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Is the untranslated volume 9 just the latest one printed or is it an actual end to the story?
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Aug 15, 2015 18:35
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Verizian posted:Is the untranslated volume 9 just the latest one printed or is it an actual end to the story? Latest printed. The web novel it's based on (although changed) continues a fair bit further as well, so there's no end in sight.
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Aug 15, 2015 18:37
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Wrong thread.
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Aug 15, 2015 19:06
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So out of curiosity, is this one of those manga/anime where the protagonist is the villain? And not just anti-hero, dark and edgy, or pragmatic. But just straight up Hitler/Lion King Scar goose stepping evil? The OP seems to imply as much.
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Aug 18, 2015 09:01
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Artificer posted:So out of curiosity, is this one of those manga/anime where the protagonist is the villain? And not just anti-hero, dark and edgy, or pragmatic. But just straight up Hitler/Lion King Scar goose stepping evil? The OP seems to imply as much. Potentially. He's treated people very well but, as he himself notes, it's not out of compassion or morality; it's the most practical way to achieve his current goals.
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Aug 18, 2015 09:08
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He's kinda like Sarevok from Baldur's Gate, the guy with the plan, trying to pull political strings to meet his own ends and become the One.
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Aug 18, 2015 09:12
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PerrineClostermann posted:Potentially. He's treated people very well but, as he himself notes, it's not out of compassion or morality; it's the most practical way to achieve his current goals. So sort of like Hitler with the great publicity but ruthless crushing of opposition sort of thing? Mordaedil posted:He's kinda like Sarevok from Baldur's Gate, the guy with the plan, trying to pull political strings to meet his own ends and become the One. Sarevok is kind of a huuge rear end in a top hat. Blegh. I'm not sure I can stomach the protagonist being like this. I might give it the ol' three episode shot though.
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Aug 18, 2015 09:18
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Artificer posted:So sort of like Hitler with the great publicity but ruthless crushing of opposition sort of thing? Noted. Sarvok is an rear end in a top hat, but Hitler was not. I didn't mean he was literally Sarevok even in personality. I meant it only as far as how he had fingers in all the pies and was orchestrating this huge plot governing a whole region while in the guise of a different person.
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Aug 18, 2015 09:22
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Mordaedil posted:Noted. Sarvok is an rear end in a top hat, but Hitler was not. Hitler was also a huge rear end in a top hat, yes. Alright. I'll give it a go. So he takes good care of the people he assumes control over then? No baby punting or orphanage burning then? What if baby punting/orphanage burning served a really important political purpose for him? 
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Aug 18, 2015 09:29
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Even though he's supposed to be the bad guy I've found him to be extremely likable so far. I think he's gonna end up being a benevolent dictator.
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Aug 18, 2015 11:24
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The appeal of Ains is that he exploits the power fantasy nature of the story in a manner that the audience wants to achieve. If he does a terrible thing, it must be Justified by the story. Ains is the superego of the puerile YA power fantasy genre.
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Aug 18, 2015 11:38
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Ains wants to find his guildmates if possible, or well, any other player possibly. It's just that whatever happened made him an actual Lich so his human emotions are suppressed. Early on he pretty much maintains something close to morality by trying to live up to the example of the guild member that recruited him since he's not capable of feeling really strong emotions anymore. He "plays" at being more neutral evil since ironically people find a badass merc who demands some form of payment for everything less suspicious than an altruistic god-like dude who can flatten armies on his own.
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Aug 18, 2015 11:47
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If you want the 'villainous' characters, try pretty much all of Ains' direct subordinates. If he is neutral evil the vast majority of his underlings are straight chaotic evil.
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Aug 18, 2015 13:28
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I've found from what I've read so far that Ains tends to do good or at least justifiable things under the guise of being an evil overlord. However, some of the subordinates are extremely, despicably evil yet loyal (Demiurge) while others are actually straight good-aligned, like Sebas. The humans in the story tend to be more outright evil and twisted. But I think Ains might end up doing some undeniably evil things later in the story or at least his underlings will do them without his knowledge from what I've heard.
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Aug 18, 2015 13:59
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Ains is in a weird transitory stage as a character right now in the anime. He has his human sensibilities and such from his old life, but he inhabits the body and mind of a lich now, and is drifting into a new mindset that doesn't really have emotions or morality. I haven't read the light novel or anything, so I'm curious to see how this ends up going for him. I think that between the messed up theocracy kingdom and the weirdo death cult, he's still kind of approaching a pivot point where he will either decide that "the common people deserve a better way of life than this, as my underlings" or "whatever, just burn it all". Off the cuff, I'm guessing that the leader of the theocracy kingdom is another Player, who went nuts when his actual self became exposed to the vast divine power and wisdom that a level 100 Priest or whatever would have possessed. I think Ains was insulated from that due to his new body being basically immune to brain problems.
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Aug 18, 2015 14:41
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Sharkopath posted:A group of idol singers that get trapped in an mmo world and subjugate and modernize it through the power of both love and weaponized singing would be a cool idea for an LN.
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Aug 18, 2015 14:57
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deadly_pudding posted:Ains is in a weird transitory stage as a character right now in the anime. He has his human sensibilities and such from his old life, but he inhabits the body and mind of a lich now, and is drifting into a new mindset that doesn't really have emotions or morality. I haven't read the light novel or anything, so I'm curious to see how this ends up going for him. I think that between the messed up theocracy kingdom and the weirdo death cult, he's still kind of approaching a pivot point where he will either decide that "the common people deserve a better way of life than this, as my underlings" or "whatever, just burn it all". D&D style morality is poorly-defined as gently caress; I find myself thinking he's kinda between Neutral and Lawful evil the more I consider it. If it wasn't for the whole "generally obeys the law" thing he'd be more Lawful Evil.
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Aug 18, 2015 15:08
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Artificer posted:So sort of like Hitler with the great publicity but ruthless crushing of opposition sort of thing? Genghis Khan is a better example as Hitler almost certainly did not take "good care of" those under his control. Fabricated posted:He's pretty much good to his allies, and crushingly brutal to his enemies. Lawful Evil is generally a little more complex than "obeys the law" usually having some sort of unique code of ethics will suffice, or otherwise acting to the goal of order. Ainz has been very lawful in most generally accepted definitions of the word. Despite his power he's nodded to the hierarchy to the guild and follows its laws to achieve his own ends; that's part of the very definition of lawful evil. Raenir Salazar fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 15:08
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Raenir Salazar posted:Lawful Evil is generally a little more complex than "obeys the law" usually having some sort of unique code of ethics will suffice, or otherwise acting to the goal of order. Ainz has been very lawful in most generally accepted definitions of the word. Again this is the DnD morality argument stuff that's been had since its creation. What's funny is that I think his "karma" on his character sheet is listed as being the most negative of all the people in the Tomb... that could just be PVP MMO type karma though (i.e. just negative points for pwning noobs or whatever) as opposed to actual "evilness".
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Aug 18, 2015 15:21
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Fabricated posted:What's funny is that I think his "karma" on his character sheet is listed as being the most negative of all the people in the Tomb... that could just be PVP MMO type karma though (i.e. just negative points for pwning noobs or whatever) as opposed to actual "evilness". I think he is definitely a PVP noob pwner. It's known that no enemy players ever managed to even enter the Tomb. When he was fighting against the priests, he was getting a little caught up on them being like real people and stuff for about 15 seconds, but then instantly fell back into a mindset of "seriously? You thought this weak of a Summon was so good?" That's why I'm sort of expecting him to start really picking apart all his potential enemies in the new world after he's done some recon. His underlying gamer's instinct is to kill these eyesore scrubs who thought they could challenge his guild.
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Aug 18, 2015 15:28
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deadly_pudding posted:I think he is definitely a PVP noob pwner. It's known that no enemy players ever managed to even enter the Tomb. When he was fighting against the priests, he was getting a little caught up on them being like real people and stuff for about 15 seconds, but then instantly fell back into a mindset of "seriously? You thought this weak of a Summon was so good?" Plenty of enemy players entered the tomb. They just never left.
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Aug 18, 2015 15:35
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IIRC there was some big combined effort that made it all the way to level 8 before everyone died and then the Tomb was considered impossible
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Aug 18, 2015 15:44
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I must have mis-remembered the dialog  it's been a few weeks.Either way, he seems to have a switch that goes off once he confirms that the opposition is, in fact, a really sorry display. He's treated all the civilians and people who exhibit basic decency toward him with extreme mercy so far, but he seems to be very ruthless toward anybody that he decides is an "enemy", with a degree of bravado that suggests he's having a fantastic time. I wonder to what extent he actually cares about the well-being of the people he saves, versus the extent to which he's basically min-maxing his interactions with the new world for ideal rep grinding.
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Aug 18, 2015 16:02
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I'm kinda hoping the people see Ains as evil but they still prefer being under him to the way things used to be. "Well I'm not so sure about that castle of his and I wish I didn't have to send him my first born but on the other hand my children will never experience a bandit or monster raid."
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Aug 18, 2015 16:04
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Sephiroth_IRA posted:I'm kinda hoping the people see Ains as evil but they still prefer being under him to the way things used to be. Would be cool, this is a rare sort of characterization in fiction.
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Aug 18, 2015 16:16
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Fabricated posted:Ainz kinda helps the weak a bit too much (at least early on) and doesn't abuse the law quite enough to totally fit the description. He's a complete outsider so the law more or less is something he kinda just deals with to avoid a hassle rather than something he obeys due to some sort of honorable compunction. He also (sort of) avenges outsiders weaker than him which is something no lawful evil character would do. Alignment talk is kinda ridiculous, or quickly devolves into boxed thinking. It is better to think of them as fields where you grow sheep. The characters alignment corresponds mostly to what herd you grass with. Ainz, in this subjective view fits most of the herd grassing on "lawful evil".
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Aug 18, 2015 16:36
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I heard it explained as lawful evil characters finding an ordered system more efficient or easily exploited than chaos, regardless of what system that order may be.
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Aug 18, 2015 17:02
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Err, that fight scene felt a lot longer in the book.
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Aug 18, 2015 17:24
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Ains is a lonely, timid man who suddenly gained great power. For all that he is now essentially a god, the most important thing to him is still the good old days with his mmo guild. So, with that in mind, he only has three goals in life. Protect what his friends left behind, make himself famous so that if any of his friends are around they will come back, and avoid disappointing his evil minions who alternately serve as proxies for his friends and their children. Of course, he gradually grows into the evil lich role he plays, but he still would give it all up in a second to be playing that mmo with his guild again.
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Aug 18, 2015 17:25
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darkgray posted:Err, that fight scene felt a lot longer in the book. In the book they clashed a few times, then Ainz gets bored and does what he did in this.
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Aug 18, 2015 17:41
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What you all missed out on:
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Aug 18, 2015 17:56
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Aw bugger, I was looking forward to how they'd show certain scenes from this part, but my expectations weren't met. The manga did a better job at actually making the aura of fear somewhat fearsome. Actually, the manga is often pretty good at drawing skeleton faces and expressions.
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Aug 18, 2015 19:21
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Please tell me the Hamster sticks around maybe replacing the gothic lolita chick please
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Aug 18, 2015 19:30
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OnimaruXLR posted:Please tell me the Hamster sticks around Hes already been forced to join the guild. He cant leave even if he wanted to.
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Aug 18, 2015 19:31
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OnimaruXLR posted:Please tell me the Hamster sticks around LN info Hamtaro sticks around for most of the rest of this arc, and then gets two short cameos in later arcs.
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Aug 18, 2015 19:38
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"I feel like an old man on a merry-go-round" was a pretty good line.
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Aug 18, 2015 22:39
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That was a good episode.
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Aug 19, 2015 00:39
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I'm glad villager girl found a practical use for the Horn of Goblin Summoning. They're so helpful! 
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Aug 19, 2015 00:59
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It's amusing how the lovely throwaway items Ainz probably considered guild bank vendor trash are miracles to everyone outside the tomb.
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Aug 19, 2015 01:02
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Fabricated posted:It's amusing how the lovely throwaway items Ainz probably considered guild bank vendor trash are miracles to everyone outside the tomb.
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Aug 19, 2015 01:04
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