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blackguy32 posted:Actually, I think the worst thing the protesters have on the cops is that they killed a man by severing his spine yet they don't know or wont tell anyone what happened. That's probably not even remotely the worst thing just the most recent awful thing.
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Apr 29, 2015 10:44
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There's all those Baltimore Sun stories about people who were beaten and abused so egregiously that judges were ordering the city to make payouts compensating them, meanwhile the violent cops went unpunished.
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Apr 29, 2015 10:47
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 Pastor looking at his senior home destroyed by the riots.
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Apr 29, 2015 11:39
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Of course, that pastor talks about poverty and inequality for years and no one gives a proper gently caress, but now here come the crocodile tears from those who love any reason to cheer on state-backed violence against these neighborhoodsDonte Hickman posted:HICKMAN: I've seen this all my life. I'm born and raised in Edmondson Village to a single parent at home. I was in the drug-infested communities, I felt the pain. I saw it from the other side. And I don't cast judgment, I don't cast blame. I knew what it was like to have to overcome, myself.
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Apr 29, 2015 12:47
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Yeah, 100% agree with him. It's unfortunate to see hooligans making light of Gray and other blacks like him to loot and destroy minority owned businesses and homes.
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Apr 29, 2015 12:51
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Lemming posted:If you aren't healthy enough to survive a nickel ride from the cops, really how can you say it's even their fault? Yeah, I'm kindof amazed that people are even trying this excuse. If nothing else, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggshell_skull
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Apr 29, 2015 12:56
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shrike82 posted:Yeah, 100% agree with him. It's unfortunate to see hooligans making light of Gray and other blacks like him to loot and destroy minority owned businesses and homes. That's not what he said though, and you'd have to be some sort of dumbass or just a virulent racist to think it was. Oh.
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Apr 29, 2015 13:08
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shrike82 posted:Yeah, 100% agree with him. It's unfortunate to see hooligans making light of Gray and other blacks like him to loot and destroy minority owned businesses and homes. right. even if that was in any way pertinent to the dude's message this would still be an idiotic thing to say. of course, it's not, so it's both idiotic and malicious.
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Apr 29, 2015 13:12
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MLK and the civil rights movement of his time being used by the current modern day versions of the racist people they were marching against to disparage minorities today is absolutely disgusting.
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Apr 29, 2015 13:14
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VitalSigns posted:Of course, that pastor talks about poverty and inequality for years and no one gives a proper gently caress, but now here come the crocodile tears from those who love any reason to cheer on state-backed violence against these neighborhoods WhiskeyJuvenile posted:
The fun thing about google street view is that you can look at all the pictures that they took that show the area in question. These buildings have been boarded up since at least their earliest photo, back in 2007. Imagine 8+ years of "the city doesn't give a gently caress about my neighborhood enough to get rid of abandoned, vacant property".
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Apr 29, 2015 13:42
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My parents live in a recently renovated row home in Baltimore that had been boarded up for 29 years. You can drive a few blocks out of downtown and go from a nice neighborhood to an area straight out of the wire just turning a corner. Despite the reality of long term decay it's a great city and a fun place to visit or live.
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Apr 29, 2015 13:53
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*if white
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Apr 29, 2015 14:02
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:Imagine 8+ years of "the city doesn't give a gently caress about my neighborhood enough to get rid of abandoned, vacant property". You don't need to get rid of those brownstones. They're perfectly structurally okay, they just need some renovation and they'd be great for someone to live in. 
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Apr 29, 2015 14:55
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Check out this 538 post. It discusses data from the EEOC and Census which indicates "In about two-thirds of the U.S. cities with the largest police forces, the majority of police officers commute to work from another town." This trend is less common among minority officers, who more often live in the areas they police. I do think this has a lot of explanatory power when it comes to the mutual suspicion between police and the policed, and indicates one of the many challenges policymakers and LEOs face in community outreach. Specifically with respect to Baltimore, if you scroll down to the first graphic in the post you can see a list of cities which includes size of police force, total percentage of the force living in the city, and then a racial breakdown of percentages of White officers, Black officers etc. living in the city. The list is organized from those cities with the highest number of total police "locals" at the top, to lowest at the bottom. Baltimore is the 50th city on this list out of 75. About 12% of White officers live there. Only about 40% of the Other category (non-White basically) lives in the city, and the average of the total force indicates only about 27% live in Baltimore. That's not a particularly impressive number. In fact, according to this examination by the Washington Post (which also uses the EEOC and Census data), 46% of the police officers working in Baltimore are white when only 28% of the city population is White. So on the one hand almost half the force is white while maybe one in ten of those individuals actually live in the city; and on the other hand the racial demographics indicate that the composition of the force does not actually mirror the composition of the residents. It's a two-pronged problem of officers not living in these cities--let alone the neighborhoods in particular that have been most problematic--, and not resembling the people they're policing either visibly or in terms of lived experience
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Apr 29, 2015 15:21
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I'm not sure what is happening here. If the police assault an individual it is a few bad apples and all police are mud. If a group of protesters assault police and burn down their neighbourhood it is ' ignore the bad apples focus on the issue.'. I figure if the police are condemned by 'a few bad apples' the people protesting are by default ignoring the point regarding the few bad apples thing then aren't the rioters as bad, if not worse, than the police? All people protesting this are mud then?
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Apr 29, 2015 15:31
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Spacman posted:I'm not sure what is happening here. This not only is untrue, but 'it is a few bad apples' contradicts 'all police are mud'. Anyway, all police aren't mud. However, the police are an institutional force, endowed by power by law, governed by rules, and controllable by our government. Rioters are not: As we have already discussed, the reasons why people riot are varied, but one definite reason that riots occur is people being part of an oppressed underclass. Does this help you think about the issue at all?
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Apr 29, 2015 15:35
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I am only one filthy cop hater and cannot speak for the rest, but to me the meaningful policy-related difference is that the protesters are not members of a monolithic, powerful group sheltering their bad apples from any negative consequences.
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Apr 29, 2015 15:38
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Glad to see this thread supports the destruction of minority owned property.
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Apr 29, 2015 15:41
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Knifegrab posted:Glad to see this thread supports the destruction of minority owned property. Hey, you never responded after I showed you why it was dumb to talk about what the 'alternatives' are to rioting. Do you understand, yet, why that's a silly question? You don't appear to, given this incredibly weak troll of a post.
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Apr 29, 2015 15:44
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Spacman posted:I figure if the police are condemned by 'a few bad apples' the people protesting are by default ignoring the point regarding the few bad apples thing then aren't the rioters as bad, if not worse, than the police? But you don't believe the police should be condemned for "a few bad apples", no matter how common or how long they stick around! Aren't you just pointing out your own hypocrisy? (Also, people don't condemn police for having a few bad apples, they condemn them for allowing and enabling those bad apples to spoil to the barrel) In good news today, Baltimore seems to be having a lot of people, including repentant rioters, working together to clean up the aftermath. Those interviewed seem to universally feel like they were shortsighted and made a mistake and wish they hadn't destroyed property. GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Apr 29, 2015 |
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Apr 29, 2015 15:47
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Pretty sure the barrels are built for the bad apples and the few good ones are tossed inside to make them rot like the rest.
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Apr 29, 2015 15:52
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Finally checking in with the thread, whats up thread. Maryland private attorney here, planning on checking in on how things are going in Baltimore and see how things are going with the mass legal defense team. In the meantime I'd just like to point out that a bail fund was set up by bmoreunited.org for protesters who are arrested. You can contribute to it here: https://www.crowdrise.com/legalbailsupportforbaltimore/fundraiser/tremurphy
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Apr 29, 2015 16:00
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GlyphGryph posted:But you don't believe the police should be condemned for "a few bad apples", no matter how common or how long they stick around! Aren't you just pointing out your own hypocrisy? No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. I think there is zero difference between the two sides in this. Anybody who has a few bad apples spoiling the bunch should be equally thrown into the maelstrom of violence.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:11
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Spacman posted:No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. The rioters will face consequences. What about the police?
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Apr 29, 2015 16:13
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Spacman posted:No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. Except one side killed a man by breaking his neck.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:16
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Spacman posted:No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. Ah, sorry then, I had confused you with someone else. I still think your position is stupid, but at least it's consistent. But do you seriously not see any of the significant differences between the two "sides" here? Do you consider the rioters and protestors to be on the same "side"?
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Apr 29, 2015 16:18
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Spun Dog posted:The rioters will face consequences. What about the police? Really? The National Guard rolled out in uniform and armed. They rode in in MRAPS , the military is currently enforcing the civil authority in one of your cities an you think the police are the issue? Really.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:19
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Spacman posted:No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. That's absolutely absurd. One group is a hugely disorganized group of people with no real power that may or may not have anything to do with one another. The protesters are not necessarily rioting and vice versa. The police on the other hand are a group of government employees that have been shown to be above to law, killing people and getting away with it, and also being backed by the system that is actively oppressing the citizens of that city. The power differential is humongous and to say that they are even remotely equivalent is naive at best and apologism for systemic abuse at worst.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:19
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Spacman posted:Really? The National Guard rolled out in uniform and armed. They rode in in MRAPS , the military is currently enforcing the civil authority in one of your cities an you think the police are the issue? Really. For reals, yo. Do you think the police that broke this mans back will face any consequences?
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Apr 29, 2015 16:20
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Spacman posted:Really? The National Guard rolled out in uniform and armed. They rode in in MRAPS , the military is currently enforcing the civil authority in one of your cities an you think the police are the issue? The riots happened because of the police, so... yes? Do you think the riots would have happened if the police didn't have a long history of loving things up here or something? It's not the only underlying issue, but it seems like a pretty big one?
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Apr 29, 2015 16:22
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Spacman posted:Really? The National Guard rolled out in uniform and armed. They rode in in MRAPS , the military is currently enforcing the civil authority in one of your cities an you think the police are the issue? Yes. Riots don't happen because people are safe, secure, and well off. They happen because poo poo's hosed up and bullshit.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:22
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Spacman posted:No, I believe that the police should be thoroughly condemned because of 'the few bad apples', likewise I think the rioters should be thoroughly condemned because of 'a few bad apples'. If it makes you feel better, the rioters have been suffering crushing police brutality and poverty for decades. The cops, not so much.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:23
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Spun Dog posted:Really. For reals, yo. I dunno matey, you have the local military locking down one of your cities. You should ask them this dumb question. Maybe they will shoot you in the scone with a rubber bullet. I can only hope.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:23
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Spacman posted:I dunno matey, you have the local military locking down one of your cities. You should ask them this dumb question. Maybe they will shoot you in the scone with a rubber bullet. 'I have no argument so now I'm going to make an impotent threat' Great, really impressive.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:25
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Spacman posted:I dunno matey, you have the local military locking down one of your cities. You should ask them this dumb question. Maybe they will shoot you in the scone with a rubber bullet. Are you a police officer by any chance
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Apr 29, 2015 16:26
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Spacman posted:I dunno matey, you have the local military locking down one of your cities. You should ask them this dumb question. Maybe they will shoot you in the scone with a rubber bullet. "hell yea, bro! order above all in the face of those who forget their place in the natural hierarchy!" / 
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Apr 29, 2015 16:29
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FourLeaf posted:'I have no argument so now I'm going to make an impotent threat' Matey, I'm not your enemy. I'm just saying that you might not want to waste you bullshit on me because you literally have the state military called up by and crawling about a major city under curfew because your white cops like killing black guys.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:30
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Willie Tomg posted:"hell yea, bro! order above all in the face of those who forget their place in the natural hierarchy!" Man, equating the black rioters to ISIS is something....
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Apr 29, 2015 16:31
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Willie Tomg posted:"hell yea, bro! order above all in the face of those who forget their place in the natural hierarchy!" Great, anyone who disagrees with you is Assad (basically hitler). Not worth arguing with any of you then.
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Apr 29, 2015 16:33
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Spacman posted:I dunno matey, you have the local military locking down one of your cities. You should ask them this dumb question. Maybe they will shoot you in the scone with a rubber bullet. You're right, that is a dumb question. We all know that they will not face any consequences. Are you a cartoon character or something?
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Apr 29, 2015 16:34
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