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Hremsfeld posted:Having difficult conversations with your child in order to deter future misbehavior is one of the primary duties of being a parent, though. Yeah, it's difficult...but when you have a kid you're signing up for that. The deterrent is being publicly shamed by her father, not being bounced back a grade. She blatantly does not give a poo poo about her academics so long as she has access to the Forest and her friends, and threatening the latter allowed him to eliminate the former without her just going behind his back. Tony has expressed his own reasons for making no assumption that she would be motivated simply by his own wishes, and while that's partly misguided Antimony also actually is prone to seeking approval from people by putting on an act of what she wants them to see and covertly doing whatever the hell she feels like, when she thinks she can get away with it. When Tony showed up her act became useless, and she wasn't getting away with anything, and no authority figure was going to turn around and undermine themselves to try to gain her sympathy which is what's been happening this whole time. If you read it even just from the perspective that Antimony is a kid who's getting herself in deep poo poo rather than that she's The Protagonist who's bound to Take On The System and Win, Tony's the only adult who's actually been acting in her interests, here, sometimes helping someone and being a niceguy who's chill and fun are mutually exclusive note how the assumption in the thread is immediately that now that she's had everything explained and knows he's not really on board with the Court's rules she's going to go off and do more of the poo poo she was doing before when she thought nobody would stop her, because that's exactly been her characterization. Presumably that will ultimately work out okay for her instead of ending up with her unceremoniously dumped on the streets and abandoned by the only world she knew, because it's a story and she's the protagonist, but the characters in the story don't know they're characters in a story. Like Kat Donny's done something narratively necessary and emotionally satisfying to the readership but completely counterproductive, assuming the objective is anything but 'Antimony as isolated enemy of the only support system she's got' A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 13:19 on Aug 26, 2015 |
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Aug 26, 2015 12:50
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Splicer posted:Or he could have says "Annie this is your father. Sorry for not being around, I went a bit mad. The court is going to kick you out for being a weirdo, so stop screwing around if you ever want to see any of your friends again ever. PS I'm paying a price in exchange for maybe not kicking you out, don't ask about it but be aware." No, he could not have done that. Antimony learning about it now, in this way, makes her liable to act against the Court, or to try to find poo poo out, or any other action that could piss the Court off even more. If Anthony had shown her that he doesn't take the Court's threats seriously by blurting the stuff out on her on his own that would make it even more likely. That is not what Anthony wants; he doesn't want Antimony to mess with the Court. He doesn't want Antimony to do something that could get the Court to actively work against her.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:01
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It's nice to see he's motivated by some actual concern for his daughter and not just pure selfishness or whatnot (I'm going to assume he's being honest here -- he may be an rear end and may have made a bunch of terrible decisions, but I don't think he's some evil agent of the court or whatnot), but he's a helluva long way from #1 Best Dad. Bit confused by "they were going to expel her" ... "they were going to wait until her graduation and then cast her out"... as those seem to be conflicting statements. I suppose he could mean "expel her [from the court]" rather than from school. Interest assumption on his part that she'd want to stay -- or more probably that he for some reason believes staying is best for her. Quinton fucked around with this message at 13:08 on Aug 26, 2015 |
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Aug 26, 2015 13:03
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tony lookin a bit more sympathetic but i stand by what i said when the only info we had was him being authoritarian maximum overdad after however many years' unexplained absence sending annie into mindbreak mode
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Aug 26, 2015 13:06
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Quinton posted:Bit confused by "they were going to expel her" ... "they were going to wait until her graduation and then cast her out"... as those seem to be conflicting statements. I suppose he could mean "expel her [from the court]" rather than from school. Interest assumption on his part that she'd want to stay -- or more probably that he for some reason believes staying is best for her. What I got is that they were going to wait until the graduation ceremony to expel her in the most humiliating circumstance possible.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:19
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:The true hero, all along Blackheart my dear pal, can you teach me to cope with being so unerringly correct all of the time.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:20
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YF-23 posted:What I got is that they were going to wait until the graduation ceremony to expel her in the most humiliating circumstance possible. yyyup also what are the odds that frankenstein Hogwarts is actually an accredited institution
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Aug 26, 2015 13:21
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Is it not clear that he's only speaking on the issue now because literally every other moment in this comic, he was under Court surveillance? Clearly there were plenty of things that the Court doesn't want Annie to know. It's not only emotional reasons that Tony couldn't just walk up and tell Annie the truth. I don't know if they're going to go so far as to explain why he was a dick about her makeup, but he was likely just filling the part of the no-nonsense, no-nepotism rule-abiding heartless teacher. And makeup isn't allowed.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:25
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YF-23 posted:What I got is that they were going to wait until the graduation ceremony to expel her in the most humiliating circumstance possible. That just seems entirely over the top... but then this *is* the Court and looking back at how they handled the appointment of the new Medium (which presumably was them delivering a similar message to her), it certainly seems possible...
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Aug 26, 2015 13:31
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Fecha posted:Is it not clear that he's only speaking on the issue now because literally every other moment in this comic, he was under Court surveillance? Clearly there were plenty of things that the Court doesn't want Annie to know. It's not only emotional reasons that Tony couldn't just walk up and tell Annie the truth. I don't know if they're going to go so far as to explain why he was a dick about her makeup, but he was likely just filling the part of the no-nonsense, no-nepotism rule-abiding heartless teacher. And makeup isn't allowed. nah i'm p sure he wasn't doing it for the court's benefit so much as Antimony's (see above). they don't really seem to care how poo poo gets done so long as it goes their way, and doesn't involve the wrong kind of magic given that the Court is also not some completely unknowable third party nobody in the cast has routine access to and knows intimately, how much of a dillhole is Eglamore for his whole 'hey kids I'm the authority figure but i'm Cool just don't let me catch you smoking up on campus directly in front of the security camera haha!' act, Antimony was right about him vvvv She still has her friends and a prospect of a future as something other than a bag lady who thinks she's a fire demon. Being Sad is not the same thing as having your life ruined irretrievably, even when you're like 15 A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 13:37 on Aug 26, 2015 |
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Aug 26, 2015 13:34
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Boogaleeboo posted:These are the polite gloves. The non-polite gloves are the Court burning her world to the ground, which was plan A. This is the soft option. in what way would you describe annie's world as not having been burned to the ground in the last couple chapters
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Aug 26, 2015 13:34
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YF-23 posted:What I got is that they were going to wait until the graduation ceremony to expel her in the most humiliating circumstance possible. Most of the characters that attend the court seem to be lifers. They go to school at the court, then get jobs at the court. Notice his reference to "the program". I'm guessing it's doubly true for the supernatural folks.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:35
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"Then I realized they can't expell her at graduation if I hold her back every year so she never graduates! Tony old boy you've done it again."
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Aug 26, 2015 13:37
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Pistol_Pete posted:A magnificent chapter as, inch by inch, the Tony-haters have been pushed into a corner and left clutching at desperate straws like: "well, even so, he didn't HAVE to be quite so harsh about her makeup." We who believed in Anthony Carver now await your apology for your utter wrongness. We've also been handed a new straw called "Was basically content to complete his suicide after he discovered he potentially harmed his daughter instead of doing the responsible thing and helping his daughter and taking responsibility." Literally the only reason he moved up from "terrible dead dad" to "bad dad" is because the Court forced him too. The Court is literally making him a better dad for his daughter here than he would be on his own. That does not reflect well on him!
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Aug 26, 2015 13:41
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Tollymain posted:in what way would you describe annie's world as not having been burned to the ground in the last couple chapters The part where she still sees her friends and interacts in a familiar environment where her needs are taken care of?
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Aug 26, 2015 13:41
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GlyphGryph posted:We've also been handed a new straw called "Was basically content to complete his suicide after he discovered he potentially harmed his daughter instead of doing the responsible thing and helping his daughter and taking responsibility." Weird, I remember the "tony bad dad" crew more or less arguing that Anthony would've been a better dad if he hadn't come at all to mess Annie's life up.
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Aug 26, 2015 13:47
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GlyphGryph posted:We've also been handed a new straw called "Was basically content to complete his suicide after he discovered he potentially harmed his daughter instead of doing the responsible thing and helping his daughter and taking responsibility." while he's no more competent than anyone thought he was I'm p sure it wasn't so much suicide as bleeding out on the floor in a cave in the No Real Doctors Here Dimension after having his shady necromantic spell backfire on him also lol YF-23 posted:Weird, I remember the "tony bad dad" crew more or less arguing that Anthony would've been a better dad if he hadn't come at all to mess Annie's life up. A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 13:51 on Aug 26, 2015 |
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Aug 26, 2015 13:47
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I have to wonder just how much Ether fuckery there is going on in the Court's heirarchy. If a boat can be made into an eldritch monstrosity, can a hobbesian social contract materialize as a literal Leviathan?
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Aug 26, 2015 13:51
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Capfalcon posted:The part where she still sees her friends and interacts in a familiar environment where her needs are taken care of? you're kidding, right
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Aug 26, 2015 13:53
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Pistol_Pete posted:A magnificent chapter as, inch by inch, the Tony-haters have been pushed into a corner and left clutching at desperate straws like: "well, even so, he didn't HAVE to be quite so harsh about her makeup." We who believed in Anthony Carver now await your apology for your utter wrongness. Afflicted with greatness
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Aug 26, 2015 13:57
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Tollymain posted:you're kidding, right Considering that the original statement was "This is the nicer than the alternative," I was pointing out that, while she had the rug cruelly ripped out from under her by suddenly-present-with-no-explanation-and-also-incredibly-disapproving father, she wasn't cast out into the non-court world where she doesn't know anyone, much less even know how to survive. So, yes, life really sucks, but the Court wanted to do much worse, apparently.
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Aug 26, 2015 14:11
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Demiurge4 posted:I noticed the elemental doesn't have its angry face on anymore. Came here to post this. Slapfights are dumb.
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Aug 26, 2015 14:21
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Anthony "The Once and Future King" Carver.GlyphGryph posted:We've also been handed a new straw called "Was basically content to complete his suicide after he discovered he potentially harmed his daughter instead of doing the responsible thing and helping his daughter and taking responsibility." I too hate the suicidal and the depressed (Your point is dumb.) ZenMasterBullshit fucked around with this message at 14:30 on Aug 26, 2015 |
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Aug 26, 2015 14:24
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Tony is an idiot and a horrible dad. If he were a part of her life at all instead of trying to get the court to play her substitute parents while he went globe trotting to try to bring back his dead wife, he would know that Annie has done quite well for herself with the forest, having successfully lived there with some of its people. Her fire elemental abilities are coming along nicely. Why does she need the court? Surely calling her up and saying "they found out about your cheating and are going to expel you, so we'll enroll you in a regular school that's not run by evil bastards who are trying to control us."
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Aug 26, 2015 14:51
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Capfalcon posted:Considering that the original statement was "This is the nicer than the alternative," I was pointing out that, while she had the rug cruelly ripped out from under her by suddenly-present-with-no-explanation-and-also-incredibly-disapproving father, she wasn't cast out into the non-court world where she doesn't know anyone, much less even know how to survive. Truly a fate worse then death.
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Aug 26, 2015 14:54
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I wonder if the implication here is that the court came and picked him up off the rocks and put him in that room/tent that he's in. Or did he actually manage to drag himself somewhere on his own, and then they found him? Kind of a big jump from the last panel of the previous page, where he's lying on the rocks half bled-out and waiting to die, and then this page where he's suddenly bandaged and on a cot. Also this thread has been insufferable ever since the Tony arc started.
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Aug 26, 2015 14:54
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Either the Court saved him (which would mean he was being monitored in his journeys even though he thought he wasn't) or someone else did and the Court eventually found out about it and sent their agents. Either is possible but my initial assumption was the second case.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:06
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Yes I think that's exactly the implication, wheels within wheels poo poo. "Hey Tony hah hah looks like you were in a bit of a pickle, noticed you tried to avoid our watching, good thing that doesn't work! Anyhow looks like you had a good sabbatical, sorry about your wife and all, but listen, you're coming back now because we need you to keep up that work you were doing. Saved your life and all, because you always were quite handy to have around. What? Oh. Right. Still! Could use your mind, didn't lose that, did you? Oh. Well, listen, we need you to come back to the Court and all. Incidentally that girl of yours? Yeah we're gonna kick her out. She's an obnoxious, entitled brat and a cheating student. Honor code violations and that. Zero tolerance. You know how it goes. So yeah. Kicking her out. We know your dying wife's final wishes were for her to stay, but rules are rules. Unless there's something you think you could do. You know, since you're coming back now and all. . ."
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Aug 26, 2015 15:06
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tonberrytoby posted:Yes, she would have to leave the court and move somewhere else. For example to the forest right next door, where she stayed several times already. And as we know Coyote is a fun and nurturing leader, and her actions wouldn't in any way lead to increased tensions between the two parties! quote:For example the Psycopomps Oh, the inhuman beings of the ether. That sounds....great, and like it pays the bills. quote:Kat or Jones if they decided against staying at the court. Oh, so she can destroy her friend's life or hope that the emotionless being decides to....wipe her rear end for her for no reason? These seem like swell ideas you have.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:08
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Yes those, all of them have been a more positive influence on Annie then the Court and Tony together.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:20
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The Court's motivation is a little opaque here. Either they wanted to humiliate Annie/make a example of her, in which case, why not go ahead as planned and let her get her rear end expelled or they want to rein her in and make her a functional member of the Court, in which case... why not do it themselves? They've been treating Annie with the kid's gloves, sure, but its a bit much to go from kid's gloves to "Haha expelled forever gently caress you". Either way, Tony's presence seems superfluous, unless were to believe that the Court are so bad at discipline they only know the trodden upon or nuclear options. e: Boogaleeboo posted:And as we know Coyote is a fun and nurturing leader, and her actions wouldn't in any way lead to increased tensions between the two parties! Except Coyote would love the increased tension/chaos, and so far we've only really seen him be a outright rear end in a top hat to Ysengrin, whos kinda a punching bag anyway? I mean, the forest wouldn't be ideal, but its not quite the horrific option you're trying to paint it. Annie spent a whole summer there with no issue.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:23
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Conot posted:The Court's motivation is a little opaque here. Either they wanted to humiliate Annie/make a example of her, in which case, why not go ahead as planned and let her get her rear end expelled or they want to rein her in and make her a functional member of the Court, in which case... why not do it themselves? They've been treating Annie with the kid's gloves, sure, but its a bit much to go from kid's gloves to "Haha expelled forever gently caress you". Honestly, I think the "We were lying to him to get him to come back and work for us" option is pretty likely, too.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:30
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Conot posted:e: The fact that Coyote would love the chaos does not actually mean it would be good for Annie, or anyone else for that matter. Also, she spent a whole summer there... under continuous threat of her hand getting cut off. I think that ranks somewhat higher than what Tony's done in terms of strictness.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:36
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UndyingShadow posted:Tony is an idiot and a horrible dad. If he were a part of her life at all instead of trying to get the court to play her substitute parents while he went globe trotting to try to bring back his dead wife, he would know that Annie has done quite well for herself with the forest, having successfully lived there with some of its people. Her fire elemental abilities are coming along nicely. Why does she need the court? yeah she's getting along grandly with her buddies the wolfmonster who sporadically goes berserk and tries to kill her, and the manipulative scheming god who devours minds Capfalcon posted:Honestly, I think the "We were lying to him to get him to come back and work for us" option is pretty likely, too. and also sometimes the court just chews people up and spits them out yeah
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Aug 26, 2015 15:40
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Conot posted:Except Coyote would love the increased tension/chaos, and so far we've only really seen him be a outright rear end in a top hat to Ysengrin, whos kinda a punching bag anyway? Except for those times he nearly had Ysengrin kill her, or told her to keep a secret or he would cut off her hand, or that time he gave Renard a power that he knew would kill an innocent man, or I don't know the million other things that he does all the time that people ignore for some reason. quote:I mean, the forest wouldn't be ideal, but its not quite the horrific option you're trying to paint it. Annie spent a whole summer there with no issue. Summer camp isn't a life. It's something you do before coming back to your life. Also for people finding it hard to believe that the Court would suddenly just go nuclear and be total pricks to her in front of everyone for no reason, what do you think about the time they already did that before in the past?
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Aug 26, 2015 15:46
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Paramemetic posted:Yes I think that's exactly the implication, wheels within wheels poo poo. This is the way I read things. The Court could have tried harder to control Annie themselves, but this way they rein Tony and Annie in at the same time. It's all pretty hosed up. The Court created the problem with Annie in the first place (by utterly failing to demonstrate that her disrespect of the Court's authority has any meaningful consequences), and now they have used Annie as leverage against Tony.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:50
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Dr Subterfuge posted:This is the way I read things. The Court could have tried harder to control Annie themselves, but this way they rein Tony and Annie in at the same time. It's all pretty hosed up. The Court created the problem with Annie in the first place (by utterly failing to demonstrate that her disrespect of the Court's authority has any meaningful consequences), and now they have used Annie as leverage against Tony. All in all, a plan well executed.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:54
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Conot posted:The Court's motivation is a little opaque here. Either they wanted to humiliate Annie/make a example of her, in which case, why not go ahead as planned and let her get her rear end expelled or they want to rein her in and make her a functional member of the Court, in which case... why not do it themselves? They've been treating Annie with the kid's gloves, sure, but its a bit much to go from kid's gloves to "Haha expelled forever gently caress you". Plus they may not see it as worth the effort. It seems like that whole rebirth cycle would tend to make them short lived. Not a terribly worthwhile investment to pour lots of resources into compared to someone like Kat who will likely live 80+ years and contribute substantially to the court's tech department the whole time.
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Aug 26, 2015 15:59
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BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 03:06 on Dec 1, 2016 |
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Aug 26, 2015 16:09
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YF-23 posted:Either the Court saved him (which would mean he was being monitored in his journeys even though he thought he wasn't) or someone else did and the Court eventually found out about it and sent their agents. Either is possible but my initial assumption was the second case. I think it's most likely that they tracked the rocket and sent out a recovery team.
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Aug 26, 2015 16:16
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