Let's Debate the Police and Criminal Justice

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Let's Debate the Police and Criminal Justice

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

I've had a genie lift driving around outside for about an hour now, and for every inch it moves, it has to
BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP.

I probably shouldn't ram my car into the drat thing, because that would be a crime, right?
Yes, this is a joke, I'm not going to hurt anyone

Good lord, this is really annoying.

Edit: It finally stopped, thank you baby Jesus.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 27, 2015 23:41

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# ? May 30, 2024 14:37

Senf: Nov 12, 2006

This seems relevant.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 00:35

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

Senf posted:

This seems relevant.

That is really bad.

"hey, this guy's homeless and hungry, let me toss peanuts in his mouth while he is in handcuffs because it amuses me!" :nexus:

Pohl fucked around with this message at 00:45 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 00:42

Murderion: Oct 4, 2009; 2019. New York is in ruins. The global economy is spiralling. Cyborgs rule over poisoned wastes.

The only time that's left is
FUN TIME

As you know, Britain is a shining light of police practice in comparison with our colonial breth-lol jk they're just as evil:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...police_custody/

quote:

THE family of Sheku Bayoh have launched a campaign to demand answers over his death in police custody, following the emergence of disturbing new developments - including that he was not carrying a knife when apprehended by officers.

Bayoh, 31, was overpowered by police in Kirkcaldy, Fife, on May 3 and later died while in police custody. It had been claimed that officers were responding to reports of a suspect carrying a knife.

But yesterday solicitor Aamer Anwar revealed that the family of the father-of-two claimed to have discovered he was not carrying a knife when he was approached by police - who used CS spray and batons before pinning him to the ground.

Other facts surrounding Bayoh�s death, which Anwar and the family have uncovered, include details of how Bayoh who was 5ft 10in and weighed 12stone 10lbs was restrained by five officers �on top or around him�, including one officer who was over 6ft 4inches and weighed 25 stone.

Bayoh�s family also want Police Scotland chief Sir Stephen House to explain why the officers involved said they believed they were responding to a terrorist threat and whether that had any role in how he was treated.

...

Anwar described Bayoh, from Sierra Leone, as a �well-liked, healthy young man�, who had moved to Kirkcaldy when he was 17 to live with his sister Kadi.

His family say they have been told by friends of Bayoh that he was �not being himself� on the morning of his death, however they added that the trainee gas engineer had no history of violence.

Anwar said: �The family want to ask whether Sheku Bayoh would have died if he had not met the police.

�Twelve weeks on the family believe the answer to that question is no.�

He added: �I never knew Sheku Bayoh, he wasn�t rich or a powerful man but what I have learned in the 12 weeks since his death is that he has a stubborn family, who love him a great deal � three sisters, his mother, brother-in-law Adie and his partner Colette, who all refuse to be bullied, lied to or to be silenced.

�Six-month-old Isaac and four-year-old Tyler will never see their father Sheku again.�

Anwar said the family believed �negative imagery� of Bayoh put out by police had been used to enforce an image of a �mad and dangerous� man.

But he said: �It has repeatedly been claimed that a 6ft plus male was brandishing a knife when the police arrived and the media was told early that morning a police officer had been stabbed.

�The family also claim they were told in the hours following Sheku�s death by a senior police officer that Sheku attacked a police woman with a knife, hence why CS spray and batons were used upon him.

�The family now know as a fact that when the police arrived Sheku Bayoh was not carrying no knife, he never threatened them with a knife, nor was one ever found on his body.�

Anwar also called for answers about why Bayoh was apparently viewed as a terrorist threat by some police officers.

He said: �The family of Sheku Bayoh want Chief Constable Stephen House to explain to them why his police officers in Fife believed that they were dealing with a terrorist threat and whether that had any role to play in Sheku Bayoh�s subsequent treatment.�

Ade Johnson, Bayoh�s brother- in-law, cited examples of previous cases of deaths at the hands of police, including Brazilian Jean Charles de Menezes who was shot dead ten years ago in London while making his way to work by officers who mistook him for a terror suspect in the wake of the 7-7 attacks.

He said: �In the UK at least thousands of police officers have been investigated for alleged assault, most of whom have not been suspended. What type of society are we in? Who polices the police? Who are the police accountable to?�

...

The event, organised jointly with Scotland Against Criminalising Communities, was also attended by other campaigners whose relatives have died while in police custody.

They included Janet Alder, the sister of Christopher Alder, 37, who choked to death on the floor of a Hull police station in April 1998, and Marcia Rigg, sister of Sean Rigg, who died after being restrained at Brixton police station, south London, in August 2008.

For context, Kirkaldy is not a big place even by Scottish standards, and there's no reason that there would be a terrorist threat there, ever. Another article (which I'm trying to dig up) has police returning to the station to meet with union reps immediately after dropping Mr Bayoh off at the hospital to die. It's a story that has been gaining traction for quite a while, but that article is a good introduction.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 03:28

Sir Tonk: Apr 18, 2006; Can't post for 4 hours!; Young Orc

It'd probably be safer if the police just immediately killed everyone they came into contact with, it's the only way to ensure they never get hurt.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 03:44

Phone: Jul 30, 2005; 親子丼をほしい。

Pohl posted:

I know the story, and that is an animated video. I was asking if there was actual video. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Even if there was ever video, it would have mysteriously disappeared.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 05:11

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

LeJackal posted:

Not when it comes to being a public servant who can, with a word, condemn citizens to death.

Honesty is a binary thing with cops.

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 08:24

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

Agreed, a cop's word alone should never be enough to convict someone of anything, and "I felt threatened" shouldn't be enough to justify a shooting. After all, everyone tells little white lies.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 08:38

Solkanar512: Dec 28, 2006; by the sex ghost

Dead Reckoning posted:

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

This is pretty amazing. The folks I work with would face charges in multiple nations if they forged their paper work, but you're ok with outright perjury?

How do you feel about a ham sandwich?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 09:38

Zarkov Cortez: Aug 18, 2007; Alas, our kitten class attack ships were no match for their mighty chairs

VitalSigns posted:

Agreed, a cop's word alone should never be enough to convict someone of anything

This statement is ridiculous.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 13:23

Toasticle: Jul 18, 2003; Hay guys, out this Rape

Dead Reckoning posted:

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

Do you not think their is an ethical (and for most professionals a legal )difference between lying and lying about something that will harm or illegally help another person?

If a banker or doctor lie on paperwork to help a friend get a loan or scheduled drugs they can lose their jobs and possibly their medical license. Why shouldn't cops be held to the same standard. Lie on paperwork to cover a buddy or cause someone to end up in jail they should suffer harsh punishment for a abuse of authority, yes?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 13:26

captainblastum: Dec 1, 2004

Zarkov Cortez posted:

This statement is ridiculous.

Eyewitness testimony is not nearly as reliable as one might think, and the general belief that it is reliable compounds that.

http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.psych.54.101601.145028

http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/law/1/4/909/

Here's a full paper on the subject:

http://web.williams.edu/Psychology/Faculty/Kassin/files/Kassin_Barndollar_1992.pdf

The obvious follow up is that the police are trained to be better witnesses - but I have found no evidence that they produce more accurate eyewitness accounts than anybody else.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 13:33

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

I thought police were trained to use certain phrases and avoid specific wording in a way to make them clearer to juries and thats gives the impression of being more reliable. Them not saying 'uhhhh' or 'um' on the stand etc makes their accounts come across as more believable.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 13:37

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

Zarkov Cortez posted:

This statement is ridiculous.

Oh great! Then we shouldn't let people be cops who falsify police reports!

# ? Jul 28, 2015 13:59

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

captainblastum posted:

Eyewitness testimony is not nearly as reliable as one might think, and the general belief that it is reliable compounds that.

http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.psych.54.101601.145028

http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/law/1/4/909/

Here's a full paper on the subject:

http://web.williams.edu/Psychology/Faculty/Kassin/files/Kassin_Barndollar_1992.pdf

The obvious follow up is that the police are trained to be better witnesses - but I have found no evidence that they produce more accurate eyewitness accounts than anybody else.

Cops are not eyewitness's in the context he was talking about. They are trained authority figures.
This isn't about people getting stuff wrong, it is about someone having an unquestioned ability to have you locked up based upon not just their word, but the authority their word carries.
The reality of right and wrong or legal and illegal ceases to matter when any individual in authority can decide that you are guilty; and their word carries more weight than yours.

Edit: Yeah yeah, I know they are eyewitnesses in the most basic sense.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:16

Raerlynn: Oct 28, 2007; Sorry I'm late, I'm afraid I got lost on the path of life.

Dead Reckoning posted:

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

The problem with that worldview is that it conveniently ignores that you're advocating perjury, which should be a punishable offense, but never is. But don't trust me on that, go look up the number of cases where men were sentenced to death row on an officer's say so. Look up the cases where innocents either spent decades in prison, or died over those lies.

Someone should have to answer for that poo poo.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:18

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

So I don't check the news for a a few days and I miss another mass shooting at a theater?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:28

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:37

Raerlynn: Oct 28, 2007; Sorry I'm late, I'm afraid I got lost on the path of life.

Pohl posted:

Here's a good criminal justice story. An escort kills a guy that was probably a serial killer.
Not only did he have no money (to pay for the escort service), he had a loving kill kit in his car

http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/man-killed-escort-serial-killer-police-32728883

While interesting, I do have one burning question...

The gently caress does this have to do with police and the criminal justice system?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:40

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:41

woke wedding drone: Jun 1, 2003; by exmarx; Fun Shoe

Dead Reckoning posted:

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

Lying in a professional capacity is wrong, Dead Reckoning. There should always be a way to either tell the truth, or withhold information from those not entitled to it.

Things don't become moral the more commonplace they become.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:45

Raerlynn: Oct 28, 2007; Sorry I'm late, I'm afraid I got lost on the path of life.

Pohl posted:

This thread doesn't always have to be a loving depressive hell hole that only talks about cops

Vahakyla posted:

In this thread, let's wrangle about everything related to Law Enforcement, good and bad.

From the first post. If you don't want to talk about cops or the law enforcement system, go somewhere else?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 14:58

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 15:03

Murmur Twin: Feb 11, 2003; An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.

captainblastum posted:

Eyewitness testimony is not nearly as reliable as one might think, and the general belief that it is reliable compounds that.

http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.psych.54.101601.145028

http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/law/1/4/909/

Here's a full paper on the subject:

http://web.williams.edu/Psychology/Faculty/Kassin/files/Kassin_Barndollar_1992.pdf

The obvious follow up is that the police are trained to be better witnesses - but I have found no evidence that they produce more accurate eyewitness accounts than anybody else.

I randomly stumbled on https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c88LSHfucTI yesterday which was a pretty eye-opening (and entertaining) look at how unreliable witness accounts can be / how easily memory can be gamed.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 15:46

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

So Raerlynn made me think about some stuff and I came across this post of mine from the start of this thread.
I don't know who I'm responding to in this particular post, and I don't know the context of their question.
All I know is nothing has loving changed; well it is probably worse

quote:

That's the thing. Crime isn't about good and evil; nor is it about a good guy and bad guy. Crime is really complicated.

The things you were asking about are subsets of crime that have a lot of mitigating factors. Domestic violence is a really good example of a complicated issue that can't be explained in a post.

Policing is a very complicated issue, and people can't seem to agree that our modern police shouldn't be shooting people without adequate provocation. The police still treat people like poo poo, they are racist in how they view their communities and how they treat the people in their communities; and they don't seem to ever be penalized for their actions.

It doesn't have to be this way, but it isn't because we don't have enough studies or the knowledge to change it; this is happening because people like it this way. I'm not sure what you are asking for. Are you asking for a field of research and study that says better policing works? There are a ton of studies and field cases that show that to be true. We don't do better policing because our populace likes the current status quo. Well, since police have jailed all the black folk, they started to crack down on whitey. That is starting to piss whitey off.

These murders of unarmed black men are not new, they are just starting to be national news. This behavior by our police is not new... look up excited delirium.

To answer your question, yes, all of that research has been done and it all basically stated that cops suck. Now what do we do about it?

I like cop threads and I like to post in them but this really hit me because I know things are only worse since I wrote that.
I will freely admit that my posting has deteriorated in this thread because nothing ever happens. I personally can't be outraged all the time, not without lashing out. I've lashed out here, and I've been punished for it. The people we are talking about in this thread are never punished, not the way they should be.

My quote ends with asking what we do about the injustice. I guess I still really feel that way and want to know what the hell we do.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 16:45 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:11

peengers: Jun 6, 2003; toot toot

There are so many stories on here about corrupt police getting off with all sorts of stuff we should have one about an officer going out of his way to help a hungry homeless man:

quote:

A Florida police officer tosses peanuts at a homeless man and reportedly talks to him like a dog in a silent booking video from the Sarasota County jail released on Monday.

The officer, Andrew Halpin, also points and laughs with several sheriff�s deputies as the handcuffed man with one foot shoeless and the other in a boot then eats the nuts off the floor, according to the footage exposed through a public records request by the Sarasota Herald-Tribune.

Halpin had been giving the man, Randy Miller, a series of �dog commands,� a person familiar with the incident told the newspaper.

At one point, Halpin kicks one of the peanuts at Miller as he writhes on the ground for the snack. The sheriff�s deputies don�t intervene in any way, and one of them appears to hand Halpin more peanuts to throw toward Miller early in the nearly three-minute video from July 18.

Police had arrested Miller, 44, for trespassing and failure to leave a property upon order by owner in the city on the southwestern coast of Florida around 37 miles south of Tampa Bay, county records show.

Miller, who officers believed was drunk at the time, has been arrested 22 times over the past two years in Sarasota County on suspicion of crimes like trespassing, refusing to leave, and drinking in public.

But officials at the Sarasota Police Department and the Sarasota County Sheriff�s Office will be investigating the officers who appear in the video rather than Miller, according to the Herald-Tribune.

Miller, 44, has been arrested 22 times in Sarasota County for crimes like trespassing and drinking in public, county records show.
The officials weren�t previously aware of the incident before the newspaper brought it to their attention. But the sheriff's office's internal affairs division is looking into the deputies' involvement, a spokeswoman for the sheriff�s office said.

And Sarasota Police Chief Bernadette DiPino suspended Halpin, who has been a Sarasota officer since 2006, after watching the video Monday morning, according to the Herald-Tribune.

�Based on the actions in the video, I immediately initiated an internal investigation on Officer Halpin,� DiPino said. �I'm disappointed in what I observed in the video, and placed the officer on administrative leave, pending the outcome of the investigation.�

I can't believe that they suspended him for the crime of feeding the homeless (he was suspended with pay at least).

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:22

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

VitalSigns posted:

Agreed, a cop's word alone should never be enough to convict someone of anything, and "I felt threatened" shouldn't be enough to justify a shooting. After all, everyone tells little white lies.

Actually, I agree that juries give far too much credence to eyewitness testimony, police or not. The reasonable belief standard is a different kettle of fish, though.

Toasticle posted:

Do you not think their is an ethical (and for most professionals a legal )difference between lying and lying about something that will harm or illegally help another person?

If a banker or doctor lie on paperwork to help a friend get a loan or scheduled drugs they can lose their jobs and possibly their medical license. Why shouldn't cops be held to the same standard. Lie on paperwork to cover a buddy or cause someone to end up in jail they should suffer harsh punishment for a abuse of authority, yes?

Raerlynn posted:

The problem with that worldview is that it conveniently ignores that you're advocating perjury, which should be a punishable offense, but never is. But don't trust me on that, go look up the number of cases where men were sentenced to death row on an officer's say so. Look up the cases where innocents either spent decades in prison, or died over those lies.

Someone should have to answer for that poo poo.

SedanChair posted:

Lying in a professional capacity is wrong, Dead Reckoning. There should always be a way to either tell the truth, or withhold information from those not entitled to it.

Things don't become moral the more commonplace they become.

I never said that lying should go unpunished. Agrajag's original contention was that any lie on an official report should result in immediate termination, no excuses. Yeah, lying to secure a conviction or cover up an unlawful use of force should result in jail time or termination, but not every lie is going to rise to that level. There are discipline measures other than termination available that should be considered depending on the nature and severity of the lie.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:40

DrPop: Aug 22, 2004

Just another bad apple

https://news.vice.com/article/massachusetts-cop-to-driver-in-video-ill-put-a-hole-right-through-your-loving-head?utm_source=vicenewsfb

VICE posted:

A Medford, Massachusetts police detective has been put on administrative leave after a driver posted dash cam footage of the officer threatening to "put a hole" in his head during a traffic stop made in an unmarked car.

Det. Stephen Lebert allegedly pulled over the motorist after he accidentally turned the wrong way down a one-way street at a traffic circle, Boston.com reported. The driver, who has only been identified as a 25-year-old man named Mike, recorded the footage from his car.

(video)

Mike said that he had purchased the dash cam recently as a self-protection measure after another car hit his vehicle at a red light. It proved useful on Sunday, July 26, when it recorded Lebert's tirade. The date on the camera was set wrong, Mike said, though the time is correct.

In the video, Lebert can be seen exiting his unmarked Red Chevy Silverado pick up truck in a white singlet and cargo shorts. Mike backs away as Lebert approaches because he isn't aware that the man is a cop.

Lebert then pulls out identification and says, "I'll put a hole right through your loving head�"

Here's the vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asnLQ8Ekwqg

Check out the bottom of the article for another video of this stand-up fellow harassing people!

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:42

Booourns: Jan 20, 2004; Please send a report when you see me complain about other posters and threads outside of QCS

~thanks!

Dead Reckoning posted:

I'm not a cop, but I worked as a bureaucrat for long enough that I've come to believe that everyone lies at some point, and it isn't necessarily a black-and-white thing. Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture.

A cop lying can have far far greater consequences than a random person though

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:42

LeJackal: Apr 5, 2011

Dead Reckoning posted:

I never said that lying should go unpunished. Agrajag's original contention was that any lie on an official report should result in immediate termination, no excuses. Yeah, lying to secure a conviction or cover up an unlawful use of force should result in jail time or termination, but not every lie is going to rise to that level. There are discipline measures other than termination available that should be considered depending on the nature and severity of the lie.

A lie on a police report is paper perjury, and undermines the rules of law. It should not only be a firing offense, but that officer should also be barred from ever re-entering the profession.

LeJackal fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:45

Pohl: Jan 28, 2005; In the future, please post shit with the sole purpose of antagonizing the person running this site. Thank you.

DrPop posted:

Just another bad apple

https://news.vice.com/article/massachusetts-cop-to-driver-in-video-ill-put-a-hole-right-through-your-loving-head?utm_source=vicenewsfb

Here's the vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asnLQ8Ekwqg

Check out the bottom of the article for another video of this stand-up fellow harassing people!

Holy poo poo, I probably would have run that guy over. All I know is he is threatening me and he's being a big dick.

Pohl fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:55

Lil Miss Clackamas: Jan 25, 2013; ich habe aids

DrPop posted:

Here's the vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asnLQ8Ekwqg

It gets more apparent with each passing day that the only good cop is a dead cop.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? Jul 28, 2015 16:55

Dum Cumpster: Sep 12, 2003; *pozes your neghole*

Chalets the Baka posted:

It gets more apparent with each passing day that the only good cop is a dead cop.

That other cop at the end seems be to be nice and helping the guy out. I know in a perfect world he'd arrest the lunatic cop on the spot but given the current situation we're in he seemed to do everything he could to help the guy.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:17

chitoryu12: Apr 24, 2014

The toxicology report for Sandra Bland has been released.

quote:

The amount of THC, one of the active components of marijuana, in Bland's system was 18 micrograms per liter, according to the report released Monday. That's more than three times the legal limit for drivers in Colorado and Washington, states that permit the recreational use of marijuana.

"I don't think it's possible to rule out the possibility of use while in jail," said University of Florida toxicology professor Bruce Goldberger, who reviewed the report for The Associated Press. Bland was impaired by marijuana at the time of her death, Goldberger said.

Bland, a black 28-year-old from suburban Chicago, was found dead in the Waller County jail on July 13. Authorities have said Bland hanged herself with a garbage bag, a finding that her family disputes. She was in custody after a traffic stop for failing to use a turn signal escalated into a physical confrontation with a white state trooper.

Robert Johnson, chief toxicologist at the Tarrant County medical examiner's office in Fort Worth, Texas, told the AP that a THC level as high as Bland's suggests she "either had access to the drug in jail or she was a consistent user of the drug and her body had accumulated THC to the point that it was slowly releasing it over time."

But, Johnson added, "I have never seen a report in the literature or from any other source of residual THC that high three days after someone stops using the drug."

Goldberger, who is also the president of the American Board of Forensic Toxicology, said Bland had a "remarkably high concentration" of THC for someone who had been in jail for three days.

He noted that while chronic users who stop using the drug will have higher concentrations than non- chronic users, "the concentrations do not persist at this level, at least in my opinion." He defined chronic as someone who uses cannabis daily, sometimes repeatedly.

Short version, the amount of marijuana in her system is coincident with having used it in jail. There was no report of the police having smelled any marijuana smoke (which is pretty loving obvious), but other people I've seen chiming in on this are saying that it's a massive amount of marijuana to eat, enough to probably get you sick; I did find an instance where someone committed suicide after consuming a pot cookie and the amount of marijuana in Bland's blood was at least 16.6 times as high as his. Assuming the study mentioned in this article is correct, 120 micrograms per liter is up to 9 times the amount to cause in-lane weaving while driving. Also this would assume that she somehow managed to hold onto her pot for two days even after being changed into her orange jumpsuit, or that someone smuggled it in while never once being caught on camera or by an officer.

Once again, poo poo doesn't make sense.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:19

AreWeDrunkYet: Jul 8, 2006

Dum Cumpster posted:

That other cop at the end seems be to be nice and helping the guy out. I know in a perfect world he'd arrest the lunatic cop on the spot but given the current situation we're in he seemed to do everything he could to help the guy.

Did the other cop report his co-worker's behavior to his superiors? There's a reason people keep insisting the barrel is rotten.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:20

Dum Cumpster: Sep 12, 2003; *pozes your neghole*

AreWeDrunkYet posted:

Did the other cop report his co-worker's behavior to his superiors? There's a reason people keep insisting the barrel is rotten.

I think we've seen multiple instances where good cops careers were over as soon as they've done that. Obviously I'd want him to do that but I'm also willing to recognize that he did what good he could in the current situation.

And do you really think "some kid said our 30 year detective threatened to kill him and I guess he has a video" is going to go over well?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:26

AreWeDrunkYet: Jul 8, 2006

Dum Cumpster posted:

I think we've seen multiple instances where good cops careers were over as soon as they've done that. Obviously I'd want him to do that but I'm also willing to recognize that he did what good he could in the current situation.

And do you really think "some kid said our 30 year detective threatened to kill him and I guess he has a video" is going to go over well?

So in other words, the whole organization is broken top to bottom.

Sure, one cop did the bare minimum not to be terrible in that situation. But that's pretty much pointless if you're describing a systematically unaccountable organization.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:31

thefncrow: Mar 14, 2001

Dum Cumpster posted:

I think we've seen multiple instances where good cops careers were over as soon as they've done that. Obviously I'd want him to do that but I'm also willing to recognize that he did what good he could in the current situation.

And do you really think "some kid said our 30 year detective threatened to kill him and I guess he has a video" is going to go over well?

I agree with all of what you said, but you've said it in a way that suggests you think you're rebutting the idea that the whole system is rotten, while your text is about how a rotten system corrupts everyone involved.

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:31

treasured8elief: Jul 25, 2011; Salad Prong

AreWeDrunkYet posted:

Did the other cop report his co-worker's behavior to his superiors? There's a reason people keep insisting the barrel is rotten.

Another recent news article I read stated departments in Massachusetts officially choose applicants who will not report other officers' wrongdoings.

Boston Globe posted:

A Civil Service Commission official wrote that he was dismayed to learn that the [Methuen police department] gave higher points to applicants who said they wouldn�t arrest a family member or an officer they knew, while docking points from who said they would.

As part of the hiring process, Methuen asked candidates how they would handle a situation in which where they found a driver in a crash who appeared to be intoxicated. They were then asked how they would handle the same scenario involving a relative or a police officer they knew from a neighboring town.

At a commission hearing, Methuen police officers said the questions were intended to help them assess the honesty and reasoning of applicants.

�I�m looking for some bearing, some honesty, and how quickly the person can think on their feet,� Police Lieutenant Michael Pappalardo testified. But Pappalardo also said he wouldn�t believe anyone who claimed they would arrest their family and friends. And when candidates said they wouldn�t arrest family or fellow officers, the hiring panel noted the person �knows discretion.�

�Some of the interview panelists actually heaped high praise on those candidates who stated that they would arrest a stranger but not arrest a friend or family member based on the same facts, citing their understanding of �discretion,�� Bowman wrote in his decision.

The case arose after Michael Phillips, 26, an auxiliary officer for the city of Lawrence who also works for an armored car company, appealed the city�s decision to bypass him for a job as a reserve police officer. The city sent a letter to Phillips, saying he showed a �lack of discretion� by saying he would arrest his mother and father if he caught them driving drunk, according to the commission decision. �This answer appears insincere and sounds like Mr. Phillips is trying to respond in the way he thinks the panel wants him to respond,� the letter stated.

Phillips also questioned whether the hiring process was impartial, because five candidates had family members who work for the city or had in the past, including two who are friends with the police chief.
...

A Civil Service Commission decision in 2008 questioned whether it was fair to punish a Pittsfield officer for failing to report a traffic stop involving a fellow officer, because �professional courtesy� is so common.

�Every police officer who testified before the commission testified that the routine and customary practice when a stop is made on a fellow police officer, is to show professional courtesy and not call in the stop,� the report said.

treasured8elief fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Jul 28, 2015

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:36

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# ? May 30, 2024 14:37

Dum Cumpster: Sep 12, 2003; *pozes your neghole*

Have you read any other of my posts in this thread? Yes I absolutely think the whole system is rotten. What do you think I meant by current situation?

# ? Jul 28, 2015 17:36

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Let's Debate the Police and Criminal Justice

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