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Nuclearmonkee posted:I finally went and mashed the end turn button for a long rear end time on Deism to wrap it up. This was the game where everyone was AId at turn 36 and the end turn button was mashed until I gave up on turn 280. fool_of_sound posted:i win! 
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Nov 2, 2015 22:58
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), it did not crush the other two nations and opted for peaceful joint rule. This peace extended for like 50 turns before I gave up and stopped hitting end turn.
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What's really weird about that is that Patala had given up and went AI over a year before the enforced date.
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Nov 2, 2015 23:35
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I think the problem was the type of AI ex-player nations get settled with. Is there actually any documentation about this by Illwinter? It would be interesting to see a counter-experiment with aggressive AIs alone and the observer-player looking at what they are doing from turn 0. In my experience, aggressive AIs tend to mindlessly attack everyone without ever considering peace, so at least that sort of game would stay dynamic, I assume.
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Nov 2, 2015 23:54
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Libluini posted:I think the problem was the type of AI ex-player nations get settled with. Is there actually any documentation about this by Illwinter? It would be interesting to see a counter-experiment with aggressive AIs alone and the observer-player looking at what they are doing from turn 0. I suspect the problem is that the assigned AI is the same as the default AI when you make a new game: random. In other words, roll a dice, and it can be normal, aggressive or defensive. In this case, the game may have rolled defensive, which barely makes war by itself.
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Nov 3, 2015 00:36
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TC and Caelum's wierd as poo poo income graphs make me think they were trading globals, with Caelum alternating between stealing and dispelling one that gives a little extra gold. Probably not Gift of Nature's Bounty, because that would have been more noticeable. Or maybe it was thrones loving with global scales?
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Nov 3, 2015 04:12
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Speleothing posted:What's really weird about that is that Patala had given up and went AI over a year before the enforced date. gently caress Ctis assassins
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Nov 3, 2015 04:26
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The income graphs probably look that way because of the changing of seasons messing with the temperature scales.
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Nov 3, 2015 06:17
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Diabl0658 posted:The income graphs probably look that way because of the changing of seasons messing with the temperature scales. But Tien Chi is oscillating at twice the frequency of Caelum
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Nov 3, 2015 07:01
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Enjoy posted:But Tien Chi is oscillating at twice the frequency of Caelum Caelum has Cold 3 pref 
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Nov 3, 2015 07:09
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I guess if Caelum picked Heat 3 then the bits going up are the winters? And Tien Chi picked neutral so he's going down in summer and winter?
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Nov 3, 2015 07:31
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fool_of_sound posted:Caelum has Cold 3 pref So... is it shivering?
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Nov 3, 2015 09:16
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I am playing LA Ulm, and I want to make Horrorvania. When I summon horrors and they route an enemy army, do they linger in the province, or are they dispelled after the end of combat? Also, what is the optimal way to use summoned horrors? Should I send multiples to the same province in a turn? EDIT: Thanks so much for that awesome advice Nuclearmonkee! Chairman Pow! fucked around with this message at 18:44 on Nov 3, 2015 |
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Nov 3, 2015 18:17
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Chairman Pow! posted:I am playing LA Ulm, and I want to make Horrorvania. When I summon horrors and they route an enemy army, do they linger in the province, or are they dispelled after the end of combat? Horrors vanish after one battle. If they enter an empty province they will stay until they fight. Horrors hate everything, including each other. Generally, a single cast of lesser horror is good to shoot at small raid groups or light province defense. Since most lessers do not fly, spamming them is inadvisable unless you are fighting fliers who will provide them with targets that aren't each other on turn 1. Half of the proper horrors fly and as such you can cast more of them and have them not just murder the poo poo out of eachother instantly as they will disperse and eat people instead. Proper horrors can clear heavy province defense and anything without mages w/ horror point defense. Also some times you get a ~1-3% (depending on if AC is active) doom horror chance and doom horrors will generally destroy armies solo.
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Nov 3, 2015 18:22
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ChickenWing posted:In honour of the recently deceased modnations (rip in piss) I have created a new game.
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Nov 3, 2015 18:56
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I'm taking a look at the nations for the new Cowards game and slow to recruit sucks  Anyway, what's the deal with MA T'ien Ch'i? I can see a smattering of magic (F2 A2 W3 E2 A2 and N2 if the random 100% paths fall where they should), enough for some Battle Magic but not enough for powerful rituals, and specially not enough for Flaming Arrows, which is a drat pity. Not much chance of Communing up because the fodder isn't sacred (Imperial Geomancers at 65 a pop and S1E1 don't seem ridiculously effective for communion fodder) and one of the two top tier mages doesn't get S. Basically every spell I'd like to cast requires some setup and a StR mage, apparently. For example, Flaming Arrows would require a F2 (30%-ish chance) cap-only slow-to-recruit Imperial Alchemist with Phoenix Power and 2 Fire gems, or a Crystal Matrix and a communion. Thunder Strike requires a lucky random roll, Storm and Summon Storm Power, etc... Expansion is more or less covered with pikes and tower shield decoys, and the archers/crossbowmen seem quite good. Imperial versions of those (prot 15, 20 resources) aren't good enough to invest heavily on Production. It would be nice to Strength of Giants and Legions of Steel them up, but again you need E3 when the highest mage is StR cap-only E1 with 30% chance of E2. So what are the research targets/second year strategy here? I guess I can Conj my way up some paths easily, but only after establishing a good position. EDIT: Oh, Power of the Spheres is +1 to paths, but at 1S gem and 100 fatigue cost, so I'm not sure how to use it. Fat Samurai fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Nov 5, 2015 |
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Nov 5, 2015 13:05
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Fat Samurai posted:EDIT: Oh, Power of the Spheres is +1 to paths, but at 1S gem and 100 fatigue cost, so I'm not sure how to use it. i have no idea what i'm talking about, but it always sounded like it could be useful in conjunction with communions to me
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Nov 5, 2015 13:14
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Pomp posted:i have no idea what i'm talking about, but it always sounded like it could be useful in conjunction with communions to me Yeah, I meant regarding Tien, because the mages I'd like to boost are S1 or S0. And I think reverse communions (where the Master boosts and the Slaves cast) are no longer a thing.
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Nov 5, 2015 13:19
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Fat Samurai posted:Yeah, I meant regarding Tien, because the mages I'd like to boost are S1 or S0. And I think reverse communions (where the Master boosts and the Slaves cast) are no longer a thing. Correct, reverse communions are kaput.
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Nov 5, 2015 13:45
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It's possible that PotS can make communions spamming astral spells last longer, because slave paths (relevant to master paths) are relevant to the slave fatigue calculation. Usually you're better off doing Light of the Northern Star to make all your S1s spam Cascades or Mind Burn though. Geomancers are actually great for communions. I like to use 4 slave, 4 master set ups. Gifts of Heaven is a great evocation. One of your masters can buff the communion with Summon Earth Power and you can bring along an a2 celestial master for Wind Guide and you can wreck armies, especially those that rely on tough elite troops. If you're facing lots of poorly defended chaff you can Blade Wind instead, and there's always the other Earth tricks like Maws and Earth Elementals and Marble Warriors and so on. Geomancers are also really cheap, and quite efficient researchers (I don't even use Ministers of Magic) and you will have hundreds of them in the late game so you don't mind losing them in droves. They are a good mage.
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Nov 5, 2015 13:45
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Fat Samurai posted:Yeah, I meant regarding Tien, because the mages I'd like to boost are S1 or S0. And I think reverse communions (where the Master boosts and the Slaves cast) are no longer a thing. an S1 can cast (power of the spheres)(antimagic) for three astral gems. Or an S2 can cast (power of the spheres)(light of the northern star) for three as well. Otherwise it's usually for like mages in a large communion for the fatigue reduction, though it is minor. And of course you use it for casting big horrible poo poo like astral tempest or master enslave. Though ideally you are t1 casting master enslave because it's generally most effective when cast immediately.
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Nov 5, 2015 14:32
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Fat Samurai posted:(Imperial Geomancers at 65 a pop and S1E1 don't seem ridiculously effective for communion fodder) Actually those ARE ridiculously good for communions. Classic thing to do is commune a bunch those guys, have an air guy cast wind guide, and drop very accurate Gifts from Heaven onto people's faces. Or you could commune up to higher level astral or earth stuff. It's good, spam them, you want them.
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Nov 5, 2015 15:40
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instead of using power of the spheres for astral tempest , use a guy who came out of the box s4 because you are insanely lucky
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Nov 5, 2015 15:41
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jsoh posted:instead of using power of the spheres for astral tempest , use a guy who came out of the box s4 because you are insanely lucky ok baalz
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Nov 5, 2015 15:50
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GenericOverusedName posted:Actually those ARE ridiculously good for communions. Classic thing to do is commune a bunch those guys, have an air guy cast wind guide, and drop very accurate Gifts from Heaven onto people's faces. Or you could commune up to higher level astral or earth stuff. It's good, spam them, you want them. This is why I'm bad at this game. Boing posted:Geomancers are actually great for communions. I like to use 4 slave, 4 master set ups. Gifts of Heaven is a great evocation. One of your masters can buff the communion with Summon Earth Power and you can bring along an a2 celestial master for Wind Guide and you can wreck armies, especially those that rely on tough elite troops. If you're facing lots of poorly defended chaff you can Blade Wind instead, and there's always the other Earth tricks like Maws and Earth Elementals and Marble Warriors and so on. Serious question, because I haven't deal with Communions in any game yet.
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Nov 5, 2015 18:49
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Fat Samurai posted:This is why I'm bad at this game. Geomancers are cheap and recruit anywhere. You don't make them in your cap.
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Nov 5, 2015 18:55
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You can still matrix non-astral mages into a communion, right?
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Nov 5, 2015 18:55
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Dirk the Average posted:You can still matrix non-astral mages into a communion, right? Yes.
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Nov 5, 2015 18:56
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Fat Samurai posted:Serious question, because I haven't deal with Communions in any game yet.
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Nov 5, 2015 19:02
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Nuclearmonkee posted:Geomancers are cheap and recruit anywhere. You don't make them in your cap. The 4 Celestial Masters to cast GfH are. EDIT:Wait, Geomancer can cast once communion-ed. Tunnel vision is bad and I'm dumb. jBrereton posted:Protip: try them out quite a lot before you play MA TC, a nation that completely relies on Communions (see also Arcoscephale, especially for examining the reasons communions can literally blow up in your face with spells like Phoenix Pyre unless you're careful about membership) Nah, charging head on is how you learn things. I'm not completely mad, so that's why I'm asking for tips. 
Fat Samurai fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Nov 5, 2015 |
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Nov 5, 2015 19:05
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Fat Samurai posted:The 4 Celestial Masters to cast GfH are. while you use communions constantly ask yourself: "how would i gently caress this up if i needed to?" because your opponents are going to do that. communions are cool and fun, but easy enough to upend if you're prepared.
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Nov 5, 2015 19:09
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OK well the main thing with TC's communions is that outside of E/S magic, you are going to knacker your slave mages out really badly. The one specific spell that is horrible to cast in that situation is Phoenix Pyre, which you will almost inevitably run into going for high Alt for Will of the Fates (battlefield-wide Luck), which is amazing for your squishy... well... everything. Anyway, if you have a Fire mage in your communion, they are probably going to cast Phoenix Pyre offscript like a total remtard. If you don't know what it does, basically any time your mage dies they come back after exploding in a huge fireball, assuming they didn't have a ton of fatigue (at which point they just explode). The problem is that off-path magic costs Hella Fatigue for slaves, and the next time one of them dies for any reason, you're going to have a huge, chaining fireball across your mageline that probably nobody at all will survive once it gets touched off, because even mages that dodge the first set of explosions somehow are now going to get hit with a bunch more fatigue due to the slave base being smaller (meaning reduced paths for Masters, and less slaves to carry it). Anyway it all goes very Space Shuttle Columbia very quickly, so unless you have a really crucial spell you can't cast with an F mage out of a communion (can't think of any? An F2 cap-only Alchemist guy I forget the name of can Pheonix Power to F3 and then cast Flaming Arrows with 2 gems if that's a priority for you), don't do it!
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Nov 5, 2015 19:22
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It's still a thing where you can put regen on something with a lot of hp and cast forever though (because 1 hp is more fatigue). I can't remember if that's a linebacker communion or a power communion.
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Nov 5, 2015 20:35
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wiegieman posted:It's still a thing where you can put regen on something with a lot of hp and cast forever though (because 1 hp is more fatigue). I can't remember if that's a linebacker communion or a power communion. Turbo communion is still a thing. However, if you have 8 masters and 16 slaves, all of whom are at 200 fatigue, each spellcast will inflict 1 pt of damage even if it's 1 fatigue each. After 200 fatigue it converts to damage at a 10 to 1 ratio rounded up
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Nov 5, 2015 20:44
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Linebacker is distributing self-buffs to the slaves then having them fight. It can't really be done in Dom4. Once upon a time slaves in Dom3 could cast or act under certain conditions. Power communion sounds like a corruption of Turbo Communion, which is what the regen communion is. For MA TC, and any nation with F2, you can Flaming Arrows a round late by casting Phoenix Power -> Flaming Arrows with extra gem. Conj 3 is not very far on the research tree either.
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Nov 6, 2015 02:41
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MA TC can cast almost any battle spell it wants without too much effort. It's big problem is that it has very little natural defense against Earthquake (though it does have Body Ethereal against RoS).
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Nov 6, 2015 03:12
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Decrepus posted:Elfsaredicks 
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Nov 6, 2015 06:15
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That's a Dom5 feature, silly.
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Nov 6, 2015 09:53
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fool_of_sound posted:MA TC can cast almost any battle spell it wants without too much effort. It's big problem is that it has very little natural defense against Earthquake (though it does have Body Ethereal against RoS). e: oh yeah that's the other really cool part about communions, specific mage turn order which is only ever a negative. jBrereton fucked around with this message at 14:51 on Nov 6, 2015 |
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Nov 6, 2015 14:16
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fool_of_sound posted:MA TC can cast almost any battle spell it wants without too much effort. It's big problem is that it has very little natural defense against Earthquake (though it does have Body Ethereal against RoS). Earthquake is hard to hit ethereal as well. The only problem is that body ethereal is targeted aoe 1, not self-buff, and so doesn't propagate to slaves. You're right though, from my experience TC's big advantage is that they can cast almost all the good crosspath evos. Acid rain, magma eruption and rain of stones being the big ones.
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Nov 6, 2015 14:57
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When playing Ragha, is it better to start with your STR mages, or recruit "fast" mages the first few turns to get research going faster and wait until you get a fort up for the STR ones? Obviously you want to grab the good STR ones (Turan Sorcerers/Airya Seraphs) that you can't normally recruit when you get the chance, but that won't happen until summer/winter depending on your scales.
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Nov 7, 2015 01:08
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