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Wanderer posted:The whole thing is a transparent reason to have a cool stealth-only prison mission, which would probably be eminently forgivable in a better game. Also if it was actually a cool stealth-only prison mission rather than a ludicrous combat-mandatory prison mission.
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Jul 13, 2015 04:15
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Wanderer posted:To be absolutely fair, and I mean more fair than the writers arguably deserve, it's not like it matters that much that the prison cameras saw him. Being "off the grid" has saved people a lot less connected than Aiden is. Any loner who shoots up a jail, when they have a photo of you and you walk around everywhere, you will be spotted by someone to make a phone call of the suspected perpetrator of the Jail Basement Massacre. Hell anyone in the motel, which would be the first place to look as it is with most crimes of this nature. This is of course ignoring that people before this could recognise him on the street by his name and take selfies with him at which point this entire post can be reduced down to "nope, this makes literally no sense".
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Jul 13, 2015 04:16
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The thing is that we've already had pedestrians coming up to Aiden and identifying him as the vigilante, there are news reports where the vigilante is identified as Aiden Pearce, when Pearce was being processed his loving name showed up and was read out.
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Jul 13, 2015 04:27
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There's literally a mechanic in the game where, if your reputation gets too low, civilians will recognize you and call the cops. Then the cops show up and you kill a shitton of them and get away. And the like, their search is over. Law enforcement is like, welp he killed the first 20 squad cars we sent after him, so I guess he just gets away. As if there's not a literal trail of destruction and traffic accidents leading all the way to his hideout. Like he probably ran right through traffic and caused a bunch of cars to stop immediately before entering his hideout.
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Jul 13, 2015 04:29
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Opposing Farce posted:Also if it was actually a cool stealth-only prison mission rather than a ludicrous combat-mandatory prison mission. Yeah, that's true. Lid posted:Being "off the grid" has saved people a lot less connected than Aiden is. Any loner who shoots up a jail, when they have a photo of you and you walk around everywhere, you will be spotted by someone to make a phone call of the suspected perpetrator of the Jail Basement Massacre. Hell anyone in the motel, which would be the first place to look as it is with most crimes of this nature. This is of course ignoring that people before this could recognise him on the street by his name and take selfies with him at which point this entire post can be reduced down to "nope, this makes literally no sense". There are no surviving witnesses to the Jail Basement Massacre aside from the guy who's theoretically been intimidated into not talking, Aiden doesn't show up on ctOS-enabled cameras (and there's apparently no such thing as a camera that isn't on the ctOS), and he's already hacked the jail's computer system once. Even if they dig up the guy who booked him and he were to say, "Wait, that rear end in a top hat's name wasn't Smith, it was Aiden Pearce," finding him's going to be a bitch for the aforementioned reasons. You have to wait for somebody to recognize and report him. I'm not really invested in defending the game, but it occurred to me reading the thread that the game's already addressed a lot of the issues people were bringing up, and in addressing them, invalidated the stated reasoning for him going into the prison in the first place. It's actually pretty funny.
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Jul 13, 2015 04:30
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Snak posted:There's literally a mechanic in the game where, if your reputation gets too low, civilians will recognize you and call the cops. Then the cops show up and you kill a shitton of them and get away. And the like, their search is over. Law enforcement is like, welp he killed the first 20 squad cars we sent after him, so I guess he just gets away. As if there's not a literal trail of destruction and traffic accidents leading all the way to his hideout. Like he probably ran right through traffic and caused a bunch of cars to stop immediately before entering his hideout.
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Jul 13, 2015 04:31
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Wanderer posted:There are no surviving witnesses to the Jail Basement Massacre aside from the guy who's theoretically been intimidated into not talking Just realized this is going to be a real awkward conversation when that guy is discovered. One live prisoner surrounded by a dozen dead guards? Hello multiple life sentences.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:15
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Edminster posted:Just realized this is going to be a real awkward conversation when that guy is discovered. One live prisoner surrounded by a dozen dead guards? Hello multiple life sentences. Well, the guards were shot in the knees by a shotgun, and the guy doesn't have a shotgun on him. Given the average competency level of the guards, I'm pretty sure they'll just say 'Couldn't have been him!' and be confused. And let's not forget the camera saw the Vigilante (or the pixel blur, rather) leaving the room, so it's possible they'll know the Vigilante killed the guards.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:18
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Snak posted:There's literally a mechanic in the game where, if your reputation gets too low, civilians will recognize you and call the cops. Then the cops show up and you kill a shitton of them and get away. And the like, their search is over. Law enforcement is like, welp he killed the first 20 squad cars we sent after him, so I guess he just gets away. As if there's not a literal trail of destruction and traffic accidents leading all the way to his hideout. Like he probably ran right through traffic and caused a bunch of cars to stop immediately before entering his hideout. I don't think you can hold this mechanic against Watch_Dogs since basically every open-world game does this, from GTA and Saints Row to Hulk Ultimate Destruction. Do enough damage/kill enough people and more people show up hostile towards you in finite amounts. Once they're dead that's it. Clean slate.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:32
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GeneralYeti posted:Well, the guards were shot in the knees by a shotgun, and the guy doesn't have a shotgun on him. Given the average competency level of the guards, I'm pretty sure they'll just say 'Couldn't have been him!' and be confused. And let's not forget the camera saw the Vigilante (or the pixel blur, rather) leaving the room, so it's possible they'll know the Vigilante killed the guards. Yeah, plus the guy doesn't have any powder residue on him. All the evidence would back up his story of the strange man who came in, killed a dozen men for mysterious reasons of his own, and left.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:36
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RareAcumen posted:I don't think you can hold this mechanic against Watch_Dogs since basically every open-world game does this, from GTA and Saints Row to Hulk Ultimate Destruction. What can be held against it though is having a morality gauge that doesn't actually affect anything other than how random NPCs react to you.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:37
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I liked the morality gauge in Red Dead Redemption. It had different, alternative benefits for being really good or evil, neither of which felt TOO out of place in a morally ambiguous gunman in the Wild West. and if you wanted to commit a crime without impacting your morality gauge? Well. That's what the bandana was for.
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Jul 13, 2015 05:46
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There's a mission in Saints Row 2 where you break into a prison (same prison you break out of in the tutorial), find someone, and then walk right out leaving a trail of carnage behind you. And it works in the narrative because Saints Row is a heightened reality where everything works on Action Movie Power Fantasy rules. The Boss can go where ever he/she wants because they're the loving Boss and they fist fight Micheal Dorn, have motorcycle sword fights with not-Yakuza, rob banks disguised as themself, and eventually punch aliens into space. Watch_Dogs wants to pull off this gritty, realistic world, but also wants Aiden to be such a bad-rear end that he can go anywhere and do anything (except overpower a man twice his age with a bum leg or shoot the bad guy when he has a chance or wear a t-shirt) and never does the game allow want to let these two ideas clash. And yeah, you don't want the player to get bored with busywork or feel powerless in an action game, but they could have used the semi-realistic complications of breaking into/out of a prison to actually make an interesting level or gameplay challenge. Instead you just stroll around a hallway, shoot some mooks, and walk right out. I'd say Watch_Dogs wants to have its cake and eat it too, but it really feels like Watch_Dogs is just demanding cake over and over without realizing it actually wants some pie.
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Jul 13, 2015 08:04
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Motto posted:What can be held against it though is having a morality gauge that doesn't actually affect anything other than how random NPCs react to you. That's fair. At least it doesn't penalize you for not saving people like that one Spiderman game.
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Jul 13, 2015 09:59
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Wanderer posted:Aiden has enough stroke in the ctOS system that the system's facial recognition software can't pick him up. You can't go looking for known associates; he has no friends, his family is conspicuously not home, and if they think to ask Jackson's therapist, she doesn't know a drat thing. You can't go to his house, because he doesn't have one. Unless they devote a bunch of units to driving in circles in the hopes that one of them runs him over, Aiden's a ghost in the machine. He could have spent the entire elevator ride from the prison basement to the roof waving his naked rear end at the nearest camera and it wouldn't matter. One of the recurring threads in Watch_Dogs is that they've hooked everything into the central system, whether it's traffic control, security networks, or even cheap toys, and that Aiden is the first of many ways in which this is biting them on the rear end. If the writing in the game were more competent, this'd be a legitimate plot point. For all the benefits that immunity and invisibility in the system garners, the fact that Aiden's a pathetic loner that's way too hung up on vengeance and romanticism would probably lead to some sort of downfall, or at the very least have a huge impact on how other characters interact with him. Of course, they couldn't go full-tilt with that ideal and had to give him a Really, Aiden Pearce is kind of like Travis Touchdown. They both live in lovely motels, barely have any social activity, most likely have miserable lives outside of their underground jobs, and (at least in Desperate Struggle) get caught up in exacting revenge - Except with Aiden's room, it's not really being highlighted in its introduction as a crappy nerd den, Aiden doesn't need to do any goofy lawnmower or coconut-collecting jobs to pay his bills, And despite being a creep to women and generally antagonistic to everyone else, Aiden's not getting into any kind of trouble for it. Aiden drags his extended family into this mess and gets a dead niece out of it, and somehow doesn't work out that maybe he should try and withdraw from the hacker world to stop more of his family from dying. Meanwhile, aside from a bunch of distant relatives that also happen to be insane murderers, the closest relationships we see in Travis' life are with a video rental store owner and a cat. In the original premise of Travis' character, he's in the fight only for himself, because it's made clear that he'll probably get killed in his sleep if he stops.
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Jul 13, 2015 17:56
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Seriously, Jacks, what the gently caress
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Jul 13, 2015 19:29
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That's not what I was expecting.
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Jul 13, 2015 19:36
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Speaking of Hank the Chog, didn't Chip say he lost that Duke Nukem Sonic RPG video in one of the streams? (The Parroty Interactive one?) I stumbled upon it a while ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJJSbId_W-U Gotta love them Chog origins. ...Chorigins.
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Jul 13, 2015 19:41
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Gamerofthegame posted:That's not what I was expecting. Yeah. What ever happened to a good ol' dickbutting?
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Jul 13, 2015 19:49
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Suspicious Dish posted:Yeah. What ever happened to a good ol' dickbutting? It just doesn't have the same impact now that it's the first thing anyone expects.
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Jul 13, 2015 19:53
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Geemer posted:Speaking of Hank the Chog, didn't Chip say he lost that Duke Nukem Sonic RPG video in one of the streams? (The Parroty Interactive one?) I stumbled upon it a while ago.
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Jul 13, 2015 20:45
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I don't get why Aiden has to be a vigilante in this story. I don't understand how a writer looked at this and decided that it was important and made sense for the narrative as it is presented that this guy is a vigilante. Because when the story demands that some guy breaks into prison to blackmail some other guy that could rat him out and he ends up shooting a dozen cops in the process then vigilante isn't really a thing that comes to my mind. It's not like criminal protagonists in open world games don't work. Why do they feel the need to jump through the hoops of making all these cops out to be cartoonishly evil motherfuckers, when the story, as presented so far, works fine if we just assume that Aiden is just a regular superhacker cybercriminal that got in over his head. And now he's out for revenge. I don't get the justification for him being a vigilante when everything he does in the story is just regular old crime. It's not like I can't believe it if they tell me that some criminal is a devoted uncle-father and gets along well with his ex-wifesister. At least he'd be honest with himself if he was just a regular old criminal rather than pretending to be a vigilante stopping petty theft before turning around and emptying someones bank account and then murdering some people for his crime day job. Is it just because the team came up with this silly facebook follower crime prevention mechanic and thought they should run with that angle to stand out amongst the competition? They don't really seem to want to commit to that theme. The new batman at least tries to make the idea of an open world game with a heroic protagonist work. It had to come up with a convoluted justification where the city is empty of nice people and they make everyone roll their eyes at the totally not lethal tank guns, but at least they bothered thinking about the narrative problems. That said, the car stunt from the prison looked pretty neat.
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Jul 13, 2015 20:48
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Great Joe posted:He literally made a game in RPG Maker and then lost the game he made in RPG Maker. Surely there has never been a greater loss in the history of Let Us Play. Oh drat. That's far worse than I thought. 
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Jul 13, 2015 22:01
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Does the reputation mechanic do anything other than affect how frequently the civilians call the cops on you? Because if so it's not a reputation track but a morality track and a really poor one at that since one moral alignment is clearly superior to the other. And it's not that hard to maintain if you can run around causing car accidents and firing grenades while remaining a protector or whatever a good guy is.
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Jul 13, 2015 22:40
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White Coke posted:Does the reputation mechanic do anything other than affect how frequently the civilians call the cops on you? Because if so it's not a reputation track but a morality track and a really poor one at that since one moral alignment is clearly superior to the other. And it's not that hard to maintain if you can run around causing car accidents and firing grenades while remaining a protector or whatever a good guy is.
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Jul 13, 2015 22:59
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Raygereio posted:Considering the story looks like it's cobbled together out of bits from several different drafts, it wouldn't surprise me if the Reputation meter is a remnant of a scrapped mechanic or something. Watch_Dogs is basically Raven's Cry but with more money wasted.
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Jul 13, 2015 23:31
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Suspicious Cook posted:Watch_Dogs is basically Raven's Cry but with more money wasted. I just watched the LP of that in the other thread - there is no way Raven's Cry is worse than Watch Dogs... Well maybe more hilarious than...
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Jul 14, 2015 00:12
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auzdark posted:I just watched the LP of that in the other thread - there is no way Raven's Cry is worse than Watch Dogs... Well maybe more hilarious than...
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Jul 14, 2015 00:15
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auzdark posted:I just watched the LP of that in the other thread - there is no way Raven's Cry is worse than Watch Dogs... Well maybe more hilarious than... I'm sorry, does Watch_Dogs have Aiden rape a nun??
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Jul 14, 2015 00:47
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Accordion Man posted:Watch_Dogs despite all its flaws is still a perfectly playable game. Watch_Dogs is poo poo in that it's a mediocre open world game with nothing interesting going on outside of people being morons and Aiden being a horrible character. Raven's Cry is terrible but it's amusingly terrible.
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Jul 14, 2015 00:52
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I'm pretty sure the guys in charge of the minigames were the b-team of Ubisoft... which means they may have been paid less but were also under less pressure to make stuff that conformed to the committee-designed diluted "vision" of the game. Hence Spider-Tank and the other awesome Digital Trips, the honestly-pretty-clever Chess minigames, the Coin Rush AR game and the other AR game we haven't seen yet in this thread.
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Jul 14, 2015 01:11
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Everyone at Ubi seems to be a pretty good video games person on some level based on some of their passion projects or even looking at limited snapshots of their triple-A titles. But somewhere in between the 18 functional groups working together there is a mechanism set to lunacy that makes the trains turn at 90 degree angles and turns the protagonist into some sort of anti-anti-hero.
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Jul 14, 2015 02:04
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utonium posted:Seriously, Jacks, what the gently caress I would prefer to play this game. Uncle picks up hacking to try and be cool with his nephew and hijinks ensue.
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Jul 14, 2015 07:26
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Watch_Dogs 2 is the story of Jacks becoming the new Vigilante and setting out to fix the image his Uncle/Dad ruined in the first game.
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Jul 14, 2015 08:01
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Leal posted:I would prefer to play this game. Uncle picks up hacking to try and be cool with his nephew and hijinks ensue.
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Jul 14, 2015 14:29
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I'm kind of (and also not all not) surprised that not once so far (or I think ever) does Aiden ever do any hacking to like, cover his tracks. Like that seems like something that might actually make sense, right?
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Jul 14, 2015 17:26
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Do we ever encounter any fixers that can manipulate faraway objects in the same way Aiden can, or would that be just giving the game way too much credit?
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Jul 14, 2015 17:48
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Some guy with pizza and a TV remote should be the new heavy.
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Jul 14, 2015 17:54
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Morroque posted:Do we ever encounter any fixers that can manipulate faraway objects in the same way Aiden can, or would that be just giving the game way too much credit? It's hard to say anything without spoiling but I'll put a vague answer here: Yes.
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Jul 14, 2015 17:55
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Last week's MGS stream is now up! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYEsdkpImoQ
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Jul 15, 2015 18:58
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