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Codependent Poster posted:Flash and crew straight up murdered the bad guy and glossed over it. I'm sure Cisco will write a Tumblr post absolving team Flash of all moral ambiguities
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Oct 12, 2015 21:20
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Codependent Poster posted:Flash and crew straight up murdered the bad guy and glossed over it. This was really bad (they could finagle it that he survived and that he's in the prison) and it's obviously something that happens because the show runs short rather than the characters thinking they should do this.
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Oct 12, 2015 21:52
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The guy already died so it's cool for them to kill him again. 
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Oct 12, 2015 22:00
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It was suicide!
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Oct 12, 2015 22:07
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Everyone complained about super-gitmo, so this was the logical next step. I hope this entire season is full of creative ways to kill the different metahuman villains that pop up.
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Oct 12, 2015 23:46
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He's a drat parallel universe immigrant, he has no rights here!
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Oct 12, 2015 23:51
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Make them science up really mundane ways of killing someone. He controls his powers with his mind, Barry! Sufficient head trauma should disable him, but if you get too close you'll fall under his influence. Cisco has been working on a device that should be able to take him out from a distance. It uses a mix of chemical powders to fire a lead projectile. He was able to contain the propellant inside a small cartridge, so you get a few tries if you miss but it is not unlimited so be careful!
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Oct 13, 2015 00:03
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He has magnetic powers Barry! Lead is a non-ferrous material, so use this lead pipe upside his head. Howver, he could get back up, so keeping going, so he can't get us. Be careful!
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Oct 13, 2015 00:10
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This guy is too powerful for you Barry! But he eats at Franco's every Wednesday so Caitlin is just going to get a job as a waitress and poison his food, we got this one.
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Oct 13, 2015 00:13
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Can't wait for Season 5 to go full on Minority Report and murder people before they even become supervillains.
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Oct 13, 2015 00:21
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Barry can just run back in time and speed bag their father's nutsack and boom no more criminals.
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Oct 13, 2015 00:29
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Something to consider is that if they're really going for the whole "Trial of the Flash" storyline, his kill count may not be a thing they ignore entirely. Unlike, just for instance, Super Gitmo.
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Oct 13, 2015 02:58
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BrianWilly posted:Something to consider is that if they're really going for the whole "Trial of the Flash" storyline, his kill count may not be a thing they ignore entirely. I know I know that's  , but that's some solid wishful thinking that will probably never come to pass.
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Oct 13, 2015 03:50
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They've already teased it during last season's finale. When Barry was running back in time, he saw a vision of himself in prison, talking to someone through the prison glass phone thing. To be clear btw, I'm not saying them nuking Atom Smasher into a slow painful death isn't some dumb lazy thoughtless thing that I've been calling out the show on since forever (Funny how everyone in last season's thread was tripping all over themselves to defend Super Gitmo; how the times have changed, eh?). I'm just saying, canonically, in the comics, the Flash killing his enemies doesn't come totally out of left field. 
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Oct 13, 2015 06:17
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Aphrodite posted:Make them science up really mundane ways of killing someone. 
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Oct 13, 2015 06:26
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BrianWilly posted:They've already teased it during last season's finale. When Barry was running back in time, he saw a vision of himself in prison, talking to someone through the prison glass phone thing. Yeah, but I beat a year one or two Flash didn't go around killing people...much less running head first into enemies and letting them punch him all the goddamned time because he was a goddamned retard moron.
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Oct 13, 2015 06:39
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I mean, hell, if he's that fast, it must seem like they're taking two minutes to swing a punch at him. Is he just so lazy that he won't dodge to the left for a subjective two seconds?
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Oct 13, 2015 06:44
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Drifter posted:I don't think that's an issue at all. If you happen to be a Flash Speedster (as Barry is and has been shown to be) and not a Ramjet speedster, like the depictions of Superman and Faora in MoS - where you can travel fast, but can't do fine motor work at super speed - then you (Barry) can goddamned well move out of the way of a stupid loving punch or grasping arm or cold beam. He's just literally loving retarded. They mention that the cold causes him to slow down a bit. The gun was created as an anti-speeder weapon. The set up also made it seem that Zoom could end up being Ronnie.
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Oct 13, 2015 08:01
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bobkatt013 posted:They mention that the cold causes him to slow down a bit. The gun was created as an anti-speeder weapon. Yes, hmm, just let me stand still while someone takes literally (my time) 10 minutes to aim and shoot a straight line weapon at me.
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Oct 13, 2015 08:13
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bobkatt013 posted:They mention that the cold causes him to slow down a bit. The gun was created as an anti-speeder weapon. You don't think with last season, Eddie being sucked up into the vortex, it could be him?
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Oct 13, 2015 08:55
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Drifter posted:Yes, hmm, just let me stand still while someone takes literally (my time) 10 minutes to aim and shoot a straight line weapon at me. So should they just take all the fight scenes out of the show entirely? Because outside of speedsters, no-one should be able to even lay a finger on Barry, and in the first 3 seconds of a fight he should be able to punch them upside the head often enough that they forget how to math. Is that interesting or fun to watch every week? His enemies being able to fight him effectively is a narrative conceit to keep the show interesting. The comics do the same thing (as those enemies who are fighting him are also his comic book enemies). That isnt going to change. Its like being overly concerned with if his stated top speeds match the speeds we see him running at; No they dont because this is just a comic book show and top speed of the Flash is now, and has always been, exactly as fast as he needs to run for this to work. Or more precisely, slightly slower than that at the start of the story but if he pushes himself and really believes then exactly that fast.
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Oct 13, 2015 09:44
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Pan Dulce posted:You don't think with last season, Eddie being sucked up into the vortex, it could be him? Eddie is a regular on ABC's sexy FBI agents show.
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Oct 13, 2015 10:28
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The great thing about Barry + Guns is he could fire a whole magazine at someone from however many different angles there are bullets in less than a second. The only limiting factor would be the speed of the mechanisms on the gun itself. It would be a horrifying sequence, someone going from normal -> Swiss cheese instantaneously.
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Oct 13, 2015 11:49
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You don't want us to shove the villains in a 5x5 dark box without a trial, you don't want us to kill them, Jesus what else could we possibly do?
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Oct 13, 2015 13:32
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It's not that he gets beat up that's annoying. It's that they also show he's fast enough to catch a bullet as soon as he feels it touch his neck and pull it away from killing him. He's that fast. But he then gets hit.
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Oct 13, 2015 14:39
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SiKboy posted:So should they just take all the fight scenes out of the show entirely? Because outside of speedsters, no-one should be able to even lay a finger on Barry, and in the first 3 seconds of a fight he should be able to punch them upside the head often enough that they forget how to math. Is that interesting or fun to watch every week? The show shows us the scope of his powers, which should NEVER let him get hit by a normal speeded person. He can delicately pluck a bullet from the back of his neck between the time it takes for it to touch him to it _almost_ breaking his skin. That's how fast and controlled he is, not to mention all the other examples out there - he can rebuild a freaking destroyed coffeehouse in the span of a few minutes. But here he is, getting punched and thrown around every god damned day. Honestly it's just lazy writing. And laziness is so damned annoying. There are better _dramatic_ opportunities.
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Oct 13, 2015 15:34
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Drifter posted:Well this is a rather reductive and childlike argument. I'm saying they could do it better. If the options for the fighting are "Barry's an idiot but resolves it later" or "Barry resolves it later" I think narratively the latter is easily the best. But how about if there were a third option? One where Barry's NOT an idiot and manages to resolve it? What other options are there? Barry is essentially god-like, and short of fighting other god-like enemies, or an enemy that can "depower" him, there is not much more you can do.
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Oct 13, 2015 16:01
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BrianWilly posted:To be clear btw, I'm not saying them nuking Atom Smasher into a slow painful death isn't some dumb lazy thoughtless thing that I've been calling out the show on since forever (Funny how everyone in last season's thread was tripping all over themselves to defend Super Gitmo; how the times have changed, eh?). I'm just saying, canonically, in the comics, the Flash killing his enemies doesn't come totally out of left field. In the comics there is definitely a police cop mentality to Barry's belief that it should be okay to kill some people if they're major threats, but that same mentality hasn't really come up in the show just yet. I don't think he exactly cries when murderers get what's coming to them, but he never seemed like someone who would be comfortable doing the deed himself.
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Oct 13, 2015 16:20
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TyrantWD posted:What other options are there? Barry is essentially god-like, and short of fighting other god-like enemies, or an enemy that can "depower" him, there is not much more you can do. Going up against enemies that don't face him openly (because that's really dumb). Finding ways to stop bad guys and protect people without resorting to violence. Having enemies that are a genuine threat to him despite his powers. Dealing with problems other than bad guys. All of those options have been used in the show, they're just mixed in with problems that really should be trivial if his powers worked consistently.
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Oct 13, 2015 16:32
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ExThe Red Queen posted:The great thing about Barry + Guns is he could fire a whole magazine at someone from however many different angles there are bullets in less than a second. The only limiting factor would be the speed of the mechanisms on the gun itself. It would be a horrifying sequence, someone going from normal -> Swiss cheese instantaneously.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:12
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For what it's worth, Barry seems to need a moment to activate his speed. Sometimes it's happened as a reflex (the bullet, the lightning strike in the pilot) but mostly he doesn't have the fine control the comic book Flash has yet. There's no reason he should be dropping out of speed to fight though. Oracle posted:Except he's limited by the speed at which the gun can fire. Come on, you know the answer. Speed...
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Oct 13, 2015 17:15
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Tiggum posted:Going up against enemies that don't face him openly (because that's really dumb). Enemies that don't directly confront Barry aren't all that threatening. Unless they act through robot-bees, the villain's goons will be subdued and Barry can search every building in the city before Cisco can search for the guy's name on google. As for stopping bad guys without violence - I'm pretty sure beating up bad guys is one of the rules of being a superhero. No one is a genuine threat to Barry unless they have powers that are greater or equal to his own - and how many people like that are really out there? Unless The Flash was a 3 episode season show like Sherlock where Barry could face off exclusively against mega-threats, he is going to have to job to villains who shouldn't stand a chance.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:17
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TyrantWD posted:Enemies that don't directly confront Barry aren't all that threatening. Unless they act through robot-bees, the villain's goons will be subdued and Barry can search every building in the city before Cisco can search for the guy's name on google. As for stopping bad guys without violence - I'm pretty sure beating up bad guys is one of the rules of being a superhero. So you're point is that because Barry is so powerful instead of writing competently the writers should just throw their hands in the air and have Barry charge directly at a big muscly dude and get punched in the face? I think that's idiotic but you're in luck, the writers appear to agree with you.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:24
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Aphrodite posted:There's no reason he should be dropping out of speed to fight though. Yeah there is. The show has explicitly shown him get tired and winded after using his speed.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:28
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Here is every villain confrontation: He shows up running in at super speed, stops, talks to them a bit, and then runs at them at normal speed.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:31
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TyrantWD posted:Enemies that don't directly confront Barry aren't all that threatening. Unless they act through robot-bees, the villain's goons will be subdued and Barry can search every building in the city before Cisco can search for the guy's name on google. As for stopping bad guys without violence - I'm pretty sure beating up bad guys is one of the rules of being a superhero. That robo-bees episode was pretty dumb. They're delicate flying machines, so Flap your hands Barry, flap your hands. a Strong wind or a vacuum should let him pass them.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:35
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^^^ Or at least do the "Flash" goto special skill of running in a circle really fast. "Flash, the world's getting destroyed!" "Don't worry, I'll just run in a circle." enraged_camel posted:Yeah there is. The show has explicitly shown him get tired and winded after using his speed. And it also shows him running through the entire city and getting to where he's going completely not out of breath of tired at all. I think he may only get 'winded' when he tried to push his limits...which are far beyond the punch or aim speed of a person. Drifter fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Oct 13, 2015 |
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Oct 13, 2015 17:38
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TyrantWD posted:No one is a genuine threat to Barry unless they have powers that are greater or equal to his own - and how many people like that are really out there? Unless The Flash was a 3 episode season show like Sherlock where Barry could face off exclusively against mega-threats, he is going to have to job to villains who shouldn't stand a chance. It's really too bad, because I think Flash and probably other shows might work better if they didn't have to do monster-of-the-week stuff to sustain the casual audience. I would love to see The Flash face off exclusively against mega-threats. Do a Sherlock format of long, 90-minute episodes, or break them up into weekly episodes to fit the 22-episode network schedule, but with each chunk of 4-5 episodes being their own Sherlock-style arc. I just don't think the networks would accept a primetime show like the Flash that didn't wrap up some story each week and made you watch several weeks in a row to get any closure.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:42
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Phenotype posted:22-episode network schedule This is the main problem with Arrow and Flash.
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Oct 13, 2015 17:45
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Phenotype posted:It's really too bad, because I think Flash and probably other shows might work better if they didn't have to do monster-of-the-week stuff to sustain the casual audience. I would love to see The Flash face off exclusively against mega-threats. Do a Sherlock format of long, 90-minute episodes, or break them up into weekly episodes to fit the 22-episode network schedule, but with each chunk of 4-5 episodes being their own Sherlock-style arc. I just don't think the networks would accept a primetime show like the Flash that didn't wrap up some story each week and made you watch several weeks in a row to get any closure. MacheteZombie posted:This is the main problem with Arrow and Flash. With Legends of Tomorrow, it's only 13 episodes for the stated reason of having a much more focused story arc. So we can see how much of a difference this will make. I'm hopeful.
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Oct 13, 2015 18:00
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