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Hazzard posted:While we're on WW2, assuming it hasn't been done to death, what made the Allies do so well on the Western Front after Normandy? The Initial German Invasion of France goes swimmingly and tears through everything, but when 1944 rolls around the German Infantry seem to melt in the face of Allied counter-invasions. Does Allied combat doctrine and equipment just really outstrip Germany by this point? List of advantages for the allies on the Western Front. -Outnumbered Germans 3:1 -Total air superiority -Uncompromised supply lines -Fully mechanized infantry divisions -Organic armour battalions for all infantry divisions -Incompetent officers mostly weeded out -French sympathy -Germans busy getting reaped by Soviets during Bagration
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Dec 11, 2015 23:46
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Nenonen posted:The Bering connection would be feasible albeit extremely risky and expensive with current technology, but a tunnel or bridge connection between Senegal and Brazil would be over 2500 km long. Meanwhile the Channel tunnel from Calais to Dover is 50 km and that was already straining the budgets of two of the wealthiest nations in the world. Oh yeah, I wasn't trying to say that that plan was feasible, just bringing up a real world (kind of) plan which would let you take a train from Brazil to Senegal (if you wanted to take a week minimum to travel)
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Dec 12, 2015 00:06
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:List of advantages for the allies on the Western Front. Just to fill in these points: * Allied Infantry divisions had armor units attached as part of the infantry division, and these "armor-infantry" units frequently had more tanks than actual German tank divisions; * The Allies had total air superiority - it was so crushing that German generals referred to it as 'the new flank.' Movement of armor had to happen mostly at night simply to avoid air attacks; *Hitler was in charge of the Germans. This seems like a given until you realize that Hitler was trying to micromanage Normandy, and as usual refused to retreat. His generals saw the danger of a pincer movement, Hitler ignored it. So the Falase pocket happened.
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Dec 12, 2015 00:26
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I was reading the D&D WWII thread and I learned that Britain was committing holocausts before Hitler was even born.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:06
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Hogge Wild posted:I was reading the D&D WWII thread and I learned that Britain was committing holocausts before Hitler was even born. We did genocide before it was cool.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:08
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Hogge Wild posted:I was reading the D&D WWII thread and I learned that Britain was committing holocausts before Hitler was even born.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:11
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Of course, when Zee Germans got round to having an empire they had a bloody good go at it also. Empires are bad, mmkay.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:21
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Empires are the bad fashion decisions of history. They look awful, make you regret everything ever associated with it and terrifyingly they will come around again at some point to gently caress with you.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:25
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Trin Tragula posted:Of course, when Zee Germans got round to having an empire they had a bloody good go at it also. Empires are bad, mmkay.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:28
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SeanBeansShako posted:Empires are the bad fashion decisions of history. They look awful, make you regret everything ever associated with it and terrifyingly they will come around again at some point to gently caress with you. Britain just didn't make the mistake of doing it in an era where everything could be photographed. We have photos of mountains of corpses from the Holocaust, tons of buffalo skulls from America, but can you see the leftovers from British Concentration Camps? I can't think of any Empire newer than Britain, but didn't have its atrocities as well documented. Hazzard fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Dec 12, 2015 |
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Dec 12, 2015 01:30
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Hazzard posted:Britain just didn't make the mistake of doing it in an era where everything could be photographed. We have photos of mountains of corpses from the Holocaust, tons of buffalo skulls from America, but can you see the leftovers from British Concentration Camps? There are photographs. I've seen them. It made me feel ashamed. Which happens a lot with this countries history.
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Dec 12, 2015 01:33
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Hazzard posted:tons of buffalo skulls from America
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Dec 12, 2015 01:33
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SeanBeansShako posted:There are photographs. I've seen them. It made me feel ashamed. Which happens a lot with this countries history. HEY GAL posted:we were sterilizing people of the wrong ethnic groups until the 70s. You don't have photographs though. Someone could deny it happens, because there's a lack of irrefutable evidence if you're a hardcore denier. A sterilised person looks the same as anyone else, usually. And didn't America give Black People Polio at some point? It's shocking how little awareness there is for something so recent,
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Dec 12, 2015 01:52
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Hazzard posted:And didn't America give Black People Polio at some point? It's shocking how little awareness there is for something so recent,
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Dec 12, 2015 01:54
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Hazzard posted:I wasn't aware, I'm forgetting the name of it now, but one of the worst ones in India happened in the early to mid 19th century, so no photos. What I read was brutal, on the par with the opening of Jerusalem: A Biography describing the sack of Jerusalem in 70 AD. Syphilis. I think it was the 1970s when some doctor was like, "wait, we have a cure, why do we need to study the progression of the disease? This is pretty horrible, we should treat these people or something. "
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Dec 12, 2015 01:56
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Hazzard posted:While we're on WW2, assuming it hasn't been done to death, what made the Allies do so well on the Western Front after Normandy? The Initial German Invasion of France goes swimmingly and tears through everything, but when 1944 rolls around the German Infantry seem to melt in the face of Allied counter-invasions. Does Allied combat doctrine and equipment just really outstrip Germany by this point? The entire western front in 1944 and 1945 was a silly little side show. The actual WW2 was fought on the eastern front, which is perhaps best illustrated with an infographic:  Each symbol represents 100k dead. Skulls are civilian dead, David's stars are civilian jews, red crosses are dead from disease/starvation. The entire allied force in France and Germany from september 1944 to the end of the war was like, what, 90 divisions, and they didn't exactly get to do a lot of heavy fighting. The Germans started off Barbarossa with about 150 divisions and kept the meatgrinder going for four years.
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Dec 12, 2015 02:01
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Where can I read more about the Vietnamese resistance against the Ming? I read it influenced their struggle against France and the US on modern era.
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Dec 12, 2015 03:02
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How would the allied powers have done if Hitler hadn't turned on Stalin? That seems to be the main defining aspect of the war with Germany.
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Dec 12, 2015 03:11
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SlothfulCobra posted:How would the allied powers have done if Hitler hadn't turned on Stalin? That seems to be the main defining aspect of the war with Germany. The Western Front would an enormous clusterfuck that the US could actually consider nuking Munich or Stalin betrays Hitler instead or both at the same time.
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Dec 12, 2015 03:27
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TheLovablePlutonis posted:The Western Front would an enormous clusterfuck that the US could actually consider nuking Munich or Stalin betrays Hitler instead or both at the same time. "Holding to Molotov-Ribbentrop" is about as gay and black as Hitler can get though.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:22
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SlothfulCobra posted:How would the allied powers have done if Hitler hadn't turned on Stalin? That seems to be the main defining aspect of the war with Germany. Does Stalin turn on Hitler anyway in this theory?
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Dec 12, 2015 04:26
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Is there any solid evidence that Stalin was going to invade? I thought EE or one of our other Russian experts said a while ago that all the data pointed to him having other poo poo on his plate
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Dec 12, 2015 04:36
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Cyrano4747 posted:Is there any solid evidence that Stalin was going to invade? I thought EE or one of our other Russian experts said a while ago that all the data pointed to him having other poo poo on his plate Also interested with this so I can hit the Suvorov fanboy in the d&d thread with it.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:41
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Required amounts of T-34s wouldn't be built until 1942 at peacetime 1941 production levels, even with projected increases going according to plan. Also the new heavy tank for the Red Army, KV-3, 4, or 5, wouldn't even be decided on until 1942. Then, seeing as Kirov factory would be the only one to be building these monsters, give it another year before the Red Army is in any shape to be invading anyone.Raskolnikov38 posted:Also interested with this so I can hit the Suvorov fanboy in the d&d thread with it. Hahaha there's a Suvorov fanboy in D&D? Tell him to read "Antisuvorov" by a historian who can actually read. http://militera.lib.ru/research/isaev_av1/index.html
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Dec 12, 2015 04:46
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Cyrano4747 posted:Is there any solid evidence that Stalin was going to invade? I thought EE or one of our other Russian experts said a while ago that all the data pointed to him having other poo poo on his plate I think the evidence comes from what the ex-Nazis told us after the war, and they had an incentive to claim that, and we had an incentive to believe them.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:50
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Wasn't discussing whether the URSS could turn against Germany in '41, they were definitely not ready to do such, and even without Barbarossa preparations they would end up badly when doing so. But the possibility of Stalin abandoning Molotov-Ribbentrop as soon as he knew he could march to Germany with less resistance (especially if there's a heavy front on France leaving the East open) is quite likely.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:53
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Ensign Expendable posted:Required amounts of T-34s wouldn't be built until 1942 at peacetime 1941 production levels, even with projected increases going according to plan. Also the new heavy tank for the Red Army, KV-3, 4, or 5, wouldn't even be decided on until 1942. Then, seeing as Kirov factory would be the only one to be building these monsters, give it another year before the Red Army is in any shape to be invading anyone. Konstantin Pleshakov's Stalin's Folly had something about a plan for attacking Germany in 1942. I have no idea whether that was a serious intent or just war planning and it's been a long time since I read it.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:56
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Speaking of Molotov-Ribbentropp and the trade agreements afterward, was Germany just sending old outdated surplus poo poo to the Soviets? Or were they sending them up-to-date stuff in exchange for all those raw materials they later used to sustain Barbarossa?
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Dec 12, 2015 04:57
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FAUXTON posted:Speaking of Molotov-Ribbentropp and the trade agreements afterward, was Germany just sending old outdated surplus poo poo to the Soviets? Or were they sending them up-to-date stuff in exchange for all those raw materials they later used to sustain Barbarossa? They gave the one of their incomplete Hipper class heavy cruisers. That's pretty cutting-edge.
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Dec 12, 2015 04:59
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Cyrano4747 posted:Is there any solid evidence that Stalin was going to invade? I thought EE or one of our other Russian experts said a while ago that all the data pointed to him having other poo poo on his plate From watching that Starmedia documentary series, (probably a little pop history in there but the main facts were apparent). Stalin would have had to been retarded to invade in the summer of 1941, with an army still rebuilding and rearming, with the Japanese in the Far East nipping at the door which would mean definitely fighting a 2 front war with Japan if they invaded Germany. If he wanted to invade he would probably be planning something like EE said 1942 or 1943 at the earliest to ensure he could deal with Japan and Germany at the same time.
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Dec 12, 2015 05:00
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HEY GAL posted:we were sterilizing people of the wrong ethnic groups until the 70s. Since we're going back over American atrocities our last discussion inspired me to re-read a little on the subject and I found this lovely quote: quote:Undoubtedly, the most infamous example of Euro-American trophy taking in the hemisphere involved a Methodist minister named John Chivington who led an attack on a peaceful band of Cheyenne and their Arapaho allies at Sand Creek, Colorado, in 1864. His troops indiscriminately killed hundreds of men, women, and children and then proceeded to mutilate the bodies of the dead. In addition to removing scalps and severing ears of the dead, one soldier cut the scrotum off one of the corpses declaring that he was in need of a new tobacco pouch. Chivignton would later appear on a DenverOpera House stage where he regaled theatre audiences during an intermission with his account of the battle and his display of over 100 Indian scalps, including the pubic hairs of Indian women which evoked the cheers of throngs (Hoig 1961; Sand 2004; Smith 1865; Thomas 2000; Weatherford 1988).
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Dec 12, 2015 05:06
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ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:They gave the one of their incomplete Hipper class heavy cruisers. That's pretty cutting-edge. Without main guns, at a massive markup, and all the manuals were in German. That's pretty loving cold. I mean, when you look at the whole period (albeit with the benefit of hindsight) between '39 and '41 you can understand why Stalin had a complete breakdown when the Nazis launched Barbarossa. They played him so loving hard. FAUXTON fucked around with this message at 05:08 on Dec 12, 2015 |
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Dec 12, 2015 05:06
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TheLovablePlutonis posted:Stalin abandoning Molotov-Ribbentrop as soon as he knew he could march to Germany with less resistance (especially if there's a heavy front on France leaving the East open) is quite likely.
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Dec 12, 2015 05:22
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chitoryu12 posted:For anyone else interested in the thread (where I post photo reviews of military rations and further information on military feeding), head over here!
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Dec 12, 2015 05:32
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Mirificus posted:I can provide some content from Feeding Nelson's Navy for your military rations thread if that would be of interest. The book goes into great detail about British naval rations during the Georgian era. Absolutely! Literally any period of history or nation is part of the discussion.
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Dec 12, 2015 05:42
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HEY GAL posted:we were sterilizing people of the wrong ethnic groups until the 70s. When you mean "wrong ethnic groups" you mean we should have been sterilizing the English the entire time, right?
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Dec 12, 2015 05:45
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Raenir Salazar posted:I want a 30YW survivor horror game now for some reason... You're gonna have to get behind my Leningrad winter of 42' idea.
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Dec 12, 2015 05:56
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HEY GAL posted:we were sterilizing people of the wrong ethnic groups until the 70s. Israel had been providing Depo shots to African Jews under the guise of routine vaccinations/vitamin shots until, well... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/feb/28/ethiopian-women-given-contraceptives-israel http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/israel-admits-ethiopian-women-were-given-birth-control-shots.premium-1.496519 Racism is a drat disease.
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Dec 12, 2015 05:58
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Cyrano4747 posted:Based on what? Where are you getting this info that Stalin invading Germany was highly likely? I'm far from an expert on Soviet Russia but everything I've read about it In the 30s points to huge interior development pushes. gently caress they didn't even have pushing for world revolution at that point. Stalin was me socialism in one country after all. It's all gay black Stalin territory. I wrote my undergrad historiography paper on the Soviet response to Barbarossa and the idea of a Soviet attack on Germany is just not something that's supported with any sources we have available. There's plenty of wehraboos that will tell you that Soviet units moving to consolidate the new border were evidence of Soviet aggression. 
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Dec 12, 2015 06:38
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does anyone know of a site where i can get good hi-res blueprints of american civil war cannons? im building a 3d model of a model 1841 smoothbore 6-pounder cannon from the period and i cant find good reference. i was hoping some of the folks in this thread could point me towards some good resources?
Kanine fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Dec 12, 2015 |
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