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Do they specifically blacklist, or is it just a case of not including the driver vibs in the base?
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Oct 27, 2015 13:46
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Why is console so hard, this is a loving mess  
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Oct 27, 2015 15:29
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Bhodi posted:Why is console so hard, this is a loving mess Seriously though, if loving OpenStack can push out a working web client with a working web console, I don't know what VMware's problem is
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Oct 27, 2015 15:38
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Philthy posted:Just wanted to say thank you for this. I picked this up and an Gigabyte AM1 board, 16GB of memory slapped it into my previous case, injected the Realtek drivers into the ESXI 6 install and now I've got a 2016 domain up and going with hardly a dent in CPU and memory usage after 3 VMs up and going. I don't think realtek is making NICs on any of the major server OEMs and VMware isn't going to bend over backwards to certify compatibility with homebrew edge cases, unfortunately. It's probably best to grab a dual/quad port intel nic and run with that if you have problems.
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Oct 27, 2015 15:53
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Vulture Culture posted:And they don't even mention that Firefox is also ending NPAPI support next year. Is Horizon not complete dogshit anymore? In Grizzly it was literally unusable. In Icehouse it was functional but still missing lots of things I would have liked and displaying a few glaring bugs. Haven't touched it after that since I changed jobs and we aren't using OpenStack (yet  ).
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Oct 27, 2015 17:58
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So far as I'm aware, OpenStack doesn't really have a dumbo configure-and-go VDI broker? http://docs.openstack.org/arch-design/content/desktop-as-a-service.html Edit: It just occurred to me you're talking about Openstack Horizon, not VMware VDI. I'm bad and should feel bad. Same question, though. OpenStack ain't quite ready for a non-developer IT bloke like me to deploy as a VDI solution? Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Oct 27, 2015 |
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Oct 27, 2015 18:28
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Docjowles posted:Is Horizon not complete dogshit anymore? In Grizzly it was literally unusable. In Icehouse it was functional but still missing lots of things I would have liked and displaying a few glaring bugs. Haven't touched it after that since I changed jobs and we aren't using OpenStack (yet
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Oct 27, 2015 18:38
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Bhodi posted:Why is console so hard, this is a loving mess Where did the come from? I use to work close to the remoting stack and I still don't fully understand what they are trying to say there. It should be pretty simple. There should be a native client that you can install and run, or you can use the html5 web version. The web version has certain limitations, but should work anywhere. The native client might not work everywhere, but won't have the limitations. Install the drat native client on a machine you use everyday. Use the web client when you need to jump on some random machine for quick access. Also, good to see that we are finally pushing the h264 remoting into vSphere. It saves a ton of bandwidth and gives you really good performance even over a lovely WAN.
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Oct 27, 2015 18:52
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Martytoof posted:Do they specifically blacklist, or is it just a case of not including the driver vibs in the base? With 6.0 they are blacklisting. You get around it by people signing ReAltek drivers as Intel now. Ridiculous.
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Oct 27, 2015 20:40
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Philthy posted:With 6.0 they are blacklisting. You get around it by people signing ReAltek drivers as Intel now. Ridiculous.
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Oct 28, 2015 05:03
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Philthy posted:With 6.0 they are blacklisting. You get around it by people signing ReAltek drivers as Intel now. Ridiculous. I didn't think anything was blacklisted, and that there was just a whitelist. It is a pain internally too, since I am usually on prototype hardware with poo poo like a laptop hard drive controller.
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Oct 28, 2015 05:06
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DevNull posted:It should be pretty simple. There should be a native client that you can install and run, or you can use the html5 web version. The web version has certain limitations, but should work anywhere. The native client might not work everywhere, but won't have the limitations. Install the drat native client on a machine you use everyday. Use the web client when you need to jump on some random machine for quick access. I agree it should be like this, but they're actually taking the opposite tack. As of esx 5.5 there's no new functionality being built into the java client. Any new poo poo you've got to use the web client for. I really don't understand why they've got such a boner over it since it's pretty goddamn clunky, but there it is. The amount of stuff that's broken without a functioning client integration plugin is kind of embarrassing, and you'd think they'd have addressed it by now.
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Oct 28, 2015 08:03
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DevNull posted:Where did the come from? I use to work close to the remoting stack and I still don't fully understand what they are trying to say there.  that picture as an answer to anything, though it's supposed to be a feature comparison between the HTML console and VMRC.The VMRC plugin that's part of the vSphere web client was depreciated, which sort of spawned the whole convo. Bhodi fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Oct 30, 2015 |
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Oct 30, 2015 16:59
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I have a question about a vcenter home lab I'm trying to operate - I have 4 VMs running in VMWare workstation 12 pro: Windows Server 2012r2 10.0.0.103 ESXi 1 (5.5) 10.0.0.101 ESXi 2 (5.5) 10.0.0.102 vcenter-server-app 10.0.0.100 In vsphere web client, I've added the esxi 1 host to a data center using IP and login info, but I can't add esxi 2 because vcenter tells me my login and password are wrong. To make sure it was correct, I set a new password for esxi 2, which i can login with on that vm. Why cant I add a second host even though I'm doing it the same way as the first one? The login details are definitely correct and I have enough licenses to support the number of host cpus in my VMs. 
TheMostFrench fucked around with this message at 07:40 on Nov 1, 2015 |
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Nov 1, 2015 07:35
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Weird, I think however you would need to refer to host and vCenter Server logging to figure it out. Edit: Maybe enable SSH on the ESXi server and try logging into its management IP using root@10.0.0.102 from the vCenter Server VM. If it works, at least you know the networking is fine, and now it's a host agent, cert, or some other issue that the logs can better illustrate. Kachunkachunk fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Nov 3, 2015 |
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Nov 3, 2015 21:48
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I saw the vSphere web client for the first time today. Is there a single good reason I shouldn't scrap our planned ESXi and convince everyone to go with Windows Server? Having separate management clients that are either deprecated but functional or featureful and utter trash (seriously, Adobe Flex??) isn't something I want to have my name on. Shumagorath fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 00:01
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Shumagorath posted:I saw the vSphere web client for the first time today. In ESXi 6 the webclient uses html5. It still sucks but it's not quite as bad.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:13
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I'm still not seeing the upside to sticking with VMware when I get to build from the ground up, aside from "some of the senior guys think VMware is the way to go". Sorry but I'm kinda new to enterprise virtualization and having only done Windows admin work at any comparable scale I feel like I want to stick with something I know (and has, you know, a useable interface).
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Nov 4, 2015 00:20
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Shumagorath posted:I'm kinda new to enterprise virtualization
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Nov 4, 2015 00:21
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Is the fat vSphere client going away? Either way, VMware virtualization's portfolio is incredibly strong. It's not just that they have a product that does what customers want it's been around for a while integrates with a ton of stuff and incredibly polished. Granted, other traditional virt offerings have caught up like Hyper-v with Windows Server but VMware is still #1. Gucci Loafers fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 00:28
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Shumagorath posted:I saw the vSphere web client for the first time today. There could be dozens of reasons you'd want to stick with VMware! You'll probably need to offer more information but I wouldn't base what I ran my infrastructure on based on the management client being Flex, Java, Flash, or something else that I'm not a fan of. Instead I'd look at what my larger team can currently support, what the ecosystem of other tools out there looks like (for example if you're using Veeam, Zerto, SRM, operations manager, embotics, storage vendor integrations or whatever), what's in the future and what I gain/lose by re-platforming everything. If the only real reason is "I object to the web client because of flex" then that's an awful criteria to make a decision on. You can do just about anything and everything day-to-day without ever actually logging into the web client. You can provision virtual machines via PowerCLI, send alerts to your centralized monitoring system, and configure new hosts/clusters/datastores via POwerCLI.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:32
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Tab8715 posted:Is the fat vSphere client going away? The client was deprecated in 5.1. The client is incapable of using any of the new features in 5.5 and beyond, as well as certain vcenter level features like distributed switches. I don't think there's an actual kill date for it though.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:33
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The fat client was deprecated around 5.x and won't be getting new features because Thanks for the input guys - it's quite amazing that a course run by VMware shills made me want to run screaming from the platform but I figure it's best to just use whatever the other teams are comfortable with. Shumagorath fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 00:33
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Shumagorath posted:The fat client was deprecated around 5.x and won't be getting new features because Breaking a dependence on a competitor is the smart thing to do. Plenty of people are managing VMware infrastructure on non-microsoft centric platforms and even still PowerShell will give you 100% of what you'd need to do so you can avoid the web client entirely.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:36
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Shumagorath posted:I'm still not seeing the upside to sticking with VMware when I get to build from the ground up, aside from "some of the senior guys think VMware is the way to go". What do you intend to do with this? VMware has much more market share and a broader ecosystem, as well as more advanced features.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:46
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1000101 posted:Breaking a dependence on a competitor is the smart thing to do. Plenty of people are managing VMware infrastructure on non-microsoft centric platforms and even still PowerShell will give you 100% of what you'd need to do so you can avoid the web client entirely. Yup, moving away was a smart idea. The execution of the web client was horrible though. It is slowly getting fixed, but the rate at which it is happening is pretty pathetic.
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Nov 4, 2015 01:22
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Thick management clients in general are a terrible. VMware's implementation leaves a lot to be desired but the idea that I've got a portable client that can run on any standard browser across a number of devices is so much better than needing a specific OS and having to manage client interdependencies and versions independent of the managed application. There doesn't even need to be a competitive reason to do away with the thick client, it's a good idea purely from a user perspective.
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Nov 4, 2015 01:33
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I'd switch from VMware but honestly everything else feels just as clunky to me. I guess SoftLayer uses Xen so I was thinking about giving that a try but then I realized there'd probably be no benefit for a small deployment. I'm not even sure what else I'd use in my homelab. I guess KVM or something but the effort to go through switching for 3 servers is kind of .. bleh
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Nov 4, 2015 01:37
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I would switch away from VMware except for vShield/guest introspection, which is a KILLER feature from a management standpoint. Never have to worry about some dumbass (usually me) forgetting to install AV or something.
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Nov 4, 2015 02:48
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Martytoof posted:I'd switch from VMware but honestly everything else feels just as clunky to me.
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Nov 4, 2015 02:55
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NippleFloss posted:Thick management clients in general are a terrible. VMware's implementation leaves a lot to be desired but the idea that I've got a portable client that can run on any standard browser across a number of devices is so much better than needing a specific OS and having to manage client interdependencies and versions independent of the managed application. Aside from having to only run the client on Windows what's it lacking? Granted, I've never been responsible for for than less than a dozen hosts so I'm coming in from the SMB perspective. Edit: If you're unhappy with VMware, why not try out Hyper-v? Yes, I know that original implementations weren't the great but it's way better now. Gucci Loafers fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 03:19
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Methanar posted:The client is incapable of using any of the new features in 5.5 and beyond, as well as certain vcenter level features like distributed switches. You can absolutely manage distributed switches with the old client. There are some newer settings from 5.5 that may not be visible, but probably 95% of the functionality is there.
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Nov 4, 2015 03:22
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Tab8715 posted:Aside from having to only run the client on Windows what's it lacking? The client itself is fine, the fact that it is installable package that requires a specific OS to run it is not. If the web client was just an HTML5 version of the thick client everyone would be happy. There are environments out there that do not have or want Windows but required it if they intended to use ESX, and that is dumb. And from VMware's perspective it's much easier to build a multi platform browser client with a uniform interface across platforms than it is to manage different binary bundles for OSX and Linux and Windows and ChromeOS and so on . And honestly, the web client in 6 is fine other than the console requiring a plugin.
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Nov 4, 2015 04:08
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Yeah honestly now that I've used the web client in 6 for a while I'm not sure I'd even want to go back to the thick client. I mean even if I was a Windows user.
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Nov 4, 2015 04:11
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The web client is different and therefore I hate it.  It'a also significantly slower and as a "power user" I can do everything I need to with the thick client. Most of my work revolves mucking around in vcli anyway. Setting it all up and managing it is someone else's problem. I'm busy devving my dev work, let the ops guys in devops handle all that...
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Nov 4, 2015 05:50
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I'm pretty sure you can still use VMWare Workstation to hook into an existing ESXi server if you really want something that apes the thick client. It isn't exactly the same (there are some limitations) and it has the 250$ price tag attached to the software, but it's something if you absolutely HAVE to have a thick client.
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Nov 4, 2015 05:57
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Wrath of the Bitch King posted:I'm pretty sure you can still use VMWare Workstation to hook into an existing ESXi server if you really want something that apes the thick client. It isn't exactly the same (there are some limitations) and it has the 250$ price tag attached to the software, but it's something if you absolutely HAVE to have a thick client. Confirmed on the Workstation 12 capacity to log into vcenter and hosts. I've yet to interact with a sales rep unwilling to throw in a few licenses for Workstation in response to (half-sincere) complaints about the web client.
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Nov 4, 2015 06:29
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Have you tried this if you can't afford the vcenter https://labs.vmware.com/flings/esxi-embedded-host-client
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Nov 4, 2015 08:29
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Vulture Culture posted:oVirt's pretty easy to get going, as is XenServer, but I can't think of a compelling reason to switch. XenOrchestra is really good, too. Tab8715 posted:Granted, other traditional virt offerings have caught up like Hyper-v Hyper-V's big selling point is that it comes with Windows. From an external tooling perspective, it's a ways behind Xen(Server). Technical feature-wise, hyper-v is probably the worst of the bunch. It works, basically, but missing basic features like nested virt and samepage dedupe is stupid. Nitr0 posted:Have you tried this if you can't afford the vcenter If you can't afford VMware, you should be using Xenserver.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:04
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If you can't afford vCenter then you should have less than 3 hosts and you should get an essentials pack for less than 1k. After being a XenServer admin for like 5 years I've gotten to the point where I won't recommend it to anyone who isn't the size of a cloud provider with experienced XenServer admins. Got bit too many times by their buggy poo poo.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:24
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