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Blockhouse posted:I want to make a Jedi. Story and gameplay wise who is more fun, Knight or Consular? Who has better plot and companions? Which animations are the sickest? I'm sure people will feel differently about all this, but these are my feelings about the two: The Consular story is a really interesting idea in theory, you're basically a Jedi Doctor for the first half and then a Jedi Diplomat for the second half, and a Jedi General in the finale. It nicely covers all the elements of being a Jedi that are meant to be more than just hitting things with a lightsaber. Problem being that because it's an MMO all of these ultimately translate to "hit things with your lightsaber", and all the companions save one are very one-note and forgettable, and the interesting one you don't get until Act 3. The Knight story is a bog-standard episodic action hero show, every planet has a superweapon of some sort and you need to stop the villain using it, while each step of the way the bad guy twirls his moustache and tells you how you'll never stop him. It's very methodical and predictable as a result, and none of the companions were particularly interesting. The Consular definitely had the more interesting story idea but was dragged down by the execution. The Knight story was very uninspiring (and at one point, massively disappointing for how it squanders what initially appears to a very intriguing twist), but it's one saving grace is that it gives you the opportunity to play against type; the villains pull out all the old TV show tricks like "You can let me go or save this village full of innocents", and you can reject the idea that the right choice is letting the evil slave-owning baby-murdering space nazi escape to kill again. So you can play the Knight like it's a story where the villains of Saturday Morning Cartoons meet The Punisher.
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Nov 4, 2015 11:50
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Plus the Knight gets T7-01, the most adorable astromech whose ID doesn't start with R or BB. "Master + T7 = great team // T7 = Hero!"
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Nov 4, 2015 12:53
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Blockhouse posted:I want to make a Jedi. Story and gameplay wise who is more fun, Knight or Consular? Who has better plot and companions? Which animations are the sickest? I think the knight probably has the most interestring companions overall, at least on the Republic side, the story is in no way complicated and is kind of silly, it made me a little frustrated because with a few changes it could h ave been a lot better than it was but it was an enjoyable romp. Consular had the problem that chapter 1 was really interesting and fun, but chapters 2 and 3 kind of lost it for me, i went in after reading a teaser about it and i was expecting a fun conspirator hunt but it didnt work out that way. Plus knight has some really cool animations, double bladed lightsabres look silly to me.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:02
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Emy posted:As far as I know, the Gree event. And only the Gree event. Next time that's coming around is 12/8. Yep, Gree Event is the only way to get BoL offhands. However, they did move the vendors to the cartel area in the fleet so you don't have to go to ilum if you already have the rep/parts. Polyakov posted:I think the knight probably has the most interestring companions overall, at least on the Republic side, the story is in no way complicated and is kind of silly, it made me a little frustrated because with a few changes it could h ave been a lot better than it was but it was an enjoyable romp. Consular had the problem that chapter 1 was really interesting and fun, but chapters 2 and 3 kind of lost it for me, i went in after reading a teaser about it and i was expecting a fun conspirator hunt but it didnt work out that way. I still think the Knight is the closest thing to the continuation of KOTOR, and enjoy the story. As cheesy as it is, you're the chosen one who can save the universe!
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Nov 4, 2015 13:16
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Medullah posted:I still think the Knight is the closest thing to the continuation of KOTOR, and enjoy the story. As cheesy as it is, you're the chosen one who can save the universe! Yup. As at as I'm concerned, every other protagonist died or vanished in the five year gap.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:26
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Medullah posted:I still think the Knight is the closest thing to the continuation of KOTOR, and enjoy the story. As cheesy as it is, you're the chosen one who can save the universe! I enjoyed it too, i was just coming off doing agent right before so i was expecting something a bit more grounded, but once i got over that and stopped letting it bother me and just embraced the cheesiness it was a ball.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:27
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Speaking of the Knight, is it possible to be viable DPS with a single lightsaber? Dual wielding sabers makes me irrationally angry and I don't want to do it.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:36
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Medullah posted:I still think the Knight is the closest thing to the continuation of KOTOR, and enjoy the story. As cheesy as it is, you're the chosen one who can save the universe! I've never understood why so many mmos make these kind of stories when the player shares a gameworld with other equally-chosen players. You aren't special by definition. At least make us work for the honour of saving the galaxy, starting off as one unremarkable level one recruit among thousands jumping about dueling outside the temple. It's like when LOTRO introduced warhorses. Instead of just letting a player obtain a generic warhorse of one of three types, every player was given the specific warhorse that belonged to the lord of a village that was burned to the ground by ringwraiths. It could then be mutated into light, medium of heavy breeds at the player's whim. Writing and gameplay don't match up.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:37
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Polyakov posted:I enjoyed it too, i was just coming off doing agent right before so i was expecting something a bit more grounded, but once i got over that and stopped letting it bother me and just embraced the cheesiness it was a ball. I'm going to be doing it in the opposite order, and I'm a little apprehensive about how all the messiah-type talk will to go over for my blue James Bond. It will be nice to be able to try all the [flirt] options, though. My JK has a space wife, so that would have been against the rules.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:38
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sassassin posted:I've never understood why so many mmos make these kind of stories when the player shares a gameworld with other equally-chosen players. You aren't special by definition. WoW did that for a very long time, and it ended in an MMO where nobody really gave a flying gently caress about what was actually going on in the plotline, pretty much in every instance you get to stand back after the fight and watch while Thrall does poo poo for you, or other NPC x. You just end up feeling really unengaged with the storyline, i played WoW since release on and off up until about 5 months ago and only at one or two points did i ever care about the plot, whereas in SWTOR i have enjoyed all the plot to a greater or lesser degree and it actually makes me really enjoy the levelling process, because i felt like what i was doing actually affected the game world. Its better to feel like you are an integral part of the plot and just ignore the fact that it doesnt really make sense on a game level, because it shouldnt really matter to you what everyone else is.
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Nov 4, 2015 13:59
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While the story of SWTOR is much better than WoW, one of the areas where the latter has an advantage is showing the game world change. I know that their phasing tech is a real headache, but it is really cool to see the world change when you do stuff. Like yesterday I was taking my Smuggler through Corellia, and you can really feel the disconnect between the story and the world when General Aves congratulates you on helping them retake Axial Park and pushing the Empire back but when you go through there again its still full of Imperials. That's probably beyond the scope of a game like SWTOR, and you never really have to go back to those places so it isn't right up in your face.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:08
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I don't think you should be a bystander who watches real important characters save the day, either. You should absolutely be taking on quests and saving people and occasionally planets by hitting things with a laser sword. But roughly 15 seconds into the Consular story a Jedi Master tells you that you were more powerful at 5 than she was at 14. You are unique, a prodigy, and the force itself is guiding your training. Then the rest is muffled because your cock is filling her mouth. She must be tired because she's gone through this with several hundred other players already today, many of whom are still bashing flesh raiders in the practice grounds. There is a middle point between "you don't matter" and "only you can do this, for you are The One". Unfortunately for SWTOR, we are both The One and we don't matter, as since the last patch Kira can snap me over her knee and save the galaxy at the same time.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:14
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poptart_fairy posted:Speaking of the Knight, is it possible to be viable DPS with a single lightsaber? Dual wielding sabers makes me irrationally angry and I don't want to do it. I don't raid, but I've never had any trouble as DPS on my Juggernaut, so you should be able to DPS as a Guardian no problem.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:15
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poptart_fairy posted:Speaking of the Knight, is it possible to be viable DPS with a single lightsaber? Dual wielding sabers makes me irrationally angry and I don't want to do it. I don't raid but it's certainly viable to solo and flashpoint with either of the Guardian's DPS trees. Vigilance gives you ongoing burn DOTs and a really nice AOE to replace force sweep. Focus buffs the hell out of a few core abilities to make them all huge hits. Both totally viable ways to play.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:18
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SWTOR is and will remain a really good single player RPG, with the option to do multiplayer things with your friends that are not tied to the single player story. I'm fine with that. It may seem silly that there are 500 Grand Champions of the Great Hunt running around, but it's better than being a runner up in the storyline and helping Shae Vizla come out of retirement to win.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:18
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Reveilled posted:I don't raid, but I've never had any trouble as DPS on my Juggernaut, so you should be able to DPS as a Guardian no problem. SKY COQ posted:I don't raid but it's certainly viable to solo and flashpoint with either of the Guardian's DPS trees. Vigilance gives you ongoing burn DOTs and a really nice AOE to replace force sweep. Focus buffs the hell out of a few core abilities to make them all huge hits. Both totally viable ways to play. Cheers, guys. Not too fussed about end game stuff, mostly the stories, but I still want to play Pretty Princess while knocking through it.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:28
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poptart_fairy posted:Cheers, guys. Not too fussed about end game stuff, mostly the stories, but I still want to play Pretty Princess while knocking through it. I think I said it in the OP, but unless you're concerned with optimal DPS in Hard Mode raiding, play whatever the hell you feel like playing and is fun. Even then, there are definitely classes that are better DPS at endgame, but the % loss is easily compensated by a player who knows his class. Heck, isn't our resident nightmare mode raider in this thread an Operative?
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Nov 4, 2015 14:31
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sassassin posted:I don't think you should be a bystander who watches real important characters save the day, either. You should absolutely be taking on quests and saving people and occasionally planets by hitting things with a laser sword. What everyone else is shouldnt really matter to you though (Unless you like to play MMO's on RP servers but that is a whole other can of worms), while in your example with LOTRO the fact that you all did the same thing is kind of rammed in your face, it isnt really in this game, you see other players around but you dont need to interact with them, or even in a game sense assume they are anything important at all, (while it is the case that yes all of them went through the same cutscene as you, in an in-game sense you dont actually know that), its not a fully solo experience granted but it is better than the alternative. You need to make allowances for the fact its a game, in a story sense the sith inquisitor should be king poo poo in a fight, especially when compared to say smuggler and agent, because of what happens and how much personal power they can gain in their plot, but they cant be because ultimately its a game and the classes need to be balanced. It is better that the storywriters write something compelling and the game deisgners create a game that is good to play, because the minute you start letting plot determine mechanics you get stupid poo poo happening. There are ways to make the two mesh better, but ultimately every player in an MMO is going through the same story because it cant be designed otherwise, for a story to be compelling you need to be invested in it and actually care and that is just really difficult to do without making you actually important within the plot.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:43
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Medullah posted:but it's better than being a runner up in the storyline and helping Shae Vizla come out of retirement to win. I'm sure I'd eventually save the world along with them, for what they would surely thank and congratulate me, but I much prefer the sort of stories we get in SWTOR, with the player as the focus. All it takes is a little suspension of disbelief to ignore all the other players walking around. It's not like you even see very many of them outside of the fleet. I wouldn't mind at all if the game were more like the Phantasy Star Onlines, with each player having their instance of the planets, and the fleet as the hub area.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:47
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i want every npc to be literally pissed that they've had to talk to thousands of people about the same thing for years
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Nov 4, 2015 14:53
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The class balance is great because taking down Sith NPCs with my Smuggler will never not feel awesome.
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Nov 4, 2015 14:55
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Polyakov posted:You need to make allowances for the fact its a game, in a story sense the sith inquisitor should be king poo poo in a fight, especially when compared to say smuggler and agent, because of what happens and how much personal power they can gain in their plot, but they cant be because ultimately its a game and the classes need to be balanced. It is better that the storywriters write something compelling and the game deisgners create a game that is good to play, because the minute you start letting plot determine mechanics you get stupid poo poo happening. Of course then I decided to follow that up with an imperial agent which is full of "I understand that they're supposed to be more powerful than me but I REALLY WANT TO KILL THIS loving BITCH!" Moments, even for a light sider.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:00
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Having just finished Makeb on my Trooper, should I do the rest of the stuff from the hutt cartel expansion or go straight to the SoR prelude it gave me the mission for? I'm already level 61 so it's not like I need the xp at all.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:03
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Medullah posted:Heck, isn't our resident nightmare mode raider in this thread an Operative? Hell yeah, Concealment for life. Sith, Jedi whatever...they all bleed. Can't wait to to get Kaliyo back January.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:12
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Medullah posted:SWTOR is and will remain a really good single player RPG, with the option to do multiplayer things with your friends that are not tied to the single player story. I'm fine with that. It may seem silly that there are 500 Grand Champions of the Great Hunt running around, but it's better than being a runner up in the storyline and helping Shae Vizla come out of retirement to win. No, it's not "really good" sigle player RPG, the plot is just silly even for Sith Warrior who has pretty much second best storyline in the game.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:14
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The Sith warrior's Story is fine, but Most of his companions are terrible. Vette works fine as a comedic foil. But Light Side Jaesa is probably one of the dumbest people I have ever seen, and her plotline once you get her is just... dumb. "No you can't be a lide side person in the Empire, you must be a SECRET JEDI! LET US TALK ABOUT JEDI THINGS WITHIN EARSHOT OF TWO MEMBERS OF THE MILITARY!". Pierce and broonmark are both RAWR VIOLENCE AND DARKSIDE and Quinn is at best tolerable.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:27
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Sekenr posted:No, it's not "really good" sigle player RPG, the plot is just silly even for Sith Warrior who has pretty much second best storyline in the game. And this is where opinion comes into play. Many, many people praise the story in this game and its the primary reason to play. FordPRefectLL posted:i want every npc to be literally pissed that they've had to talk to thousands of people about the same thing for years My friends and I used to joke about that doing Belsavis dailies back in the day "Okay, the damned Jedi got themselves caught AGAIN. And we lost the Rakata device AGAIN."
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Nov 4, 2015 15:33
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Kurieg posted:The Sith warrior's Story is fine, but Most of his companions are terrible. Vette works fine as a comedic foil. But Light Side Jaesa is probably one of the dumbest people I have ever seen, and her plotline once you get her is just... dumb. "No you can't be a lide side person in the Empire, you must be a SECRET JEDI! LET US TALK ABOUT JEDI THINGS WITHIN EARSHOT OF TWO MEMBERS OF THE MILITARY!". Pierce and broonmark are both RAWR VIOLENCE AND DARKSIDE and Quinn is at best tolerable.  She doesn't remain a Jedi, and becomes more and more comfortable being a part of the Empire as the story goes on, by the end she is a ls Sith, though she doesn't do as much synthesis of that and the Jedi code as Ashara does. Pierce is a badass comando dude who belongs in an 80's action flick. Broonmark is...okay yeah, but I just have no strong feelings on Broonmark one way or the other. Quinn would be fine except for the incident.I feel most of the stories are fine BW stories and enjoyed them, except for trooper which was awful. The biggest problem with the Jedi stories isn't that you end up being the ~Chosen One~ or saving the galaxy, its more that you never earn that title. sassassin is right since from Tython onward both Jedi stories go out of the way to fluff you up as the best possible, and there's never a real sense of being a padawan and earning your way to the top, it's just go be the universe saving dick swingingest hero from day 0. The Sith stories are both very much helped by the fact that you are an apprentice and do apprentice things for all of act 1, so there's a very strong sense of earning your place and power. It's even more a shame because Warrior learns more things about the Force than the Jedi ever does. Missing out on moments like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMUKGTkiWik in a Jedi story is criminal.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:37
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Sekenr posted:No, it's not "really good" sigle player RPG, the plot is just silly even for Sith Warrior who has pretty much second best storyline in the game. I just finished the SW story last night and I thought it was pretty good for a video game story, and outstanding considering it's in an MMO. What's with the strange hate on galaxy/world-saving protagonists in RPGs? Nearly ever book and RPG uses some variation of this theme. Hell, the best tabletop stories I've heard still focus on some type of hero saving a big something, and this is Star wars after all. Bait and Swatch fucked around with this message at 15:42 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 15:38
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Bait and Swatch posted:I just finished the SW story last night and I thought it was pretty good for a video game story, and outstanding considering it's in an MMO. There is a big difference to me in becoming a galaxy saving hero vs starting as one. I think the former is infinitely preferable.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:46
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I always thought the best part of the 8-way storyline was that you got a sense that even the grandest gestures of "saving the galaxy" are taking place in a galaxy so large that ultimately their effects are limited. The Knight does stuff, but the Warrior counters some of it. The Agent deals with threats no one else has even heard of, etc. It's a shame they kind of had to collapse that all, though it is understandable.
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Nov 4, 2015 15:53
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Is the Gree event this week?
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Nov 4, 2015 15:56
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DrunkenGarbageCan posted:Hell yeah, Concealment for life. Sith, Jedi whatever...they all bleed. Same here and I am optimistic that we got away pretty good in the PVP balancing of this addon. (By which I mean with enough gear we will murder poo poo in a hilarious kind of way.) But I don't get a foot on the ground in any PVE environment, am I doing something wrong here or do you respec for that or use another char?
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Nov 4, 2015 16:09
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Eimi posted:
I only recently finished Act 2 so maybe Jaesa gets better, but Pierce disagreed with me on a whole bunch of poo poo because I wasn't causing as much collateral damage as possible. Broonmark is just.. there. The sith Warrior has no real compelling reason to let him join the party, he's just some guy who you kept running into and tried to kill you twice. I'm probably just spoiled from the SI Companions, I miss Ashara trying to reconcile everything she's done and Nerding out with Talios.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:10
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Kurieg posted:I only recently finished Act 2 so maybe Jaesa gets better, but Pierce disagreed with me on a whole bunch of poo poo because I wasn't causing as much collateral damage as possible. Broonmark is just.. there. The sith Warrior has no real compelling reason to let him join the party, he's just some guy who you kept running into and tried to kill you twice. To be fair, if I ever met a talz I would want them on my team ASAP because just look at 'em. They're like wookies or jawas. You want as many of them as possible.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:15
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Kurieg posted:I only recently finished Act 2 so maybe Jaesa gets better, but Pierce disagreed with me on a whole bunch of poo poo because I wasn't causing as much collateral damage as possible. Broonmark is just.. there. The sith Warrior has no real compelling reason to let him join the party, he's just some guy who you kept running into and tried to kill you twice. I guess Pierce does get way better when you do his companion quest vs the quest where you first meet him. Because his companion quest should've been a playable mission with this as the music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyz_2DEah4o  Broonmark does make no sense because how crazy he is when you meet him, but he's also like really loyal to you for some reason, so it's like the guys misguided and kill crazy but I can't hate him. On Jaesa vs Ashara, like I liked what Ashara said a bit better but on the other hand, my impression of Ashara is that she is an idiot and Jaesa is more intelligent and contemplative. I mean you entirely just punk Ashara into joining you.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:18
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Jedi posted:Is the Gree event this week? It's not until next month, December 8th. Rakghouls start next week.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:38
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I actually like the setup for the Knight storyline You kill a man's son in front of him on tv and he vows extreme and personal vengeance but they follow it up with you being the aggressor, vigorously hunting down all the guy's agents and plots because you are special and amazing and the only one who can help.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:39
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Bait and Swatch posted:I just finished the SW story last night and I thought it was pretty good for a video game story, and outstanding considering it's in an MMO. Yes, it's a solid serviceable story considering. Key word being "consindering". It's OK to cut it some slack but it doesn't make it "really good" or "outstanding". What concerns single player RPGs, I don't think it's even fair to compare to say PST, Witcher, KOTOR 1 and 2. And among MMOs Secret World has much better stories.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:45
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dogboy posted:Same here and I am optimistic that we got away pretty good in the PVP balancing of this addon. (By which I mean with enough gear we will murder poo poo in a hilarious kind of way.) To be fair I main Shadow/Sin Off-tank for progression content then move over to Concealment once stuff is on lock down and it's time to take alts through. If you're learning content as well I'd recommend going heals or picking up an easier DPS AC like Sniper or Mando. Also everything Concealment does Deception is going to do better and easier currently. Concealment was a monster in 2.0, competitive in 3.0, and is now average in 4.0. The nerf to Meticulously Kept Blades wasn't needed. Everything in this guide still applies except for gearing.
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Nov 4, 2015 16:49
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