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Perestroika posted:I'm actually really curious how they're looking to implement Chaos. They haven't announced them as their own faction yet, but judging from the trailer it'll probably still play a major role even in the initial release. They've said that they're looking to have significantly differing internal mechanics for each faction, so it seems likely that they'll be planning something unique in that regard. Yeah this is what I'm expecting, as well as chaos cults and the like being a problem for human settlements. Then they'll be a proper faction in an expansion.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:17
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Someone also mentioned Chaos being a factor in how magic works, so too many spells and *poof* giant demon bird in the middle of your army, like in the trailer.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:17
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Klaus88 posted:I must now out " Similarly, Kislev is basically '17th century Eastern Europe and Russia, all of it, if it had to deal with regular hell-viking invasions and that kept people together a bit more.'
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Jun 5, 2015 17:17
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Skandranon posted:Someone also mentioned Chaos being a factor in how magic works, so too many spells and *poof* giant demon bird in the middle of your army, like in the trailer. This is accurate to how magic tends to work in the setting.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:26
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All magic is Chaos. Human magic is just Chaos filtered through focusing on one specific element (like metal or fire or whatever) so that you don't pull in too much and explode too easily. Elves, being the jerks that they are, get super special magic that's all wizardry in semi-holy harmony that's incredibly powerful and I think, safer. Typical goddamn elves.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:29
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Night10194 posted:All magic is Chaos. Human magic is just Chaos filtered through focusing on one specific element (like metal or fire or whatever) so that you don't pull in too much and explode too easily. Except for Dark Elves where it is really Chaos magic but they all lie and say it isn't because if Malekith found out, the dark elves would be short a whole bunch of magic users.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:47
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Eimi posted:Except for Dark Elves where it is really Chaos magic but they all lie and say it isn't because if Malekith found out, the dark elves would be short a whole bunch of magic users. Dark Elves are the only people in all of Warhams to ever get tricked by Khorne. They're not very bright.
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Jun 5, 2015 17:53
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Night10194 posted:All magic is Chaos. Human magic is just Chaos filtered through focusing on one specific element (like metal or fire or whatever) so that you don't pull in too much and explode too easily. It's mostly that mastering magic takes a really, really long time and humans don't live long enough to really grasp magic on the same level as an elf who lives for hundreds if not thousands of years, so human wizards compensate for this by becoming hyper specialists and getting really, really, really good at their particular school of magic. Elf high magic is basically just "I have attained at least some level of mastery of all the winds of magic so I can blend them together to do fancy stuff".
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Jun 5, 2015 18:03
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Yeah, high elves can pull some hilarious/ridiculous magical bullshit. In the tabletop game, there are a whole bunch of rules that work to somewhat limit what a single noemal magic user can do. They can only know so many spells of so many schools, they can use only so much power per spell, they have a pretty high chance of blowing the gently caress up when they try too powerful a spell, their spells are fairly likely to be dispelled, and so on. Enter Teclis, a high elf hero and master of all things magic and bullshit. He just looks at all those silly 'rules', goes "nope", and basically gets to ignore all of them. Even a lovely apprentice human wizard is a significant force that can alter the course of a battle in a big way. Teclis can pretty much win one on his own.
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Jun 5, 2015 18:17
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Night10194 posted:Oh, and Kislevite musketeers brace their gun with a giant poleaxe. Streltsy, they were called. I remember playing one in a short-lived WHFRP game. It was awesome  thebardyspoon posted:Yeah this is what I'm expecting, as well as chaos cults and the like being a problem for human settlements. Then they'll be a proper faction in an expansion. I actually want Chaos to be a full faction, but with a more asymmetrical play style. Your military forces should be small but hard-hitting, and you win battles not by clashing directly on the battlefield, but by using special agents (like ninja in Shogun) to gravely weaken enemies. Skandranon posted:Someone also mentioned Chaos being a factor in how magic works, so too many spells and *poof* giant demon bird in the middle of your army, like in the trailer. I thought it isn't just a factor, and wizards literally harness raw Chaos to power their spells, don't they?
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Jun 5, 2015 19:01
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CommissarMega posted:Streltsy, they were called. I remember playing one in a short-lived WHFRP game. It was awesome I played one in a full campaign where we prevented the return of Konrad von Carstein and stopped Thanquol from blowing up Nuln. Pyotr the Sad Russian Marksman was so much fun to be.
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Jun 5, 2015 19:26
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Night10194 posted:I played one in a full campaign where we prevented the return of Konrad von Carstein and stopped Thanquol from blowing up Nuln. Pyotr the Sad Russian Marksman was so much fun to be. That assumes that Thanquol can accomplish anything without self-sabotage or Felix and Gortrek showing up to foil him.
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Jun 5, 2015 19:30
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Klaus88 posted:That assumes that Thanquol can accomplish anything without self-sabotage or Felix and Gortrek showing up to foil him. They were busy elsewhere (and it's not like they actually know Thanquol, much to his fury) and it was mostly a matter of 'stop him before his plan hits the point where when it blows up in his face it takes the city he planned to conquer with him'
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Jun 5, 2015 19:44
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CommissarMega posted:I actually want Chaos to be a full faction, but with a more asymmetrical play style. Your military forces should be small but hard-hitting, and you win battles not by clashing directly on the battlefield, but by using special agents (like ninja in Shogun) to gravely weaken enemies. Someone said it earlier, but Chaos in WFB are basically the Sphess Mehrines from 40k. Bunch of super expensive badasses, so they should always be outnumbered and slow.
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Jun 5, 2015 21:09
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Well elves would be great as magic casters and dwarves will be cannon happy. hopefully with gyrocopters aswell.
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Jun 5, 2015 21:36
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Perestroika posted:Yeah, high elves can pull some hilarious/ridiculous magical bullshit. In the tabletop game, there are a whole bunch of rules that work to somewhat limit what a single noemal magic user can do. They can only know so many spells of so many schools, they can use only so much power per spell, they have a pretty high chance of blowing the gently caress up when they try too powerful a spell, their spells are fairly likely to be dispelled, and so on. gently caress elllllveeeessss.
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Jun 5, 2015 21:46
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CommissarMega posted:I thought it isn't just a factor, and wizards literally harness raw Chaos to power their spells, don't they? Yes, lore wise. I was speaking purely from a potential video game mechanic angle. Hard to do though, as some people get upset with probabilistic things and will then just not use magic at all. Could be interesting though.
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Jun 5, 2015 21:47
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Orv posted:gently caress elllllveeeessss. A completely correct opinion.
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Jun 5, 2015 21:52
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It'd be funny if the Chaos guys would work like the Darknuts in that Zelda MTW2 mod. As in, hilariously proficient and armored but also incapable of running. Also re: Diplomacy, I can't wait to see how CA fucks it up since setting is pretty perfect for the typical TW diplomacy AI. It would be neat, though, to have sort of faction-specific methods for getting factions to like you. Dwarves like you by default but if you gently caress up they demand extreme restitution before liking you again, chaos always welcomes "friendship" but takes advantage of it in bad ways, orcs get a diplomacy bonus for beating the poo poo out of them repeatedly because clearly you're a proper orky sort of 'ooman, elves being the only faction to care about things like "warmongering", skaven alternating between fawning obsequiousness and opportunistic aggression depending on how many weapons you have pointed at their head at a given moment, etc
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Jun 5, 2015 21:53
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Eimi posted:Someone said it earlier, but Chaos in WFB are basically the Sphess Mehrines from 40k. Bunch of super expensive badasses, so they should always be outnumbered and slow.  Chaos marauders actually make up the bulk of your adverse horde, being naked Conan types who prefer charging the enemy lines and overwhelming them with raw numbers unless they worship The Great Changer. Chaos Warriors make up the elite foot and cavalry. This should translate into great swarming light foot and excellent heavy infantry but nothing in between those two extremes.Orv posted:gently caress elllllveeeessss. Night10194 posted:A completely correct opinion. Elves started this whole mess in the first place. 
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Jun 5, 2015 22:06
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Orv posted:gently caress elllllveeeessss. Wood Elves are cool  Isolationist racist hippies whose only friends are crazy murdertrees.
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Jun 5, 2015 22:06
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QuasiQuack posted:Wood Elves are cool They are indeed pretty cool because they're crazy alien motherfuckers who may or may not be puppets of a psychopathic and ancient forest of evil. I know they eventually resolved the Loren as something nice and heroic but goddamnit, I liked the crazy murderforest. The place was basically the Zone from Stalker crossed with a fairy tale.
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Jun 5, 2015 22:09
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Skandranon posted:Yes, lore wise. I was speaking purely from a potential video game mechanic angle. Hard to do though, as some people get upset with probabilistic things and will then just not use magic at all. Could be interesting though.
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Jun 6, 2015 00:02
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Slann are the REAL badasses when it comes to magic and nothing will convince me otherwise.
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Jun 6, 2015 00:50
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There's already a precedent for "random chance to gently caress up if you push things" sort of mechanic in TW games, from the more concerete things like "press button to overheat engine and maybe blow the gently caress up" to more abstract things like "hey lets shoot our cannons into the battle line and hope more of their dudes die".
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Jun 6, 2015 00:58
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Tiler Kiwi posted:There's already a precedent for "random chance to gently caress up if you push things" sort of mechanic in TW games, from the more concerete things like "press button to overheat engine and maybe blow the gently caress up" to more abstract things like "hey lets shoot our cannons into the battle line and hope more of their dudes die". Onagers. 
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Jun 6, 2015 01:01
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my dad posted:Onagers. If AoE 2 taught me anything, it's that vomiting a pile of rocks over a bunch of squishy things at forty miles an hour is incredibly satsifying.
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Jun 6, 2015 01:04
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Tomn posted:Hold everything, stop the presses, Karl Franz could potentially make friends with the Orcs?
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Jun 6, 2015 01:09
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What abour orc magic, is that also chaos magic
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Jun 6, 2015 01:26
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Zzulu posted:What abour orc magic, is that also chaos magic Nah, its independent. Its directly tied to the Orcs belief in Gork and Mork, and the magic grows stronger the larger the size of the gathering of Orcs in which its employed. They get real hype, and poo poo starts exploding (including their shaman's skulls)
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Jun 6, 2015 01:28
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Zzulu posted:What abour orc magic, is that also chaos magic No, there's just something about orks that Chaos doesn't want to mess with, in either fantasy or 40k.
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Jun 6, 2015 01:28
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Astus posted:No, there's just something about orks that Chaos doesn't want to mess with, in either fantasy or 40k. It's because if that cowardly prick Khorne ever tried anything, Gork and Mork would curbstomp him and he knows it.
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Jun 6, 2015 01:30
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my dad posted:Onagers.
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Jun 6, 2015 01:59
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Orks are more likely to declare war on you the stronger you are, because a fight's a fight. Skaven respect you if you betray and backstab your allies. If you play as the dwarves, the game MAKES you declare war over certain offences.
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Jun 6, 2015 02:31
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Tiler Kiwi posted:There's already a precedent for "random chance to gently caress up if you push things" sort of mechanic in TW games, from the more concerete things like "press button to overheat engine and maybe blow the gently caress up" On the other hand, I have never once used the overheat engine option. But that's because extra speed is pretty much the single least important aspect of FotS naval combat and there are almost no circumstances when moving faster is worth the risk of potentially losing your ship. If the benefits were better, as magic hopefully will be, it might be done instead!
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Jun 6, 2015 03:03
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Zzulu posted:What abour orc magic, is that also chaos magic Dandywalken posted:Nah, its independent. Its directly tied to the Orcs belief in Gork and Mork, and the magic grows stronger the larger the size of the gathering of Orcs in which its employed. They get real hype, and poo poo starts exploding (including their shaman's skulls) Pretty much this, Orc magic isn't really 'magic' per say by the same rules that most other factions follow. I don't think GW ever clarified if Fantasy Orcs have the same gestalt field as 40k Orks, but they probably do and it is that plus a combination of literally asking Gork and Mork to do stuff (usually stomp on an enemy army) that serves as Orc 'magic.' Human wizards carefully distil the essence of Chaos into their chosen elemental form, shape the spell and unleash it. Orc Shamans just ask their gods to stand on some dudes.
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Jun 6, 2015 03:57
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Neruz posted:Human wizards carefully distil the essence of Chaos into their chosen elemental form, shape the spell and unleash it. Orc Shamans just ask their gods to stand on some dudes. This is literally true, not hyperbole, by the way. One of the spells is Foot of Gork (or Mork) and invites the Orc God to simply step on some guys.
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Jun 6, 2015 04:08
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Krazyface posted:Orks are more likely to declare war on you the stronger you are, because a fight's a fight. "certain"
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Jun 6, 2015 12:08
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Perestroika posted:I'm actually really curious how they're looking to implement Chaos. They haven't announced them as their own faction yet, but judging from the trailer it'll probably still play a major role even in the initial release. They've said that they're looking to have significantly differing internal mechanics for each faction, so it seems likely that they'll be planning something unique in that regard. It's always worth mentioning a big feature of the Empire is much of it is covered in forests which are full of Beastmen tribes (and other horrible things) so I'd be very disappointed if we didn't see some of their units braying around raiding settlements and generally being a nuisance of some description.
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Jun 6, 2015 13:27
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Klaus88 posted:
Yeah Chaos are supposed to be one of the most numerically superior factions in all of the Warhammer fluff(matched only by the greenskins and the skaven). The Space Marine Black Spiky Platemail Giant Hulking Armored Guys are iconic but they're the super elite of the elite and a tiny fraction of an average Chaos army, which is generally made up of bazillions of barbarian marauders and beastmen.
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Jun 6, 2015 13:41
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