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Yeah I feel the same way about the Reasons of State quest. Imagine if they'd done it that way, though? Roche, Ves and Thaler dying offscreen and Dijkstra taking over without player input? The fans would cry bloody murder.Jack of Hearts posted:Having read the novels, I got the impression that Nilfgaard was supposed to be reasonably tolerant of the elder races, which is why they got their northern relatives on their side so easily. That's propaganda. Elves and dwarves fought for the North at Sodden. Afterwards, when Nilfgaard armed the Scoia'tael both with weapons and with the strategically impolitic slogan "Humans to the sea" and the humans of the North began to turn on them, they had no choice but to flee or become rebels. If you stuck around, you'd be forced to help the Scoia'tael by sword, then killed for helping the Scoia'tael by the humans. Temerian special forces were breaking nonhumans on wagon wheels then staking up corpses by the major thoroughfares as a warning, for the crime of giving Squirrels grain at sword point. Scoia'tael themselves often assassinated any prominent non-human leaders calling for peace and reconciliation. There was nowhere to turn. All of this is according to Emhyr's plan. It's the same reason he turned the north against mages after Thanedd and with the framing of the Lodge in TW2. The North, together, was strong, vital, innovative. But they had deep divisions that could be exploited to allow a Nilfgaardian victory. Iskra's backstory in Time of Contempt shows how the Elder Races are truly treated in Nilfgaard. Separate but equal, at best. Which granted, is often better than what's started happening to them in the North. But that's as much Nilfgaard's doing as the Nordlings. They wanted them at each others' throats.
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Sep 6, 2015 04:40
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The Sharmat posted:Yeah I feel the same way about the Reasons of State quest. Imagine if they'd done it that way, though? Roche, Ves and Thaler dying offscreen and Dijkstra taking over without player input? The fans would cry bloody murder. They could have made a subquestion where you discover those plans though. Then you can stop it, etc. That would have been neat. The best way to describe Nilfgaard for me is that they are awful, but structured. They're big on keeping the veneer of "WE ARE CIVILIZED." Never mind that if you don't want to accept their "gift" of civilization they'll kill you and your family. And the game really, really doesn't show you how ruthless Emhyr is.
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Sep 6, 2015 04:51
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It does but it's all carefully hidden. I didn't even notice all of it on my first playthrough. And I was looking.
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Sep 6, 2015 04:57
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The Sharmat posted:Iskra's backstory in Time of Contempt shows how the Elder Races are truly treated in Nilfgaard. Separate but equal, at best. Which granted, is often better than what's started happening to them in the North. But that's as much Nilfgaard's doing as the Nordlings. They wanted them at each others' throats. I admit, I don't remember what Iskra's deal was compared to the humans of the gang, because Tolkein made me an anti-elf racist. But the short stories made clear that elves who weren't willing to totally assimilate were facing slow annihilation prior to the wars, while the elves' alliance with Nilfgaard got them the Valley of the Flowers as an autonomous realm. "Separate but equal" is a bad phrase to use here, because it calls to mind civil rights in America, where groups truly want to be treated equally; meanwhile, a lot of elves (who are explicitly given voice in the author's works) would love nothing more than to be separate and also very much separate, thank you. I think there's a lot more subtlety here than you're letting on.
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Sep 6, 2015 05:49
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Dol Blathana is hardly autonomous. Iskra is the only time we ever see Nilfgaardian elves that I can remember, and it's pretty explicit that they're normally killed when found outside the reservations. This was not the case in the North. The ones dying out in the Last Wish are the ones that are trying to be separate at all costs. Leading to their inevitable economic and political marginalization.
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Sep 6, 2015 05:52
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The Sharmat posted:Dol Blathana is hardly autonomous. How is Dol Blathana not self-ruling? Every nation is subject to treaty obligations. I don't really think it's explicit at all how elves are treated in Nilfgaard, because Nilfgaard is not homogeneous, and having looked up Iskra's story in Time of Contempt, evidence is scant. Clearly, "free elves" live on reservations within a particular Nilfgaardian sub-kingdom, but those reservations must be wholly self-governing, since there's a no-man's land between them and human territories. But complete separation from humans is what a substantial number of elves desire.* (Why would the elves of Dol Blathana side with Nilfgaard if their southern cousins were all being essentially suffocated to death?) * Elves are discriminated against in this world, but also, elves (e: certain elves) are godawful pricks, much like in Tolkein. Dwarves were doing fine for themselves until elves decided to carry them along with their elder-racial-superiority bullshit. Tacky-Ass Rococco fucked around with this message at 06:24 on Sep 6, 2015 |
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Sep 6, 2015 06:16
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I went all-loving-out for Vergen and its benevolent dragon queen and it barely gets a mention in W3  .
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Sep 6, 2015 06:19
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Jack of Hearts posted:How is Dol Blathana not self-ruling? Every nation is subject to treaty obligations. Jack of Hearts posted:I don't really think it's explicit at all how elves are treated in Nilfgaard, because Nilfgaard is not homogeneous, and having looked up Iskra's story in Time of Contempt, evidence is scant. Clearly, "free elves" live on reservations within a particular Nilfgaardian sub-kingdom, but those reservations must be wholly self-governing, since there's a no-man's land between them and human territories. But complete separation from humans is what a substantial number of elves desire.* Jack of Hearts posted:(Why would the elves of Dol Blathana side with Nilfgaard if their southern cousins were all being essentially suffocated to death?) And I'll pose you a similar question: Why did elves and dwarves fight for the North at Sodden in the first war if they'd have it so much better under Nilfgaard? Jack of Hearts posted:* Elves are discriminated against in this world, but also, elves are godawful pricks, much like in Tolkein. Dwarves were doing fine for themselves until elves decided to carry them along with their elder-racial-superiority bullshit. Dwarves were doing fine for themselves purely because by happenstance, their culture is more compatible with human culture, and also because they live in unassailable mountain strongholds for the most part. Dwarves outside Mahakam genuinely don't care if they're forced into ghettos. Their psychology just works that way. wiegieman posted:I went all-loving-out for Vergen and its benevolent dragon queen and it barely gets a mention in W3 Eskel at least mentions there's still fighting in the area so maybe Saskia is ok. Though I've heard a surprisingly plausible conspiracy theory about the potential ending for Saskia in TW2 that is kinda dark but would allow CDPR to consolidate the outcomes if they decide to bring her back later. Basically the idea is that the curse is never lifted no matter what you do. Philippa's counter-spell was bullshit (Geralt and Iorveth both express skepticism about it). At the end, Philippa has escaped, and feeds Saskia lines to give Geralt via telepathy, so it looks like she's free but isn't.
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Sep 6, 2015 06:28
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The Sharmat posted:Dol Blathana's treaty obligations are "Doing whatever the hell Emhyr tells them to". I mean, this isn't ASoiaF, we're not given that much information. If the Valley of Flowers is indefensible, then yes, it's a protectorate of Nilfgaard. Even then, allegiances switch, and northern elves can fight for the north against the south if need be. Feudalism is complicated in this regard. The Sharmat posted:Nonetheless, it's the only example we have. The chief example we have of the Nilfgaard confederacy is Toussaint, which also cannot be construed as representative, because it seems really swell. The Sharmat posted:Dwarves outside Mahakam genuinely don't care if they're forced into ghettos. Their psychology just works that way. Goddamn, I though I was racist. You're gonna say that about Zoltan? Zoltan?
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Sep 6, 2015 06:54
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The Sharmat is SA's #1 Witcher 3 fan, and he's racist towards Zoltan. This is a sad day.
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Sep 6, 2015 06:58
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Jack of Hearts posted:I mean, this isn't ASoiaF, we're not given that much information. If the Valley of Flowers is indefensible, then yes, it's a protectorate of Nilfgaard. Jack of Hearts posted:The chief example we have of the Nilfgaard confederacy is Toussaint, which also cannot be construed as representative, because it seems really swell. Jack of Hearts posted:Goddamn, I though I was racist. You're gonna say that about Zoltan? Zoltan? Zoltan doesn't deny this when it's brought up. Dwarves don't care that much about where they live. They just like having other dwarves around to work with. They're different. EDIT: Is it racism when they're another species? I mean elves and humans can interbreed and aren't really that different. They're no more than subspecies. Dwarves are different. Also dwarves are better smiths because they have more fast twitch muscle fibers. Prove me wrong.
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Sep 6, 2015 06:59
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Forest troll make bridge all like this But rock troll make bridge like this
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Sep 6, 2015 07:07
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The Sharmat posted:EDIT: Is it racism when they're another species? I mean elves and humans can interbreed and aren't really that different. They're no more than subspecies. Dwarves are different. I've actually assumed that all sapient non-monstrous humanoid races (halflings, humans, elves, dwarves) are the same species (with magical/interdimensional variation) and can interbreed. There's no evidence they can't, just that elves look better and are more prominent targets for mating. We have no evidence against this. And what does halfling even mean in this context?
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Sep 6, 2015 07:11
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Dudes with furry hands and feet. Shorter than dwarves, and slighter. Yeah that's one of the more common theories. It's hard to test though given that despite what every singe dwarf believes, no other race finds dwarf women remotely attractive nor do they desire to "steal" them.
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Sep 6, 2015 07:17
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On Nilfgaard and elves, aren't they partially descended from them? That's why the their language is so similar to the Elder Speech, right?
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Sep 6, 2015 07:19
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Lord Cyrahzax posted:On Nilfgaard and elves, aren't they partially descended from them? That's why the their language is so similar to the Elder Speech, right? No more than in the North. They did take more from their culture though, for whatever reason, in terms of language. Though even this isn't unique to them. Lots of northern names are descended from Elder Speech equivalents. Cirilla, for instance (a common name in the Northern Realms, to the extent that the Lodge felt Ciri wouldn't even need to change it to lay low) comes from the Elven "Zireael", meaning swallow. Some Northern propaganda after the first war when racial tensions started breaking out due to the Scoia'tael was that the Nilfgaardians weren't even actually human, but an elven race derived from the southern "Black Seidhe". Which is ironic since there's elven blood in virtually every family in the North, and it was only within the past twenty years or so that they even began discriminating against half and quarter elves.
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Sep 6, 2015 07:23
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Just got to the Isle of Mists. But I've got about 15 quests in my journal, some about 17 levels higher than the Main Quest. (I've got the achievement for recruiting all possible allies so I've assumed I've not missed anything important, and I've not auto failed any quests.) Should I reload and take care of them first or will I get a chance later on?
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Sep 6, 2015 11:24
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There's still a lot of time after the Isles to do the sidequests, so no worries.
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Sep 6, 2015 11:42
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JaucheCharly posted:What's the deal with the stone circle in the woods NW of crow's perch? If you go there when the moon is right you can take a moongate to the underworld, but don't forget to bring the sandlewood box.
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Sep 6, 2015 13:45
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To people who finished the game - I'm looking for PC save game files for different endings: where Ciri dies and where she becomes a witcher. I'm only interested in playing the epilogue scenes so the perfect save point would be when Geralt rides to the tower before Ciri teleports to fight the White Frost. Anybody could help me out here?
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Sep 6, 2015 18:43
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Palpek posted:To people who finished the game - I'm looking for PC save game files for different endings: where Ciri dies and where she becomes a witcher. I'm only interested in playing the epilogue scenes so the perfect save point would be when Geralt rides to the tower before Ciri teleports to fight the White Frost. Even faster than finding the right endgame file, if it suits your needs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r08I_h1TBE
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Sep 6, 2015 20:20
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Yeah, I know youtube exists but I want to play through those parts and a lot of people finished the game with different endings so theoretically getting a couple save files before the final showdown shouldn't be a problem. I can provide one where Ciri becomes an empress if anybody's interested.
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Sep 6, 2015 20:40
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Can we please return to a civil discussion and keep dwarf misogyny and body shaming out of this thread? Thanks. Sorry, but reading micro aggressions against dwarf politics is one of my triggers.
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Sep 6, 2015 21:20
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The Mahakam Internet Defense Force needs to leave. Their inordinate influence on Northern finance has hampered the war effort from the start. The Vivaldi Bank is just a tool of Nilfgaardian economic hegemony. Edit: Christ there is a lot of hugging in the last quarter or so of this game. The Sharmat fucked around with this message at 07:35 on Sep 7, 2015 |
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Sep 7, 2015 07:11
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Because of lack of interest in sharing the save games from you guys I'm just powering through the main quest to play through the other endings but I must say I'm enjoying the 'wrong' Ciri interaction alternatives as I didn't expect some of them to be whole new scenes. For example not going with Ciri to The Lodge's meeting triggers a hilarious scene where Geralt waits behind the door and Yen shows up and there is this whole 'stressed parents waiting in the school corridor while their kid is taking an exam' kind of scene complete with Yen trying to look through the keyhole and Geralt first being irritated at that but then asking if he could also take a look. Of course afterwards Ciri comes out and they both pretend they're looking at something interesting on the wall. Fun stuff all around.
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Sep 7, 2015 10:32
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That's not the "wrong" choice. That's the good choice. You can usually tell what the wrong choices are by the aftermath. Also because Yennefer usually tells you if you did good or bad, but by that point it's too late. I'd give you one of my Witcheress ones but I don't have private messaging or anything.
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Sep 7, 2015 10:41
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Ah ok, I didn't know that haha, then the wrong choice of going with Ciri inside is also worth seeing if only to see The Lodge's new stance regarding her. Would it be a problem for you to upload the save file here? http://www.filedropper.com/ You could just post a link in the thread. Also a question regarding freeing Margarita from the prison - there's an option to ask Zoltan to help you out by bringing alcohol to the guards but he refuses saying he's afraid of getting killed as he would be a dwarf showing up right at Eternal Fire's fanatics' door (btw I thought this was completely out of character for him as that guy was never afraid of anything (like going to Kaer Morhen to fight the freaking space elves) and wouldn't refuse to help Geralt). Later I started wondering if his reaction changes when you kill Radovid first? It seems the threat of being killed because of being non-human would be gone.
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Sep 7, 2015 10:49
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Does it matter if the save is from an earlier patch? If not I'll upload it later today. Yeah it's definitely worth it to take the wrong choices to see alternate things play-out and get more information. Or at least youtube them. Especially when there's no other way to, for example find out what the Lodge offered Ciri. Zoltan: only helps you if Geralt didn't do Triss's sidequest. If you skip that, then the witchhunters are too busy loving with alchemists and such in Novigrad to move on to non-humans. Margarita's whole thing was apparently changed late in development. Apparently, you initially heard about her much earlier on, and rescuing her was involved with the overall Dijkstra quest chain in Novigrad. At one point there was apparently a choice that would eventually require you to save her or help Dijkstra get his treasure, in a mutually exclusive fashion. This is probably why Yennefer doesn't talk about her in that cut sequence where the Lodge gets screwed. Rita can be dead by that point in the game, originally..
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Sep 7, 2015 11:01
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The Sharmat posted:Does it matter if the save is from an earlier patch? If not I'll upload it later today. Regarding Zoltan: that makes sense, although if the option of him helping you out exists then it would be pretty nice to have that option open up again if you kill Radovid before asking him, just one trigger more for an already existing content.
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Sep 7, 2015 11:20
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Killing Radovid has absolutely no impact in the world until the end sequence and it's pretty clear they just ran out of time and money there.
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Sep 7, 2015 11:28
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Palpek posted:Because of lack of interest in sharing the save games from you guys I'm just powering through the main quest to play through the other endings but I must say I'm enjoying the 'wrong' Ciri interaction alternatives as I didn't expect some of them to be whole new scenes. For example not going with Ciri to The Lodge's meeting triggers a hilarious scene where Geralt waits behind the door and Yen shows up and there is this whole 'stressed parents waiting in the school corridor while their kid is taking an exam' kind of scene complete with Yen trying to look through the keyhole and Geralt first being irritated at that but then asking if he could also take a look. Of course afterwards Ciri comes out and they both pretend they're looking at something interesting on the wall. Fun stuff all around. I should have a witcheress save you're welcome to borrow, but won't be back to my main computer until Tuesday. If you haven't played through that ending by then, I'll send it your way.
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Sep 7, 2015 11:44
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The ending was shorter than I anticipated, but still very good. I think it was the happy ending, but it was still poignant. Not sad like MGS 3, but I loved that ending and this was very similar in some respects, probably because they're both about mentors and families of choice. The voice acting, facial animations, and body language in this game were exemplary. I only wish there was some way they tracked Geralt's hair and armor in some of the cutscenes. Looking forward to checking out the other endings online. Edit: I don't even want to know how long I have spent on this game in the past few months. Fortunately the PS4 version messes up the clock if you out the game in rest mode (my game says more than 23 days, which is absurd), so I don't have to know. I'm sure it was well over one hundred hours. the truth fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Sep 7, 2015 |
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Sep 7, 2015 20:10
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Ok guys I managed to find a pretty good point in the game to get the witcher ending. Thanks to everybody who offered help. I should be able to use that point again to get to the last ending pretty fast it's just before Ciri talking to the Lodge so you have 3 Ciri checkpoints pretty close to one another and just before the final few missions so it's doable in a couple of hours I'll post the 3 different main ending saves when I'm done so people can experience them if they want. Also that witcher ending is pretty great. The delivery of the lines changef a lot in how I felt about it when I only knew how the ending went before playing it myself so I'm really happy I went through with seeing it myself. It's just very warm when it comes to Ciri-Geralt interactions and this makes it pretty genuine. I also found it pretty funny that the witcher epilogue starts with Geralt going to the emperor while the empress ending starts with Geralt doing witcher stuff. Palpek fucked around with this message at 00:25 on Sep 8, 2015 |
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Sep 8, 2015 00:22
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There is really only one good point for the ending you are talking about. The Empress ending is if Ciri meets her father, while the Witcher ending happens if she doesn't. You only get those if there are enough good choices, otherwise you get the bad ending no matter what. That's my impression after checking out the ending guides and videos this afternoon.
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Sep 8, 2015 00:37
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One thing that kind of gets me about the *end game spoilers* witcher ending, is that it seems like Emhyr will find out Geralt was lieing about her being dead pretty quickly. Ciri goes around doing witcher work, I would think word would spread pretty fast that there is a girl witcher since that's never happened before, and it would get back to Emhyr.
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Sep 8, 2015 00:38
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Supposedly Emhyr slips into plural in the first part of his dialogue, as in "Ihr... du" if German translation were based on Polish - but it's apparently based on English, so that bit was lost in translation. But yes, ashen-haired witcheress is too obvious for any of Geralt's circle, much less to Emperor of Nilfgaard with spy network.
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Sep 8, 2015 00:45
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RenegadeStyle1 posted:One thing that kind of gets me about the *end game spoilers* witcher ending, is that it seems like Emhyr will find out Geralt was lieing about her being dead pretty quickly. Ciri goes around doing witcher work, I would think word would spread pretty fast that there is a girl witcher since that's never happened before, and it would get back to Emhyr. I got the impression that he knew, or at least suspected, what was happening
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Sep 8, 2015 01:41
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The entire spark of the game was that Emhyr can't find Ciri. I imagine tracking down a Witcher would be really hard work, nevermind a Witcher that can side step realities and walk betwixt worlds and poo poo.
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Sep 8, 2015 02:24
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Nemesis Of Moles posted:The entire spark of the game was that Emhyr can't find Ciri. I imagine tracking down a Witcher would be really hard work, nevermind a Witcher that can side step realities and walk betwixt worlds and poo poo. The guy literally (which is to say figuratively) dances on the graves of his enemies. If his intelligence network caught wind of a white-haired witcher teamed win an ashen-haired witcher (who had white hair, to bring the father-daughter thing home), then yeah, Geralt at least is dead.
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Sep 8, 2015 03:12
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Jack of Hearts posted:The guy literally (which is to say figuratively) dances on the graves of his enemies. If his intelligence network caught wind of a white-haired witcher teamed win an ashen-haired witcher (who had white hair, to bring the father-daughter thing home), then yeah, Geralt at least is dead. In my ending he was dead as gently caress, so I assume that Nilfgaardian interest in Ciri died with him.
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Sep 8, 2015 04:47
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