|
TEAYCHES posted:How can you be so dense that you don't recognize that it's really hosed up that another Clinton is running for president in a representative democracy. We have over 300,000,000 people in this nation and we're looking at another Bush vs. Clinton election? Get a loving grip. And what's with those peanuts the airlines give you?!
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:31
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 20:29 |
|
|
Hieronymous Alloy posted:I think the fact that so many of our leaders are part of political dynasties is a troubling symptom of America's social and economic stratification. It doesn't automatically disqualify any individual candidate but it isn't a good thing either. It was one reason I supported Obama over Hillary in 2008 and one reason I plan on voting for Bernie in the primary. But it isn't a reason by itself to choose a Republican over Hillary, at least not for me. This is a reasonable opinion. I agree that Hillary Clinton would be a better president than Jeb Bush, however I am, if you will, "miffed" that these are our options. It's extremely unhealthy that we live in such an oligarchy and I do not believe that it's sustainable.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:36
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:This is a reasonable opinion. I agree that Hillary Clinton would be a better president than Jeb Bush, however I am, if you will, "miffed" that these are our options. It's extremely unhealthy that we live in such an oligarchy and I do not believe that it's sustainable. Actually, history shows that hereditary ruling systems are the most sustainable.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:37
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:This is a reasonable opinion. I agree that Hillary Clinton would be a better president than Jeb Bush, however I am, if you will, "miffed" that these are our options. It's extremely unhealthy that we live in such an oligarchy and I do not believe that it's sustainable. Well I mean, all of europe disagrees with that statement. Also you never explained why you don't think Clinton is 'running in good faith', I'd legitimately love to hear what you mean there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:38
|
|
|
Tatum Girlparts posted:Well I mean, all of europe disagrees with that statement. because she supported a lot of really hosed up "welfare reform" in the 90s and now shes giving lip service to populist messages. also she voted for the iraq war and that was a really bad thing that happened
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:39
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:because she supported a lot of really hosed up "welfare reform" in the 90s and now shes giving lip service to populist messages. also she voted for the iraq war and that was a really bad thing that happened Did you have the same feelings about Robert Byrd?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:42
|
|
|
Her lukewarm criticisms of the TPP are a patronizing lie.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:42
|
|
|
So which matters more, the content of a position or how authentically it's held? I mean I'm sure many of the Republicans authentically believe that a Christian theocratic surveillance state above and beyond the one we have would be better, but I don't think that makes it true. For that matter, how do we measure authenticity?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:44
|
|
|
computer parts posted:Did you have the same feelings about Robert Byrd? I don't give a single gently caress about that dead man.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:44
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:I don't give a single gently caress about that dead man. So you didn't, interesting.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:45
|
|
|
Nessus posted:So which matters more, the content of a position or how authentically it's held? I mean I'm sure many of the Republicans authentically believe that a Christian theocratic surveillance state above and beyond the one we have would be better, but I don't think that makes it true. History of previous positions and statements compared to current statements without any honest explanation of how her views changed. She is a PR managed candidate and if you think it's controversial to label Hillary Clinton as an unauthentic politician then I honestly don't know what to say.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:45
|
|
|
Guys, guys, remember, once a politician espouses an opinion, they are NEVER allowed to change it. Ever.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:47
|
|
|
FireSight posted:Guys, guys, remember, once a politician espouses an opinion, they are NEVER allowed to change it. Ever. Of course people are allowed to change their opinions, but I've never heard a good excuse from Hillary Clinton for why she thought it was a good idea to invade the nation of Iraq. Almost a million human beings died, and many millions were displaced in that conflict. Look at the region now, and what's going on. That is a grave evil.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:50
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:History of previous positions and statements compared to current statements without any honest explanation of how her views changed. She is a PR managed candidate and if you think it's controversial to label Hillary Clinton as an unauthentic politician then I honestly don't know what to say. What to say is "you are right" to that person, because they are right and you are a conspiracy theorist blowhard who doesn't understand basic concepts.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:52
|
|
|
The idea that Clinton's newfound populism is bullshit: literally a conspiracy theory.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:54
|
|
|
Nintendo Kid posted:What to say is "you are right" to that person, because they are right and you are a conspiracy theorist blowhard who doesn't understand basic concepts. Remember that time when Edward Snowden leaked thousands of documents about government surveillance to the press and you immediately sided with the government because you are bitch-made?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:55
|
|
|
computer parts posted:Actually, history shows that hereditary ruling systems are the most sustainable. the 2016 presidential primary thread: wherein democrats defend monarchy rather than criticize hillary clinton
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:58
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Remember that time when Edward Snowden leaked thousands of documents about government surveillance to the press and you immediately sided with the government because you are bitch-made? I don't because I didn't, guy who can't understand concepts. What I do remember is people like you swearing Snowden wouldn't have his leaks forgotten the way every previous leaker had for the past like 50 years though. How'd that work for you? 
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:58
|
|
|
Nintendo Kid posted:I don't because I didn't, guy who can't understand concepts. Yes. Concepts. Well, I remember. And I also remember you walking it back, because you are a bitch-made unprincipled dork who wants to appear serious but really believes in nothing.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 22:59
|
|
|
Hillary would've had a career without her husband I mean really she's at least just as good as Bill was if not better.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:00
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Yes. Concepts. Well, I remember. And I also remember you walking it back, because you are a bitch-made unprincipled dork who wants to appear serious but really believes in nothing. I believe in plenty of things, you on the other hand are both a liar and quite ignorant. Have fun being politically irrelevant!
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:00
|
|
|
Nintendo Kid posted:I believe in plenty of things, you on the other hand are both a liar and quite ignorant. Have fun being politically irrelevant! lmao owned
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:02
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Of course people are allowed to change their opinions, but I've never heard a good excuse from Hillary Clinton for why she thought it was a good idea to invade the nation of Iraq. Almost a million human beings died, and many millions were displaced in that conflict. Look at the region now, and what's going on. That is a grave evil. Hmm, if only there was some well respected military leader that made the argument to go to Iraq and was only later proven false.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:04
|
|
|
computer parts posted:Hmm, if only there was some well respected military leader that made the argument to go to Iraq and was only later proven false. Which one? Are you serious?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:06
|
|
|
Sheng-ji Yang posted:the 2016 presidential primary thread: wherein democrats defend monarchy rather than criticize hillary clinton That wasn't a defense of monarchy. TEAYCHES posted:Yes. Concepts. Well, I remember. And I also remember you walking it back, because you are a bitch-made unprincipled dork who wants to appear serious but really believes in nothing. What does 'bitch-made' mean?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:08
|
|
|
Clearly Bernie Sanders would make better foreign policy decisions as President since he had the prescience to vote against invading Iraq.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:08
|
|
|
FireSight posted:Guys, guys, remember, once a politician espouses an opinion, they are NEVER allowed to change it. Ever. Kerry is a "flip flopper" (animates picture of John Kerry sail surfing so that the picture flips back and forth)
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:09
|
|
|
Obdicut posted:What does 'bitch-made' mean? Bitch-made means that you have no basic ethics and you don't care about the repercussions of your nation's actions, or the people who suffer and die because of it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:11
|
|
|
Sheng-ji Yang posted:Clearly Bernie Sanders would make better foreign policy decisions as President since he had the prescience to vote against invading Iraq. I agree. Crossposting from the Bernie thread. Scinon posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx2lxWD7WJ4
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:11
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Bitch-made means that you have no basic ethics and you don't care about the repercussions of your nation's actions, or the people who suffer and die because of it. Coincidentally a definition you applied to Hillary Clinton.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:11
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Which one? Are you serious? I wish I wasn't serious about that, gently caress this planet. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:13
|
|
|
computer parts posted:Coincidentally a definition you applied to Hillary Clinton. Yes, being a senator and voting for the Iraq War, is a really hosed up thing. The reason why it was hosed up is because hundreds of thousands of humans died and millions were displaced. Also as the smoke cleared we now have an even worse situation in the Middle East.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:13
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Yes, being a senator and voting for the Iraq War, is a really hosed up thing. The reason why it was hosed up is because hundreds of thousands of humans died and millions were displaced. Also as the smoke cleared we now have an even worse situation in the Middle East. So by the transitive property, Hillary Clinton is "bitch-made".
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:13
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:Bitch-made means that you have no basic ethics and you don't care about the repercussions of your nation's actions, or the people who suffer and die because of it. Maybe he just has a different opinion than you, but actually has ethics and cares about stuff.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:15
|
|
|
Obdicut posted:I think we should have worse candidates, and more of them should be closely related to each other. Roger Clinton 2016  This thread always straddles the line between cool and good (thanks mostly to Joementum and a few others for breaking up the bullshit with actual content and saving the day), and completely loving insufferable. Hillary's like pretty much the same as Ted Cruz, guys, if Bernie doesn't win I'm taking my ball and going home. Vote GOP because the dem isn't immediately instituting full communism. Christ, some of you guys are just as bad at conservatives, in that you're just as obsessed with ideological purity and that you concern yourselves only with the immediate future and never even consider the long view.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:16
|
|
|
Its the loving primary season dude.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:18
|
|
|
Obdicut posted:Maybe he just has a different opinion than you, but actually has ethics and cares about stuff. I think that anyone who proclaims themselves to be a liberal yet types out apologetics for grave war crimes and other disasters; and the people who supported such crimes, does not have any room to speak about the future of this nation.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:19
|
|
|
The whole argument that Hillary was deceived into the war and really had no other choice but to vote yes falls apart when her competition in the primary said this at the same time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdFw1btbkLM
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:21
|
|
|
TEAYCHES posted:I think that anyone who proclaims themselves to be a liberal yet types out apologetics for grave war crimes and other disasters; and the people who supported such crimes, does not have any room to speak about the future of this nation. Okay, so what's your plan? Is it tell people they're bitch-made?
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 20:29 |
|
|
Then I guess you have to be two standard deviations to the left of the political center to have a right to talk about the nation's future. gently caress pragmatism, that's for weak babies and sheeple.
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2015 23:22
|
|