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Won with DEMo  code:I figured I would go do all 15 runes if I went through the trouble of surviving this lovely start, but it took forever because I was squishy for so long.. 
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Nov 18, 2015 05:25
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Did they change something on 0.17 since 0.16.1 (obv. not the double damage bug version)? I've been playing local and... dying a lot. Which is the point I know, but I'm not dying the way I usually would, and have been in the past. I started with some splatty OcMo since I'm going to luck into a win with one of those one of these days, splatted about 10, and then decided to do some FoFi as a palate cleanser as it were. About 20 chars later, one has made it far enough to choose between orc/lair. Of those 20, 5 have died to Ogre w/ GC doing 25+ damage on a single hit. 5 more have died to orc priests. I realize these are dangerous monsters, but it just feels weird since they weren't usually the ones to 'get' me in the past (that honour being held by invisible stalkers, centaur packs, and hydras mostly). I'll admit this is a whooole lot of confirmation bias but it feels like: - I've heard you guys discuss how giant clubs have changed recently, did the crit rate change? It seems to be firing way more often. Put another way, on my old install I had to play 121 chars before I got up to 5 ogre deaths and I've reached that one in 20 plays this time. - Did smite rate change for orc priests? I've had quite a few cases where they are 3 steps away, I take 3 steps, and get smote every step. Again, it 'feels' higher (unrelated to dying) - Did drop rate for xp potions go up? I've found 3 so far on this version off the floor, which feels like a lot when previously I can only remember finding them in zigs and once in a bailey - Did drop rate for weird armor go up? The last five chars in a row I've found naga barding somewhere between D1-5 (not a naga). Not a complaint, curious if they massaged that - Did food drops change? This version feels like I 'have' to use chunks, whereas before it was just eat bread press next. All of these chars have been melee (I haven't even learned a spell on 0.17 yet) and not having any food drains Note this isn't another "wah devs ruined crawl" kind of post, I'm legitimately curious if any of things changed so I should be changing my playstyle.
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Nov 18, 2015 12:05
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Scaramouche posted:Did they change something on 0.17 since 0.16.1 (obv. not the double damage bug version)? I've been playing local and... dying a lot. Which is the point I know, but I'm not dying the way I usually would, and have been in the past. I started with some splatty OcMo since I'm going to luck into a win with one of those one of these days, splatted about 10, and then decided to do some FoFi as a palate cleanser as it were. About 20 chars later, one has made it far enough to choose between orc/lair. Of those 20, 5 have died to Ogre w/ GC doing 25+ damage on a single hit. 5 more have died to orc priests. I realize these are dangerous monsters, but it just feels weird since they weren't usually the ones to 'get' me in the past (that honour being held by invisible stalkers, centaur packs, and hydras mostly). I'll admit this is a whooole lot of confirmation bias but it feels like: Out of everything, the only thing on there that I probably agree might have something wrong is the naga barding drops. I have also seen one in D:1-8 about every 1-in-3 games (but it's only naga bardings, not centaur bardings). Everything else just sounds like you're getting lucky/unlucky, but completely normal.
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Nov 18, 2015 12:37
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Gotta agree with Floodkiller here, aside from maybe the bardings the issues you speak of smack of getting used to playing again.
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Nov 18, 2015 13:24
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Being a returning player after missing a few versions, I am walking around with way more food than ever before. I have seen way more barding though, which is cool for those characters.
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Nov 18, 2015 13:28
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I'm playing offline, should i keep playing 0.16 or try 0.17? 0.17 is basically a few nerfs and minor changes right?
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Nov 18, 2015 14:12
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Matty posted:I'm playing offline, should i keep playing 0.16 or try 0.17? 0.17 is basically a few nerfs and minor changes right? The newest version is probably always going to be the one I'd suggest. It's not always the really obvious things in the change log that come up with that, it's the little quality of life things.
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Nov 18, 2015 14:15
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Matty posted:I'm playing offline, should i keep playing 0.16 or try 0.17? 0.17 is basically a few nerfs and minor changes right? Switch. Square LOS is worth the change alone.
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Nov 18, 2015 14:49
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The return of SquareLOS is taking me some getting used to, I tell you what. I almost got dunked on in Vaults:5 because I carelessly wandered within diagonal viewdistance of some nasty poo poo that I knew was there, and it woke up everything nearby. Darkness is such a good spell; I gotta make more use of Hexes. In other news I'm crazy busy and still bad at this game, but I have a reasonably good ogre with 4 runes and I'm going to try to chalk up an Ogrecome before the tournament ends. I have no god drat clue how I'm gonna gank the ORB without getting clowned by OoFs and also clowns, but gently caress it, gotta try.
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Nov 18, 2015 17:00
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Angry Diplomat posted:The return of SquareLOS is taking me some getting used to, I tell you what. I almost got dunked on in Vaults:5 because I carelessly wandered within diagonal viewdistance of some nasty poo poo that I knew was there, and it woke up everything nearby. Darkness is such a good spell; I gotta make more use of Hexes. I would suggest beating everything into a pulp with your gsc first. Tends to help!
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Nov 18, 2015 17:34
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Matty posted:I'm playing offline, should i keep playing 0.16 or try 0.17? 0.17 is basically a few nerfs and minor changes right?  You just can't see as far diagonally, because reasons, so if you're using ranged attacks the amount of turns you will get to stop enemies approaching from diagonals before they reach you are almost halved. And vice versa.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:06
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IronicDongz posted:I would recommend switching. SquareLOS makes way, way more sense once you get used to it, because of how circularLOS does this: The "reasons" being "being based on reality", but yeah, I'm willing to give up MY IMMERSION for a simpler view distance setup.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:20
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I don't recall being able to see less far northwest than north IRL. In a game which is already considerably abstracted by way of being tile-based(and where you can more diagonally), squareLOS is more "realistic" than circleLOS because real life doesn't have magic directions. Not that it matters anyways. LazyMaybe fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Nov 18, 2015 |
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Nov 18, 2015 18:30
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ZeeToo posted:I know the tournament is still ongoing, but you'll probably want to update to Trunk, now, since monster rod power doesn't depend on their shield any longer in Trunk. Really though, why was this a thing? It clearly wasn't an accident, the intended behavior was to modify monster rod power by shield skill. It's right there in the code comments.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:40
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Except that aside from the shield_base, none of the other variables are modified from 1. There is no modification based on shield skill, just what shield they're packing and does it by making buckler wielders weaker by a quarter, shields by half and large shields by...nothing. Why are they weaker when they're holding defenses easier to pierce? Not a clue. It's nonsensical and incomplete. Maybe it was before there was such a thing as an Evocations skill but there were rods.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:58
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World Famous Whore posted:Switch. Square LOS is worth the change alone.
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Nov 18, 2015 18:59
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Sage Grimm posted:Except that aside from the shield_base, none of the other variables are modified from 1. There is no modification based on shield skill, just what shield they're packing and does it by making buckler wielders weaker by a quarter, shields by half and large shields by...nothing. Why are they weaker when they're holding defenses easier to pierce? Not a clue. That was my thought as well, but the comment in the code is code:It actually generally works for the shield penalty. Bucklers reduced power by 20%, shields by 33%, and large shields by 50%. Where it falls apart, as you point out, is the function never actually gets the monster's shield skill, so it's just stuck at 1. There's also a variable called shield_num, which looks like it was supposed to increase the penalty based on number of shields worn? Probably for the best that it's also just stuck at 1. Not My Leg fucked around with this message at 19:24 on Nov 18, 2015 |
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Nov 18, 2015 19:20
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I need to rant, and yell that this loving game consists of hours of mind-numbing tedium, followed by a short burst of something interesting that kills you because you weren't paying attention due to the tedium of the past two hours. Basically, a game in which you're asked to inspect pineapples for ten days, and somewhere in the middle someone substitutes a live hand grenade. Okay, that feels better. Give me a few hours and I'll start a new character.
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Nov 18, 2015 20:56
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Not My Leg posted:Really though, why was this a thing? It clearly wasn't an accident, the intended behavior was to modify monster rod power by shield skill. It's right there in the code comments. I'm placing my bets that it was originally put in for labyrinths to ensure the minotaur wasn't impossible to beat if it picked up a large shield and a rod of destruction, or something like that.
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Nov 18, 2015 21:11
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Did crawl at one point actually try to make up for the circular los discrepancy by making diagonals be equivalent to sqrt(2) instead of one? I seem to recall reading about it. I might be mixing it up with the roguelikes thread though, they've blended together in my head at this point.
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Nov 18, 2015 22:08
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It's been suggested a lot, but quickly shot down each time. Basically it would have lots of horrible, horrible side-effects. For instance: does it take longer to attack diagonally? What shape is an AOE with a radius of 1 -- a 3x3 block or a cross? SquareLOS is nice and consistent, its only downside is that it doesn't really look circle-y. e: Not to mention sqrt(2) is transcendental and Crawl doesn't support non-integer amounts of time.
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Nov 18, 2015 22:30
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SlyFrog posted:I need to rant, and yell that this loving game consists of hours of mind-numbing tedium, followed by a short burst of something interesting that kills you because you weren't paying attention due to the tedium of the past two hours. Basically, a game in which you're asked to inspect pineapples for ten days, and somewhere in the middle someone substitutes a live hand grenade. I like Dungeon Crawl a lot and have wasted too much of my life playing it, and I unequivocally agree that this is the single worst thing about it. It's gradually getting better in that regard, though.
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Nov 18, 2015 22:55
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megane posted:e: Not to mention sqrt(2) is transcendental and Crawl doesn't support non-integer amounts of time. Actually it's just irrational, not transcendental, and crawl does support non-integer amounts of time (tenths of an aut) Other than that you're right
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Nov 18, 2015 23:04
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Angry Diplomat posted:I like Dungeon Crawl a lot and have wasted too much of my life playing it, and I unequivocally agree that this is the single worst thing about it. It's gradually getting better in that regard, though. Its still the name of the game in extended though. I kind of laughed half-halfheartedly to myself when I read that Lair branches are shorter but the Hells are all still 6 levels of tedious bullshit before severe pain. VVV Agree with the idea that they should both be shorter. I have a lot of ideas about how that could work while still being challenging but no point in them when I can't code. Internet Kraken fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Nov 18, 2015 |
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Nov 18, 2015 23:06
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I do genuinely think that Hell would be better if each branch were just one difficult floor. And pan would be better if you were guaranteed to get the rune levels right off the bat, and then random levels came after so if you really wanted you could trawl through it for zigs or whatever.
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Nov 18, 2015 23:19
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IronicDongz posted:I do genuinely think that Hell would be better if each branch were just one difficult floor. And pan would be better if you were guaranteed to get the rune levels right off the bat, and then random levels came after so if you really wanted you could trawl through it for zigs or whatever. You can get zigs in Pandemonium? Can you get banished from a zig in Pandemonium? How far down the rabbit hole can you go? 
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Nov 18, 2015 23:25
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I think if you get banished in pan, or in a zig, or in a zig in pan, you return to where you got banished when you find an abyss exit. You have go through an abyssal entrance portal to transit through it back to the dungeon. Maybe I'm wrong on some of that, but I seem to remember that getting banished by a wizard on Lom's level doesn't screw you out of the magic rune.
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Nov 18, 2015 23:36
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Yashichi posted:crawl does support non-integer amounts of time (tenths of an aut) You're thinking of "turns." A step normally takes 10 aut, which the game for some reason shows as 1.0 turns. And an aut is indivisible; if an action would somehow take some non-integer amount of auts, it gets rounded randomly. In other words if your weapon skill is such that you should have a delay of 0.75 turns = 7.5 auts, instead each swing randomly takes 7 or 8 auts. ...but yes, sqrt(2) isn't transcendental, I'm stupid.
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Nov 18, 2015 23:45
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Yeah, that's my mistake. Eventually we'll all have our minutiae straightened out.
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Nov 18, 2015 23:53
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Internet Kraken posted:Its still the name of the game in extended though. I kind of laughed half-halfheartedly to myself when I read that Lair branches are shorter but the Hells are all still 6 levels of tedious bullshit before severe pain. Yeah, I does seem like having the ability to code (and having people willing to test things for you and give feedback) helps immensely for ideas to make it into trunk. It's specially noticeable for ideas that are good but are either complex or have people on the fence. e: Every time I see eyes of draining I think it's an Internet Kraken 
apple fucked around with this message at 00:25 on Nov 19, 2015 |
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Nov 19, 2015 00:06
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SlyFrog posted:I need to rant, and yell that this loving game consists of hours of mind-numbing tedium, followed by a short burst of something interesting that kills you because you weren't paying attention due to the tedium of the past two hours. Basically, a game in which you're asked to inspect pineapples for ten days, and somewhere in the middle someone substitutes a live hand grenade. I dunno, i enjoy mindlessly wading through trash monsters for a couple of hours straight while my mind transcends to another plane of consciousness. Then an ugly buzzkiller appears
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Nov 19, 2015 00:30
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We call those killer bees. 
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Nov 19, 2015 00:44
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Maybe try a mummy, we still need a Gozag win SlyFrog  it's nonstop excitement
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Nov 19, 2015 00:57
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code:
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Nov 19, 2015 01:19
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 nope.jpg
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Nov 19, 2015 03:33
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Humans Among Us posted:Maybe try a mummy, we still need a Gozag win SlyFrog Given my repeated failures with the easiest of the easy, Ye Olde stock Minotaur Fighter/Berserker (again, almost always due to being stupid - I could at least respect if it was from running into an out of depth Ogre on 2 or something), I'm going to hold off on the Gozag Mummy for now. 
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Nov 19, 2015 04:24
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resistentialism posted:I think if you get banished in pan, or in a zig, or in a zig in pan, you return to where you got banished when you find an abyss exit. You have go through an abyssal entrance portal to transit through it back to the dungeon. But can you find a Zig in the Abyss in a Zig in Pan? 
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Nov 19, 2015 04:40
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I don't think Gozag is a very good Mummy God. Yeah, you don't need those corpses and it gives you potion effects that are otherwise off limits, but not being able to use regular potions negates half of Gozags late game "infinite consumables via shops" bonus, and Gozags weak startup time before you amass a bankroll doesn't mesh well with mummies generally lovely early game. Instead you should pick any other race without a special hunger mechanic for Gozag.
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Nov 19, 2015 04:40
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I was just playing my TrCK that finally stabilized against Xom's "assistance" (and the first successful start after 23 other splats) and was doing Depths to get some much needed experience to take on Vaults. Who should I run into but Mara: I dig a murderhole and berserk (due to a complete lack of normal haste) with full rF+++, figuring it should be a piece of cake. However, just before dying, Mara teleports away and leaves me stuck fighting a berserked illusion of myself in a corner. By the time berserk has worn off and allowed me to read teleport, I'm already at half health, and Xom is buffing my illusion while cackling loudly. I die a couple turns later. Five seconds after I see that I've died, my playlist changes to Dogsong. Well played, Xom.
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Nov 19, 2015 04:43
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Locke Dunnegan posted:But can you find a Zig in the Abyss in a Zig in Pan? Nope, they only spawn in pan and the one freebie in the depths.
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Nov 19, 2015 05:23
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