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Caphi posted:I don't get Memory. Actually I don't get +1d6 abilities. I can't imagine people use it when they're short by 5 or 6 (our deva sure doesn't), so it seems like practically speaking it's a retroactive +2, maybe +3, that sometimes has a chance to fail. The thing about Memory is that it's an encounter power, and useful on so much more then just combat situations. Every discrete "scene" that deva can boost one of their skills if they think it's fallen short - which adds up a lot. SunAndSpring posted:Deva are good but I like Aasimar better "Mommy was an angel so I'm basically perfect" has never been an interesting background, which is why tieflings were always way more popular 
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Dec 8, 2015 04:22
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ProfessorCirno posted:"Mommy was an angel so I'm basically perfect" has never been an interesting background, which is why tieflings were always way more popular Sure, the background wasn't interesting, but there's good potential with them, like playing a guy burnt out on the stress of living up to his literal angel of a father, or a rogue who has realized that since everyone expects you to be a giant goody two-shoes by nature they will never expect you scamming the poo poo out of them.
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Dec 8, 2015 04:38
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I like the Deva because I can play them like an immortal from Highlander. Ok thanks.
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Dec 8, 2015 04:44
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Dick Burglar posted:Question about Avengers: does their damage as a striker just kinda suck til they hit Paragon and grab Painful Oath? Seems like before then they're basically banking on being a more "reliable" striker, but without any actual bonus damage mechanic. In my experience Avengers do play a little different than other strikers but they don't lag behind to a noticeable degree (unless we're comparing them to Rangers or something). Their crit-fishing amazing and the accuracy bonus they can pull out from Oath is itself a passive DPR boost. Avengers also have a lot of utility and are pretty sticky depending on which Oath you're rocking. They are amazing in a radiant mafia but I guess anything is.
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Dec 8, 2015 04:48
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Yeah I'm not interested in radiant cheesing, I've toyed with those builds and they're all samey. The appeal of Avenger to me was crit-fishing. Samurai background, high crit weapon, every crit feat you can get, Melegaunt's Darkblade for crits on 19-20 in Paragon. Not gonna go full Twin Strike Avenger cheese, but pretty much everything shy of it is fair game. I also like grabbing Monk multiclass so I can carry around a Rain of Hammers Ki Focus. Sadly, I still have to use a Holy Symbol with Mighty Crusader Expertise (which is handy because you can avoid OAs with ranged attacks), but hey. Even a +1 focus is a nice little boost from its effect and daily power. Speaking of crit builds, are there any items that give you a damage bump on crits? I feel like there is at least one. Maybe a hand item?
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Dec 8, 2015 05:19
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Ring of Giants (L13) gives a bonus equal to twice your weapon's enhancement bonus on a crit, while the War Ring (L16) adds critical damage die on a critical hit.
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Dec 8, 2015 05:23
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Dick Burglar posted:Question about Avengers: does their damage as a striker just kinda suck til they hit Paragon and grab Painful Oath? Seems like before then they're basically banking on being a more "reliable" striker, but without any actual bonus damage mechanic. Bonus accuracy is extra damage over the long run, and if your Avenger lands just one attack more than another striker that's often enough to balance out over the course of a fight. You also have to account for the higher crit rate provided by consistent double rolls.
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Dec 8, 2015 05:27
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SunAndSpring posted:Sure, the background wasn't interesting, but there's good potential with them, like playing a guy burnt out on the stress of living up to his literal angel of a father, or a rogue who has realized that since everyone expects you to be a giant goody two-shoes by nature they will never expect you scamming the poo poo out of them. See, now imagine a deva who's desperately burning out trying to live up to the name of their angel of a father, except it isn't their father, it's literally just their own past life. Last cycle you were the most glorious crusader who conquered the demon lands and brought about a new age of peace. Now you see your face on posters everywhere, but you aren't that guy, and the harder you try, the more it slips away.
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Dec 8, 2015 05:28
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:Dragonborn. Only race with +Str and +Cha. Don't forget Vryloka! 
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Dec 8, 2015 05:40
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Dick Burglar posted:Yeah I'm not interested in radiant cheesing, I've toyed with those builds and they're all samey. The appeal of Avenger to me was crit-fishing. Samurai background, high crit weapon, every crit feat you can get, Melegaunt's Darkblade for crits on 19-20 in Paragon. Not gonna go full Twin Strike Avenger cheese, but pretty much everything shy of it is fair game. I also like grabbing Monk multiclass so I can carry around a Rain of Hammers Ki Focus. Sadly, I still have to use a Holy Symbol with Mighty Crusader Expertise (which is handy because you can avoid OAs with ranged attacks), but hey. Even a +1 focus is a nice little boost from its effect and daily power. Dwarf Avenger|Cleric. 14/11/10/10/18/8 starting stats. Dwarven Weapon Training, Battle Awareness, Avenging Resolution. At L11 take the Draeven Marauder PP and Deadly Axe. Use a Rending Gouge. Enjoy your 19-20 crit range on a 2d6 high-crit weapon that counts 1's and 2's as 3's and gives you a free MBA when you crit. It's a fairly gimmicky multi-class and I wouldn't use this build if I were going into Epic, but if you just want a low-paragon crit fisher it's hilarious.
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Dec 8, 2015 05:57
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Right now my build is a Wood Elf for Sense Threat and Reactive Stealth. I figure if I'm gonna run the Samurai background I really want to make sure I'm top billing on initiative, and the loss of Elven Accuracy hurts less when you've got Oath of Enmity. I'm using the Ardent Champion PP which grants a shift 1+MBA upon crit. Why does a gouge even need Avenging Resolution? Gouges are already Brutal 1, which straight up allows for rerolls of 1s. I guess it helps if you roll a 2, but eh. Anybody track down the Avenger charop thread backup? I couldn't find it in the backup log I found on ENworld. Dick Burglar fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Dec 8, 2015 |
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Dec 8, 2015 06:06
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Generic Octopus posted:This threshold for 'broken' seems kinda low. You have to sort of filter everything a little on this thread. For "seriously broken" read "a little better."
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Dec 8, 2015 06:14
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ProfessorCirno posted:See, now imagine a deva who's desperately burning out trying to live up to the name of their angel of a father, except it isn't their father, it's literally just their own past life. Last cycle you were the most glorious crusader who conquered the demon lands and brought about a new age of peace. Now you see your face on posters everywhere, but you aren't that guy, and the harder you try, the more it slips away. Fair enough. I still think they look goofy though, at least in the official art.
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Dec 8, 2015 06:24
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Khizan posted:Dwarf Avenger|Cleric. 14/11/10/10/18/8 starting stats. Dwarven Weapon Training, Battle Awareness, Avenging Resolution. At L11 take the Draeven Marauder PP and Deadly Axe. Use a Rending Gouge. Don't take Dealy Axe until you've taken at least Impaling Spear, probably Surprising Charge. Deadly Axe is nice but it's not a huge damage boost compared to those.
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Dec 8, 2015 10:21
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ProfessorCirno posted:Genasi became maybe one of the best melee striker races period following the creation of a single real stupid item. If you're using a heavy blade, Genasi will probably do ridiculous things to your damage.
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Dec 8, 2015 14:01
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So, dumb question that I already know the answer to, but I figured I'd ask how dumb this sounds: the Academy Master PP has pair of powers that are "use an at-will/encounter power, get +2[W] or +2 damage dice on a non-weapon attack. (Plus a duration extender on the Encounter version)." Now, RAW this probably means powers that don't actually involve dealing damage but instead make someone else attack, such as Hypnotism or Direct the Strike should gain no benefit. However, how stupid would it be for the +2 damage dice to trickle over to whomever is directed to attack?
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Dec 8, 2015 14:05
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ElegantFugue posted:Which item is that? Unknown Quantity posted:So, dumb question that I already know the answer to, but I figured I'd ask how dumb this sounds: the Academy Master PP has pair of powers that are "use an at-will/encounter power, get +2[W] or +2 damage dice on a non-weapon attack. (Plus a duration extender on the Encounter version)." Now, RAW this probably means powers that don't actually involve dealing damage but instead make someone else attack, such as Hypnotism or Direct the Strike should gain no benefit. However, how stupid would it be for the +2 damage dice to trickle over to whomever is directed to attack? RAW neither of those powers actually works at all IIRC, but eh, the intent of the writers was clear, they just didn't actually understand the rules of the game which was not uncommon. It wouldn't be remotely problematic to do exactly what you're suggesting
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Dec 8, 2015 14:20
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Firewind Blade is more or less a continuation of probably the thing I hated most in bleeding edge char ops, the neverending search for separate damage ticks. Personally I feel the whole thing subverts one of the big selling points of 4e, namely the death of rolling thirty attacks on your turn an instead turning it all into a single power usage.
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Dec 8, 2015 14:45
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ProfessorCirno posted:Firewind Blade is more or less a continuation of probably the thing I hated most in bleeding edge char ops, the neverending search for separate damage ticks. Personally I feel the whole thing subverts one of the big selling points of 4e, namely the death of rolling thirty attacks on your turn an instead turning it all into a single power usage. Firewind Blade was a designer not knowing how the game works, pure and simple. Any designer who actually understood the mechanics would not have designed it. Even just making it extra damage would have been fine and perfectly balanced.
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Dec 8, 2015 14:55
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So basically it just adds a chunk of extra damage (to creatures other than your target) every turn. Shocking Flame may or may not interact with it, since I'm not entirely sure the extra damage would count as melee damage. Seems dumb. And yeah I'm with Cirno: charoppers who claim that "instances of extra damage" magically means you get to re-apply all your static modifiers and poo poo are the worst. That's not clever interaction of rules, that's just using obtuse interpretations of (admittedly often poorly-worded) powers to gain a dumb advantage.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:15
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Dick Burglar posted:So basically it just adds a chunk of extra damage (to creatures other than your target) every turn. Your target is an enemy adjacent to you.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:22
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Not to other targets, to your current target. And Shocking Flame doesn't interact with it, it triggers it in the first place, because otherwise it's tough to get fire damage on e.g. a Barbarian without using your enchant slot in which case, no firewind. Firewind *isn't* an instance of extra damage, that's why it's dumb. If it was, it would be OK at best.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:23
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Generic Octopus posted:Your target is an enemy adjacent to you. Oh, christ. I thought it said one enemy adjacent to your target but nope, it's adjacent to YOU. Holy poo poo talk about a dumb dev.
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Dec 8, 2015 19:42
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Not surprised to find out that that item's from an Essentials supplement.
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Dec 8, 2015 21:44
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Late day damage charop is almost entirely built around gathering as many different ways to stack damage modifiers (and vulnerability is a super popular one), and then as many damage instances as possible, and it lead to a lot of real stupid crowbaring with rules to make it work. Elemental damage was super popular because it allowed the use of dragonstones and the ability to tap vulnerabilities. Like, yes, it is in part because the rules on attacks and damage instances weren't really the best in their writing because D&D always has and always will refuse to put stuff in basic language rather then get overly wrought about it, but gunning for it in the first place just kills some of the better parts of 4e and makes it more 3.x-ish, which is always a crime in my book.
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Dec 8, 2015 23:11
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I am starting to gain an appreciation for what this thread means when Controllers make the DM say "but that's bullshit". It's ~magical~ when your Elite has to blow Action Points just to be able to move. Not that I mind, though!
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Dec 11, 2015 05:55
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gradenko_2000 posted:I am starting to gain an appreciation for what this thread means when Controllers make the DM say "but that's bullshit". It's ~magical~ when your Elite has to blow Action Points just to be able to move. I sorta mind it, in the sense that it made me feel like I was sold a bill of goods. Like, the ease with which you can homebrew/up-level/de-level monsters is basically just a bunch of useless busywork if it doesn't result in an encounter that is interesting and challenging. If monsters are meant to be speedbumps, they could sure cut down on the overhead involved (see: every Leader in the Monster Vault is your classic D&D "Wizard who chose spells poorly" with a different coat of paint)
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Dec 11, 2015 08:43
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Controllers make the game suck for everybody but themselves.
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Dec 11, 2015 09:34
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Frankly the game's focus on control, or at least the heavy focus on action denial, was a mistake. Outside of marking, a lot of control effects mostly just slow down the game or make what would have been a challenging/interesting encounter a comical or boring mess. This pointedly got so bad that every solo has a way to completely ignore most of the best or even all control effects. It's more manageable when control lessens enemy damage or otherwise makes enemy actions inefficient, rather than outright hog-tying them and obviating a battle that might have otherwise held peoples' attention.
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Dec 11, 2015 11:25
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I like the power my group's Invoker has that lets him stun enemies at the cost of becoming dazed. Usually it's worth it, but there are those times where it turns out, he could have really done with being not dazed that next round. (I'm sure there are some feat shenanigans that let him avoid getting dazed, anyway.)
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Dec 11, 2015 20:20
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My Lovely Horse posted:I like the power my group's Invoker has that lets him stun enemies at the cost of becoming dazed. Usually it's worth it, but there are those times where it turns out, he could have really done with being not dazed that next round. (I'm sure there are some feat shenanigans that let him avoid getting dazed, anyway.) Superior Will, eventually several items that you give you bonuses to your saves vs. daze.
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Dec 11, 2015 20:24
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My Lovely Horse posted:(I'm sure there are some feat shenanigans that let him avoid getting dazed, anyway.)
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Dec 11, 2015 20:25
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Apparently Wizards has chosen to prevent any new DDI subscriptions without advance notice. What's conspicuously absent is any statement indicating that this is a temporary measure. Pretty bummed about this, since I had some sort of weird account issue that prevented me from being able to use any of the tools the last time I tried to re-up, which was shortly after the change to the new account system. Without the welcomed convenience the various digital tools provided, this almost certainly means I'll never be able to run a 4E game again. 
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Dec 13, 2015 08:44
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Before I try to do this myself, is there a centralized list of the 4e monsters? I don't mind redoing the math from a monster that in MM2 or whatever, but if I'm looking for a level 6 soldier, I'd like to be able to see what my options are at a glance.
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Dec 13, 2015 08:51
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Both the compendium and monster builder should be able to handle that – if you have Insider. If you don't, this tool doesn't include any unique monsters (and probably has an incomplete list of sources), but can handle what you need otherwise. Edit: This encounter builder looks like it pulls creatures from all sources, but requires compendium access to get any useful data – including the monster's source. Auralsaurus Flex fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Dec 13, 2015 |
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Dec 13, 2015 09:02
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Auralsaurus Flex posted:Apparently Wizards has chosen to prevent any new DDI subscriptions without advance notice. What's conspicuously absent is any statement indicating that this is a temporary measure. Pretty bummed about this, since I had some sort of weird account issue that prevented me from being able to use any of the tools the last time I tried to re-up, which was shortly after the change to the new account system. Why does that link in their post not lead me to an actual site? Anyone else have that issue?
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Dec 13, 2015 09:08
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The link redirects me to ddi.wizards.com. Does that work for you?
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Dec 13, 2015 09:10
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Auralsaurus Flex posted:The link redirects me to ddi.wizards.com. Does that work for you? Nope. It's just bringing me to a page saying that it is either unavailable or doesn't exist. I have no clue why this is doing this.
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Dec 13, 2015 09:30
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Yesterday I fired up the offline builder and it gave me a bunch of Javascript error messages. Didn't write them down but it was something about scripts not running properly that referred to dnd.wizards.com. Everything seems to be working fine e: uh nevermind I have them deselected in campaign setting for that character. Ahem. But the script errors do refer specifically to dnd.wizards.com/sites/all/themes/[...]. My Lovely Horse fucked around with this message at 10:49 on Dec 13, 2015 |
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Dec 13, 2015 10:42
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Auralsaurus Flex posted:Apparently Wizards has chosen to prevent any new DDI subscriptions without advance notice. What's conspicuously absent is any statement indicating that this is a temporary measure. Pretty bummed about this, since I had some sort of weird account issue that prevented me from being able to use any of the tools the last time I tried to re-up, which was shortly after the change to the new account system. Lol, Wizards. Also, good LORD that site is ugly. I mean, I have a big screen and it's entirely full of a picture. Not... content. I can barely see content at the bottom of the screen, just.
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Dec 13, 2015 10:48
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