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Even outside of Hassou Tobi, physical resists were somewhat rare in P4 and physical skills have really good power. In P3 physical skills did around the same damage as magic but there was no Phys Amp or Boost so spells did a lot more damage in practice. P4 buffs physical skills to having 20-50% more damage over the equivalent level spell and also makes severe tier physical skills a lot more easily available than the severe magic skills. Add a chance to crit on top of that and physical skills are by far the most damaging things in the game.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:09
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ImpAtom posted:The problem with Hassou Tobi is that while it is the highest damage skill in the game if you've reached the point you can get it you can trivially kill anything in the game anyway. It's still fun to obliterate everything with that skill power charged though.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:22
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I'm honestly surprised that later SMT games make all bosses immune to all ailments and instant death types. It would make it more interesting if a given boss were immune to all ailments EXCEPT, say, Panic. Or if some random Tyrant boss was inexplicably not immune to Expel, merely resistant. Most people wouldn't even think to try that anymore, and it's not like the Scan-type magics show their weaknesses anyway so it's a risk. It'd be like Final Fantasy V. V has more tactical depth than any SMT game, even with Press Turns, because of stuff like that.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:34
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Pimp Drakula posted:Really? I must have missed out while trying to focus on knockdowns for all-out attacks. I've still got a couple playthroughs to go, will have to try physical damage. smh @ you not using the canonical party of Teddie, Chie, and Kanji
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Jul 18, 2015 06:38
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Tallgeese posted:I'm honestly surprised that later SMT games make all bosses immune to all ailments and instant death types. The design decisions all went to Etrian Odyssey instead.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:45
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Tallgeese posted:I'm honestly surprised that later SMT games make all bosses immune to all ailments and instant death types. You would need to completely rebalance status effects if you don't want the player to be able to just completely lock down bosses like in PQ.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:46
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Tallgeese posted:Or if some random Tyrant boss was inexplicably not immune to Expel, merely resistant. SMT4 actually does do this. Bosses that are weak to Expel in their playable forms can be IK'd with it as bosses. Like Asmodeus. 
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Jul 18, 2015 06:46
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Tallgeese posted:It'd be like Final Fantasy V. V has more tactical depth than any SMT game, even with Press Turns, because of stuff like that. While I'm a big fan of FFV, I'm not sure it's right to say that it has more overall tactical depth when that depth only becomes relevant once you impose large restrictions upon yourself, such as the FJF.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:46
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Ruggington posted:smh @ you not using the canonical party of Teddie, Chie, and Kanji Teddie is a waste of Yukiko's spot in the party, but yes Kanji and Chie are the correct remaining members.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:49
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Pimp Drakula posted:Teddie is a waste of Yukiko's spot in the party, but yes Kanji and Chie are the correct remaining members. traesto is best girl
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Jul 18, 2015 06:52
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WrightOfWay posted:You would need to completely rebalance status effects if you don't want the player to be able to just completely lock down bosses like in PQ. Yeah, it's a hard thing do to on the player's end. If you don't do it well it ends up as either gamebreaking or pointless. Sure, there are some enemies in FFV that have one status effect as a massive chink in their armor, but you can't really discover that through normal gameplay without either tossing every status effect spell you have at every boss or looking into the bestiary after you've already killed it.
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Jul 18, 2015 06:57
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Tallgeese posted:I'm honestly surprised that later SMT games make all bosses immune to all ailments and instant death types. In Persona Q, every single FOE and all every boss but one that I can think of is open to Panic and it absolutely trivializes them all The FOEs in the third labyrinth resist Light but aren't immune to it as well
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Jul 18, 2015 07:01
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WrightOfWay posted:You would need to completely rebalance status effects if you don't want the player to be able to just completely lock down bosses like in PQ. While true, honestly it's not as if almost every boss in SMT3 and DDS1 is not trivialized by a party with Dark Might and just beating them senseless. You can trivialize almost any boss just by finding and spamming their elemental weakness until they croak in short order.
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Jul 18, 2015 07:14
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WrightOfWay posted:You would need to completely rebalance status effects if you don't want the player to be able to just completely lock down bosses like in PQ. Panic cheesed everything in PQ because the game didn't carry over an important mechanic from the EO series. Basically every time you hit something with a status effect, the target built up a resistance to it. Hit them enough times with it and they become immune to it. It made status effects usable on stuff like bosses without running into the problems of permanent lockdown.
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Jul 18, 2015 07:16
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The problems with PQ's combat system were larger than that. You don't get to grow a resistance to instant death, for starters. I'm pretty sure that you could stack buffs in such a way as to kill pretty much any boss in a single turn as well. You really just needed the one panic to land so the enemy couldn't dodge anymore.
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Jul 18, 2015 07:56
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Pimp Drakula posted:Teddie is a waste of Yukiko's spot in the party, but yes Kanji and Chie are the correct remaining members.
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Jul 18, 2015 08:20
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also teddie's cooler and has better voice acting and doesn't make me waste time hanging out with him to make him better. teddie is superior 
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Jul 18, 2015 08:22
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oh wait we're talking about golden
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Jul 18, 2015 08:24
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... yeah his voice acting's still better, just by less
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Jul 18, 2015 08:24
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Accordion Man posted:This, Yukiko is the best healer in an RPG period. She's the best at healing and pretty much the best at offensive magic. She's boring
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Jul 18, 2015 08:29
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She traded an interesting personality for healing skills and magic damage. I can respect that.
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Jul 18, 2015 08:30
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SyntheticPolygon posted:She traded an interesting personality for healing skills and magic damage. I can respect that.
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Jul 18, 2015 08:37
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SyntheticPolygon posted:She traded an interesting personality for healing skills and magic damage. I can respect that. who, yukari?
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Jul 18, 2015 08:39
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Yukiko is waaaaaaaaaay better than Yukari as far as the actual gameplay part is concerned. Not that it really matters but heyRuggington posted:She's boring Still better than Teddie
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Jul 18, 2015 08:41
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Manatee Cannon posted:Still better than Teddie teddie in persona 4 is a good and cool character
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Jul 18, 2015 08:42
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yukiko drained his entertainment value like a vampire for the spinoffs which is why she is now good and he is now bad
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Jul 18, 2015 08:42
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Teddie in Persona 4 is ok but kind of annoying at times. He has some good scenes that balance that out and he's not a bad character on the whole; I liked him in Golden. Yukiko is still better tho
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Jul 18, 2015 08:43
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we could go back and forth on "yukiko is good" "yukiko is bad" "good" "bad" forever. she is amusing as a counterpoint to other characters but cannot carry a scene for the life of her until the spinoffs occur and she loses her marbles i m o. chie and yukiko are cumulatively one very good character
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Jul 18, 2015 08:46
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chie and yukiko- they cannot live without the other, existing in balance, much like yin and yang, or goofus and gallant
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Jul 18, 2015 08:47
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*holds out hands in ancient aliens gesture* but if that's true, could it be that these are not yuri fanfictions, but yuri fanfact?
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Jul 18, 2015 08:50
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All of the party members in P4 are good imo I'd just rank Teddie at the bottom of that list
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Jul 18, 2015 08:52
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alcharagia posted:we could go back and forth on "yukiko is good" "yukiko is bad" "good" "bad" forever. she is amusing as a counterpoint to other characters but cannot carry a scene for the life of her until the spinoffs occur and she loses her marbles i m o. chie and yukiko are cumulatively one very good character It's a good thing that due to the way the game works she only has to carry a scene in her social link, which is an incredibly small part of the game. Also probably why Atlus made her kinda crazy once she had to carry more scenes in the spinoffs. alcharagia posted:*holds out hands in ancient aliens gesture* but if that's true, could it be that these are not yuri fanfictions, but yuri fanfact? Yuri is always a fact.
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Jul 18, 2015 08:52
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SyntheticPolygon posted:It's a good thing that due to the way the game works she only has to carry a scene in her social link, which is an incredibly small part of the game. Also probably why Atlus made her kinda crazy once she had to carry more scenes in the spinoffs. this is true quote:Yuri is always a fact. hell yeah it is Manatee Cannon posted:All of the party members in P4 are good imo yeah honestly this. i give yukiko poo poo but she's a'ight i just don't like hanging out with her. the only one i don't like is naoto and that's only because lategame she becomes terrible, pre-that, in spinoffs, and on her own she's aces
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Jul 18, 2015 08:54
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let me summarize the facts of the case so far
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Jul 18, 2015 08:54
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Naoto has the bad luck of being a detective but not the protagonist in a mystery story. So once she joins the party she isn't allowed to figure out any new things about the case or draw connections to anything because that's the players job. So all she can do is summarise things we already know in case you have forgotten them, although it's not complex and was explained like an hour ago.
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Jul 18, 2015 08:57
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She got to figure out how Personas work after literally the entire cast forgot about it in Arena "You're not my shadow because I still have a persona!" I think she's the only member of the P4 cast to actually remember that on her own and it was treated like some big reveal to make her seem smart
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Jul 18, 2015 09:04
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Arena owns.
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Jul 18, 2015 09:10
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re: Yukiko, how painful is it to play the game without her or Teddie in party? Seems like healing would be a pain in the rear end and take the protagonist's turns, but I don't really like having one party slot practically locked down by either of them. (Even though my first game I did what everybody probably did and just kept Yukiko from where she joins until the end.)
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Jul 18, 2015 09:18
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Aithon posted:re: Yukiko, how painful is it to play the game without her or Teddie in party? Seems like healing would be a pain in the rear end and take the protagonist's turns, but I don't really like having one party slot practically locked down by either of them. (Even though my first game I did what everybody probably did and just kept Yukiko from where she joins until the end.) Yukiko is the best healer and the best offensive caster among your party members, so she's a big asset to pretty much any party, but the main character can do everything she can if you'd really rather not use her. P4 isn't such a difficult game that you'll suffer badly for not optimising your party composition.
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Jul 18, 2015 09:47
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By the time I got to the endgame, Yukiko was basically in my party to babysit them. Chie and the MC killed the bosses, while Naoto did all the work on the trash getting to the boss. I thought of replacing her but at that point she was more than 30 levels above the next highest member and she has a poo poo ton of spirit so I can afford to cast the heal everyone to full spell every turn. Though she does have the cool combo all out attack with Chie, twin dragons. No idea if there are others.
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Jul 18, 2015 09:55
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