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I love all these people spouting proverbs to defend SC that were originally written in context of smaller forces beating larger ones in combat, or some dude sculpting a really big, complex statue out of a difficult material, and starting over and over again if he screws up. Context matters. But here's a few that are actually relevant. quote:A fool and his money are parted easily. And that's just the As.
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Oct 2, 2015 12:42
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Xaerael posted:I love all these people spouting proverbs to defend SC that were originally written in context of smaller forces beating larger ones in combat, or some dude sculpting a really big, complex statue out of a difficult material, and starting over and over again if he screws up. I'm a big fan of "There's none so blind as them that won't see."
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Oct 2, 2015 13:00
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Stanko-Prussian posted:I suspect the mentions are because croberts is trying to use "gamergate" as a jar of bees. allude that this might be in their wheelhouse, shake them up, then throw them into the room. Not a good plan for anyone involved if it works, or if it doesn't work. Just got sent a screen cap in fact that pretty much sums that up. Not image linking it because I don't want to cause a derail. http://puu.sh/kvLSU/7c571a6bbc.png Croberts little cultists will go very far it seems.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:00
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SirTagz posted:Or.. you know.. the 2-3 people with agenda spammed their emails to every outlet, including DS and the Escapist but most of the outlets saw the letters as unreliable and uncorfirmed anonymous spam which cannot be reported. According to The Escapist, they have 7 identified individuals (identified to the editor, the writer and their legal department) previous or current CIG employees, plus 2 anonymous sources that they didn't quote from. So it is possible that seven previous & current CIG employees are spinning things to make the Star Citizen development look terrible. I'd say unlikely but certainly possible. Or the Escapist is lying, unlikely but again possible. The reply from Chris Roberts that makes the whole situation look like a complete trainwreck might also be fake, that's very unlikely though.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:03
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Whittle posted:**suits-up** I'll be there. Maybe with an air horn. Maybe not. Depends if I can sneak it past the watchful eyes of DiscoDumbo and FatLes. In any case, FREE SWAG. If you give me the code phrase "Deadpool loves Chimichanga" I'll even buy you a beer for being a goon.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:06
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Stanko-Prussian posted:I'm a big fan of "There's none so blind as them that won't see." Good one for DS "Every dog has it's day"
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Oct 2, 2015 13:11
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Oct 2, 2015 13:32
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AP posted:According to The Escapist, they have 7 identified individuals (identified to the editor, the writer and their legal department) previous or current CIG employees, plus 2 anonymous sources that they didn't quote from. Fair enough. For me the only thing that matters though is their remaining funds and burn-rate. I don't give a gently caress how the people are treated - if they do not like it, they can leave and stay in a less stressful environment. If there is enough money CIG can just keep hiring more skeletor-fodder and release the game eventually. And on the other hand - if CIG is out of money it does not matter if CR is the sweetest most reasonable manager ever - the project will crash and burn. gently caress all this drama. Just show me the money.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:33
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SirTagz posted:gently caress all this drama. Just show me the money. I think once the noise dies down that's going to be the general feeling. How much money is actually left Chris?
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Oct 2, 2015 13:36
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I used to love crossover games like Streets of Simcity where you could race a car in a city that you built in Simcity.As time went by and games got more complex I really enjoyed the possibility of one day being able to have a game that does it all. Like a Grand Theft Auto where you could for example buy property and build a theme park there and then it's a game like Theme Park, or buy a car and drive it in an actual racing sim, maintaining the world coherence. Maybe get elected president and declare war on other countries or be a soldier in that same war. Games like GTA are actually getting more complex and more like that (but still ages away). They gave Croberts too much money and what started as a Space Sim is now an attempt to make such a game, in space. You have an ideas man and a lot of money so a lot can be done, but eventually money is going to end and everything is going to collapse. The feature creep is endless, but not the money. Instead of building a game first and then add complexity, he's trying to make this perfect, complete game in a single go.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:37
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SirTagz posted:Fair enough. A true space capitalist 
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Oct 2, 2015 13:41
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It's not like we've never seen it before. We saw it with Schafer with Broken Age and we're seeing it with Inafune and Mighty No.9. Projects that asked for little, talked big, got way more than they asked for, were late, and the product does not look very good. I think if Kickstarter and crowdfunding has been a lesson in anything, it's that sometimes Publishers exist for a loving reason. As easy as it can be to say those mean old businessmen are stomping over their free spirits, but really they're a bunch of people trying to keep a project on time. And it turns out when you put that in the hands of the fans they're far worse than any boardroom.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:50
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 Can't imagine it's much fun inside CIG at the moment.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:52
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Onmi posted:It's not like we've never seen it before. We saw it with Schafer with Broken Age and we're seeing it with Inafune and Mighty No.9. Projects that asked for little, talked big, got way more than they asked for, were late, and the product does not look very good. I think if Kickstarter and crowdfunding has been a lesson in anything, it's that sometimes Publishers exist for a loving reason. As easy as it can be to say those mean old businessmen are stomping over their free spirits, but really they're a bunch of people trying to keep a project on time. And it turns out when you put that in the hands of the fans they're far worse than any boardroom. Godus from Molyneaux also comes to mind.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:53
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It turns out that expecting all these "game developer legends" from the '80s and '90s to triumphantly return and make your dream games, since now they have full creative control and no pubisher oversight, was a pretty dumb idea dreamed up by manchildren with more nostalgia than sense (and eaten up by younger manchildren with more delusion than anything else).
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Oct 2, 2015 13:56
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Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides.
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Oct 2, 2015 13:57
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SirTagz posted:Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides. Have a nice cup of tea, it might help.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:00
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SirTagz posted:Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides. It's not like they showed any actual emails or anything.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:03
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SirTagz posted:Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides. Actually, if they had been given too much time, they could have fabricated pretty much whatever "evidence" they wanted to post to "prove" it was all "untrue". But you're starting to sound like a true believer, so I don't really know why I'm bothering to reply to you in the first place, because "Chris is right" all the time I guess.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:03
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SirTagz posted:Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides. If they clean up their act before the article drops, then when the article does drop you can sue for libel. Because at the time of publication, the information provided, at least on the stance of company finances, would be incorrect to what was pushed out. 24 hours is SoP for requesting comment, and the requestee is in their right to explain they can't give comment now, but will later, and ask for the article to be postponed. CiG didn't do that. The fact that Crobert didn't say "Yes I will provide comment, but I need time" says that he wanted to attack, not provide a statement. EDIT: It's actually a pretty common tactic, to not respond to your critics when an accusation has been made, and then to launch back, tearfully painting yourself as the mom and pop store victim being bullied by those who want to destroy you. That way the people on your side, will become even more fiercely loyal since they will perceive you as having been unjustly attacked, and you call into credibility to accusations of the accuser giving them a tainted reputation. You can probably think of examples of this that don't have to be pointed out. Onmi fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Oct 2, 2015 |
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Oct 2, 2015 14:05
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SirTagz posted:Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides.  McDowell posted:Aren't Derek Smart's games produced by very few people on very small budgets? Universal Combat 2.0 is more playable than Star Citizen Whoa whoa whoa. I'm the target audience of ~battlecruiser 3000AD~ and its sequels, and I kinda liked what I saw, but I still had more fun dicking about with star citizen. They're both really bad Also, both are really the poster childs of simulation genre. The developer spending so much time on the simulation and assets/features they forgot to make the game. See il-2 or DCS thread for another example.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:06
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I emailed demanding my money back 4 days ago and I haven't gotten any response, positive or negative 
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Oct 2, 2015 14:07
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Onmi posted:I think if Kickstarter and crowdfunding has been a lesson in anything, it's that sometimes Publishers exist for a loving reason. As easy as it can be to say those mean old businessmen are stomping over their free spirits, but really they're a bunch of people trying to keep a project on time. And it turns out when you put that in the hands of the fans they're far worse than any boardroom. That's been my biggest takeaway from all the crap kickstarter video games.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:08
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Onmi posted:It's not like we've never seen it before. We saw it with Schafer with Broken Age and we're seeing it with Inafune and Mighty No.9. Projects that asked for little, talked big, got way more than they asked for, were late, and the product does not look very good. I think if Kickstarter and crowdfunding has been a lesson in anything, it's that sometimes Publishers exist for a loving reason. As easy as it can be to say those mean old businessmen are stomping over their free spirits, but really they're a bunch of people trying to keep a project on time. And it turns out when you put that in the hands of the fans they're far worse than any boardroom. And then Fig showed up to give people fake equity while the keeping filthy, evil hands of invested meddlers away from the pure and innocent game developers.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:10
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The most important person in any creative project is the person who can say "no" without being fired.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:10
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Have citizens already committed a ritual mass suicide to get their real ships in the afterlife?
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Oct 2, 2015 14:10
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That CR letter is brutally pathetic and a terrible piece of PR. Ironically it's exactly how I would envision DS responding if things were reversed. Wait for line of defense to release proper for the DS meltdown. loving egomaniacs, all around. I will say it's sad to see CR flail and gnash, reminds me of hitlers last days... Ve vill counterattack ze Russians and take back the romnian oil fields!!!! (queue Sandi singing deutchland Uber alles, again)
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Oct 2, 2015 14:16
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Onmi posted:EDIT: It's actually a pretty common tactic, to not respond to your critics when an accusation has been made, and then to launch back, tearfully painting yourself as the mom and pop store victim being bullied by those who want to destroy you. That way the people on your side, will become even more fiercely loyal since they will perceive you as having been unjustly attacked, and you call into credibility to accusations of the accuser giving them a tainted reputation. 
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Oct 2, 2015 14:17
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Paladinus posted:Have citizens already committed a ritual mass suicide to get their real ships in the afterlife? e:it's got a z in it. tooterfish fucked around with this message at 14:20 on Oct 2, 2015 |
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Oct 2, 2015 14:18
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SirTagz posted:Well that last comment if pretty much bullshit. It would make sense if Joshua was FBI and stormed CIG Austin office or something to get to the records but they just posted an article. How does that stop an audit or a cleanup or whatever. Wtf people are just loving up their own narratives on both sides. Yeah that sounds like bollocks, but it doesn't matter. Escapist gave them 24 hours to respond. That's perfectly reasonable. They're publishing a news article and don't want to be beaten to the punch. All the SC fans whining about CIG not being given enough time are as usual talking a load of shite. It's something they're focusing on in an attempt to discredit the content and writer, not a genuine complaint. They wouldn't have been happy if Croberts had been given six months to respond. 24 hours is enough to either craft a decent reply (if you're not incompetent and have someone who knows even the slightest thing about public relations) or threaten to bludgeon them with lawyers which they would have grounds for if the story was made up. I know and care nothing about The Escapist or their history and don't give a gently caress what their reputation is like. In this instance the wah games journalism crying is more than a little undeserved given they claim to have been contacted by former and current staffers, checked it out and then run their story based on confirmed sources. That's close enough to actual journalism. Personally I'd have been a bit reluctant to delve into some of it, like the financial stuff, without some kind of documentation to back it. Perhaps they saw proof but couldn't publish it, wasn't mentioned though. If it ends up being totally wrong they'll pay for it and we can have a good laugh at their expense too, but if they did actually check stuff and get it cleared by legal (  ), poo poo's all good.My favourite part of Croberts reply to the article are his demands to know who told them everything. It's like he's never heard of sources being protected before. It is an interesting insight into the mind of a man who is not used to being told "no". it dont matter fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Oct 2, 2015 |
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Oct 2, 2015 14:22
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DOMDOM posted:That CR letter is brutally pathetic and a terrible piece of PR. Ironically it's exactly how I would envision DS responding if things were reversed. Wait for line of defense to release proper for the DS meltdown. i, too, am reminded of the last days of nazi germany, by this videogame
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Oct 2, 2015 14:22
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HOLY poo poo. The box art for the game HAS BEEN LEAKED. Don't get too hyped too quickly, but I think this is a game changer... I'm probably taking back all my dissent. Image behind spoiler so I don't ruin it for everyone. 
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Oct 2, 2015 14:24
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Paladinus posted:Have citizens already committed a ritual mass suicide to get their real ships in the afterlife? And miss Citizen Con? No, CIG will gradually break the bad news over time. We might have to cut the odd feature to release early, we are going to stream line the studios, you'll be happy to hear that progress is going ahead despite some problems with the more expensive elements. Due to gameplay improvements we've decided to cut some ships and modules that weren't needed from the initial release. As you know funding has been an issue for some time, so due to popular demand we're going to reissue Towels you can purchase. Space games continue to be a niche market and with the funding declining, due to your lack of commitment and faith, we are going to switch to a more movie/game focus. The game element of the project just isn't working out but Blu-Ray copies of Around the Verse season 4 are now available in the store.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:24
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Onmi posted:It's not like we've never seen it before. We saw it with Schafer with Broken Age and we're seeing it with Inafune and Mighty No.9. Projects that asked for little, talked big, got way more than they asked for, were late, and the product does not look very good. I think if Kickstarter and crowdfunding has been a lesson in anything, it's that sometimes Publishers exist for a loving reason. As easy as it can be to say those mean old businessmen are stomping over their free spirits, but really they're a bunch of people trying to keep a project on time. And it turns out when you put that in the hands of the fans they're far worse than any boardroom. Sadly the concept of budgeting and finances is anathema to the types that willingly part with large sums of cash based on flimsy business plans (or lack thereof) and purchasing things based on a flimsy promise of delivering "something" that is completely divorced from the reality. I work in property development and looking at the whole kickstarter model of funding and the hilariously bad "business plans" that can be summed up in a short youtube video and a few .jpgs of sketches is hilarious. Like gently caress man the monthly project updates on a loving ongoing project I deal with is a gigantic booklet that is delivered to us from the construction company in which contains a line by line breakdown of material costs, cost overruns, projected budgets and a tally month over month over various item etc. When I look at how kickstarter/crowdfunding models, and how they do things with proposals and updates, I just laugh at the amount of foolish people drinking up the kool-aid who think they are playing VC with their own cash. Hey here's a clue: buying something before it is made in which you have no control of overseeing or redressing the quality of, is dumb. Take this for an example on how the real world works: if something isn't built to specifications, after one of our construction engineers go onsite to look it over, we withold funds till that poo poo is fixed because that is how you get things done. Now look at kickstarter/crowdfunding, yeah. It's no big surprise when you basically hand all the cash over to a group on the promise to deliver something and the ultimately they don't, or deliver something that falls far short of what was promised. Agrajag fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Oct 2, 2015 |
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Oct 2, 2015 14:25
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Chalks posted:Escapist said that Chris Roberts was running CIG into the ground with his aggressive and irrational management and that the CR and Sandi frequently personally attack their employees. This is a good summary.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:25
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This is loving gold
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Oct 2, 2015 14:27
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alphabettitouretti posted:Yeah that sounds like bollocks, but it doesn't matter. Escapist gave them 24 hours to respond. That's perfectly reasonable. They're publishing a news article and don't want to be beaten to the punch. All the SC fans whining about CIG not being given enough time are as usual talking a load of shite. It's something they're focusing on in an attempt to discredit the content and writer, not a genuine complaint. They wouldn't have been happy if Croberts had been given six months to respond. 24 hours is enough to either craft a decent reply (if you're not incompetent and have someone who knows even the slightest thing about public relations) or threaten to bludgeon them with lawyers which they would have grounds for if the story was made up. Chris Roberts sent his response in time, he just forgot to include the Escapist on the email from what I can make out. Sounds like David Swofford had to forward the reply to them when he noticed.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:29
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Ladies and Gentlegoons I am pleased to report I have officially been accused of being Derek Smart. Where do I go to collect my badge?
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Oct 2, 2015 14:32
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AP posted:Chris Roberts sent his response in time, he just forgot to include the Escapist on the email from what I can make out. Sounds like David Swofford had to forward the reply to them when he noticed. I bet he just assumed that because his own people can turn around a ship sale in three hours that other entities would work the same way. And what the gently caress was he doing spending 8 hours writing that pile of poo poo?
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Oct 2, 2015 14:33
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Onmi posted:Ladies and Gentlegoons I am pleased to report I have officially been accused of being Derek Smart. Where do I go to collect my badge? the bridge obviously commander.
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Oct 2, 2015 14:34
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