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GW could have just literally taken their existing LotR ruleset, copied the fanmade warhammer armylists for said (I would be amazingly surprised if these didn't exist), put it in a book and would have had a massively, almost incomprehensibly better game to release. I just...I don't understand how even that didn't happen.
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Jul 5, 2015 00:29
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I'm still trying to wrap my head around some units having the ability to deal a mortal wound on a save roll of 6. Trying to do any damage ti them entails them having a 1/6 chance to get a free attack back that skips the rolls to hit, wound and save against you  (Also happy birthday Joe)
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Jul 5, 2015 00:32
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lilljonas posted:53 minutes in, great review. Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. The game volume overpowers him in the beginning but he turns it down. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYoNhQevx08 BlackIronHeart fucked around with this message at 00:41 on Jul 5, 2015 |
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Jul 5, 2015 00:37
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I can't look away from this batrep. Its like a car crash that somehow keeps rolling to involve more cars you didn't realise were there.
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Jul 5, 2015 00:41
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BlackIronHeart posted:Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. I listened to this earlier today not knowing who it was. Best part is when he takes a massive bong hit halfway through to keep from losing control.
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Jul 5, 2015 00:41
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BlackIronHeart posted:Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. The game volume overpowers him in the beginning but he turns it down. This is already glorious. Pro click. Edit: adamantium|wang posted:I can't look away from this batrep. Its like a car crash that somehow keeps rolling to involve more cars you didn't realise were there. This is actually one of the less messy AoS batreps I've seen; most just end up with everything in a massive pile in the absolute centre of the table.
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Jul 5, 2015 00:41
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Joe_Richter posted:I would be amazingly surprised if these didn't exist I did a cursory search and didn't find any. Does anyone know if they exist? If not I smell a goon project! 
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Jul 5, 2015 00:50
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BlackIronHeart posted:Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. The game volume overpowers him in the beginning but he turns it down. this is good
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Jul 5, 2015 00:51
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That game he's playing in that video is extremely cool. The Warhammer Fantasy Mount and Blade mod is great.
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Jul 5, 2015 00:52
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"I'm going to use movement trays because there's no reason not to." *has moved every single model off a tray by the top of turn 2*
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Jul 5, 2015 01:02
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BlackIronHeart posted:Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. The game volume overpowers him in the beginning but he turns it down. I knew there was a reason I liked this guy, even if he posts streams of gameplay like my kid does
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Jul 5, 2015 01:06
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The only good thing so far is that I've discovered miniwargaming and their hour long battle reports; this pleases me. And makes me want to play Warhammer but not this AoS garbage.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:07
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Wait till you find wargamergirl, or the beasts-of-war Infinity ones (where they have one of the Games Designers in the room)
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Jul 5, 2015 01:12
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BlackIronHeart posted:Owen, the Chaos player, made his own video about AoS and he apparently doesn't feel a need to keep it PG-13. The game volume overpowers him in the beginning but he turns it down. this is a broken man
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Jul 5, 2015 01:17
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A lot of the stuff I'm seeing is stuff I'd suspected. The pile-in forcing models out of coherency, coherency resulting in wonky bullshit on its own, combats won or lost based on nothing except dice (movement? positioning? what are those,) no actual rule for what happens if you're out of coherency, no point in trying to negate shooty units because they just keep doing their thing, and every single battle report so far has been nothing but a pile in the middle by turn 2 where they roll dice for X hours before getting sick of it. But holy poo poo, the internal balance between warscrolls is dumber than I thought on top of that. Summon 75 chaos warriors every single turn while you can, they're about as effective as goblins. And I've started going over scrolls and discovering poo poo like wood elf archers being beaten by most other races' basic archers except for Orcs and Goblins in terms of actual damage output. I've been focusing so much on the stupid bullshit rules that I haven't paid attention to the numbers, and they are a total mess.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:18
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Rulebook Heavily posted:
Could it really be -that- bad? I mean, even the waterhead cadre that made this has to know that elves ans bows is actually a thing. I guess they had to balance out that Elf ballista that fires 72 shots a turn. Pfft. Yeah, balance.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:23
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So I remember when I got into warhammer 14 years ago the starter set cost me 80$ and I considered that steep even when I had a paper route and I was in middle school and was only paying for myself. So who are they expecting to spend 250$! I mean seriously who has that kind of money to pay for this poo poo? You know does anyone there understand ecconomics? I mean while I am sure a child might be willing to spend 120, maybe even 150, 250 dollars is a third of the price for a custom decent gaming desktop. Why would a kid drop that down on this?
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Jul 5, 2015 01:24
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Crowsbeak posted:So I remember when I got into warhammer 14 years ago the starter set cost me 80$ and I considered that steep even when I had a paper route and I was in middle school and was only paying for myself. So who are they expecting to spend 250$! I mean seriously who has that kind of money to pay for this poo poo? You know does anyone there understand ecconomics? I mean while I am sure a child might be willing to spend 120, maybe even 150, 250 dollars is a third of the price for a custom decent gaming desktop. Why would a kid drop that down on this? I think it's $250 in New Zealand and $125ish in the US. So it's madness, but not complete insanity.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:27
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Sephyr posted:Could it really be -that- bad? I mean, even the waterhead cadre that made this has to know that elves ans bows is actually a thing. It's apparently clearly and transparently obvious and you'd have to be a cheating WAAC not to notice that the "make 12 attacks" with a 6-attack profile line is actually meant to mean "instead of 6, make 12".
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Jul 5, 2015 01:34
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Moola posted:this is good "All you do is roll the same thing over and over and over again. How do you gently caress that up?" I like this guy.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:37
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lilljonas posted:Quick pool; which GW employee is going to get stabbed in a parking lot by a deranged WHFB veteran first? Gav. ro5s posted:I think it's $250 in New Zealand and $125ish in the US. So it's madness, but not complete insanity. That makes more sense.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:42
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I feel like I'm going insane. How are so many people defending this? How are so many people saying it sounds awesome based purely on a tribalistic hate-on for an imagined omnipresent-but-nebulous cheat-tryhard-tournament (delete as appropriate for your current implication) player? If there's anything I can console myself with it's that they're at least proving they're exactly AoS's target market what with going "Wark, wark" like a goose, which probably gives you some kind of loving bonus.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:47
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Because Games Workshop and specifically Warhammer is their team, and they're so invested in supporting them that any criticism of the game is in turn a criticism of them.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:51
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Sephyr posted:Could it really be -that- bad? I mean, even the waterhead cadre that made this has to know that elves ans bows is actually a thing. Wood elves shoot one attack per model at 3+ to hit, wounding at 4+, with no rending. If enemies are within 3", the only penalty is that they hit on 4+ instead. If we assume 20, that's 6-7 wounds per shooting attack (5 wounds if in combat) with zero rend (only once per game can you have -3 rend.) So an unmodified save of 4, which is a LOT of combat units, is going to reduce that by half, so have fun plinking at 3 wounds per. Let's just say we're shooting Sigmarines because I don't like them. The same amount of dwarf quarrelers hit on 4+, wound on 4+, have zero rend but shoot TWICE each. That's 10 wounds inflicted every combat round, and since the only penalty is that they shoot only once while in combat, they also deal 5 in that situation. That's 5 wounds on a Sigmarine unit to the Wood Elves' 3 (6-7 once per game.) They are, of course, way better in melee combat. But let's get really silly. Those Bretonnian peasant bowmen we giggled about way back hit on 5+, wound on 4+ and reroll wound rolls of 1. So at the very base, they're dealing 5 wounds per volley in or out of combat. Their once-per-game special ability, with 20 models, quadruples their shots. That's 20 wounds on average in one volley. Our target practice Sigmarines will suffer 10 on average after saves. On top of this, Bret peasants get melee stuff like stakes that inflict Mortal Wounds (no save at all) to charging units, so it's a wash as to whether they beat wood elves in melee. That is, if the Peasants don't have a nearby paladin. If there's a nearby paladin, they always hit on 4+ instead. Now they are just about as effective as wood elf archers without even using their volley fire. With that volley fire, they're doing 26-27 wounds, inflicting about 13 to a Sigmarine unit. And that's just some basic ranged units. Let's look at an actually good ranged unit. Dwarf Thunderers get -1 Rending on every single attack, automatically making them the best of these four so far. They only get those 20 attacks at -4" range from a bow, but they hit on 3+ (4+ in combat), wound on 3+, and inflict -1 to saves. That's about 9 wounds every ranged attack, period, saved down by Sigmarite armor to 6 wounds. Hope you like your arcane bodkins, wood elves. And oh, wait! Thunderers have TWO ranged weapons! And if you're within 8" of them, they can fire their handguns AND their pistols at the same time! That's 60 shooting attacks inflicting 27 wounds that are saved down to 18. And that's not even counting their melee weapons, because if you melee these guys then you're one poor bastard because for some reason their pistols are listed as a separate melee weapon as well so you get to use them in the melee phase too. But hey, at least wood elves shoot marginally better than night goblins!
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Jul 5, 2015 01:53
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 This poo poo is killing me
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Jul 5, 2015 01:53
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A guy on Twitter was really excited about it, because it was "Just what Fantasy needed!" and I almost engaged before realizing his photo was taken in a GW store in front of GW crap and he had GW promotional art as his page background. I think the bulk of people pushing this on social media are deeply personally invested in it doing well.
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Jul 5, 2015 01:56
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moths posted:A guy on Twitter was really excited about it, because it was "Just what Fantasy needed!" and I almost engaged before realizing his photo was taken in a GW store in front of GW crap and he had GW promotional art as his page background. This guy seems to think this is just what GW needed to do as well. Same guy? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-Ik-CJydW0
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Jul 5, 2015 02:02
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There has to be some paid shilling for this poo poo too. GW is all in on this, I mean they're giving away promotional and review copies of the starter set. When is the last time they did that?
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Jul 5, 2015 02:12
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BlackIronHeart posted:This guy seems to think this is just what GW needed to do as well. Same guy? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-Ik-CJydW0 https://twitter.com/spireland I think so! Funny (and depressing) that it probably is just the same handful of guys defending the poo poo out of this everywhere. There's a lot of "BOLS told you to hate it" going on, which is funny because this is the first time BoLS was even slightly critical of a GW thing.
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Jul 5, 2015 02:19
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Yeah, the podcasts have received starter boxes a week ago. This is GWs last ditch attempt to save fantasy. This is.
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Jul 5, 2015 02:26
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You'd think that they'd spend more than a single coke binge making the rules then
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Jul 5, 2015 02:28
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Talk to me about 7e Warhammer Fantasy with 6e army books.
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Jul 5, 2015 02:45
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dishwasherlove posted:Talk to me about 7e Warhammer Fantasy with 6e army books. Yes, this please.
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Jul 5, 2015 02:49
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Wow. This is loving disgusting. Some of those rules are so dumb, my head is swimming from the cold realization that an actual, established game company put those out in legitimate seriousness. Had they offered those "rules" as a friendly ruleset along side the new WFB, I could accept them. But as a real successor to WFB, it is a literal slap in the face to anyone who had any interest in Fantasy at one point or another. If someone told me that AoS was the product of a competitor infiltrating GW and putting out this garbage in an effort to destroy the company, I would 100% believe that. Either that or GW is built over an old hat making factory and everyone inside is suffering from mercury poisoning... Christ, not only do I ever want to buy another GW product, I am really considering selling all of my 40K stuff in case they get the bright idea to do something like this to that game as well. I can't wait to see their stock prices on Monday morning.
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Jul 5, 2015 03:14
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berzerkmonkey posted:I can't wait to see their stock prices on Monday morning. I'll be amazed if games workshop's stock does anything other than track whatever the major indexes are doing. Most of the discussion is in the GW death pool thread, but I've written at length about the severe disconnect between GW's major investors, and what GW does on the level that its customers (hobbyists) pay attention to. Sure, some hobbyists hold a few hundred shares, but they don't have enough clout to significantly move the price. It's the big guys - the insiders and the mutual funds etc. that hold tens of thousands of shares each - that matter, and they do not pay attention to internet rumors and forums discussing the latest game's rules. The stock won't react until AoS's impact on the bottom line becomes visible in a financial report. Which won't be until December/January at the earliest. Meanwhile, the next annual report is due this month, and the stock is going to react to that in the short term.
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Jul 5, 2015 03:29
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Leperflesh posted:I'll be amazed if games workshop's stock does anything other than track whatever the major indexes are doing. You're likely correct, but some stockholders have to be interested in the actual product, and will be seeing what the community reaction is this weekend. I imagine this will have some impact.
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Jul 5, 2015 03:33
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berzerkmonkey posted:You're likely correct, but some stockholders have to be interested in the actual product, and will be seeing what the community reaction is this weekend. I imagine this will have some impact. Unlikely, the stock price has never jumped up or down based on releases before. Lepers right in that the people that hold the majority are all huge pension funds and have so much inertia they really only react to the financial reports.
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Jul 5, 2015 03:52
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So, serious question. How many of you cool kids want to try WARMACHINE or HORDES for the first time?
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Jul 5, 2015 03:53
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berzerkmonkey posted:You're likely correct, but some stockholders have to be interested in the actual product, and will be seeing what the community reaction is this weekend. I imagine this will have some impact. It would be a first. If you look at where major movements of the stock have occurred in the past, they're always based on either the overall market moving bigtime, or on new information from the semi-annual reports. When GW surprised the market with a cut in its dividend, that dumped the stock huge. When they announced sales figures for their new line of paints were fantastic, the stock leapt upwards. When they announced changes in products? Release a new boxed set, like space hulk or something? It makes no impact whatsoever. A few nerds sell a few hundred shares, but major movements of LON:GAW happen on volumes of 100k+ shares. Over the last three years their average daily volume has been around 58k shares. Against that, trades of a few hundred shares at a time are nothing but background noise. If every gamer nerd dumps their stocks Monday, the stock might go down a half of a percent. But it also might move as much as two percent entirely due to the market as a whole being up or down. So if the stock drops a percent or two on Monday, it'll be indistinguishable from normal daily movements of the stock. 41 Institutional investors hold 71% of the company between them. None of those institutional investors are likely to be paying attention to what the internet has to say about a single new product from a company that honestly is not very important to most of them. Games Workshop is a small-cap company among thousands of small-cap companies. The funds that hold them do so mostly as a diversifying factor against other companies in and out of the sector and industry (Sector: Cyclical Consumer Goods & Services; Industry: Toys & Juvenile Products - NEC) and because they pay a regular dividend and have no debt. "Stockholders" always has to be understood in the context of who actually matters in the stock market. There are hobbyist investors who buy shares in the companies they feel loyalty to; most of them are unsophisticated investors and whether or not they make money on their investments in the long run is almost entirely due to chance. The investors who have the most information and who are first in line when it comes to buying or selling are the big guys who rarely consider trades of less than a hundred thousand dollars at a time, and when one of them makes a move, it's a desk trader whose actions have got to be justifiable to management. And that means based on fundamental or technical indicators, not internet rumors. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 04:06 on Jul 5, 2015 |
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Jul 5, 2015 04:03
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KuangMkV posted:So, serious question. How many of you cool kids want to try WARMACHINE or HORDES for the first time? I assembled the Menoth and Khador set I bought on eBay months ago 
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Jul 5, 2015 04:10
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