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Nakar posted:Most of the assumptions Miller makes are wrong but at the time he makes them I don't see why he wouldn't think them. Quiet exhibits a bunch of powers similar to the Skulls, it makes sense to assume she is one (and the Sniper Skulls basically work just like her, so...). They didn't know Skull Face had taken over Cipher until later, and Ocelot was actually the one who told them Skull Face was responsible for MSF's destruction. And "he wants to wipe out every language except English" was supported by the evidence that they were training parasites to react to every language yet not one was being trained in English. Isn't this the thread that had the MGSV Big Lebowski picture? Kaz isn't wrong, he's just an rear end in a top hat.
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Oct 16, 2015 08:43
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Colapops posted:Perhaps, but you can teach someone administrative duties and logistics. Snake's genetics made him the perfect soldier, and that can't be taught (I guess?) so that's why he's hot bait for cloning. You know, no where in the story do we really get a confirmation that Big Boss's genetics are perfect for soldiering. The genome soldiers didn't really work out and I think that's kinda the theme of MGS1, genes don't define you.
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Oct 16, 2015 08:53
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That's true, until you realize that Liquid had the best soldier genes and kept kicking Snake's rear end until FOXDIE killed him.
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Oct 16, 2015 08:57
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MGS is about trying to escape your fate, and how that only plays into the hands of destiny. "Without free will, there is no difference between submission and rebellion" -Agent Ames
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Oct 16, 2015 08:58
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Liquid really was just like, the coolest dude ever.
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Oct 16, 2015 09:02
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4000 Dollar Suit posted:I kept waiting for the Eli is actually a clone of miller bomb to drop, he looks so much more like kaz than boss. #whoah maybe quiet is his mum
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Oct 16, 2015 09:17
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Nakar posted:Incidentally on a replay I overheard a conversation about DD where one of the Mother Base soldiers gets really defensive over another one suggesting DD is a wolf and not a dog. It's well before the Huey sequence and is essentially foreshadowing for it.
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Oct 16, 2015 09:21
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:imo it's definitely ambiguous as to what you actually look like. Miller is blind, Ocelot knows the truth, Huey doesn't recognise you at first and your men sometimes talk about how nobody knows what Big Boss really looks like (which seems, uh, unlikely, but ok) and you've been magically hypnotised. Maybe you look like your created character the whole time Unlikely, After all the point of the plastic surgery was to fool the outsiders. I'm pretty sure Skull Face would know you weren't Big Boss unless you looked sorta like him.
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Oct 16, 2015 09:43
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Onmi posted:Unlikely, After all the point of the plastic surgery was to fool the outsiders. I'm pretty sure Skull Face would know you weren't Big Boss unless you looked sorta like him.
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Oct 16, 2015 09:47
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Nakar posted:Incidentally on a replay I overheard a conversation about DD where one of the Mother Base soldiers gets really defensive over another one suggesting DD is a wolf and not a dog. It's well before the Huey sequence and is essentially foreshadowing for it. Buschmaki posted:That's true, until you realize that Liquid had the best soldier genes and kept kicking Snake's rear end until FOXDIE killed him.
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Oct 16, 2015 10:07
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For the record, it's really strange Eli knows he's Big Boss's son, that he's a clone and all that, and yet this seems to all be revelations to Solid Snake.
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Oct 16, 2015 10:12
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I think they were testing out different ways of having them grow up. Like, Liquid got told he was worthless and sent to battlefields in Africa, Snake just hung out in America and eventually joined the army just because, I think.
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Oct 16, 2015 10:33
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Onmi posted:For the record, it's really strange Eli knows he's Big Boss's son, that he's a clone and all that, and yet this seems to all be revelations to Solid Snake.
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Oct 16, 2015 10:40
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Eli doesn't really have much purpose in the story as it is which is strange because there's such an obvious part for him to play: his role should have been to push Venom on the path to realizing he's not the real Big Boss. In Chapter 2, have Eli stick around Mother Base purely for the purpose of getting revenge on Big Boss. However, once the blood tests come back negative, have Eli learn of the results and realize that (since he knows for sure he is Big Boss' clone) that Venom is a fake. Realizing there's no reason to stay anymore, Eli and Mantis escape with Sahelanthropus but not before Eli makes some very pointed remarks to Venom that he's living a lie. Venom pursues them to the Kingdom of the Flies and ultimately defeats Eli. As Venom leaves the infected Eli to die, Eli snaps and drops the bombshell that Venom is a phantom. Venom returns to Mother Base troubled and begins an investigation that would ultimately lead to the Truth.
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Oct 16, 2015 10:58
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Onmi posted:For the record, it's really strange Eli knows he's Big Boss's son, that he's a clone and all that, and yet this seems to all be revelations to Solid Snake. Eil didn't know he was a clone, he just thinks Big Boss is his actual biological father. He doesn't find out about Les Enfants Terribles until much, much later, by which point in time he's already become Liquid Snake.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:01
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Although I guess you could argue whether it is canon, the Kingdom of Flies episode makes it clear that Eli knows he's a clone. Even in the main game itself, his LUST FOR REVENGE really only makes sense if he knows that he's a clone.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:19
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4000 Dollar Suit posted:I kept waiting for the Eli is actually a clone of miller bomb to drop, he looks so much more like kaz than boss. Given what giant, whiny bitches they both are, it actually would've been believable. I think it's funny that Miller didn't hate Quiet because she was dangerous to MB staff or Snake, he hated her because she got to go on missions with Snake and he didn't. He's a jealous turd with a revenge boner. Also, how and when did Miller get a second foot? He very clearly only has one at the start when he's wheeled off. He has a bitchy little fit at Ocelot when the latter suggests he gets fitted for prosthetics like Snake did. Yet here he is, walkin' about with two feet. Did I miss a cutscene where he went "I got up to take a poo poo in the night, fell over, and crapped myself, Ocelot. Where's that fake foot at?" or something?
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Oct 16, 2015 11:29
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Modest Mao posted:You know, no where in the story do we really get a confirmation that Big Boss's genetics are perfect for soldiering. The genome soldiers didn't really work out and I think that's kinda the theme of MGS1, genes don't define you. The Genome Soldiers didn't quite work out because they were normal ("normal") soldiers that got shots full of Boss-juice later. The genetic manipulation basically fried them, right? As for Eli & David and their clone status: it's kind of up in the air whether Eli knew he was an actual clone, or if he just thought Boss was his father, but the tapes reveal that he escaped custody, not that he was just let loose on an unsuspecting Africa. Liquid and Solid both were sort of supposed to show that genetic tampering could be successful and it turns out they were super successful. They weren't successful for the people who originally ordered their creation, of course, but them's details. I mentioned it a while ago but in the end, the weapon to surpass Metal Gear wasn't a new Gear, or a new nuke, or vocal cord parasites (WOLBACHIA), it was a new type of soldier - Liquid, Solid, and Solidus. The ~CYBORG NINJAS~ were the next step after that.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:31
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Colapops posted:The Genome Soldiers didn't quite work out because they were normal ("normal") soldiers that got shots full of Boss-juice later. The genetic manipulation basically fried them, right? Johnny (Yes, that Johnny) was a genome soldier.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:38
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Slightly off-topic from TPP but: Beasts of No Nation launched on Netflix and it's got several similar themes to TPP. Child Soliders in an African nation, a Charismatic leader building an army for his own use and based on his own ideology. It's pretty good and I'd recommend watching it if you are interested in that part of TPP.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:39
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ChibiSoma posted:Also, how and when did Miller get a second foot? He very clearly only has one at the start when he's wheeled off. He has a bitchy little fit at Ocelot when the latter suggests he gets fitted for prosthetics like Snake did. Yet here he is, walkin' about with two feet. Did I miss a cutscene where he went "I got up to take a poo poo in the night, fell over, and crapped myself, Ocelot. Where's that fake foot at?" or something? Where and when does Miller have two feet? There's a flashback moment when Snake blasts Skull Face's extremities off but he doesn't have prosthetics there or anything, it just briefly switches to him in his prime when he gets his moment of revenge.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:47
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Full Battle Rattle posted:Johnny (Yes, that Johnny) was a genome soldier. He probably isn't. Much like with SOP, he hates needles, he probably skipped Gene Therapy day every day.
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Oct 16, 2015 11:48
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Colapops posted:I mentioned it a while ago but in the end, the weapon to surpass Metal Gear wasn't a new Gear, or a new nuke, or vocal cord parasites (WOLBACHIA), it was a new type of soldier - Liquid, Solid, and Solidus. The ~CYBORG NINJAS~ were the next step after that. the real weapon to surpass metal gear is the meme or the myth, information and ideological control which can reproduce any individual as though they were a clone (S3).
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Oct 16, 2015 12:03
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In addition to the 10 more hours of cutscenes this game needs it should have been purely about liquid
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Oct 16, 2015 12:21
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I really hope they either remake MG1/2 with this engine or at least hand things off to a new time like Kojima suggests. I don't really need plot, just more gameplay in this engine.
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Oct 16, 2015 12:25
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Sylink posted:I really hope they either remake MG1/2 with this engine or at least hand things off to a new time like Kojima suggests. I don't really need plot, just more gameplay in this engine. I really would love MG1/2 in this engine. I mean the base managing element wouldn't make sense, but this is probably Kojima's best 'Game'
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Oct 16, 2015 12:32
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As much as it makes me shudder to do so, I kinda agree with how Jim Sterling abridges it on the Steam store page. Gameplay-wise, it's the best in the whole series. Story-wise, it's the weakest in the whole series. And I played Portable Ops, which had fortune telling anime twins.
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Oct 16, 2015 12:37
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dangerdoom volvo posted:In addition to the 10 more hours of cutscenes this game needs it should have been purely about liquid
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Oct 16, 2015 12:48
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honestly I'd love for them to just do something different with Fox Engine and do something with Liquid Snake. I already know about MG1+2 events but the days of FOXHOUND and how those freaks got together is something I'd love. Metal Gear Liquid: Tactical Genome Operations
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Oct 16, 2015 14:13
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MinibarMatchman posted:honestly I'd love for them to just do something different with Fox Engine and do something with Liquid Snake. I already know about MG1+2 events but the days of FOXHOUND and how those freaks got together is something I'd love. Metal Gear Liquid: Tactical Genome Operations I think the reason we wont is... well Kojima wanted to retire the character of Roy Campbell because his voice actor died, Which is probably why he's so far been "Sir not appearing in these games" despite his importance to the plot. That's also why I assume we haven't really explored FOXHOUND as an organization I mean... How did Big Boss come back from all of this to join it? How did Liquid?! Did Liquid join with Psycho Mantis? They both joined after Solid Snake so what were they doing until that point? I mean yes, FOXHOUND is the latest iteration of Cipher's armed forces, But how did Big Boss come to be in charge of it? Was it Venom or Naked who was there?
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Oct 16, 2015 14:56
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Paul Eiding is not dead edit: Oh you mean the Japanese voice actor, who it turns out actually is dead. Yeah that's probably why.
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Oct 16, 2015 14:57
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CJacobs posted:As much as it makes me shudder to do so, I kinda agree with how Jim Sterling abridges it on the Steam store page. Gameplay-wise, it's the best in the whole series. Story-wise, it's the weakest in the whole series. And I played Portable Ops, which had fortune telling anime twins. I'm having trouble thinking of another series that manages to simultaneously amaze and confound to the extent that MGS does.
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Oct 16, 2015 15:17
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My prediction is that MGSV's gameplay will age astoundingly well
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Oct 16, 2015 15:21
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Grey Fox posted:It's stuff like this that makes me wonder how MGSV is going to shake out in the long term among Metal Gear fans. In a way, it's no different than most of the games in the series: there are parts that completely blow you away and parts where you shake your head and wonder about how decisions on the project were made. Will the gameplay come off as ancient a few years from now, and if it does, can it still hold up without the same kind of stories as previous MGS titles? The gameplay of the first three MGS games are still held up as exemplars for their period. I don't think the most sophisticated open world game ever built is going to be looked down on too harshly No Dignity fucked around with this message at 15:29 on Oct 16, 2015 |
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Oct 16, 2015 15:27
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CJacobs posted:Paul Eiding is not dead I think it's funny that they wrote around a supporting character because the Japanese VA died, but they had no qualms about changing the English VA for the main character.
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Oct 16, 2015 15:54
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CharlieWhiskey posted:I think it's funny that they wrote around a supporting character because the Japanese VA died, but they had no qualms about changing the English VA for the main character. It's especially strange as Kojima reportedly prefers the English VA to the Japanese, but that traditional seiyu worship didn't extent as far as not unceremoniously chucking The Most Iconic Voice in Gaming under a bus
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Oct 16, 2015 16:02
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A Buttery Pastry posted:DD is a dog though. DD is almost certainly a wolf-dog. Half wolf, half dog. Not only is this a reference to Metal Gear Solid 1, but wolf hybrids called Volkosoby are currently used by the Russian military to patrol part of the Afghan border. We know how much Kojima cares about anachronistic things, so I don't think it matters that Volkosoby didn't start being used until 2010.
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Oct 16, 2015 16:15
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Snak posted:DD is almost certainly a wolf-dog. Half wolf, half dog. Not only is this a reference to Metal Gear Solid 1, but wolf hybrids called Volkosoby are currently used by the Russian military to patrol part of the Afghan border. We know how much Kojima cares about anachronistic things, so I don't think it matters that Volkosoby didn't start being used until 2010.
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Oct 16, 2015 16:18
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A Steampunk Gent posted:The gameplay of the first three MGS games are still held up as exemplars for their period. I don't think the most sophisticated open world game ever built is going to be looked down on too harshly
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Oct 16, 2015 18:41
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A Steampunk Gent posted:It's especially strange as Kojima reportedly prefers the English VA to the Japanese, but that traditional seiyu worship didn't extent as far as not unceremoniously chucking The Most Iconic Voice in Gaming under a bus
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Oct 16, 2015 19:01
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