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drkeiscool posted:Shamus posted part 2. lol This loving guy "I'm not going to pick apart the science of fallout" "BUT WHERE DO THEY GET FOOD FROM??? MY HANDY HAS CONDENSERS" Apparently this guy forgot he was playing a shoot a mans video game and not a thesis on living in a post nuclear society
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Jun 14, 2015 09:07
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RBA Starblade posted:I thought Fallout 2 was the only bad Fallout. Shame on you.
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Jun 14, 2015 09:20
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Fallout 2 has such a lovely start to it. The rest of it is super good though
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Jun 14, 2015 09:23
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MisterBibs posted:If you're wondering how people in a 50s-inspired nuclear wastelander eats and breaths, and other EYEBOT ROLLCALL
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Jun 14, 2015 09:30
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SCIENCE!
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I must be the only person in the world not to mind the Temple of Trials.
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Jun 14, 2015 09:31
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I always assumed that the random junk food still being edible 200 years later was because of stupidly powerful preservatives, since this is in the 'future' and all that.
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Jun 14, 2015 09:40
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The temple of trials is basically the worst way to learn how to play isometric Fallout. Also if you go in blind with a premade character or your own custom abortion instead of using God's chosen agi heavy gifted+small frame character, getting to the end is a huge chore even if you have a good idea of what to do.
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Jun 14, 2015 09:48
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If you don't like the Temple of Trials just turn around and tell the guy you don't wanna do it.
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Jun 14, 2015 10:02
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Flaky posted:I just see 'critics' making the same dumbass observations about things they don't like again and again and proposing totally moronic solutions. I mean, criticise the games all you want, that's fine, we should all try to hold games to a high standard, and people clearly like the games and want to see them improve over time. But ultimately, if the criticism of the game is poorly reasoned, then that is going to be reflected by the mods put out by modders and by the developers in the next game who are going to presumably try to improve certain aspects of the game based on those criticisms. You want those criticisms to be well founded. I was merely being hyperbolic because it really is just a terribly thought through critique and really misses what the whole game and even series is about at a fundamental theoretical level. Like why are you even playing this game if all you want to do is farm or whatever? Those things are being critiqued because they are questions every other Fallout game has done something to explain or show signs of improvement in, while Fallout 3 just doesn't bother to. If you think it's a literal complaint like "if we don't see farms, the game is ruined forever", you really miss the point. It's about poking the gaming world with a stick, a thing Bethesda is being praised for creating every time, and seeing what holds up. And generally, Fallout 3 does fall short in these areas, where a narrative outside of the one stated directly at the player falls short in this one game. To contrast, Oblivion and Skyrim both had farms, while Morrowind did not. The reason why it isn't a problem for Morrowind to lack farms (unless there's a mushroom farming facility I missed) is because the story of the game isn't about food shortage.
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Jun 14, 2015 10:08
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Mordaedil posted:It's about poking the gaming world with a stick, a thing Bethesda is being praised for creating every time, and seeing what holds up. That's just it, that sort of world-poking is completely immaterial, and shows someone looking for a problem where none exists. Amount it matters that there's no farms or food-producing stuff in Fallout 3: zero point zero. The bombs dropped, everything is a wasteland, but humanity managed to survive. That's what matters, not where they get their food. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Jun 14, 2015 |
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Jun 14, 2015 10:10
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It does, however, paint the wastelanders as surprisingly lazy and incompetent for being such resilient survivors without a few more ranches, hunting huts and farms spewed about that you'd see even in the New Vegas Wasteland. Thankfully, you can see some some functional bramin pins around Arefu when you fix Blood Ties, so they weren't completely Bethesda about showing some signs of life in the towns before they were wiped out by a random Albino Radscorpion. Whether or not they matter in Fallout 3's lack of a story isn't as important as all these little bits spewed across the map are what certain people look at in between the VAT pirouette ragdolls and loot in Fallout 3's big nothing of a narrative. It isn't the best argument to make, but that doesn't mean it can't be made if it was better articulated just because you don't give a poo poo about it.frajaq posted:I always assumed that the random junk food still being edible 200 years later was because of stupidly powerful preservatives, since this is in the 'future' and all that. And I always assumed how fusion batteries and other electronics still worked was because of the Wasteland's miraculously long lasting radiation ironically gave us all the energy sources we could ever need without having to actually find and refine uranium. poo poo could easily be given even the simplest answers if Bethesda actually got someone to sit down and put it in somewhere besides loading screen text, but they're the same people that stick to the same godawful gamebryo engines year after year.
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Jun 14, 2015 10:38
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MisterBibs posted:That's just it, that sort of world-poking is completely immaterial, and shows someone looking for a problem where none exists. If that is how you feel, that's fine, but then you are not cut out for creating open world games, because for a lot of people, poking the scenery is what is important.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:15
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It's not like Fallout 1 had much in the way of answering what people ate or drank either. Well, besides human meat shipped to Bob in the Hub which was then shipped all over, seemingly but that begs the question of how did the meat get so well preserved during those journeys? The answer of course, being that it's a goddamn video game you spergs. Fallout 3 has problems where settlements stretch your disbelief, like intentionally building a town around an unexploded nuclear bomb and Little Lamplight in general, but the food argument is completely overblown. What do wastelanders eat? The eat meat, cave fungus and whatever they can scavenge out in the wastes from the various mutated wildlife.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:26
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Temple of Trials should have been an old church or something. The tribal motif in fallout 2 is my last favorite thing about it. Other than that fallout 2 owns though. I guess New Reno is a bit too over the top too.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:30
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MisterBibs posted:Amount it matters that there's no farms or food-producing stuff in Fallout 3: zero point zero. The bombs dropped, everything is a wasteland, but humanity managed to survive. That's what matters, not where they get their food. But humanity needs food to survive?  edit: unless... unless you're not human. ... are you an alien, MisterBibs? drkeiscool fucked around with this message at 11:50 on Jun 14, 2015 |
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Jun 14, 2015 11:43
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Mr. Fortitude posted:It's not like Fallout 1 had much in the way of answering what people ate or drank either. Other than the multiple farms in multiple cities, and Water Merchants at the Hub, and the water pump in Necropolis...
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Jun 14, 2015 11:47
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Cameron posted:lol This loving guy There are three games in the fallout series where the primary focus and often only method of conflict resolution is 'shoot a mans' and only one of those is in the main series.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:48
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drkeiscool posted:Other than the multiple farms in multiple cities, and Water Merchants at the Hub, and the water pump in Necropolis... What farms were there in Junktown? The only possible explanation is that all food goods get imported and then sold at Killian's store. Though my mind did slip when it came to water, somehow.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:54
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Is it really hard to believe that there were farms and the like offscreen?
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Jun 14, 2015 11:54
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closeted republican posted:Is it really hard to believe that there were farms and the like offscreen? So why does Fallout 1 get a pass for that yet Fallout 3 doesn't, despite Fallout 3 obviously being abstracted as far as size and distance between places in the wasteland go and the same goes for New Vegas where Primm is much further away from Vegas itself than is depicted in game? That's why the whole argument about food and water is spergy as hell. It's a video game.
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Jun 14, 2015 11:57
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Junktown doesn't have crops because its pretty much just a small fortified trading post/casino. You can tell that the developers devoted a tiny amount of effort to explaining the role it has in the early-postwar economy which is much more than you can really say for anywhere in FO3.
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Jun 14, 2015 12:01
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Mr. Fortitude posted:So why does Fallout 1 get a pass for that yet Fallout 3 doesn't, despite Fallout 3 obviously being abstracted as far as size and distance between places in the wasteland go and the same goes for New Vegas where Primm is much further away from Vegas itself than is depicted in game? Yeah. Spergin' out about how a society would work in-game is stupid because there's going to be a very heavy amount of abstraction on the game world for the sake of an enjoyable game. Some games may choose to add things like farms for variety's sake, while others won't.
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Jun 14, 2015 12:04
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closeted republican posted:Is it really hard to believe that there were farms and the like offscreen? It is just poo poo writing and setting design. The main plot's premise is that the wasteland needs clean water. But the actual settings seems to want to convince you that it doesn't. After all the wasteland seems to do be doing fine what with everyone having access to food & water. Also everyone's level of suspension of disbelief they're willing to go to is different. If this stuff isn't a problem for you and you simply don't care. Then good for you. Honestly. I'm not going to look down on you for that. Just like I'm not going to look down on anyone who likes a movie I find to be brainless. But sitting back and smugly calling anyone who wants think about a game's writing a sperg for wanting to think about a game's writing, is just you being an rear end in a top hat. Just saying. Raygereio fucked around with this message at 12:18 on Jun 14, 2015 |
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Jun 14, 2015 12:14
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The existence of farms isn't really part of the game's writing. Also lol you're a sperg
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Jun 14, 2015 12:48
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cargohills posted:The existence of farms isn't really part of the game's writing. Yeah, the non-existence of farms is a much smaller problem than the writing being absolute poo poo.
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Jun 14, 2015 13:20
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Andrast posted:Yeah, the non-existence of farms is a much smaller problem than the writing being absolute poo poo. it's a pinata of micro shitperiences
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Jun 14, 2015 13:48
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ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:I must be the only person in the world not to mind the Temple of Trials. It's pretty easy and short but it does scorn your feeble attempts to be a gun man. It's laughable if you wanna do punchmans though.
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Jun 14, 2015 14:08
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cthulhoo posted:it's a pinata of micro shitperiences A few years from now, people are going to talk about that Cream-of-Plenty post as a legitimate Todd Howard quote.
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Jun 14, 2015 15:29
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The whole "what do they eat" thing is largely because of that Shandification Of Fallout video and it's pretty overblown imo; people in Fallout 3 eat by hunting animals (the natural food chain presumably beginning with stuff like cave fungus and those tufts of grass you see out in the wild) and scavenging pre-war food. It's correct that this wouldn't be enough to sustain a population, but then the population in Fallout 3 isn't being sustained, most people are drifters or cannibals, the few settlements are barely hanging on because they have access to clean water and shelter (there are raiders trying to tunnel into Megaton because that town has clean water and only lets a certain amount of people come in as a result, which is why the Big Town people can't just move there). This gives the Project Purity thing a significance I don't think is ever actually brought up in the game, because with pure water you could irrigate the wasteland. Other Fallout games have farms and stuff because they're set in places which are livable to begin with.
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Jun 14, 2015 15:41
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The town being built around an atom bomb is a reference to a film.
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Jun 14, 2015 15:42
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Cream-of-Plenty posted:In the initial stages of Oblivion, Todd Howard wanted to "bounce some ideas" off of somebody for a few storylines he was working on, but nobody was available (who wasn't already under NDA) except for Pete Hines, who is borderline illiterate--and Kirkbride had already left by this point in development. "I never trusted him [Michael Kirkbride, chief writer of Morrowind]," Hines remarked. "He always wanted to work by himself, and focus on parts of characters and settings that players shouldn't care about." haha, source? Those guys were fired, right?
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Jun 14, 2015 16:04
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Mr. Fortitude posted:The answer of course, being that it's a goddamn video game you spergs.
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Jun 14, 2015 16:26
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Woah, apparently Burke was removed from Japanese Fallout 3, therefore removing the quest that allows you to blow up Megaton.
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Jun 14, 2015 16:29
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Mordaedil posted:If that is how you feel, that's fine, but then you are not cut out for creating open world games, because for a lot of people, poking the scenery is what is important.  For me, the verisimilitude of a game's setting is as much a part of gameplay as the pew-pew is. Don't get me wrong, I'm replaying F3 right now and it's fun, but compared to the realized world of NV, it just doesn't compare. Odds are, once I'm done with my refresher run through F3 I'll probably restart New Vegas.
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Jun 14, 2015 16:32
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sout posted:Woah, apparently Burke was removed from Japanese Fallout 3, therefore removing the quest that allows you to blow up Megaton.
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Jun 14, 2015 16:33
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Are you guys just looking for excuses to say "the writing is wrong"? I mean if we are about to sperg how things make no sense, why not complain what Geckos eat? How can huge Scorpions and insects exist at all, because their bodies would not be able to hold together increased mass? How the gently caress are Securitrons considered good design, yes give the robot that's standing on a single tire a rocket launcher, it will NEVER topple over! Where the gently caress do people get electricity? Why are psychic powers considered canon?
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Jun 14, 2015 16:37
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Mordaedil posted:If that is how you feel, that's fine, but then you are not cut out for creating open world games, because for a lot of people, poking the scenery is what is important. no but if you care about anything at all that means you're a sperg because as a goon i can't understand basic concepts
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Jun 14, 2015 16:39
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fallout 3 came out 7 years ago fyi.
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Jun 14, 2015 16:40
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Flaky posted:Bullet time, [...], etc are more bloat than improvements I find. Are you serious? The bullet time actually makes the combat fun. Like, I would actively seek combat for the first time in Fallout: New Vegas after I started using it. Watching This Machine cycle in slow motion owns
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Jun 14, 2015 16:41
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MisterBibs posted:If you're wondering how people in a 50s-inspired nuclear wastelander eats and breaths, and other ShadowMar posted:no but if you care about anything at all that means you're a sperg because as a goon i can't understand basic concepts
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Jun 14, 2015 16:44
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