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This is just gonna keep going like an endlessly spinning wheel that goes nowhere. I've learned some fascinating things about how the Roma are inherently incapable of integrating into glorious western civilization and about various leftist conspiracies to kill black men and make video games terrible, though. E: Witcher 3 has very little diversity, which is bad. It has a lot of interesting stuff on how the devs interpret how life was in medieval eastern europe with magic mutants added in, lots of cool slavic mythology, and is pretty uncompromising in its portrayal of how brutal and terrible war can be for people caught in the middle of it, and also viking celts, which makes it an awesome game. It has only one gay man in it, which I think sucks. In total: great game, could be more diverse. All gamers should be killed, hail satan. murphyslaw fucked around with this message at 00:27 on Jun 28, 2015 |
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Jun 28, 2015 00:21
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murphyslaw posted:This is just gonna keep going like an endlessly spinning wheel that goes nowhere. I've learned some fascinating things about how the Roma are inherently incapable of integrating into glorious western civilization and about various leftist conspiracies to kill black men and make video games terrible, though. That was figured out long before the conversation started here. Just sit back and watch twitter cannibalize itself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTLqp-KKuo4
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Jun 28, 2015 00:23
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InsanityIsCrazy posted:That was figured out long before the conversation started here. Just sit back and watch twitter cannibalize itself. The moment you get seriously invested is the moment you lose.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:23
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The whole argument is retarded. Witcher portrays racism with elves and dwarves quite realisticly yet people demand their token ethnicity just for the ease of mind, nevermind that they would most definietly would be portrayed as slaves or as an enemy.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:24
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:This is two controversies conflated. There's Witcher 3, and there's an RPG about 14th Century Bohemia (Kingdom Come. Deliverance, I believe). Ah, I hadn't heard much about the second game. Witcher 3 is still filled with a ton of Tolkien fantasy stuff though that kind of dilutes any arguments based on being faithful to slavic culture. 15th century Bohemia was also pretty far from being some isolated "whites only" region.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:25
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poptart_fairy posted:Male only, but the game cracked a number of jokes based on your skin tone. Ask Lightbox Interactive, they made Emmett Graves. I mean holy poo poo, just make a strong character without stereotypes. I mean Jade from Beyond Good and Evil is a great character.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:26
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blackguy32 posted:Ask Lightbox Interactive, they made Emmett Graves. I mean holy poo poo, just make a strong character without stereotypes. I mean Jade from Beyond Good and Evil is a great character. I thought Lee from the Walking Dead games was well written. Same for Clem in 2.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:28
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The whole "tokenism" thing also tends to come back to the idea that "white male" is the default and any deviations to that must justify their existence.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:28
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Zerilan posted:Ah, I hadn't heard much about the second game. Witcher 3 is still filled with a ton of Tolkien fantasy stuff though that kind of dilutes any arguments based on being faithful to slavic culture. 15th century Bohemia was also pretty far from being some isolated "whites only" region. If you want an in-universe explanation then black people just don't exist.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:30
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blackguy32 posted:Ask Lightbox Interactive, they made Emmett Graves. I mean holy poo poo, just make a strong character without stereotypes. I mean Jade from Beyond Good and Evil is a great character. How were they minority characters without simply being reskinned white people is what I'm asking though, as that seems to be a fairly common criticism I see whenever examples of minority leads get brought up in the first place.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:30
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Zerilan posted:The whole "tokenism" thing also tends to come back to the idea that "white male" is the default and any deviations to that must justify their existence. On the other hand, if said deviation is not written / displayed "well enough," the devs will be the first against the twitter wall. There was a picture of someone comparing Guybrush Threepwood to a gendered opposite, Galbrush, that laid out some of the finer points. I'll see if I can find it.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:31
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There is apparently a southern country in the Witcher where, not black people, but certainly people who are swarthier than what we would usually consider "white" live. The Witcher 3 takes place in the northern regions, though.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:31
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The Witcher is really deep in its interaction with racial issues, in how it portrays the racism displayed towards the Tall White Guys with Pointy Ears, and the Short White Guys with Beards. They are metaphors for Racism, and it is really deep. Great game, could use some actual minorities in it. 65 hours played, love it. But no secretly I hate it and want to shoot every copy of it into the sun.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:32
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We must capture and depict the inherent and fundamental difference between Whites and not-Whites.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:32
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Oh hey, I found the old Slate article about twitter being terrible for this kind of poo poo: http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/technology/2014/10/twitter_is_broken_gamergate_proves_it.html quote:GamaSutra editor-at-large Leigh Alexander wrote a “gamers are over” article in which she called gamers “these obtuse shitslingers, these wailing hyper-consumers, these childish internet-arguers.” Her article prompted Intel to pull an ad campaign from GamaSutra last week, presumably on the grounds of needing those hyper-consumers’ money. Alexander’s Twitter stream is arguably even less temperate, with remarks such as “it’s funny how dudes who are ‘aspiring games journalists’ tweet bullshit at me as if I cannot instantly kill all their dreams” and “maybe mean of me to burn a young female writer but, sorry, this is not gonna be a career for her.” I doubt that GamaSutra would have published her statement that actor and GamerGate supporter Adam Baldwin “jacks off goats.” You are a professional writer who has just written that a mainstream actor who disagrees with you masturbates goats. What is going on with you? quote:Twitter drags everyone down to the bottom. No matter whom you unfollow, mute, or block, someone you do follow will sooner or later draw your attention to an outrage and encourage you to join the condemnation. On Twitter, negativity is viral.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:35
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Zerilan posted:Ah, I hadn't heard much about the second game. Witcher 3 is still filled with a ton of Tolkien fantasy stuff though that kind of dilutes any arguments based on being faithful to slavic culture. 15th century Bohemia was also pretty far from being some isolated "whites only" region. This is where I have to agree with GGers. Racial "tokenism" makes sense when the setting actually is racially diverse. e: Of course I haven't played Witcher. Do any not-Mongols show up? BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Jun 28, 2015 |
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Jun 28, 2015 00:35
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Brannock posted:We must capture and depict the inherent and fundamental difference between Whites and not-Whites. No, that would be bad and stupid.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:35
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Zerilan posted:15th century Bohemia was also pretty far from being some isolated "whites only" region. Actually, it's pretty far from any region that isn't isolated "whites only". The closest black people you're going to find traveling with impunity are in Spain. Yeah, there might be some ambassador at the King's court, but Kingdom Come takes place over 10 square miles of rural countryside.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:36
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murphyslaw posted:No, that would be bad and stupid. Yeah, I'm not arguing against the idea of diversity but as I see the "oh they're just a reskinned white" I'm genuinely curious how you'd make a minority character that didn't fall into that (supposed) trap. It's like how I see female versions of Bioware protagonists get dismissed as female protagonists because they're gender neutral, rather than written to be female - something I never quite grasped.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:37
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Custom characters are also bad because there are only 2 gender options.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:40
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poptart_fairy posted:Yeah, I'm not arguing against the idea of diversity but as I see the "oh they're just a reskinned white" I'm genuinely curious how you'd make a minority character that didn't fall into that (supposed) trap. It's like how I see female versions of Bioware protagonists get dismissed as female protagonists because they're gender neutral, rather than written to be female - something I never quite grasped. Me neither tbh. You can't please everybody. For my part I would be satisfied with a wandering trader being a part of the main quest or a jaunt into some foreign locale just to show that there's a world beyond not-poland. I'm sure that's completely stupid re: the books and tokenism or whatever but I think that would be cool, personally.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:41
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poptart_fairy posted:How were they minority characters without simply being reskinned white people is what I'm asking though, as that seems to be a fairly common criticism I see whenever examples of minority leads get brought up in the first place. How is Sheva a minority character other than basically being a reskinned Jill Valentine in all but origins only? I thought she was an ok character. I mean we aren't THAT different to white people. Yeah we have different experiences that color our opinions but its not like we are some alien race that only listens to hip-hop. InsanityIsCrazy posted:On the other hand, if said deviation is not written / displayed "well enough," the devs will be the first against the twitter wall. Nobody held Jade for not being "Latina" enough.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:42
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blackguy32 posted:How is Sheva a minority character other than basically being a reskinned Jill Valentine in all but origins only? Twitter and tumblr weren't a thing when BG&E first came out.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:44
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Personally, I'd love to play a medieval fantasy game where a Mansa Musa esque king from a far off land suddenly shows up out of nowhere one day on a pilgrimage with a massive entourage and a ludicrous amount of gold.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:44
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blackguy32 posted:Nobody held Jade for not being "Latina" enough. You sure about that?
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Jun 28, 2015 00:44
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blackguy32 posted:How is Sheva a minority character other than basically being a reskinned Jill Valentine in all but origins only? I thought she was an ok character. Well Sheva was born and raised in the area the game is set and still got complained at for not being black enough. 
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Jun 28, 2015 00:45
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murphyslaw posted:Me neither tbh. You can't please everybody. Our modern internet gadgets have cemented the fact that if you can't please one person, that one person will screech to their thousands of internet followers, so now you can't please lots of everybodys.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:46
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There are a few different non-white characters in the newest Witcher game, I just remembered, who are really neat characters. One of them is this kind of weird fey kid who is blue that you find in a hole in the ground who is hilarious, and another is a sympathetic succubus with brown skin who you can either loving murder iirc or let live (like in the Witcher 2). Problem is, none of these characters are actually human. I guess that counts in some way though. More learned people than me will have to weigh in on that.
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Jun 28, 2015 00:51
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Bholder posted:Custom characters are also bad because there are only 2 gender options. gender sliders are actually possible (and quite fun).
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Jun 28, 2015 01:03
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i dont believe you!
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Jun 28, 2015 01:05
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The Witcher is specifically based on a Polish series of books in a setting based on Polish history and folklore right? Did people also expect Koei to put Mexican characters in Romance of the Three Kingdoms?
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Jun 28, 2015 01:08
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poptart_fairy posted:Well Sheva was born and raised in the area the game is set and still got complained at for not being black enough. Given that you encounter literal spearchuckers straight out of a Tin-Tin book later on I'm surprised they showed as much restraint as they did.
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Jun 28, 2015 01:10
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I'm still amazed nobody on the team thought twice about that. I know Capcom's primarily Japanese, but even so. loving hell guys.
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Jun 28, 2015 01:11
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Squinty posted:The Witcher is specifically based on a Polish series of books in a setting based on Polish history and folklore right? Did people also expect Koei to put Mexican characters in Romance of the Three Kingdoms? Polish people are white and therefore do not get protection when making a game about their culture.
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Jun 28, 2015 01:11
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Turdy dick licker and holder of AIDS balls. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 28, 2015 01:14
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argondamn posted:Polish people are white and therefore do not get protection when making a game about their culture. Basically anglos, I hear.
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Jun 28, 2015 01:18
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Is this appropriate fodder for this thread now or do I have to make it be about Fuckin' Gamers somehow?
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Jun 28, 2015 01:27
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Who exactly (i.e. which groups) are part of the conspiracy to make games not fun? Blaming websites with millions of users like tumblr and twitter is obviously absurd. This whole 'anti-' boogeyman is really strange to me.VJeff posted:Is this appropriate fodder for this thread now or do I have to make it be about Fuckin' Gamers somehow? Why would a sports tweet be relevant to gamergate?
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Jun 28, 2015 01:29
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VJeff posted:Is this appropriate fodder for this thread now or do I have to make it be about Fuckin' Gamers somehow? adam baldwin will not be happy with this
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Jun 28, 2015 01:29
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personally i enjoy videogames. personally i am videogames.
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Jun 28, 2015 01:30
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