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kant posted:I find that even more confusing. I'm pretty sure it was just a joke. It wasn't meant to actually mean anything.
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Dec 6, 2015 21:53
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just_a_guy posted:I think that when he saw the diamond wall with "home" written behind and started pulling the pieces together (time looped rooms) he figured it out. The Doctor actually assumed the Tardis was behind that wall. Probably because he didn't expect to be locked away inside a portable prison universe.
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Dec 6, 2015 22:05
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I couldn't sleep last night, and I got to thinking. A dangerous thing, I know:
Thinking about things in this context, I buy into the whole "I'm the hybrid / I've Gone Too Far" thing. It's not really about Clara, its about 12 and how deeply he cares about those he loves, and drat the consequences. 12 would've blown a hole in the universe to get to Rose, even if it caused both universes to overheat. 12 would've dropped his TARDIS into the Angel-heavy Manhattan to get Amy and Rory back, even if the paradoxes blew everything up. And in both circumstances, Rose/Amy/Rory would cry their hearts out to him and say "Why did you do this for me?", just as Clara did to 12. And 12, just like he did with Clara, would've admitted that he did what he had to do because he cared about his friends. edit: and you know what irrationally irritates me about this episode? When the Doctor grabs his new screwdriver in a Heroic Pose, he's mostly holding the business end (the part that glows). It's like holding a sword over your head and holding the blade. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Dec 6, 2015 |
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Dec 6, 2015 22:05
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to the universe.
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The other thing I kinda thought was interesting is that the Doctor was almost a sad old man when he couldn't remember Clara. Like watching an older person try to remember something that loved so dearly but can't remember the details. Super sad mind you but well done by Peter Capaldi. edit: Also, I think Jenna Coleman had a good run and in general was a good companion. Mooseontheloose fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Dec 6, 2015 |
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Dec 6, 2015 22:06
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I really liked this episode a whole lot. I liked the Western feel in the beginning with the Line in the Sand, I liked the Doctor making fun of the Time Lords' hats, I liked Doctor Clara and the Diner Tardis, just a lot of good stuff going on here. I'm not sure why people didn't like it but I never am. So whatevs! :shoban:
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Dec 6, 2015 22:18
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I think the only issue I had was the Chameleon circuit thing, it just seemed a little stupid, not fun.
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Dec 6, 2015 22:28
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just_a_guy posted:So yeah. I guess That's what makes him dangerous. People are never sure if he actually has something capable of annihilating them or if it's all talk (we already saw Matt smith being called out on his bullshit in the pandorica. I I love it in Time of the Doctor when the Doctor is an ancient, slightly confused man with no plans or weapons left, face to face with a triumphant invading fleet of Daleks..... and the Daleks are still just a little timid about getting too close to him in case he suddenly fucks them over in some spectacular fashion. And then he does  Mooseontheloose posted:edit: Also, I think Jenna Coleman had a good run and in general was a good companion. I am so glad she stuck around for Capaldi's time as the Doctor, because she and Smith never really gelled for me (we were starting to see signs of it working from Day of the Doctor on) but she had an almost immediate chemistry with Capaldi. The stuff the series did with her over the last two seasons really worked well for me. qntm posted:Oh, and Capaldi looks infinitely better this season now he's got a decent head of hair going on. Whenever I upload gifs to my Capaldi folder on Imgur, I see this image:  And it catches me by surprise every time, his hair just looks off. It's so much better now, so much more the "Doctor".
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Dec 6, 2015 22:28
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My only gripe is my usual Moffat gripe: he thinks of unnecessary "cool" things to throw in without much explanation, like the Sliders and almost all of the under-Gallifrey scenes. It's the core character interactions that made this episode shine.
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Dec 6, 2015 22:31
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Jerusalem posted:And it catches me by surprise every time, his hair just looks off. It's so much better now, so much more the "Doctor". I loved his wild, unkept hair in the Zygon Inversion, it made him look a little more unhinged.
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Dec 6, 2015 22:32
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Thank gently caress the sunglasses are gone and we're back to a screwdriver.
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Dec 6, 2015 22:58
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Hopefully they'll branch out and have a Sonic Glove, Sonic Cane or a Sonic Ring. Edit: a Sonic Guitar is a step too far.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:06
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Eleven already did the Sonic Cane.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:10
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Before you know it they'll have a sonic hedgehog.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:11
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MisterBibs posted:
That was a valid fighting technique https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordhau
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Dec 6, 2015 23:13
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CommonShore posted:shucks. I want it now. [''; MrL_JaKiri posted:I'm still wondering what someone who has watched Doctor Who thinks of this episode It sucks! Yeah, complete garbage from start to finish and I hated basically every second of it. It was hard to top the awfulness of the season openner but this one managed to do it.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:19
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marktheando posted:And the Doctor murdering the general was incredibly out of character in a way that didn't feel earned, and was just glossed over in a very unsatisfying way. Mr "it feels like dying" "I don't want to go!" says regeneration is just man-flu?! Killing a guy on his 10th regeneration probably loses some of it's sting when said guy is the highest ranking military figure on a planet that he knows can now give an infinite supply of "new regeneration cycles" to people like the Master and the Doctor, particularly when the rear end in a top hat in charge who prohibited said extensions just caught a shuttle to Nowheresville. echoplex posted:Thought Masie was her best here, maybe something to do with her not playing anyone contrived now, she's simply a person at this point. We definitely had a 'classic' (stocking faced) cyberman head in the dressing for the cloisters, it's a shame it didn't make it into the ep/edit. You have a very nice knack for futurism in your designs. It's the kind of stuff I personally want to see in The Future. Well done, and thanks for sharing. One question---was the classic console room purpose built for this episode, or was it a recycle of stuff from the Doctor Who Experience and/or An Adventure in Space and TIme? I can't believe Moffat and Gatiss didn't throw that poo poo into storage for a rainy day immediately...
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Dec 6, 2015 23:21
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Astroman posted:One question---was the classic console room purpose built for this episode, or was it a recycle of stuff from the Doctor Who Experience and/or An Adventure in Space and TIme? I can't believe Moffat and Gatiss didn't throw that poo poo into storage for a rainy day immediately... It looked like the same console but in An Adventure it was green tinted. 
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Dec 6, 2015 23:26
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marktheando posted:And the Doctor murdering the general was incredibly out of character in a way that didn't feel earned, and was just glossed over in a very unsatisfying way. Mr "it feels like dying" "I don't want to go!" says regeneration is just man-flu?!
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Dec 6, 2015 23:36
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Didn't really like this one at all  Such a shame after last weeks fantastic episode.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:39
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Rhyno posted:It looked like the same console but in An Adventure it was green tinted. I think it was green in Adventure because the original was green in real life, but we only ever saw it in black and white. Because of that it looked white, and that's why they made it white for this version. I like how the design really is classic. It has a sort of modern I-aesthetic to it.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:42
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Did you miss the bit where they said he was breaking his own codes and generally being evil Which in turn played into the realization that as long as the Doctor and Clara were together, they would go to any lengths to keep the partnership going and drat the cost to time and space. Both were guilty of going to crazy lengths, both knew the other wouldn't accept a forced break, so in the end they did the only thing they could and removed the emotional context. The Doctor says that the hole left in his memories meant he was able to reconstruct what happened, but now he only intellectually remembers that he had adventures with Clara, that she meant a great deal to him, and that she eventually moved on with a final message to him to keep living his life and to "be the Doctor". He can feel satisfaction in that, without feeling like somebody has artificially dragged them apart or that she needs rescuing, which is what lead to a situation like him hammering his way through a diamond wall for 4.5 billion years just to get her back.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:47
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Astroman posted:I think it was green in Adventure because the original was green in real life, but we only ever saw it in black and white. Because of that it looked white, and that's why they made it white for this version. DW makes me pretty emotional these days. I guess I'm yearning for a better, simpler time in my life so when that control room popped up I got a little misty, like seeing an old friend.
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Dec 6, 2015 23:49
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Mr Beens posted:That was a valid fighting technique It's still dumb, visually. They framed the shot in a way of a dude holding his device/weapon aloft, pointing it towards the sky and towards the future. Like I said, it's spergy and pointless, but it strikes me as a case of Capaldi was told to grab it heroically and he wound up grabbing it backwards. (another screwdriver-related thing: I like to believe that the TARDIS generating a new screwdriver was the Doctor Who equivalent of a woman friend of yours taking you out to a party to get you out of a post-breakup doldrum.)
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Dec 6, 2015 23:55
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MisterBibs posted:It's still dumb, visually. They framed the shot in a way of a dude holding his device/weapon aloft, pointing it towards the sky and towards the future. It's more like going shopping. It's basically the Doctor's TARDIS going "Let's get you a new tablet. You like gadgets, don't you, hon?"
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Dec 7, 2015 00:09
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Pesky Splinter posted:That's really loving cool dude. Which episode did they use the Rembrandt in? Did you come up with the technobabble in the TARDIS manual yourself, or were there outside guidelines or something? The Rembrandt was done for Ep4 when the Doctor is explaining the bootstrap paradox, but I don't think it showed up in the edit until 5 or 6, but I saw it on and off in the series. We printed it direct onto stretched canvas and then aged it with laquer so it looked pleasingly legit. The manual stuff was thought up over a day or two (based on reading the old Star Trek tech manuals as a kid) but at the last second it was decided it should be in Gallifryean rather than English. Forktoss posted:Hey echoplex, you wouldn't happen to a have a pic of that stocking-faced Cyberman head you mentioned Fraid not. Not sure where it was from, assume the Experience. Neddy Seagoon posted:One question for echoplex though, in the scene where the Doctor's drawing a line in the dirt is that gunship a superimposed model or just CGI? I swear it looks like a model. All CG. Those designs are done by the post company and actually don't pass our way (although we made the cockpit set, but that was from bits of other set, as we often do) Astroman posted:You have a very nice knack for futurism in your designs. It's the kind of stuff I personally want to see in The Future. Well done, and thanks for sharing. Thanks! You don't get much time to work things out on that show so it's often a case of going with what you know. Michael Pickwoad is a cracking designer too and always has good ideas on how things should go. The console was taken from the Experience and then painted white (as well as the labels being replaced), and then swiftly repainted and sent back! I was in the Experience after hours putting the original labels back on. Everything else was made from new. ThaGhettoJew posted:Just wanted to let you know I appreciate the BLK-MESA button (and everything else, of course). I see that Den of Geek didn't pick up on the Buckaroo Banzai thing that was (barely) hidden in E12.
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Dec 7, 2015 00:12
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echoplex posted:The Rembrandt was done for Ep4 when the Doctor is explaining the bootstrap paradox, but I don't think it showed up in the edit until 5 or 6, but I saw it on and off in the series. We printed it direct onto stretched canvas and then aged it with laquer so it looked pleasingly legit. The manual stuff was thought up over a day or two (based on reading the old Star Trek tech manuals as a kid) but at the last second it was decided it should be in Gallifryean rather than English. Can you tell us about the classic console room build?
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Dec 7, 2015 00:14
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I liked that Clara, whose only moments of personality was as someone who went around pretending to be The Doctor to people who wouldn't know any better, who bantered off all sorts of obscure Doctor trivia to distract Cybermen, and who keeps looking to The Doctor for praise not as a romantic fancy but because she loves adventures and mysteries ("I was good, wasn't I? I was properly good."), basically goes off to be her own Doctor. Yes, it discards the emotional weight of Danny, but you know what? Danny surrendered his own resurrection, and there wasn't anything she could do. Besides which, the afterlife is now defined as The Master's Well of Souls or something, since Missy had been going through time establishing organized religion to fill out her time lord hard drive, so in the end they may be together anyway. The problem with Osgood is she is a pander to Doctor Who fandom that is not nearly as complimentary as they think it is. Her being clever and being a walking encyclopedia of The Doctor's history isn't getting it. Clara is a better example of them actually getting it. I didn't grow up with Doctor Who, but we've had two Doctors now by actors who grew up wanting to be The Doctor. And so it seems like Clara is a better fan/viewer insert than Osgood (and arguably most companions that exist to give the viewer a grounded "normal" person.) Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 00:27
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I didn't mind that episode (my wife hated the sunglasses so she was very happy the screwdriver returned) and having only watched the reboot I was a bit confused by all the Gallifrey stuff - it was only through reading threads like these afterwards that I realised that Rasillon was the Timothy Dalton character. An issue I have with this episode - and it may just be ABC's iView player - a lot of the dialogue is hard to hear over the music. I didn't hear the resurrected General's sassy remark for example. I do get that the Doctor shot him/her to buy himself a few minutes of time.
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Dec 7, 2015 00:46
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Craptacular! posted:Yes, it discards the emotional weight of Danny, but you know what? Yeah the more I thought about it, the more I thought it was pretty loving presumptuous of me to want to dictate that Clara NEEDS to give up the adventuring life and settle down to being a normal human being. Sure it would be emotionally healthy to properly grieve for Danny (which she clearly still had ongoing issues over) but her character has long been established as somebody who wanted more than anything to travel and see exciting things, not to be a settled down homebody. All that stuff with her looking after her dead best friend's family (who were promptly ushered out of there after season 7) was her anchoring herself to a normal life to help others at her own expense, and in the end it is appropriate that she gets to be "selfish" (she's still eventually going to go back to die) and continue to enjoy herself and live the life she always wanted. It is kinda lovely for her family though, I would hope that she and Me pop in to at least say her goodbyes before she eventually returns to Trap Street to face the raven.
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Dec 7, 2015 00:50
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Rhyno posted:It looked like the same console but in An Adventure it was green tinted. In the days of black and white tv , true white would produce too much glare so they used a greenish tint console for production to look "white". It's not a problem for high definition. It's the same reason the Lone Ranger's "black" mask in the black and white serials was actually purple. As for Rassilon, I miss Timothy Dalton as well. Maybe they should get Brian Blessed as his next regeneration. That's the man who's bested Capaldi on screen and in real life.
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Dec 7, 2015 00:52
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Jerusalem posted:Yeah the more I thought about it, the more I thought it was pretty loving presumptuous of me to want to dictate that Clara NEEDS to give up the adventuring life and settle down to being a normal human being. Sure it would be emotionally healthy to properly grieve for Danny (which she clearly still had ongoing issues over) but her character has long been established as somebody who wanted more than anything to travel and see exciting things, not to be a settled down homebody. All that stuff with her looking after her dead best friend's family (who were promptly ushered out of there after season 7) was her anchoring herself to a normal life to help others at her own expense, and in the end it is appropriate that she gets to be "selfish" (she's still eventually going to go back to die) and continue to enjoy herself and live the life she always wanted. I am not convinced her family ever actually existed. They showed up like, what, once?
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Dec 7, 2015 00:55
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Burkion posted:I am not convinced her family ever actually existed. Grandma was there to talk to her after Danny died, and that's it. Her mother is dead from ?????
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Dec 7, 2015 01:12
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Craptacular! posted:Grandma was there to talk to her after Danny died, and that's it. Her mother is dead from ????? Oh God I forgot she did show back up. I just remembered them from the baffling sub tumor of Time of the Doctor where apparently she has a new mom? Or her old mom didn't die or Something?
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Dec 7, 2015 01:15
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Her father remarried.
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Dec 7, 2015 01:19
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echoplex posted:Thought Masie was her best here, maybe something to do with her not playing anyone contrived now, she's simply a person at this point. We definitely had a 'classic' (stocking faced) cyberman head in the dressing for the cloisters, it's a shame it didn't make it into the ep/edit. That poster for the Rave is like the most Peter Saville thing I've seen that isn't from Saville. And wow, I love all of this. There's such care put into stuff that is on screen for like a second, but that care shows through. It reminds me of the stuff the Okuda's designed for TNG era Star Trek, which is probably my favorite sci-fi stylings ever. For the show. I really loved how they did say that the Doctor was so single minded in his attempts at saving Clara he never bothered to actually ask her if she wanted to be saved. And others have said, Maisie was by far the best in this show than the others she's appeared in. I also really liked the Mutiny of the soldiers to stand with the Doctor. Though it really pissed me off having the Time Lords act like big jerks the whole way. Maybe the Doctor knows something they don't? I mean literally, its the DOCTOR, so maybe you should just go along with his ideas? I did like how they went back to the mysterious shack in the desert from Day of the Doctor, though having it just be in a lovely part of Gallifrey is kind of rote. I like how they got that tactor that kind of looks like Terrance Stamp to be Rassilon. I assume that somewhere during the war he got injured and regenerated. Doctor Who, the one show you can change actors without having to explain. Though by far my favorite thing was the classic Tardis with classic sounds. Even had the Round Things!
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Dec 7, 2015 01:42
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Also, Danny died with a cleared conscience, whereas of he chose to live he'd continue being traumatized by his past, so his story isn't really too tragic. The fucker who hit him with a car was never addressed once, of course.
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Dec 7, 2015 01:44
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twistedmentat posted:I like how they got that tactor that kind of looks like Terrance Stamp to be Rassilon. I assume that somewhere during the war he got injured and regenerated. Doctor Who, the one show you can change actors without having to explain.
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Dec 7, 2015 01:52
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On rewatching it, I really like the Doctor's 'death' speech to Clara. It's not a goodbye. It's telling her how to be the Doctor. Because of course he knows what she's going to do with a stolen TARDIS and an infinite moment between heartbeats. She's going to do exactly what he would.
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Dec 7, 2015 01:55
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Craptacular! posted:Yes, it discards the emotional weight of Danny, but you know what? Danny surrendered his own resurrection, and there wasn't anything she could do. No one should remember or acknowledge Danny Pink at any time for any reason, ever.
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Dec 7, 2015 02:41
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Every time Danny showed up I groaned. The subplot of him and Clara was beyond boring.
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Dec 7, 2015 02:43
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