magnet posted:what is blood sac Priests of certain nations, notably EA Pangaea, EA LA Mictlan, at least one of the EA heims, and hilariously, Marverni, can sacrifice up to their holy level in blood slaves to in temples to produce an additional temple check per sacrifice, spreading your dominion. It's a must for Mictlan, as this is their only way to spread dom, and a massive boon for EA Pangaea, since between cheap temples and that ability, you can get ridiculous domspread going.
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Apr 26, 2015 03:42
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