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The Nazis were also big public health advocates and made meaningful contributions to medical science.
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Jun 9, 2015 09:15
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But it is pleasing to see the left wants to introduce more tory policy out of a complete misunderstanding of what that policy entails.
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Jun 9, 2015 09:16
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Who cares where the word came from and what their original intentions were. Like many words used in political rhetoric it has a number of meanings now.
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Jun 9, 2015 09:16
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cambodia is a lovely place
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Jun 9, 2015 09:25
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Listening to some old This American Life episodes at work today - and this one about Cambodia came up.
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Jun 9, 2015 09:35
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Negligent posted:But it is pleasing to see the left wants to introduce more tory policy out of a complete misunderstanding of what that policy entails. I hate how the term 'the left' is used to include republicans. Look up the history of the term and you'll see it's since been stolen by the right to bring progressives to the centre.
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Jun 9, 2015 09:55
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Negligent posted:If you seriously think the term knowledge economy means what the greens think it does then.... Well i guess you are just as naive as the rest of the tree hugger wing of that party. Negligent posted:Like seriously look at the etymology of the term and who started advocating for it first. It wasn't the left. Negligent posted:But it is pleasing to see the left wants to introduce more tory policy out of a complete misunderstanding of what that policy entails. Shucks, sure is nice of you to make an effort to educate and inform these poor souls on why their stance is wrong. Oh wait, you did the other thing where you fart out "Go read a dictionary leftards. Checkmate"
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Jun 9, 2015 09:57
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I can't count the number of times I've been trying to convince fascists-in-all-but-name that genocide and state-sanctioned rape are bad and had them end the discussion by 'agreeing to disagree' since our positions are apparently equally substantiated and correspondingly positioned on the left-right axis. Because, naturally, centrist views hold that "some amount of rape and genocide is good, but not all the time - like snacks or video games".
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Jun 9, 2015 10:04
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*sigh* I should have known when I saw 30 new posts in as many seconds. Hey QM, could you do an effort post on what a knowledge economy is and how it works? It's not a concept I'm overly familiar with. Skimreading this poo poo fight suggests that Intellectual Property isn't the main export, and in this case, what is?
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Jun 9, 2015 10:08
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quote:Scott Morrison was made aware in December 2013 of serious allegations of sexual abuse at Australia’s detention centre on Nauru, almost a year before a full review into allegations was commissioned, a Senate inquiry has heard. Scott Morrison knew of Nauru abuse a year before government acted, inquiry told http://gu.com/p/49jxj SMILLENNIALSMILLEN fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Jun 9, 2015 |
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Jun 9, 2015 10:09
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Splode posted:*sigh* I should have known when I saw 30 new posts in as many seconds. While I'm not familiar with the full import of the term 'knowledge economy' I can still come up with a few brief examples beyond "licensing IP and getting swole-rich on the juicy royalties". At its most basic it's just having a country full of smart, educated, qualified people that people pay to solve problems. Say, hypothetically, that the world had been polluted into oblivion and we as a species were circling the drain. Australia, as a country with a lot of smart people well-educated in things like climate science and water management, could stand to gain a bunch of juicy contracts (from world governments or the private sector) researching things like desalinisation, better farming/urban water management, water recapture techniques, cloud seeding, etc etc - provided we actually retain those scientists as a resource and provide them with an environment in which they can work productively (we haven't, we're actively reducing qualified scientists and burning their working environment to the ground). Or maybe this internet/telecommunications thing is taking off and companies like Samsung or Boeing or whoever decide that consumers might benefit from being able to communicate more effectively and efficiently, they would then look around for research labs that can find ways to improve wifi technology in moving vehicles. When deciding where to invest their billions of R&D dollars, they tend to look for places that can offer actual scientists rather than plumbers and mcdonalds staff Or on a more widespread and lower level, maybe your company needs a website made or a CGI advertisement or a bit of software for managing staff payroll or for managing the temporal, financial and logistical assignment of contractors/duties/materiel for house construction. Those are all projects and paycheques that won't be going to plumbers and burger flippers Sulla Faex fucked around with this message at 10:22 on Jun 9, 2015 |
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Jun 9, 2015 10:17
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Sulla-Marius 88 posted:While I'm not familiar with the full import of the term 'knowledge economy' I can still come up with a few brief examples beyond "licensing IP and getting swole-rich on the juicy royalties". At its most basic it's just having a country full of smart, educated, qualified people that people pay to solve problems. Say, hypothetically, that the world had been polluted into oblivion and we as a species were circling the drain. Australia, as a country with a lot of smart people well-educated in things like climate science and water management, could stand to gain a bunch of juicy contracts (from world governments or the private sector) researching things like desalinisation, better farming/urban water management, water recapture techniques, cloud seeding, etc etc - provided we actually retain those scientists as a resource and provide them with an environment in which they can work productively (we haven't, we're actively reducing qualified scientists and burning their working environment to the ground). Oh contracting and consulting, of course. Now I feel dumb! Thanks Sulla
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Jun 9, 2015 10:21
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I added another short paragraph with a few more widespread examples. It really does cover so many things. Another potential idea, Australia's timezone means it could provide emergency IT support (not just help desk but active coding/bugfixing) for europe and america, both places that tend to have a fair bit of cash invested in multi-billion dollar 24/7 services and where qualified, high-earning professionals tend to balk a bit at working 9pm-7am for years on end But I'm sure the future really lies in digging rocks out of the ground and fixing pipes e: Hell, it could extend to the arts as well. Chinese businesses making ads in Shanghai could commission backing tracks or green-screen performances or whatever and watch/manage in almost real-time as the work is done in local studios in Australia. There are a number of reasons why that specific example is not terribly likely to really take off (regardless of how much they love white models in their ads) but it's a short example of how previously stagnant and tiny industries in Australia could really take off if we actually focused on converting into a knowledge economy, with the infrastructure to back it up. Sulla Faex fucked around with this message at 10:39 on Jun 9, 2015 |
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Jun 9, 2015 10:29
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https://twitter.com/9NewsSyd/status/608191649265508352 @9NewsSyd Opponents of @JoeHockey within Liberal party could be eyeing off his job after comments on housing. #AusPol #9News Morrison's big break!
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Jun 9, 2015 10:39
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Don't forget home reno shows!
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Jun 9, 2015 10:40
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Ler posted:https://twitter.com/9NewsSyd/status/608191649265508352 Promises, promises.
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Jun 9, 2015 10:46
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I have money riding on hockey not being treasurer come the election so please don't get my hopes up auspol
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Jun 9, 2015 10:50
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Ler posted:https://twitter.com/9NewsSyd/status/608191649265508352 Opponents of Joe Hockey have been eyeing off his job since at least 2011, I'll believe it when it happens.
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Jun 9, 2015 10:54
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I don't care if it happens or doesn't, I just want the media to rekindle the spill fire. This government is getting such a free ride, I want every question put to Abbott from here til the gallows to be "Can you comment on rumours that there is a spill movement against you? Do you think your government will last out the week?"
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Jun 9, 2015 10:58
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Most conservatives I know think he's an idiot so I assume he's not that well liked by the Liberal base. That said, I used to have a co-worker who thought Hockey was "down to earth"
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Jun 9, 2015 10:59
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Big Willy Style posted:I have money riding on hockey not being treasurer come the election so please don't get my hopes up auspol I read the transcript wondering if this might be some kind of beat up. No, I should have just accepted it on face value. Another rambling, train wreck of an interview by an idiot who talks all around the problem, makes it worse and then doesn't know when to shut up. I hope you cash in soon.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:01
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The essence behind the so-called "knowledge economy" is that it is using specialist knowledge to contribute to the production of goods and services. So on the one hand, yes, some of that might entail producing things that are intangible and are in the realm of IP. But not all intellectual property is as easily abused and universal as things like "Music" or "Software". Intellectual property applies to things with a limited lifespan. Ad copy, for example, only lasts as long as that ad campaign does, before it becomes pretty much a historical artifact. The provision of advice, recommendations, analysis, all these things are processes that can be applied to people who have acquired and honed specialist skills in their chosen field. Whether they can attract a premium for their labour depends on the traditional factors of how much regular and peak demand there is for their skillset, how good they are at it, what their reputation is - but also how many people are in that industry in comparison. This includes academics, who are often at the forefront of thinking in a particular industry, but in this country they often face significant discrimination from employers because they're seen as applying for jobs below their pay grade, and also as a threat to managers who don't like the idea of employing somebody who has evidence that they're smarter than their boss.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:01
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The only compelling argument I've ever found for Joe Hockey's 'popularity' is friendlyjordies' wherein he looks like a chubby preteen kid that's always getting bullied and accidentally breaks everything he touches no matter how hard he tries, so you can't help but pity him and sneak him little treats and chocolates under the table
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Jun 9, 2015 11:02
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I can't imagine Abbott staying more then a month or two after any point where Hockey leaves. If the momentum gets up that Hockey is needed to be replaced as treasurer, it seems like it would just be to good an opportunity for the Lib members against Abbott to call for a complete fresh start. Pretty sure Abbott knows this as well.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:09
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Les Affaires posted:The essence behind the so-called "knowledge economy" is that it is using specialist knowledge to contribute to the production of goods and services. So on the one hand, yes, some of that might entail producing things that are intangible and are in the realm of IP. But not all intellectual property is as easily abused and universal as things like "Music" or "Software". I'm good with that, but without revisiting some of the posts above the original context of this discussion was the mining industry and manufacturing industry. Obviously there are lots of skill sets across these sectors but how do you shift the economy from A to B without scrap heaping a bunch of people? Not everyone is going to want to or will be able to embrace a "knowledge economy". To your point, even if people make the transition you would think it's going to be tough as there are probably a lot of people ahead of them in the game.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:11
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dr_rat posted:I can't imagine Abbott staying more then a month or two after any point where Hockey leaves. If the momentum gets up that Hockey is needed to be replaced as treasurer, it seems like it would just be to good an opportunity for the Lib members against Abbott to call for a complete fresh start. I think you are spot on with that assessment. However, it's probably something more mutually assured destruction, "Tony, if I'm finished, so are you."
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Jun 9, 2015 11:14
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Graic Gabtar posted:I'm good with that, but without revisiting some of the posts above the original context of this discussion was the mining industry and manufacturing industry. We shape our environment and our environment shapes us. The only way to do so sustainably into the long term is through cultural change and political/structural change. Cultural change unfortunately is really REALLY difficult to shift, and that makes the political and structural change also difficult. But some of the structures that can be put in place are things that, for example, reduce the volatility of the mining industry (removing the boom-bust structure), and at the same time setting up the structures required to encourage the sustainable development of specialist industries. Funnily enough, selling specialist services is closely aligned with manufacturing, it's just that as average education increases, your manufacturing can increase to be more complex - hi tech. Both of them benefit from a steady dollar in which to export to overseas markets at an attractive and predictable rate. Unfortunately, as long as mining exports continue to cause fluctuation in our dollar, it is unwise to ever invest a substantial sum of money into manufacturing for exports because your margins could be squeezed unpredictably by a sudden change in the mining environment. Leading again, to the implementation of certain measures that reduce the boom-bust cycle in that industry. I can't seem to figure out what would do that though.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:18
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If it's mutually assured destruction who is Russia and who is the USA? Hockey takes up a vast space while offering little of value other than hot air so he is probably Russia in this analogy
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Jun 9, 2015 11:19
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Graic Gabtar posted:Obviously there are lots of skill sets across these sectors but how do you shift the economy from A to B without scrap heaping a bunch of people? This is a real problem and I wish I knew the answer, or even a credible potential answer. It'll work itself out, but it'll take a generation.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:23
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Well said Joe!!! The sense of entitlement in this country is overwhelming at the moment. The same people complaining about not being able to own a house would be even more upset if Joe had suggested they should give up the second car / overseas holidays / eating out / the latest fashions / the latest electronics gear etc etc not to mention the idea that they are entitled and should be able to get a 4 x 2 home as a first property. Bowen's and the Greens' comments are facile and only encourage the sense of entitlement. If Bowen is so concerned about the earnings of nurses perhaps he could tell us what he did about lifting them when Labor was in Government.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:29
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Les Affaires posted:We shape our environment and our environment shapes us. The only way to do so sustainably into the long term is through cultural change and political/structural change. Les Affaires posted:Cultural change unfortunately is really REALLY difficult to shift, and that makes the political and structural change also difficult. But some of the structures that can be put in place are things that, for example, reduce the volatility of the mining industry (removing the boom-bust structure), and at the same time setting up the structures required to encourage the sustainable development of specialist industries. Les Affaires posted:Unfortunately, as long as mining exports continue to cause fluctuation in our dollar, it is unwise to ever invest a substantial sum of money into manufacturing for exports because your margins could be squeezed unpredictably by a sudden change in the mining environment. Leading again, to the implementation of certain measures that reduce the boom-bust cycle in that industry. There are probably a few things we could take advantage of what we do today but there's always disagreement over what is a "good" industry for Australia to be into.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:36
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Sulla-Marius 88 posted:I don't care if it happens or doesn't, I just want the media to rekindle the spill fire. This government is getting such a free ride, I want every question put to Abbott from here til the gallows to be "Can you comment on rumours that there is a spill movement against you? Do you think your government will last out the week?" They've already anointed Morrison as leader-in-waiting; going after Hockey and/or Abbott won't signify a shift towards a more critical or responsible press, they'll just push until they get the leader they want and then it'll be business as usual, ie the government will resume doing abominable poo poo and saying stupid things and noone will care.
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Jun 9, 2015 11:46
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Jumpingmanjim posted:Well said Joe!!! The sense of entitlement in this country is overwhelming at the moment. The same people complaining about not being able to own a house would be even more upset if Joe had suggested they should give up the second car / overseas holidays / eating out / the latest fashions / the latest electronics gear etc etc not to mention the idea that they are entitled and should be able to get a 4 x 2 home as a first property. Bowen's and the Greens' comments are facile and only encourage the sense of entitlement. If Bowen is so concerned about the earnings of nurses perhaps he could tell us what he did about lifting them when Labor was in Government. “What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.”
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Jun 9, 2015 11:53
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tithin posted:“What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.” 
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Jun 9, 2015 11:56
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Graic Gabtar posted:Well you could argue through want or necessity that is always going to happen. Your individual outcomes may vary which is the problem. You're right, but unless there is a national strategy to overcome the malaise, the choice is to live within it and adapt, or to do what you can to move somewhere else where they do take it seriously. A lot of people choose the latter because they get frustrated with the lack of national focus. Graic Gabtar posted:German car industry leaps to mind. Ticks many of the boxes without a race to the bottom on quality. The Germans benefited from the post-war investment boom but cleverly they also invested it into their national culture. To be German is to be efficient and high quality. What does it mean to be Australian? That's half the problem. Graic Gabtar posted:Above most of our pay grades. I don't agree that there's necessarily a "good" or "bad" industry for Australia. The question for me is what can we do collectively to ensure we can adequately sustain our quality of life into the future. The trouble is, a lot of people have a good quality of life already and ask "why change" when they don't realise maintaining their quality of life depends on that change.
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Jun 9, 2015 12:08
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Les Affaires posted:The Germans benefited from the post-war investment boom but cleverly they also invested it into their national culture. To be German is to be efficient and high quality. The German car industry also developed as an export industry, whereas the Australian car industry developed to take advantage of tariffs. open24hours fucked around with this message at 12:18 on Jun 9, 2015 |
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Jun 9, 2015 12:14
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Jumpingmanjim posted:Well said Joe!!! The sense of entitlement in this country is overwhelming at the moment. The same people complaining about not being able to own a house would be even more upset if Joe had suggested they should give up the second car / overseas holidays / eating out / the latest fashions / the latest electronics gear etc etc not to mention the idea that they are entitled and should be able to get a 4 x 2 home as a first property. Bowen's and the Greens' comments are facile and only encourage the sense of entitlement. If Bowen is so concerned about the earnings of nurses perhaps he could tell us what he did about lifting them when Labor was in Government. I love how you can tell that this person both has multiple cars, goes on overseas holidays and probably has the latest iPhone/iPad, and would be completely unwilling to give up any of them. Only people who have those things think everyone else has those things.
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Jun 9, 2015 12:16
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The mining tax was a good start towards limiting the effect of the boom-bust cycle, albeit pretty late to the party. All the so-called super profits it was supposed to target had dried up by the time it kicked in, so the labor party looked foolish for implementing it and the liberal party took the opportunity to throw the baby out with the bathwater. A sovereign wealth fund (beyond the future fund) would go a long way to helping as well, but it is ridiculously fraught politically. All sides in politics have to trust that the government of the day has the discipline and foresight to not raid the capital, and only take from the dividends. We have to convince the less fortunate too that the big hoard of money sitting there is better used as invested rather than just spent as part of the budget. Both of these can serve to change the capital and investment environment within an economy such that the various key indicators (AUD:USD, interest rates, cost of capital, etc etc) are more stable and therefore easier to start a business in. You might note the RBA governor expressing a lot of frustration recently because the government won't do any fiscal stimulus using the mega low rates, business won't do any investment using the mega low rates, but also the "high by historical standards" AUD to USD is preventing a lot of businesses that would normally start up from doing so. At a sustainable rate of AU70c per USD it makes more sense to create an export manufacturing business than it does at 77-80c:USD, and in the absence of a deliberate government innovation strategy (subsidies, tax benefits, red tape reduction, etc) the RBA has no choice but to try and do what they can to push our dollar lower. Their only lever is interest rates though, and that has caused the side effect of the real estate bubble we see now. In part as well, our dollar is maintained at the current high level because in comparison to other rates across the world, it's still pretty good. If you have a large sum of money and you want to shift it somewhere to earn interest, why pick the US dollar at 0% when you can pick the Australian dollar at 2%, and even higher retail.
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Jun 9, 2015 12:20
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Graic Gabtar posted:Not everyone is going to want to or will be able to embrace a "knowledge economy". To your point, even if people make the transition you would think it's going to be tough as there are probably a lot of people ahead of them in the game. The transition doesn't have to be overnight. It took Australia decades to shift from primary industries and manufacturing to service. e: and yeah, like LesAffaires says, many aspects of a highly-educated productive specialised workforce actually pair well with more "traditional" economic outputs, since having a powerful research sector allows you to produce better quality high-tech goods, which is an additional plus for Australia since it allows us to value-add our considerable natural resources instead of simply crushing them up and selling them off overseas. Quantum Mechanic fucked around with this message at 12:30 on Jun 9, 2015 |
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Jun 9, 2015 12:27
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Waaaah the Christians are out to get me
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Les Affaires posted:I don't agree that there's necessarily a "good" or "bad" industry for Australia. The question for me is what can we do collectively to ensure we can adequately sustain our quality of life into the future. The trouble is, a lot of people have a good quality of life already and ask "why change" when they don't realise maintaining their quality of life depends on that change. You can kind of say there's "good" industries for Australia in terms of where we have comparative advantage. Cheap fossil-free energy would be one - we have some of the most abundant solar and wind resources in the world, and if we get tidal sorted out, we'd be absolutely set. We've also up until recently been a major world performer in scientific research for our size. Really, Australia by all rights should be a world leader in renewable energy. It takes three inputs - steel and silicon, both of which we have the raw materials for in abundance, innovation and research expertise, which we have huge potential for, and sunlight, which we're bathed in.
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Jun 9, 2015 12:35
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