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AndyElusive posted:Show is amazing. Everyone on it is amazing. This episode: amazing. The 9th Doctors penis = amazing. Rise up, jerusalem!
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Nov 3, 2015 18:18
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The wristband jacking was hardcore. I feel really bad for that kid who had to watch his dad stomp-break a man's hand then die in a nasty car crash shortly after. I kept wondering why Matt didn't offer up the car when he needed money: "Here take the keys to my nice car, just needs one part replacing, 5 miles down the road." 500$ to spank a dude and yell Brian? wut? Why not atone at the stocks? Was that an exorcism by oar? Pretty sure it'll go unexplained too. My guess about Matt leaving is that he has found the people who need him the most and will spend the next six months preaching to the lost souls looking for something in Miracle. It's not like he was allowed to do much at his old job. Not sure I understand why he got in the stocks though, he has nothing to feel atone for (except fighting with wedding douche). It's refreshing that everyone who found out that Mary was pregnant was rightly horrified. Not that the hospital bothered to report Matt to the local authorities. A lot of things going though the cracks in the new world: Want to adopt? cool, would you like another baby? Dug up a corpse and brought it to the police? no big deal, she was GR scum. Possibly raped your vegetative wife and acting super creepy about it? we'll release her into your care after you sign a form that covers our asses. Sometimes that's the most frightening part of all: the state agencies are done giving a poo poo too. That scene in S1 where there is no morgue or investigation into the stoning, just a trip to the incinerator, was chilling. edit: hope the longterm residents have RFID chips so they don't have to risk having their "leaving Miracle temporarily" wristbands stolen. n3wt fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Nov 3, 2015 |
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Nov 3, 2015 19:21
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There were 2 things I noticed in the most recent episode, nothing of any importance but just 2 things I enjoyed. 1 is that the guy who is playing John is loving crushing it this season. He's really good. When he was telling Matt "Here's what's going to happen" I couldn't look away from the screen. 2 is Kevin's "Are you loving serious?" face when Matt started asking John why he is angry at the town. It was hilarious after the intensity of what took place 30 seconds prior.
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Nov 3, 2015 19:32
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n3wt posted:edit: hope the longterm residents have RFID chips so they don't have to risk having their "leaving Miracle temporarily" wristbands stolen. If you thought the wristband jacking was hardcore just imagine what stealing someone's RFID chip would look like on this show.
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Nov 3, 2015 23:48
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n3wt posted:My guess about Matt leaving is that he has found the people who need him the most and will spend the next six months preaching to the lost souls looking for something in Miracle. It's not like he was allowed to do much at his old job. Not sure I understand why he got in the stocks though, he has nothing to feel atone for (except fighting with wedding douche). Matt's favourite book is Job, so there's two things at play. He's pretty familiar with the idea that God might absolutely mercilessly wreck your life for kicks, and the correct response is to just take it with a smile. He probably also sees Job as the ultimate awesome good guy and a personal hero, so maybe on some level he's always dreamed of getting a chance like this. Maybe he has a martyr complex too, I dunno. When he saw the guy in the stocks and wanted to free him but wasn't willing to take his place, it was because he still cared about stuff like living in relative comfort, not showing his dick and being pelted by vegetables, and caring for his wife. Now he's cast off all his worldly attachments and is free to show everyone in the camp what a loving badass Christian martyr he is, did you see how awed they are? My guess is he's going to be running the camp like a cult within a few episodes.
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Nov 4, 2015 00:03
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Boris Galerkin posted:I never liked Matt. I'll fight you IRL, son. Say that poo poo to my face. AndyElusive posted:Show is amazing. Everyone on it is amazing. This episode: amazing. The 9th Doctors penis = amazing.
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Nov 4, 2015 01:41
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n3wt posted:My guess about Matt leaving is that he has found the people who need him the most and will spend the next six months preaching to the lost souls looking for something in Miracle. With all that is intentionally ambiguous in this show, I think it's actually pretty clear why he left. It's two reasons that work in conjunction rather than as alternatives. One reason is the one he explicitly mentioned: "I shouldn't have to hide, Nora." He means he shouldn't have to hide the experience of Mary waking up the way John wants, which is the price of remaining in Miracle unharassed. (At the very first, I wrongly believed it meant that he didn't take the wristband from the child--since doing that to me seemed like too obscene a thing for him to do--and also refused to hide out in town without a wristband, but that's actually not what it meant.) He only "hid" by lying about it in the first place because he was so desperate to get his wife back into the town. There's more than that one reason though, since leaving by himself wasn't his original plan even while he was in the trunk. The other reason is implied, or at least communicated wordlessly since you can read it on his face. Why did the father die and the child live? Matt interprets the car crash and its outcome as a sign (from God) that his wife and the boy belong in Miracle while he himself currently belongs outside of it. The father took and wore the wristband meant (by God) for Mary, so he died for doing so, and that wristband went back to where it belonged with Mary. The boy was wearing "Matt's" wristband, which actually was meant (by God) for the boy himself, so he lived, and Matt then refused to both take and wear the wristband as his own. Now leaving that unfortunate kid running around with the wristband and no father wouldn't do the kid much good, so Matt takes the wristband--without wearing it--and the kid and basically throws them in John's face along with one of the most stirring gently caress-yous television has to offer. By doing that then walking out of town he essentially spends his social capital (the wristband) in the way most likely to get the boy taken care of, most likely within Miracle. Why the father was so desperate to have himself and his son in Miracle, I have no idea, but we may learn later. If you want to split hairs or just try to be fairer, you could say the father deserved the wristband only long enough to deliver his son into Miracle, then he died for trying to stay in with it. Matt newly sees himself in the same position: he thinks his role in getting into Miracle now is only to see his wife delivered there safely, and having accomplished that, staying there with a wristband taken from the boy would be wrong. You can see all this by looking at his face and listening to the way he says, "that's mine," then looking at his face moments afterward. At first he definitely believes what he says and sounds demanding and a bit angry; moments later he no longer believes what he said is true and even looks ashamed to have said it.
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Nov 4, 2015 04:07
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Is this the only show TVIV doesn't hate right now
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Nov 4, 2015 04:33
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Tomahawk posted:Is this the only show TVIV doesn't hate right now
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Nov 4, 2015 04:34
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Tomahawk posted:Is this the only show TVIV doesn't hate right now I've been thinking of suggesting a new thread title (There ain't no miracles in this thread) but with all the love in this thread I don't want to jinx it.
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Nov 4, 2015 18:21
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TVIV>The Leftovers Season 2: BRIAN!
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Nov 4, 2015 20:12
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Tomahawk posted:See yourself out WHY? 
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Nov 4, 2015 21:51
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Because AHS has been loving terrible this season and comparing it to this season's Leftovers is a joke. I honestly thought you were joking initially when you posted thisShadow posted:Add American Horror Story to that list. Latest season has been awesome.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:16
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AHS has been terribad for a while and still I end up catching the episode by the weekend. And I enjoy it despite that. You could have compared seasons 1&2 to other good shows I think but Hotel is Zoolander with more music videos. At the moment the top 3 things on tv for me are The Leftovers, Fargo and The Knick.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:25
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My top 3 are Leftovers, Fargo, and The Americans, though I haven't seen The Knick.
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Nov 4, 2015 22:28
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Nov 4, 2015 22:31
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Onomarchus posted:With all that is intentionally ambiguous in this show, I think it's actually pretty clear why he left. It's two reasons that work in conjunction rather than as alternatives. One reason is the one he explicitly mentioned: "I shouldn't have to hide, Nora." He means he shouldn't have to hide the experience of Mary waking up the way John wants, which is the price of remaining in Miracle unharassed. (At the very first, I wrongly believed it meant that he didn't take the wristband from the child--since doing that to me seemed like too obscene a thing for him to do--and also refused to hide out in town without a wristband, but that's actually not what it meant.) He only "hid" by lying about it in the first place because he was so desperate to get his wife back into the town. I agree with this interpretation, just don't really get why he went full-encampment-crazy and into the naked stocks since he's done The Right Thing by giving the boy the wristband and standing by his conviction that Mary woke up. No need to go the extra, extra mile when he's already gone through hell, given up all comfort and life with his wife...but he feels he needs some extra pain because Job something something? Punchy might be on to something with the cult idea, he's been longing for a flock and they're gonna love his brand of crazy, especially his absolute faith in the town of Miracle. John might come to regret putting that particular charismatic spark in the encampment powderkeg. As for the RFID chip idea, it would be along with the wristbands. The wristbands would be an easy visual pass but real legit residents are easier to identify in case they lose the wristbands or havoc breaks loose in town and residents need to be quickly seperated from visitors. They'd expire when disconnected from your vitals. I was expecting something like that when much was made of Miracle being a national park as we chip national park animals to see when they're poached or escape etc... But yeah this is a town where they don't put your photo on the wristbands to make sure that they're yours so they're not exactly thinking ahead about wristband jacking.
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Nov 4, 2015 23:33
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Pretty much agree. I think Matt felt really, really bad about raging at his comatose wife and being selfish in general.I don't mean selfish compared to the general population but just compared to how he normally is. He got into a kind of a spiritual rut. He's hanging out in Miracle doing nothing for anyone else just in the hope that Donna will wake up again. And then he gets into a kind of gently caress you got mine situation with the guy who steals the wristbands and the people generally outside the camp. Normally he's also painfully honest and he's ready to lie about raping his wife to preserve what he wants. Then he sees kid and his dead dad and he has a moment where he's like its not about what I want and he won't sacrifice who he is a person to be comfortable. So out he goes and the first person he thinks of is the guy in the stocks. I don't necessarily agree that he thinks he doesn't deserve to be in miracle but he doesn't really compromise. Love the character but he's total heartache.
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Nov 5, 2015 00:04
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I think it might be a matter of "well, I'm not able to legally stay in town, my wife's pregnant, and she's not with me. I've been beaten up, broken, insulted, stolen from... The stocks can't be that much worse." Or he just went full Job. You never go full Job.
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Nov 5, 2015 00:26
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I think he freed the guy to free the guy mainly, although the "my turn" probably indicates that he wants to repent his own selfishness. By his own code, he probably felt selfish for not taking the guy's place the first time; the stocks are not a legitimate punishment.
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Nov 5, 2015 01:15
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I agree with pretty much all the repentance reasons that have been said, but I have a couple reasons to add. I agree he really wanted to free the guy and maybe would have done it earlier except he was looking out for his wife and obsessed with getting her back into town. That woman's mocking him by saying, "Yeah, I didn't think so," was like a dare and like her calling him out for not having the courage of his convictions and ultimately his faith. However, the way the camera zooms in on the repent signs and him saying "because it's my turn," seem like they're suggesting you should think about what he's repenting for. I had given it a little though before and came up with one certain answer and a maybe, and then I saw some good ones here. The thing I'm certain he's repenting for is his denial to John that Mary woke up. It's the main thing he actually mentions before announcing he's leaving then going straight out. I'm a little surprised the writers had Matt deny it at first only two times instead of three, since it seemed so much like Peter's denial of Christ three times. A big possible reason is hitting the guy with the oar as a man of God. He didn't just beat a guy for money since he had to first prove his credentials as a Christian and a pastor. He basically profaned his sacred office for money. At least arguably. The thing is, it was all tremendously ambiguous, not to mention weird. I got the feeling watching the sequence that what he was doing had to be either very bad or very good. The bad is easy to see, and more likely right since we don't know if the guy ever got up after the end of it, but it could have been good if the guy was just dying to get catharsis or absolution that he felt could come only from either Miracle the town or just corporal punishment from a man of God, something a Christian reverend wouldn't normally provide. OK, even then it's debatable if it's good. As people have discussed, he might have been repenting for snapping at the needy kid and trying to take back his own spot in Miracle from him. (EDIT: He never actually tried to though, he just considered doing that.) As Goofballs pointed out and I agree, he might be repenting for how he had begun to treat his wife. You can chart his progress by how he says "Good night" and "I love you" to her, at first getting worse then finally going back to good and normal as he leaves her in the car with Kevin and Nora. The kicker of course is how he treats her early in the episode then sees himself on the laptop like it's a mirror. This is a bit of duplicate, but he could have been repenting for not freeing the guy earlier. I don't think so though. Not only would most people not blame him for refusing when he has his wife to take care of--he seems to be drat near considering doing it before he's distracted by people running into his wife--but I think he ultimately feels like he was charged by God with delivering her into Miracle at that time. I didn't think of this till about now, but he could be repenting for attacking that rear end in a top hat guy in the wedding party who wanted to get ahead in line. The thing is, while it's possible he's also repenting for this, I have my doubts. Onomarchus fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Nov 5, 2015 |
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Nov 5, 2015 04:26
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Matt's maybe even repenting for that time he got robbed in a casino car park and then stamped on a guy's head. Matt's definitely got that blinding rage inside him that bursts out when you take away something precious to him, and this time he either swallowed it or was too concussed to act on it. I'm thinking he swallowed it, and let it out on Brian Guy in the camp. So he's got a lot of rage and violence to feel guilty about, and because he knows he's capable of rage and violence he probably fears that he really did rape his wife. He's also got some stuff below the surface contributing to a need to repent, like maybe he has survivor's guilt from that fire that killed his parents. He also has to know on some level that his God doesn't do stuff like make magic towns that heal people, and his belief in that magic is a betrayal of his faith. And maybe he feels guilty cos he says gently caress, too.
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Nov 5, 2015 04:50
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Josh Lyman posted:My top 3 are Leftovers, Fargo, and The Americans, though I haven't seen The Knick. watch the knick. leftovers, fargo, the americans and knick are in fact all the best on tv atm
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Nov 5, 2015 07:47
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So, I read The Book of Job last night, and one of the elements of the story that I don't seeing being discussed in this thread in relation to the show are Job's friends. In the story, after Job has lost his livestock, lost his children, and been stricken with boils from head to toe, Job's three buddies show up and start questioning him on how all of this came about. Basically, they each accuse him of sinning or failing to live according to God's will in different ways. And in a way, they aren't trying to tell Job that he's a bad person, they're just trying to justify why all of this has happened to him. Because if it can happen to Job, a man of God, for absolutely no reason, it could happen to any of us! I think that in this case, John has taken the role of Job's friends. He's denying Matt's version of the story because to him it doesn't make any sense. If Miracle was really special, then why hasn't John's wife been miraculously cured of her deafness? Why are Matt and his wife more deserving of God's love than John and his wife? In the same way that Job's friends accuse him of sin because they fear they might be the next to lose everything for "no reason", John accuses Matt of lying because he fears that he is in some way undeserving of Miracle's power. On a semi-related note, this is one of the only shows that consistently leaves my mind reeling for days after an episode drop. There's just so much to pick apart and analyze, I absolutely love the universe that's being constructed here.
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Nov 5, 2015 16:34
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I get John's position. Its the same as most sceptical people today minus the pyromania and murderous intensity. There probably is no God and even If there is a God it doesn't care about us and people who say there is a God and that it cares about us are infuriating because then why does God allow ethnic cleansing or any other horrific pointless thing to happen to total innocents. Just because someone was able to survive or be nowhere near the monstrous event it doesn't mean God loves you, you were just lucky. In the Leftovers universe its way easier to start thinking like religious person and inferring meaning to randomness because of the massive entirely unexplainable event. So John is out punishing hoaxers who are exploiting the situation. To be honest if some dude I barely knew claimed his comatose wife woke up they had sex and then she never woke up again but now she's pregnant from that one time I'd absolutely think it was a total bullshit story too and I would not be inclined to do them any favours either. Its only believable and probably what happened because its Matt saying it. I'm really looking forward to seeing more of John's back story. My bet is somewhere along the way he got hoaxed real good. Thanks for reading Job. I had no intention of doing that and the stuff with people trying to reason about why God punishes or uplifts anyone is pretty cool.
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Nov 5, 2015 17:03
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:watch the knick. leftovers, fargo, the americans and knick are in fact all the best on tv atm Okay, but, as someone who's only watched The Leftovers so far (and a couple eps of The Knick), these all seem to be, like, really similar as shows in terms of emotional viewing experience (dramatic, somber, whatever--with the possible exception of The Knick, which seemed more like the traditional prestige-genre anti-hero HBO-style show). Do they feel similar to you (or other people who mentioned Fargo and The Americans), or distinct enough?
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Nov 5, 2015 17:06
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Goofballs posted:I get John's position. Its the same as most sceptical people today minus the pyromania and murderous intensity. There probably is no God and even If there is a God it doesn't care about us and people who say there is a God and that it cares about us are infuriating because then why does God allow ethnic cleansing or any other horrific pointless thing to happen to total innocents. Just because someone was able to survive or be nowhere near the monstrous event it doesn't mean God loves you, you were just lucky. In the Leftovers universe its way easier to start thinking like religious person and inferring meaning to randomness because of the massive entirely unexplainable event. So John is out punishing hoaxers who are exploiting the situation. To be honest if some dude I barely knew claimed his comatose wife woke up they had sex and then she never woke up again but now she's pregnant from that one time I'd absolutely think it was a total bullshit story too and I would not be inclined to do them any favours either. Its only believable and probably what happened because its Matt saying it. I'm really looking forward to seeing more of John's back story. My bet is somewhere along the way he got hoaxed real good. I think you're absolutely right about John's perspective, and I think it stems from the fact that he wasn't in Jarden when the Departure actually happened. There's a good chance that he saw some of the chaos that resulted first hand because of the Departure, he was in a prison after all. And think about it, in Jarden, all of these people are celebrating being left behind, or at least being left alone. But to John, a man locked up, is being left alone really all that much of a blessing? If you were in prison, wouldn't you kind of envy the guy in the cell next to you who got poofed away from it all?
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Nov 5, 2015 17:39
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Fargo is absolutely nothing like any of those other shows, and The Leftovers is probably the most singular and specific show that has ever existed on television it is not, in any loving way, like any other prestige drama the knick is very much a "traditional" prestige cable drama, and the americans while being excellent is very much an FX show in terms of perspective and presentation, it's just so excellent in all aspects of its production it doesn't much matter The Leftovers is an incomparable show, and has perspectives and storytelling conceits that no other show on television is trying or really has tried before. if you like it or not has no real bearing on whether or not you like the knick, the americans, or fargo, but you should probably give them a try anyways because they're excellent shows especially the last one, fargo is fuckin incredible
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Nov 5, 2015 17:42
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The Leftovers is a bit different to me, it has some really raw wound qualities to it. The Knick is more about progress and its era and it has characters like Cleary who add a bit of levity to thing. Fargo is really funny. They are all kind of group shows where it isn't one character with people just playing off them and they're all doing kind of ethical/emotional stuff in a way that isn't trivial or hallmark simple in their judgements. Like compared to ncis or whatever blah show that just wants to be entertainment.
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Nov 5, 2015 17:46
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Leftovers is like Lost and BSG. A mystery wrapped in an enigma where anything goes.
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Nov 5, 2015 17:51
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Toxxupation posted:Fargo is absolutely nothing like any of those other shows, and The Leftovers is probably the most singular and specific show that has ever existed on television Ha. Okay, this is useful and good to read. Thanks. I had a bug in my head about not being interested in watching too many "really serious" shows, but I *want* to watch Fargo, at least, and knowing it feels totally different and consistently funny is helpful. I also have a bug about not being into spy shows that has stopped me from checking out The Americans, but I do like really awesome FX shows, too, so... eventually. onefish fucked around with this message at 18:32 on Nov 5, 2015 |
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Nov 5, 2015 18:14
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onefish posted:I also have a bug about not being into spy shows that has stopped me from checking out The Americans, but I do like really awesome FX shows, too, so... eventually. I didn't watch the Americans just due to time constraints. Once I started watching them on demand I was hooked and binge-watched three seasons. It is a quality spy show, feels really period authentic (I was in my teens in the 80s so I may not the best judge), has some great personal drama and conflicts. One of those shows that leaves me playing it over in my head days afterwards. And not in that "is Glen dead" bullshit way. /Rant
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Nov 5, 2015 19:40
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I couldn't get into the Americans. For some reason I have a hard time enjoying basic cable dramas.
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Nov 5, 2015 19:41
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Puppy Galaxy posted:I couldn't get into the Americans. For some reason I have a hard time enjoying basic cable dramas. Felt exactly the same. Cant take a "monster of the week" show anymore.
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Nov 5, 2015 20:00
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Puppy Galaxy posted:I couldn't get into the Americans. For some reason I have a hard time enjoying basic cable dramas. I'm the same way. I think it was Oz that ruined it for me, because once I saw that, way back when it originally ran (  ), I just couldn't really get into all of these shows that play it safe. "Oh, one of the team members on that police procedural is in trouble? They'll be ok." "There's a maniac with a gun to a child's head? Dude will probably start crying, drop the gun, and they'll take him away."Major, cable dramas more often than not don't play it safe. I mean, we knew that for every episode of Breaking Bad, Walt would be alive for the next episode, but everything else was up in the air. Even for shows that don't tease character death (Better Call Saul), it's STILL compelling when you're given freedom and don't have to confine yourself to the type of writing and plotting that is so by-the-numbers. I wanted to say 'the type of shows that write for bored housewives', but even I find that sexist... yet, I can't think of a better term. Help?
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Nov 5, 2015 20:06
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The season long story arcs that are becoming more and more popular have definitely made it difficult to get into the week-by-week shows. I think most shows would benefit from fleshing out a good story over several episodes but if you don't have talented writers at the helm it gets rather tedious (see: Dexter's last season, Under the Dome, but to be fair UtD was so awful it carried into pure comedy).
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Nov 5, 2015 20:28
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Rupert Buttermilk posted:I wanted to say 'the type of shows that write for bored housewives', but even I find that sexist... yet, I can't think of a better term. Help? Substitute "Baby boomers" for housewives. My grandma loves her some NCIS.
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Nov 5, 2015 20:33
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Rupert Buttermilk posted:Major, cable dramas more often than not don't play it safe. I mean, we knew that for every episode of Breaking Bad, Walt would be alive for the next episode, but everything else was up in the air. Even for shows that don't tease character death (Better Call Saul), it's STILL compelling when you're given freedom and don't have to confine yourself to the type of writing and plotting that is so by-the-numbers. I wanted to say 'the type of shows that write for bored housewives', but even I find that sexist... yet, I can't think of a better term. Help? Maybe like "shows that have half a season to sink or swim in ratings or get cancelled" I don't really know how it works for FX, AMC. But if it's on NBC, CBS or ABC I pretty much skip it off the bat. I don't really watch many tv series anymore though so I'm content with what I get from HBO Netflix etc. basically just wanna see titties and 9th doctor hammer
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Nov 5, 2015 20:35
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Dr. Tim Whatley posted:Felt exactly the same. Cant take a "monster of the week" show anymore. You know - I do love how Fringe was the only show that's been able to combine the two gracefully.
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Nov 5, 2015 21:30
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Webbeh posted:You know - I do love how Fringe was the only show that's been able to combine the two gracefully. Despite being in an an almost totally different era of TV, what about X-files?
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Nov 5, 2015 21:40
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