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ulmont posted:Links are fixed - I'm blaming SA. I own the house (this apartment is not rented out though). In that case, the thing that limits how much current a device pulls is the device itself. You have 3 options. The first is to swap the tandem breaker and the receptacle down to 15A ones and use the existing wire. You can almost always use existing wire that's thicker than necessary. The second option is only if that new AC/heater doesn't have one of the new LDCI plugs. For that you just chop off the plug on it and put on a 30A plug. The third would be to make an adapter. I've searched around and nobody makes adapters for 6-30p's, and if they do, they are to locking outlets, so you would need at least one more adapter. For a single adapter you'd have to make one yourself. For a 15A adapter, use at least 14-2 gauge cable and repurpose the white wire for a hot carrier. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Jul 30, 2015 |
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Jul 30, 2015 21:22
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Dur, this is a good idea. I've gotten 25 years of use out of this book and it's updates. It's worth way more than the $10.50 it costs on Amazon. If you use this to build understanding, you can refer to the NEC for data on conductor size, box fill, etc.
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Aug 1, 2015 01:37
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I keep forgetting libraries are a thing.
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ausgezeichnet posted:I've gotten 25 years of use out of this book and it's updates. It's worth way more than the $10.50 it costs on Amazon. If you use this to build understanding, you can refer to the NEC for data on conductor size, box fill, etc. Thanks for the link! I love these kinds of books--I've got the Popular Mechanics Complete Home How-To, and though it's got a really great section on household electricity (that you can read here on Google books), I still feel like I only know just enough to be dangerous. Eg, twisting stranded wire together with 14g solid core romex... doesn't stranded have the tendency to work its way loose with a twist cap? What's the best type of connector in that situation? Specifically I'm thinking of the bathroom ventilation fan and ceiling fan I recently installed, both of which have aluminum wiring to boot... which, come to think of it, doesn't aluminum expand and contract and work its way loose over time too? Am I asking for trouble using the wire nuts supplied with the products? Catatron Prime fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Aug 2, 2015 |
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Aug 2, 2015 13:17
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OSU_Matthew posted:Am I asking for trouble using the wire nuts supplied with the products? You mean using the supplied materials according to the instructions that are tested as a complete package by UL? No, that's not "asking for trouble". In fact, that's "doing it properly" and not being daft enough to think you know more than the engineers who designed it and a certified testing laboratory.
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Aug 2, 2015 16:18
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if you're making an aluminum to copper connection you SHOULD NOT use the wirenuts provided with the light fixture. they make wirenuts for that specific purpose or you can use a butt splice of some sort.
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Aug 3, 2015 00:12
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crocodile posted:if you're making an aluminum to copper connection you SHOULD NOT use the wirenuts provided with the light fixture. they make wirenuts for that specific purpose or you can use a butt splice of some sort. Good pick....I missed the aluminum part there. (that was dumb, thank you) So there is no way to use those fixtures directly (as I said: according to the instructions). The only reasonable option is going to be a rated aluminum to copper splice as a pigtail to the light. If there is sufficient room in the box on the light you MAY BE ABLE TO use that to contain the splice. Otherwise it will need to be enclosed in it's own box elsewhere. What product will be acceptable and where to make the AL to CU splice varies greatly between code and AHJ. If you are coyboying this without inspection I would suggest an Alumiconn and put it in the light box if there is enough space. Most AHJs would be happy with that.
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Aug 3, 2015 01:24
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OSU_Matthew posted:Thanks for the link! I love these kinds of books--I've got the Popular Mechanics Complete Home How-To, and though it's got a really great section on household electricity (that you can read here on Google books), I still feel like I only know just enough to be dangerous. May want to clarify...is the house wiring 14g solid core copper (NM-B) and the bath fan/ceiling fan stranded "aluminum" wire? The wiring on the fans themselves may look like aluminum but is almost assuredly tinned copper, which is silver in color. This would not need a special connector. If the house wiring is indeed aluminum then a special connector would be needed.
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Aug 3, 2015 02:28
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Helvetica Sucks posted:May want to clarify...is the house wiring 14g solid core copper (NM-B) and the bath fan/ceiling fan stranded "aluminum" wire? The wiring on the fans themselves may look like aluminum but is almost assuredly tinned copper, which is silver in color. This would not need a special connector. If the house wiring is indeed aluminum then a special connector would be needed. Yes, the house wiring is 14g. I added a small run in the attic by tying into another box that previously contained a wall sconce, and securing the new wire run to the studs under the insulation, and then installing a bracket/work box between the joists where I wanted to put the fan. The house was built before electricity came to the area, so a lot of the electrical stuff is in odd or inadequate hodgepodge places. I'm just trying to update things as I go with useful stuff like adequate overhead lighting. You're probably right about it being tinned copper, but it's solid silver the whole way through and I just don't underestimate the manufacturer's tendency to save half a penny wherever they can, to the point of creating a safety issue... of course, I just finished reading "Poorly Made In China", so that's probably tainting my thinking. The bathroom fan came with special push-in quick connectors, which I had to clip off so I could tie the light/fan motor wiring together to work off a single switch. Motronic posted:What product will be acceptable and where to make the AL to CU splice varies greatly between code and AHJ. If you are coyboying this without inspection I would suggest an Alumiconn and put it in the light box if there is enough space. Most AHJs would be happy with that. Thanks! This is what I was wondering, if wire nuts were the best option for stranded to solid, and if there was a better connector I should be using for aluminum (since I suspect but could be wrong about the motor's wires).
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Aug 3, 2015 04:45
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OSU_Matthew posted:Thanks! This is what I was wondering, if wire nuts were the best option for stranded to solid, and if there was a better connector I should be using for aluminum (since I suspect but could be wrong about the motor's wires). Sorry I missed the important part there before, but yes those will be safe. Do not mate that directly with the lights.......you want to keep the rating for insurance reasons. If I were in your position (and unwilling to replace the AL run) I would make the AL to CU connection in a separate box. This isn't a safety recommendation. It's a liability recommendation. In case you haven't been reading this thread I'm a former AHJ (I was a municipal fire marshal who investigated cause and origin of fires).
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Aug 3, 2015 04:56
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Motronic posted:Sorry I missed the important part there before, but yes those will be safe. The main bathroom lights are on a separate run from another switch. The lights I'm talking about are on the fan unit itself: http://m.lowes.com/pd/Utilitech-1-5-Sone-90-CFM-White-Bathroom-Fan-with-Light/50133248 Sorry if that wasn't clear... Only thing I did was snip the connectors off the unit so I could twist fan/light leads together to run off the single power source going to it. I've been plowing through this and the crappy construction thread, and I really appreciate having your authoritative insight in both.
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Aug 3, 2015 12:26
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I have a 2 car attached garage that is unfinished, no drywall. 1/2 of the garage has a garage door opener, a light, and a duplex outlet. I want to build a work bench on the other side and run 2 duplex outlets to it, an overhead light and a garage door opener. Do I need to add a new circuit? Do I need to run my wiring in conduit?
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Aug 7, 2015 04:55
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Whale Cancer posted:I have a 2 car attached garage that is unfinished, no drywall. 1/2 of the garage has a garage door opener, a light, and a duplex outlet. I want to build a work bench on the other side and run 2 duplex outlets to it, an overhead light and a garage door opener. You should be good to tap off that existing circuit if those are the only things on that circuit. New stuff goes in in whatever the old stuff uses. If Romex, then Romex. If conduit, then conduit.
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Aug 7, 2015 05:23
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No conduit just exposed Romex. Thank you.
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Aug 7, 2015 06:10
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Whale Cancer posted:No conduit just exposed Romex. Thank you. There's more to it than that unfortunately. What amperage is the existing circuit? What else shares that circuit? BEP was probably right, for as little as you're adding, you should be fine for an addition. Now if you wanted to go all out and put in 40A circuits in each car bay to charge your hybrids, that would be a different story. Garage outlets also require GFCI protection. You will probably have to upgrade the existing outlets in there to have GFCI protection also. Here's where that gets tricky: the outlet on the ceiling for the existing door opener must have GFCI protection, but you can't install a GFCI on the ceiling because that violates the "easily accessible" rule so you could test and reset that GFCI without getting out the ladder. GFCIs can protect devices further down branch, so if that ceiling box isn't the first node on that branch, you could put the GFCI down low and use its load terminals to protect that ceiling box. If that ceiling box is the first on that circuit, then you might need to swap in a GFCI breaker. Edit: Conduit is only required to protect exposed wires. In an unfinished garage, if you can staple your wires at least 1&1/4" back from the stud faces, then you don't need conduit. That being said, certain rare locales LOVE their conduit. I've heard Chicago is one of them. Ask your local code authority (usually your city or county), they will know. They could also tell you if you need a permit, but for as little work as you're doing, I doubt you would need one. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 17:24
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This is a bit of a strange question, but why isn't it the norm in NA to have a GFCI at the breaker box? My house has a single GFCI, which is located in the breaker box. It protects all outlets on the property. From the power company comes 3 phase 240V 3x25A, neutral and ground. That goes through 25A main fuses, and the meter. From there it goes to a main switch, which demarcates where my part of the infrastructure begins. Then it is passed through the central GFCI, split up into 16A groups, with a fuse and switch for every group. Having a GFCI at each individual outlet that needs it seems really inconvenient and expensive to me.
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Aug 7, 2015 18:45
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A GFCI in the US has a trip point of ~5mA and is intended primarily for personnel protection. GFPE devices are much more similar to the RCDs found in the UK, having a ~30mA+ trip point and are intended for equipment protection and a single device is often used to protect an entire service (Generally 480Y/277V). GFCI's are more likely to trip and plunging an entire building into darkness is kind of lovely. GFCI receptacles are much more prevalent simply for cost reasons. A 20a gfci breaker is 3-4x more expensive than a receptacle. With AFCI's being required in more and more places, combo gfci/afci breakers might start to make sense from a cost perspective.
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Aug 7, 2015 19:08
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Deedle posted:This is a bit of a strange question, but why isn't it the norm in NA to have a GFCI at the breaker box? How much ground current trips that GFCI? The purpose of having a GFCI on every circuit is so you can have it trip at a very low current to ground (6 mA generally) without affecting everything else. If everything in the house is running off one GFCI then either it's got to be set so high as to not be very useful or you run the risk of a nuisance trip shutting off your refrigerator.
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Aug 7, 2015 19:11
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ThinkFear posted:GFCI's are more likely to trip and plunging an entire building into darkness is kind of lovely. GFCI receptacles are much more prevalent simply for cost reasons. A 20a gfci breaker is 3-4x more expensive than a receptacle. There's also the issue of convenience. If you trip a GFCI breaker, then you have to walk all the way to the panel to reset it, which could be in the basement, outside, etc. If you trip a GFCI outlet, it's usually close by.
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Aug 7, 2015 21:31
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fisting by many posted:How much ground current trips that GFCI? It has so far never had a nuisance trip. It has so far only tripped twice. Once due to me loving up with the repair of my coffee maker, and once when my roommate ignored repeated warnings and cut a live cable.
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Aug 7, 2015 21:56
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I've got electric baseboard heaters and want to remove them so I can refinish the floor, but they will go back. I'll admit I have little knowledge of home wiring- I took a look and I think I understand what goes where and mostly why. I'm thinking of flipping the breaker, drawing a diagram, photographing everything and flagging all the wires, capping the loose ends, and then just putting them back where they were. Bad idea or should I be able to handle it?
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Aug 8, 2015 03:29
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Baseboard heaters are incredibly easy to wire, you'll be fine. You'll probably feel dumb when you take it off and see how it's connected.
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Aug 8, 2015 03:34
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chef posted:I've got electric baseboard heaters and want to remove them so I can refinish the floor, but they will go back. I'll admit I have little knowledge of home wiring- I took a look and I think I understand what goes where and mostly why. fisting by many posted:Baseboard heaters are incredibly easy to wire, you'll be fine. Three wires, the non-bare ones go to anywhere. Baseboard heaters 101. Unless there's a thermostat in there, in which case it's only SLIGHTLY more difficult.
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Aug 8, 2015 22:40
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We bought a house, and it looks like one of the previous owners did something boneheaded with one of the downstairs smoke alarms near the kitchen: the wires going to the smoke alarm have been cleanly cut. The alarm itself is old and needs to be replaced anyway, so I'm thinking of putting a battery-powered unit in there. However, it looks like the other cable ends might be dangling up there. This concerns me greatly, but I've never done any kind of electrical work before so I'm not totally sure what to do. I've bought the battery-powered alarm, and I'm ready to install it onto the old mounting plate, but I need to do something about these cables first. What's the proper procedure here? Kill the main breaker, pull down the wires to see which ones were cut, put caps on them, and wrap them up in electrical tape? If I go to the hardware store, they'll probably have the caps that I need; I have some nice wire strippers that can probably get me an estimate of the gauge, I guess QuarkJets fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Aug 8, 2015 |
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Aug 8, 2015 23:11
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QuarkJets posted:We bought a house, and it looks like one of the previous owners did something boneheaded with one of the downstairs smoke alarms near the kitchen: the wires going to the smoke alarm have been cleanly cut. The alarm itself is old and needs to be replaced anyway, so I'm thinking of putting a battery-powered unit in there. However, it looks like the other cable ends might be dangling up there. This concerns me greatly, but I've never done any kind of electrical work before so I'm not totally sure what to do. Get a 10-pack of yellow or tan wire nuts. Cap the wires without touching the metal bits with your fingers. Do not use tape. If it makes you feel better, check if any of the wires are hot with a non-contact voltage tester first if you have one.
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Aug 8, 2015 23:20
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Yellow or tan, got it. Gonna head to the hardware store shortly. Thanks for your help
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Aug 8, 2015 23:41
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ulmont posted:Links are fixed - I'm blaming SA. I own the house (this apartment is not rented out though). For what it's worth, I found the amperage draw for the Friedrich. The specs list the maximum breaker as 30 amps - the heater in it draws a ton of power (4kW). It's also shown as having a 6-30P plug. So if you go with that particular unit, you're fine keeping the wiring as-is. Go here and clicks on specs. OSU_Matthew posted:Cat5e can theoretically handle gigabit speeds, cat 6 is officially rated for it. Of course, most places in America don't actually have gigabit service from their ISP, so it's largely a moot point for now. Only place you'll see gigabit speeds is on local equipment, eg if you're running a file server on your LAN. I know this is an old post, but some cable (and fiber) ISPs are offering speeds in excess of 100mbit. I have 200mbit downstream at home, for example (my ISP offers up to 300mbit, and Verizon FiOS offers up to 500mbit in my area). I wired the entire house with the cheapest CAT5E I could find (copper clad aluminum poo poo at that), the cheapest keystone jacks I could find (Monoprice), cheapest patch panel I could find (no-name on Amazon), and a kind goon sent me an old rack mount 16 port gigabit switch... everything links at gigabit speeds, everything pulls well over 200mbit on downloads, and the only limiting factor when moving files between computers is the speed of the HDDs. CAT6 is officially certified, but CAT5E will generally link at gigabit full duplex as long as the run is less than 100 meters. Like Motronic said, if it's not, it's usually a problem at the end point - I've had links drop down to 100mbit because I was in a rush punching down the block or the keystone. CAT6 is also a lot harder to bend, and costs a bit more.
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Aug 9, 2015 01:13
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:Get a 10-pack of yellow or tan wire nuts. Cap the wires without touching the metal bits with your fingers. Do not use tape. If it makes you feel better, check if any of the wires are hot with a non-contact voltage tester first if you have one. Happy news, the nuts that you suggested screwed right on and that whole situation looks like it's dealt with. And the new smoke detector looks perfect. Thanks again
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Aug 9, 2015 02:57
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My kitchen light is a 90s era fluorescent tube deal, and it looks like the ballast has died. I have attic access over the area, how big of a job would it be to install cans? I have experience with patching drywall, cutting holes etc. I'm pretty sure it is exposed Romex in the attic. What is the correct way to run the new lights off of the existing wiring? Also, somewhat tied to that, I am also wanting to install a waterproof LED can over our shower. There is a ceiling fixture and also a wall fixture already present - would it be best to join it from the light or from the wall switch?
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Aug 9, 2015 03:15
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Rubiks Pubes posted:My kitchen light is a 90s era fluorescent tube deal, and it looks like the ballast has died. I have attic access over the area, how big of a job would it be to install cans? I have experience with patching drywall, cutting holes etc. I'm pretty sure it is exposed Romex in the attic. What is the correct way to run the new lights off of the existing wiring? My mother-in-law did exactly what you are describing, and ended up having another florescent fixture put in because the cans didn't give her enough light in the kitchen.
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Aug 9, 2015 16:55
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Rubiks Pubes posted:My kitchen light is a 90s era fluorescent tube deal, and it looks like the ballast has died. I have attic access over the area, how big of a job would it be to install cans? I have experience with patching drywall, cutting holes etc. I'm pretty sure it is exposed Romex in the attic. What is the correct way to run the new lights off of the existing wiring? Assuming that the only wires in the junction box that the fluorescent fixture is wired to, and you want to control the cans with the same switch, you would move those wires to one of the junction boxes attached to a can that the wires can reach and then from that can, run romex in sequence to the rest of the cans, then you can remove the original junction box or patch over it. If the wiring is more complex in that box, you could start your romex runs to the cans from the wires that fed the tube light then use a cover plate to cap it. Rubiks Pubes posted:Also, somewhat tied to that, I am also wanting to install a waterproof LED can over our shower. There is a ceiling fixture and also a wall fixture already present - would it be best to join it from the light or from the wall switch? The ceiling fixture. Assuming that current fixture isn't a heat lamp or something special, just tie in to that box.
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Aug 9, 2015 17:30
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n0tqu1tesane posted:My mother-in-law did exactly what you are describing, and ended up having another florescent fixture put in because the cans didn't give her enough light in the kitchen. LED retrofit kits for cans are really, really bright. They're fairly cheap as well (I found them for $10/ea and bought a bunch)
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Aug 9, 2015 18:11
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So I am good with just running Romex? And using wire nuts for the connections? I don't want to do anything against code. Any particular precautions with running the Romex I should consider? Thanks for the help.
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Aug 9, 2015 23:08
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Rubiks Pubes posted:So I am good with just running Romex? And using wire nuts for the connections? I don't want to do anything against code. Any particular precautions with running the Romex I should consider? You SHOULD be fine. What state are you in? Staple the Romex within 12" of each box, and every 3' thereafter. If you're running across joists the long way and it's (say) 4' between joists, it's OK to staple at every joist.
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Aug 9, 2015 23:11
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I'm in Alabama
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Aug 10, 2015 02:32
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Rubiks Pubes posted:I'm in Alabama You should be fine. If you want to be really sure, talk to your local code authority, usually your city or county. The latest code book is linked in the OP. Basically, the book is updated every 3 years and only improves with time. If you follow the latest book, you would pass an inspection based on an older edition. As for basics, use Romex at least thick enough for the existing circuit's amperage: 14 gauge for 15 amps, 12 gauge for 20 amps. Staple it as necessary as BEP mentioned above. Make all junctions inside boxes or devices with wire nuts big enough for however many wires you twist together (read the labels on the nut packages). All boxes must be both mounted and accessible, they can't be buried inside walls. If you can get in that attic, that counts.
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Aug 10, 2015 19:47
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I do have attic access so that will make the whole process easier. Is it OK to use higher gauge if it isn't necessarily needed
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Aug 10, 2015 21:26
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Rubiks Pubes posted:I do have attic access so that will make the whole process easier. Is it OK to use higher gauge if it isn't necessarily needed You mean lower gauge: lower numbers are thicker. 14ga is thicker than 16ga, etc.
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Aug 10, 2015 21:34
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Rubiks Pubes posted:I do have attic access so that will make the whole process easier. Is it OK to use higher gauge if it isn't necessarily needed Yes, it's OK to use thicker wire than needed. The real issue is cost and ease of working with it. Copper is expensive and the thicker it is, the harder to bend.
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Aug 10, 2015 22:17
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My power company, PGE, is going to be installing service to my property for the first time. They tell me I can get a drop from their pole max of 150ft and they'll run 1/0 aluminum. What I don't understand is that they keep on telling me that this is 200A service. Per NEC table 310.15(B)(16) 1/0 alu is good for only 120A. What gives?
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Aug 11, 2015 05:12
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dwoloz posted:My power company, PGE, is going to be installing service to my property for the first time. They tell me I can get a drop from their pole max of 150ft and they'll run 1/0 aluminum. What I don't understand is that they keep on telling me that this is 200A service. Per NEC table 310.15(B)(16) 1/0 alu is good for only 120A. What gives? Simple answer, the poco doesn't have to follow the NEC. They size their services based on what they think your peak demand will be at a given time. You probably won't ever get near 200 amps let alone 120. Source: I'm a poco engineer. It's fun to watch the Low voltage engineers poo poo themselves when they give you a design showing a 1MVA service and we turn around and give them one sized for 300 or 500 KVA.
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Aug 11, 2015 05:47
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