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Morn posted:shipwreck chat Thanks for this. I had always assumed the Great Lakes were pretty placid until I read that climatic conditions of Great Plains warm air encountering bodies of cold water generated violent storms. The most disastrous storm in recent history was 1913. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Lakes_Storm_of_1913 Many ships were sunk and 240 people died at sea and on land. One sailor survived the sinking of his ship by not being aboard. Here is his tale: wikipedia posted:By the evening of Tuesday, November 11, there were still several unidentified bodies in the Goderich morgue from a few different vessels. Thomas Thompson of Hamilton, Ontario scanned the corpses for signs of his son John, a crewman aboard the James Carruthers. Thomas saw one body who looked a lot like his son. The facial features and hair color were identical. The corpse was missing an eyetooth like his son and had a tattoo of J.T. on the left forearm. Several scars and a birth defect (the second and third toes of the feet grew together) convinced Thomas Thompson that he had finally found his son John. He arranged to take possession of the body and notified his family. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_James_Carruthers
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May 9, 2015 12:04
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Turns out there's a drug out there that permanently induces severe Parkinson's disease. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP quote:MPTP (1-methyl-4-phenyl-1,2,3,6-tetrahydropyridine) is a neurotoxin precursor to MPP+, which causes permanent symptoms of Parkinson's disease by destroying dopaminergic neurons in the substantia nigra of the brain. It has been used to study disease models in various animal studies. This book review gives a fairly good overview of how the effects of MPTP were first discovered in users of contaminated opiates in the 1970's: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199612263352618 quote:The book opens with the unfortunate victims becoming immobile (“frozen”), unblinking, and mute only hours after injecting the street drug. As can be imagined, Langston and colleagues at Santa Clara Valley Medical Center were perplexed by the strange state of the first patient they encountered. On examining the patient's girlfriend and finding her in a similar frozen state, Langston and his neurology colleague, Phil Ballard, realized there must be a connection.
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May 9, 2015 14:40
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The tradition didn't die with Saddam Hussein or KISS's comic book.  quote:An Austrian gay mag called Vangardist made headlines around the world this week for using the blood of three HIV-positive people to print its new issue. The sterilized blood carrying the virus was used on 3,000 of 18,000 copies, and was intended to address the stigmatization many people living with HIV deal with on a daily basis. http://www.vice.com/read/vangardist-julian-wiehl-hiv-blood-ink-interview-876
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May 9, 2015 15:24
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I read about 30 pages of this thread and didn't see this, so here you go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tichborne_case tl;dr: Random guy gets told he may be someone else, travels across the ocean to confirm it, becomes the other person in the hearts of the English public
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May 9, 2015 16:42
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Inevitable posted:An Austrian gay mag called Vangardist made headlines around the world this week for using the blood of three HIV-positive people to print its new issue. The sterilized blood carrying the virus was used on 3,000 of 18,000 copies, and was intended to address the stigmatization many people living with HIV deal with on a daily basis. "Let's fight the stigma that people with a blood-borne illness face by making our customers touch their blood!" said the smartest man in the world.
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May 9, 2015 16:51
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:Thanks for this. There's also the famous sinking of the SS Edmund Fitzgerald, the largest vessel to ever be sunk on the Great Lakes and the subject of a well-known Gordon Lightfoot tune: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgI8bta-7aw
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May 9, 2015 17:50
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3 posted:There's also the famous sinking of the SS Edmund Fitzgerald, the largest vessel to ever be sunk on the Great Lakes and the subject of a well-known Gordon Lightfoot tune: There's also a good book about it, Mighty Fitz, on Amazon. Lots of detail about the iron ore trade, Great Lakes merchant shipping, and the Fitz herself and her crew and how they came to find themselves in the middle of every sailor's nightmare, and about the discovery of her resting place and the wreck, too. It's a good read.
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May 9, 2015 18:45
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Vladimir Poutine posted:Turns out there's a drug out there that permanently induces severe Parkinson's disease. I looked up this book because it sounds like an extremely interesting read and sadly, one of the authors was himself diagnosed with Parkinson's later in life.
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May 9, 2015 18:47
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No Great Lakes sinking is more bizarre than the SS Daniel J Morrell http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Daniel_J._Morrell The ship broke in two in a November storm, 1966. Most of the crew jumped into the water and drowned/froze to death. The few crew on the fore section held back as long possible before getting into a life raft. Just as they did so a ship was sighted approaching. It was the Morrell - the aft half had continued sailing (with its engine and rudder), had gone round in a circle and collided with the fore section. We only know that because of the one crewman who survived, rescued on the point of death by hypothermia.... 
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May 10, 2015 10:16
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Reading more about the Station Fire. It's mind boggling how fast the fire spread. Book claims if you you didn't escape the building before 90 seconds then you were likely dead. Also, the media is scum. quote:In order to keep reporters from accosting families a tthe Crowne Plaza, the Rhode Island State Police and West Warwick police closed the main door of the ballroom and allowed access to families only through a side door. Nevertheless, some enterprising out-of-state journalists rented guest rooms at the hotel and attempted to enter the Family Assistance Center under false pretenses. They were detained by police, then evicted from the hotel. quote:Several victims lay in the parking lot, still smoldering. Hoping to cool them down, Vannini grabbed extinguishers from fire trucks, wielding one and handing others to civilians. When he pointed his extinguisher at one badly burned victim, its stream came out too hard, tearing burned skin off the man’s body.Vannini tried applying snow, instead. quote:"Be absolutely certain of the identity of the deceased. . . .All notifications should be made in person. . . .More than one person should be present to make the notification. 
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May 11, 2015 02:15
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When I read the article some years back, I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that 100 people died. It just seemed so insane. Then when the even worse Kiss nightclub fire happened, I saw a video a journalist took of the Station fire. Big mistake to have watched that right before bed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOzfq9EgxeoThe screaming at 5:30 from the people being burned alive is what horrified me the most.
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May 11, 2015 03:02
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Celery Face posted:When I read the article some years back, I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that 100 people died. It just seemed so insane. Then when the even worse Kiss nightclub fire happened, I saw a video a journalist took of the Station fire. Big mistake to have watched that right before bed. Yeah, don't click this. The book gives a vivid enough description of the video. One of the things the author points out is there are several recordings of the fire in various forms: Brian Butler was a local WPRI news reporter who filmed the above mentioned video. Morbidly enough he was there to film a story on fire safety at the urging of one of the club's owners, a news reporter at his station.. Dan Davidson was amateur photographer who snapped several photos before escaping. Joe Cristina was there with Matt Pickett and snapped a single photo before escaping. Matt Pickett died in the fire but the Sony Walkman he was carrying in his pocket to record the concert survived. The ATF was able to salvage the burned recorder then piece together the whole thing using computers. quote:The Pickett audiotape continues for another ten minutes. Its contents are probably worse than most of us would care to imagine. As fire science suggests, many victims were instantly rendered unconscious by smoke,and thereby spared suffering. However, Matthew Pickett’s audiotape also teaches that pain and despair do not discriminate by sex, and pleas to be rescued by God or man may go unheard. In the end, its only sounds are the crackle, hiss, and pop of flames,indistinguishable from those of logs in a fireplace —sounds that in a different setting can be so comforting,but are here so profoundly disturbing. One thing that stood out to me was how long it took for people to realize "Hey, this fire is not under control" and just fail to escape. The book offered the explanation that humans are used to being near controlled fire ( fireplaces, bonfires,etc) and that the sudden appearance of a dangerous, out of control fire simply causes many people to freeze up. Nckdictator has a new favorite as of 19:38 on May 11, 2015 |
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May 11, 2015 04:22
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Celery Face posted:When I read the article some years back, I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that 100 people died. It just seemed so insane. Then when the even worse Kiss nightclub fire happened, I saw a video a journalist took of the Station fire. Big mistake to have watched that right before bed. The one guy running out of the flames is just insane to me. It was already an inferno, so I am wondering what he had to do to make it out of that whole place.
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May 11, 2015 04:55
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That video is still one of the most chilling I've ever seen, and I've seen some awful poo poo. I only watched it once years ago but it's still really fresh in my head. The part where they're all jammed in the doorway moments before it bursts into flames will probably never leave my memory.
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May 11, 2015 05:02
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Nckdictator posted:One thing that stood out to me was how long it took for people to realize "Hey, this fire is not under control" and just fail to escape. The book offered the explanation that humans are used to being near controlled fire ( fireplaces, bonfires,etc) and that the sudden appearance of a dangerous, out of control fire simply causes many people to freeze up. See also the Bradford City stadium fire of 1985 (Wiki link, there are videos that are  ), where a wooden stadium burned down during an English football game. The wooden structure meant the fire spread so rapidly that by the time some fans realized they were in danger there was no hope of escape, and inadequate emergency exits kept those who did recognize the danger from getting out.In 1980, all 301 occupants of Saudia Flight 163 died because they were overcome by smoke and fire between making an emergency landing but before opening any doors. I'm gonna sound like a spergy safety nerd, but the two lessons I'd like people to take away from situations like this: 1. Pay attention to emergency exits and always have a plan for how you are going to get out if poo poo gets real. Your best exit likely isn't the one you came in from, and like they say in the airline safety briefings, your closest exit may be behind you. If something happens, don't wait to see other people moving before you get the gently caress out. 2. gently caress everyone who intentionally or negligently violates fire codes, they are vile scum and you should proudly narc them out at the first opportunity. If anyone ever gives you poo poo about fire safety, make them watch the Station video and ask them if they want to die like that. Also, I suggest checking out the OSHA DOT JAY PEG thread in GBS for more about workplace safety in general. Don't kill or maim yourself in a dumb way because the bossman told you to!
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May 11, 2015 05:35
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Alereon posted:
I read up on the Station Nightclub fire a few years ago. I remember reading that something like 80+% of the occupants tried to exit through the main entry/exit door that they came in, which caused the crush that prevented so many people from escaping. I go see a lot of bands play in venues of a similar size and ever since I read that, I always scan the room for the exits as soon as I get inside. I don't even have to remind myself to do it; the Station fire crosses my mind every time I enter a venue. I also always try to stick relatively close to the people I'm with even if we get separated in the mosh pit so if anything happens I can grab them and make sure they follow me to the nearest exit, rather than the front door. I never say any of this to the friends I go see bands with because I'd probably sound like a huge weirdo, but it makes me more comfortable to have this stuff in mind.
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May 11, 2015 05:53
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Alereon posted:
Then again, the guitarist perished, so had the bouncer not blocked that exit, it may not have mattered.
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May 11, 2015 07:19
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Nckdictator posted:Matt Pickett died in the fire but the Sony Walkman he was carrying in his pocket to record the concert survived. The ATF was able to salvage the burned recorder the piece together the whole thing using computers. That just continues to amaze me. Considering how brutal the fire was, and how the club looked afterwards, the fact that they could get anything at all intelligible out of a cassette tape is astounding.
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May 11, 2015 07:42
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Nth Doctor posted:What I find incredibly hosed up is that there are multiple survivors' accounts stating that a bouncer was turning people away from the door right next to the stage, saying it was for the band only. The Station fire has always held a terrible, morbid fascination for me because I attended shows there; that door nearest the stage, if I remember correctly, opened *in*. It was a really big door, too, so if they'd opened that one, it would have been a straight-out exit, rather than people having to fight their way back towards the front of the club (the main room narrowed down to a doorway through a little foyer, and then the exit door.) After the fire, investigators put out a request to anyone who had photos of the inside of the place to submit them; I submitted quite a few where you could clearly see the painted cardboard egg-cartons that covered the walls and ceilings -- that was their soundproofing -- and that's what the investigators needed evidence of. That contributed to the horror as the cardboard cartons burned so quickly, but the type of paint used produced the toxic smoke. The two owners, in my brief encounter with them, were dicks. It was a pretty small club, but the entrance was a complete bottleneck, even under the best of times. There were windows all along the one side of the main club area, but I guess in the confusion and smoke and everything, people didn't think or couldn't think to smash them out with the chairs either in the bar area or along those sides. Probably wasn't enough time. I'm with Alereon; I used to do a lot of band photography at clubs like this, and you're smashed right up next to the stage with the crowd. I've been to clubs since as just a patron, and I can't get close to the stage anymore. Hell yes, I look for exits and escape routes as well.
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May 11, 2015 08:07
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Morn posted:OP - If you want something sort of scary and unnerving, check out all the WWII T-2 tankers that broke in half (during service and after the war). Speaking of those tankers, lets talk about the SS Fort Mercer and SS Pendleton quote:On 18 February 1952, during a severe "nor’easter" off the New England coast, the T2 tankers SS Fort Mercer and SS Pendleton broke in half. Pendleton was unable to make any distress call; she was discovered on the unusual shore radar with which the Chatham, Massachusetts, Lifeboat Station was equipped during the search for Fort Mercer. Boatswain's Mate First Class Bernard C. Webber, coxswain of motor lifeboat CG-36500 from Station Chatham and his crew, consisting of Engineman Third Class Andrew Fitzgerald, Seaman Richard Livesey, and Seaman Ervin Maske, rescued the crew of Pendleton, which had broken in half. Webber maneuvered the 36-footer under Pendleton 's stern with expert skill as the tanker's crew, trapped in the stern section, abandoned the remains of their ship on a Jacob's ladder. One by one, the men jumped into the water and then were pulled into the lifeboat. Webber and his crew saved 33 of the 34 Pendleton crewmen. Webber, Fitzgerald, Livesey, and Maske were awarded the Gold Lifesaving Medal for their heroic actions. "But ElMaligno!" You may say "This is not scary at all, it just seem like a brave rescue!" That is true, but your see the book "The Finest Hour" goes into greater detail on how absolutely poo poo this particular Nor'easter was on the north Atlantic, You see there were reports of waves being 10, perhaps even 20 feet tall, Bernard Webber onboard his 36 foot long boat reported waves "at least twice as tall as his boat was long" That’s 60-70 plus feet tall waves if you don’t want to do the math. Remember that scene in "The perfect storm" where the Andrea Gail climbed an ocean wave that was impossibly high? Webber would state that this scene was a great example on the ferocity of the storm. Webber and his crew would save 41 people from the SS Pendleton and would see one die when the cook of the Pendleton mistimed the jump, fell in the water and was crushed between the rescue boat and the Pendleton. Webber would be lauded as a hero and lead a star studded Coast Guard career, but he would forever feel guilty about the fact that he did not save them all. I have personally been out at sea in Coast Guard Cutters during Nor’easters and it always been lovely and scary as gently caress, but nowadays the Coast Guard al all about safety and bringing everybody home. But back then things were different, the old Coast Guard motto was “You have to go out, but you don't have to come back” If you don’t find this poo poo scary then put your young self in the boots of the youngest crewmember of the CG-36500 and ask yourself “If I had to face waves that are double the size of my boat not because I want to do so but because it is expected of me to do so, would I be scared?” Yes, you fuckers SHOULD be scared.
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May 11, 2015 08:33
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ElMaligno posted:Yes, you fuckers SHOULD be scared. “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” Living in a country where the furthest you can get from the sea is ~50km, sailing and fishing obviously has had a strong influence on our history. A common local saying is "only a fool does not fear the sea", and I assume similar sayings exist in all sea-faring cultures. The ocean is mighty and does not care for you.
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May 11, 2015 08:58
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Big waves freak me the hell out. Water is incredibly powerful, turning something that I playfully bodyboarded as a kid at the beach into something that will annihilate anything in its way out of nowhere and with no warning. On that note, how about a wave that was recorded at 250 loving meters high after a landslide caused a mountain river to overflow a dam. Multiple villages were swept away by this monster. If you were in its way, there was literally nothing you could do but pucker up and kiss your wet rear end goodbye.
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May 11, 2015 11:34
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Alereon posted:2. gently caress everyone who intentionally or negligently violates fire codes, they are vile scum and you should proudly narc them out at the first opportunity. If anyone ever gives you poo poo about fire safety, make them watch the Station video and ask them if they want to die like that. A lot of people don't seem to realize that fire codes exist for a reason and that reason is because someone did the opposite and people died.
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May 11, 2015 12:13
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Celery Face posted:When I read the article some years back, I couldn't wrap my head around the fact that 100 people died. It just seemed so insane. Then when the even worse Kiss nightclub fire happened, I saw a video a journalist took of the Station fire. Big mistake to have watched that right before bed. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah gently caress 
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May 11, 2015 12:38
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ASIC v Danny Bro posted:Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah gently caress I don't know why I watched this, Jesus Christ those screams. Literally threw up; I cannot handle hearing that very real and primal terror. Wasabi the J has a new favorite as of 12:55 on May 11, 2015 |
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May 11, 2015 12:52
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Ms Boods posted:that door nearest the stage, if I remember correctly, opened *in*. It was a really big door, too, so if they'd opened that one, it would have been a straight-out exit The door opening inwards is a huge red flag when it comes to fire codes. Theatre doors open outwards specifically because then you can open them even in a crushing crowd. This article on the Iroquois fire of 1903 posted:The tragedy also spurred a drastic toughening of safety standards for theaters and other public buildings, and the rules became a benchmark for the nation. Henceforth, all theater exits had to be clearly marked and the doors rigged so that, even if they could not be pulled open from the outside, they could be pushed open from the inside.
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May 11, 2015 14:33
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As someone who lives in rhode island, the Station Nightclub fire was hosed up. RI is pretty small, so if you lived here you probably knew someone who knew someone who was involved. I actually lived down the street from one of the owners, the way I found out about the fire was some reporter banging on my door asking if we knew the guy and to tell us about him. Also growing up in the ocean state, you learn pretty quick that the ocean will murder your rear end. you don't even need to be out in the middle of it, you can just be hanging out at the beach and get killed. Once or twice a week when I was a lifeguard someone will get caught in a rip current and start getting sucked out to sea and need saving. Sometimes those people can't swim and go under where the lifeguards can't see them, or they decide to swim at night or at other times when there are no lifeguards on duty, and unless they're a really strong swimmer, they're not coming back.
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May 11, 2015 15:14
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Seriously do not listen to that video. I just fell asleep after work and immediately heard the screams.
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May 11, 2015 15:43
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Inevitable posted:The tradition didn't die with Saddam Hussein or KISS's comic book. The deadliest paper cut
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May 11, 2015 17:00
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Ms Boods posted:I'm with Alereon; I used to do a lot of band photography at clubs like this, and you're smashed right up next to the stage with the crowd. I've been to clubs since as just a patron, and I can't get close to the stage anymore. Hell yes, I look for exits and escape routes as well. For some reason, all the clubs in Boston got reeeeeeally strict about relabeling their fire exits and installing fire doors in 2003 and 2004, and just try to have an event involving even a tea candle at one. Neither of these are bad things, of course.
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May 11, 2015 17:06
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I looked up the Station fire and was surprised to learn it was only the fourth-deadliest nightclub fire in U.S. history. Here are the first three: Cocoanut Grove Fire quote:The Cocoanut Grove was Boston's premier nightclub during the post-Prohibition 1930s and 1940s. On November 28, 1942, this club was the scene of the deadliest nightclub fire in history, killing 492 people (which was 32 more than the building's authorized capacity) and injuring hundreds more. The enormity of the tragedy shocked the nation and briefly replaced the events of World War II in newspaper headlines. It led to a reform of safety standards and codes across the country, and major changes in the treatment and rehabilitation of burn victims. Rhythm Club fire quote:The Rhythm Club fire (or The Natchez Dance Hall Holocaust) was a fire in Natchez, Mississippi, United States on the night of April 23, 1940 that killed 209 people and severely injured many others. Hundreds of people became trapped inside the one-story steel-clad wooden building. The victims were mostly African Americans. Beverly Hills Supper Club fire quote:The Beverly Hills Supper Club fire in Southgate, Kentucky, is the third deadliest nightclub fire in U.S. history. It occurred on the night of May 28, 1977, during the Memorial Day holiday weekend. A total of 165 people died and over 200 were injured as a result of the blaze.
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May 11, 2015 17:40
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I was in this nightclub a few months before it burnt to the ground: http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/s...8-1227127544119 quote:Tith Narong, Siem Reap City police chief, told The Cambodia Daily that the club, popular among young Cambodians, had no windows and only one door, hindering escape. In Cambodia the fire service is ridiculously underfunded with the chiefs and politicians just helping themselves to all the money. This means the actual firemen refuse to go out to fires unless they get paid when they get there, so everyone has a whip-round and phones them back and says they'll give them twenty bucks. Cambodians also aren't very squeamish: THIS VIDEO IS EXTREMELY GRAPHIC - CORPSES
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May 12, 2015 01:03
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ranbo das posted:Also growing up in the ocean state, you learn pretty quick that the ocean will murder your rear end. you don't even need to be out in the middle of it, you can just be hanging out at the beach and get killed. Once or twice a week when I was a lifeguard someone will get caught in a rip current and start getting sucked out to sea and need saving. Sometimes those people can't swim and go under where the lifeguards can't see them, or they decide to swim at night or at other times when there are no lifeguards on duty, and unless they're a really strong swimmer, they're not coming back. Rips are loving dangerous. If you don't know anything about the ocean then they'll look like the calmest bit around and an excellent place to swim, and then you're 300m out to sea and oh gently caress.
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May 12, 2015 10:06
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The Lone Badger posted:Rips are loving dangerous. If you don't know anything about the ocean then they'll look like the calmest bit around and an excellent place to swim, and then you're 300m out to sea and oh gently caress. The sad thing is that escaping a rip current is really easy (just swim parallel to the shore for a bit), but it's not intuitive.
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May 12, 2015 10:20
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Isn't the recommended way to deal with a riptide to swim parallel to the shore until you're out of it, then ride the current back in? Everything I've heard growing up said that the danger is in wearing yourself out and drowning fighting against the current (which you'll almost never be able to do), whereas if you swim across it a few hundred meters you'll be fine. Edit: Well, there ya go.
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May 12, 2015 10:24
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Mr. Flunchy posted:The sad thing is that escaping a rip current is really easy (just swim parallel to the shore for a bit), but it's not intuitive. And you have to stay calm while you're swept away. You panic, you die.
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May 12, 2015 10:25
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The Lone Badger posted:And you have to stay calm while you're swept away. You panic, you die. Yeah, "swim parallel to the shore for a bit and you'll be fine" tends to get overridden by "OH gently caress I'M BEING SWEPT OUT TO SEA I'M GOING TO DIE".
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May 12, 2015 11:36
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Hijo Del Helmsley posted:Yeah, "swim parallel to the shore for a bit and you'll be fine" tends to get overridden by "OH gently caress I'M BEING SWEPT OUT TO SEA I'M GOING TO DIE". Well yeah. That's why it's important to know how these things work. (from wikipedia)  I've been caught in them a couple of times and it's definitely unnerving, but keep your head and you'll be fine.
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May 12, 2015 11:51
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Mr. Flunchy posted:Well yeah. That's why it's important to know how these things work. Been caught in a couple myself (Australia lol) But some have deffo been easier to swim out of than others. Worst one was at a beach I didn't know, got caught in a real big fucker, and got dragged over rocks covered in oysters.
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May 12, 2015 12:40
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Did the oysters scrape you up enough to make you bleed? And if so, this being Australia, why didn't the sharks get you?
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May 12, 2015 13:37
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