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Yeah there's nothing that can't be explained away with "blah blah electroMAGNETIC spectrum" outside of one story where he is telling Xavier a thing that happened.
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Sep 18, 2015 00:07
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Also Morrison is a lovely writer, which also explains a lot.
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Sep 18, 2015 00:18
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The timeline is basically: 1) Morrison takes over "X-Men" and names it "New X-Men", Joe Casey takes over Uncanny. 2) Joe Casey leaves Uncanny, Chuck Austen writes Uncanny for about two years and does the Husk/Angel skyfucking, Juggernaut turns good, the Draco, exploding communion wafers, etc. 3) Morrison leaves New X-Men, Austin switches over from Uncanny to New and immediately writes a two part "oh no that was Xorn, the other Xorn" story to allow Chris Claremont to use Magneto in New Excalibur. Casey stays on the book, which is back to just "X-Men" for another eight issues. 4) Claremont Mark III starts in Uncanny the same time that Austen is mopping up NXM. Then Milligan writes X-Men while Claremont continues on Uncanny. 5) I don't remember any particularly good X-Books coming out from like 2004-2010 but I am probably forgetting something. Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 00:52 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 00:39
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No pretty much all those comics aside from morrison's x-men (which obviously some people will argue about) are trash also yost/kyle new x-men was the best x-men book from 2006-2008
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Sep 18, 2015 01:12
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hope and vaseline posted:Austen's best unintentional contribution was naming the 5th Cuckoo Mindee, thereby ruining the SPICE girls acronym. This is the most mindblowing thing I've ever heard in my goddamn life. I didn't realize it was a thing. Also Mindee's name is really Irma, because reasons.  The circle is complete.
A Tin Of Beans fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Sep 18, 2015 |
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Sep 18, 2015 01:30
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I'll still defend that Exiles/X-Men crossover as being... okay.
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Sep 18, 2015 03:47
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Edge & Christian posted:The timeline is basically: Joe Casey's run was weird, it was also very much running with the whole "mutants as pop culture" idea alongside Morrison, but he didn't execute it quite as well. He also introduced the Church of Humanity, which eventually led to Austen's exploding communion wafers. He did, however, use Chamber, which was good. Austen's run started off fine, and there were some good aspects to it, such as bringing back Havok from post-Mutant X limbo and Juggernaut joining the team. It really quickly descended into hot garbage, though.
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Sep 18, 2015 13:19
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Oh wait Astonishing X-Men was also around that period. That was a good comic. Then Ellis took over and it wasn't very good anymore.
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Sep 18, 2015 13:23
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Alright, I'm at peace with the Iceman stuff because I can entirely relate to the dude on his entire line of thinking there.
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Nov 4, 2015 18:51
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Cabbit posted:Alright, I'm at peace with the Iceman stuff because I can entirely relate to the dude on his entire line of thinking there. That's funny because there are a lot of presumably straight people being really really mad about making Iceman gay on the internet today.
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Nov 4, 2015 18:56
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iceman gay. so what
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Nov 4, 2015 18:57
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Jean still needs to keep the gently caress out of people's heads though.
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Nov 4, 2015 18:58
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zoux posted:That's funny because there are a lot of presumably straight people being really really mad about making Iceman gay on the internet today. I thought they did that like months ago. Or did they finally nut up and made adult iceman gay too.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:03
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CharlestheHammer posted:I thought they did that like months ago. Closeted but yeah.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:12
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CharlestheHammer posted:I thought they did that like months ago. Yep
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Nov 4, 2015 19:12
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Does xmen 600 today wrap up Bendis's run?
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Nov 4, 2015 19:23
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Norns posted:Does xmen 600 today wrap up Bendis's run? Yup. It's a longer $6 issue.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:29
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Cabbit posted:Alright, I'm at peace with the Iceman stuff because I can entirely relate to the dude on his entire line of thinking there. What was the thinking?
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Nov 4, 2015 19:29
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ImpAtom posted:What was the thinking? That he's already marginalized by being a mutant and he didn't want to be even further marginalized by being a gay mutant.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:31
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zoux posted:That he's already marginalized by being a mutant and he didn't want to be even further marginalized by being a gay mutant. That's pretty legit.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:31
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ImpAtom posted:That's pretty legit. Can not wait for Northstar to sucker punch him a couple hundred times.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:35
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bobkatt013 posted:Can not wait for Northstar to sucker punch him a couple hundred times. I don't want to straightsplain gay issues since there are probably gay posters who have actual life experience with it, but the question of if there's a duty to come out can be highly contentious.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:41
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Northstar is probably too busy doing a victory dance and reaffirming the accuracy of his gaydar. Edit: God, I just had a horrible premonition of somebody fridging Northstar's husband so they can pair up Jean Paul and Bobby.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:42
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bobkatt013 posted:Can not wait for Northstar to sucker punch him a couple hundred times. One day, I'm going to try and figure out if changing my name on here to "Quebecois Mutant Terrorist" is allowable under the character limit
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Nov 4, 2015 19:43
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zoux posted:I don't want to straightsplain gay issues since there are probably gay posters who have actual life experience with it, but the question of if there's a duty to come out can be highly contentious. I just mean its Northstar and he is going to be an rear end about it, and more based off Northstar's experience.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:43
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Cabbit posted:Northstar is probably too busy doing a victory dance and reaffirming the accuracy of his gaydar. I wanna see a scene where Bobby admits he's totally into Northstar, and that makes Northstar even madder because he's married now.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:44
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Did people really think they weren't going to have adult Bobby come out? Just because he dated a few women in the past, doesn't really mean much. I've recently been dealing with someone whose ex fiancé, and father of her child, drunkenly came out a month before their wedding. Not a drat thing surprises me anymore. Was Extraordinary any good? That Ramos art is a little off putting.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:49
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zoux posted:That he's already marginalized by being a mutant and he didn't want to be even further marginalized by being a gay mutant. Also, he's been busy with the crazy life of being an X-Man and also a Champion once, which, yeah, would leave you very little time to honestly try and figure out where you're at. e: Extraordinary X-Men was trash. The writing's kinda bland, and the pileup of disasters strking the mutants at once screams of "Screw you X-Men fans you're never gonna get an interesting story ever again".
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Nov 4, 2015 19:49
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Die Laughing posted:Did people really think they weren't going to have adult Bobby come out? Just because he dated a few women in the past, doesn't really mean much. I've recently been dealing with someone whose ex fiancé, and father of her child, drunkenly came out a month before their wedding. Not a drat thing surprises me anymore. There did seem to be some reluctance to do it, whether this was always going to happen or Bendis buckled to pressure is up in the air.
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Nov 4, 2015 19:52
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I just read extraordinary and is colossus having a terrible/starved childhood a new invention? In claremonts original run he had a loving family and a successful farm/co-op - I remember being surprised when I first read it that the depiction seemed so positive for an american comic in the 70s
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Nov 4, 2015 19:56
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Phoon posted:I just read extraordinary and is colossus having a terrible/starved childhood a new invention? In claremonts original run he had a loving family and a successful farm/co-op - I remember being surprised when I first read it that the depiction seemed so positive for an american comic in the 70s It might be a retcon to tie in with whatever his backstory is in the Deadpool movie? Illyana and Piotr sitting at the table and both looking pretty young is the weirdest thing, since Piotr was buff as hell, and had a dozen X-Men missions under his belt, by the time Illyana was six.
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Nov 4, 2015 20:22
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Die Laughing posted:Did people really think they weren't going to have adult Bobby come out? Just because he dated a few women in the past, doesn't really mean much. I've recently been dealing with someone whose ex fiancé, and father of her child, drunkenly came out a month before their wedding. Not a drat thing surprises me anymore. I was hoping that he'd end up as bi. They're different people taking different paths, that's Bendis' big arc and theme with the time-displaced X-Men. It feels like that scene was just a repeat of the scene with young Bobby and Jean with the added aspect of adult Bobby just being scared, as if that invalidates everything beforehand. I get that younger Bobby and older Bobby having different sexual orientations may be awkward, and honestly at the moment I'm failing to figure out a way to get it to work, but the other option still feels like a blanket change as opposed to taking in the history of the character. I wanted to have the one-two punch of Marvel getting a mainstream bi superhero as well as a gay one. It may just be that the situation's completely antithetical to it with how it's been set up, but that's a writer's problem. It doesn't help that Bendis made allusions to the idea when the earlier talk between O5 Jean and O5 Bobby happened. I'm not at all saying that Marvel getting new gay characters shouldn't have happened. It just feels to me like it's coming at the expense of having bi characters as well where... I think Psylocke is the only one I've been made recently aware of that's not a future or alternate version of someone, an anti-hero that plays up the stereotypes to their fullest, or just a straight (  ) villain. It's nice that there's more representation in general, but I feel like there was an opportunity lost here.
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Nov 4, 2015 20:38
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Having present Bobby be bisexual while past Bobby is gay would be pretty odd. The best case scenario there would be devaluing past Bobby's perception of his own orientation, like, "No, trust me, give it time you'll probably find women you want to bang". Not exactly a great message to put out there. The worst case scenario is, I don't know, young Bobby is gay but something made him bisexual as he got older which.. isn't really indicative of how I understand orientation to work. Meanwhile, there's a poo poo ton of people who spend a lot of time closet well into their adult life because of an extremely similar rational to Bobby, so it's nice to put it out there again that coming out isn't necessarily something that gets easier as you get older. Edit: Of course, we could definitely do with more avenues of diversity than "gay white cis guy" and "lesbian white cis woman". Cabbit fucked around with this message at 21:16 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 21:10
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Even setting aside the (largely justified, IMO) criticisms of bi-erasure, if Bendis wanted to tell a story about "full gay" Iceman coming to terms with his sexuality... he could have actually *told* that story by developing it throughout his run, instead of sticking it at the very end and using Jean's telepathic intrusions as a shortcut. as far as characterization goes, what he did is only slightly less lazy than having Jean wave a magic wand and saying "okay, both of you are gay now"
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Nov 4, 2015 21:48
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Barry Convex posted:Even setting aside the (largely justified, IMO) criticisms of bi-erasure, if Bendis wanted to tell a story about "full gay" Iceman coming to terms with his sexuality... he could have actually *told* that story by developing it throughout his run, instead of sticking it at the very end and using Jean's telepathic intrusions as a shortcut. To be fair, "Iceman is gay" was a fan theory long before this happened. I'm sure some of it was a meme based off one panel but it's been suspected for some time at least.
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Nov 4, 2015 21:52
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ImpAtom posted:To be fair, "Iceman is gay" was a fan theory long before this happened. I'm sure some of it was a meme based off one panel but it's been suspected for some time at least. He didn't come up with this in a vacuum, sure, but it's still lovely storytelling with little resemblance to recognizable human psychology, all for the sake of... publicity? Bendis patting himself on the back? Well, what's done is done, and more LGBTQ representation is ultimately a good thing. Hope Lemire and Hopeless do a better job running with it.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:18
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Two questions. Why was this book loving delayed for so god drat long. From what Bendis said the issue was done before secret wars started. Second, why was that backup story in there? It's kind of annoying that it is an oversized issue and a portion of that was dedicated to a story I didn't even bother to read in my Claremont UXM omni.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:32
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I just read it and...well...it was kinda anticlimactic, wasn't it? And not just the gaiety; the whole issue was anticlimactic. Which...y'know. Bendis. But, hey, I can live with it.bobkatt013 posted:Can not wait for Northstar to sucker punch him a couple hundred times. Which is to say...I don't think Bendis made Bobby repressed enough. I feel like Bobby admitted it (albeit to himself, and to a psychic) far too easily. I kinda wanted more angst about his repression. But there wasn't really any dramatic twist to this, was there? He just kinda sighed and complained and then there were some hugs. Young Bobby had a more dramatic reaction to this than old Bobby did. Psychics other than Jean must have realized that Bobby was gay before now, but we don't touch on that at all. In fact, we examine literally none of the repercussions of this...like, what's either Bobby gonna do about it now? Hell if we know 'cuz Bendis just ends his run on a whimper (literally Hank McCoy is whimpering in his room) and leaves all this for others to handle, exactly like how I suspected this might end back in April. 'Cuz...y'know. Bendis.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:33
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Barry Convex posted:Well, what's done is done, and more LGBTQ representation is ultimately a good thing. Hope Lemire and Hopeless do a better job running with it. Lemire doesn't do character, and Hopeless doesn't do not awful.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:45
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Aphrodite posted:Lemire doesn't do character, and Hopeless doesn't do not awful. Well this entire post is just bullshit.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:52
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