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Proposition Joe posted:Jakku was well done and they succeeded in making it feel like it's own thing. It was distinct from Tatooine, but let's not pretend it's memorable for anything more than the Star Destroyer wrecks dotted across the surface
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Dec 19, 2015 09:08
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When the prequels came out, was there the sentiment that "They should have just remade the original trilogy with updated graphics"?
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Dec 19, 2015 09:09
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Nobody could decide how to pronounce Jakku. Jack-ouu?
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Dec 19, 2015 09:09
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I thought it was clearly supposed to be pronounced like Baku, capital of Azerbaijan.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:10
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Josh Lyman posted:When the prequels came out, was there the sentiment that "They should have just remade the original trilogy with updated graphics"? Given they did literally that a few years earlier, no, not really.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:11
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NTRabbit posted:It was distinct from Tatooine, but let's not pretend it's memorable for anything more than the Star Destroyer wrecks dotted across the surface The culture of the place is much different than Tatooine. The people are much poorer, more desperate, and the whole place has a dystopian feel to it.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:12
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Proposition Joe posted:The culture of the place is much different than Tatooine. The people are much poorer, more desperate, and the whole place has a dystopian feel to it. You must have read accompanying literature to get that much out of it, all I got were poor schlubs salvaging scrap on a ball of sand, there wasn't enough explanation of any kind to let the place have a visible culture, and it spent more time on screen than any other world.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:15
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Tatooine was a shithole but at the end of the day people could still put blue milk on the table and didn't have to stand in line for rations.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:19
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Proposition Joe posted:Tatooine was a shithole but at the end of the day people could still put blue milk on the table and didn't have to stand in line for rations. Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:22
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NTRabbit posted:Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape. It's a sad wasteland full of scavengers, I'm not sure what you expected
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Dec 19, 2015 09:26
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NTRabbit posted:Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape. You got to see the day in the life of an average resident of Jakku, a girl named Rey.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:28
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Tatooine was an undefined sand planet with two suns where people struggled to survive, Jakku was an undefined sand planet with one sun where people struggled to survive. Quite different. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 09:31 on Dec 19, 2015 |
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Dec 19, 2015 09:28
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NTRabbit posted:Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape. Maybe if you're not paying attention. What about the scene with the old woman and the silent realization of the unbreaking lineage of indentured servitude on the planet? What about the fact that Rey has to live out in the wastes in an AT-AT husk? What about her having to turn in parts for ever-decreasing amounts of rations?—company stores, anyone? Caedar fucked around with this message at 09:37 on Dec 19, 2015 |
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Dec 19, 2015 09:28
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Jakku isn't anywhere close to as cultured as Tatooine but it isn't supposed to be. It's a dump where the only notable thing that happened there was a battle that left garbage strewn across miles of empty landscape that eats up metal for dinner or whatever. It's what makes the fact that Rey was left there all the more pitiful. What a lovely planet to call home.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:29
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NTRabbit posted:Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape. That there is no defined culture on Jakku does not diminish the existence of a social structure, which was on full display and clearly defines Rey's character. Rey is the strongest of all three new "main" characters precisely because Jakku is so distinctive.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:30
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NTRabbit posted:Yes, and Jakku has... nothing about it at all. There was no culture on display, just a landscape. .. Yes it did? Like straight-up it plainly showed it was a scavanger culture not a thriving civilization. Every single shot in the area focused on that, even the joke shots like someone diving out the SECOND a TIE Fighter crashed to start looting it. It's presented as a desperate hellhole where everyone is struggling to gain the approval of a scant few. This is nothing like Tatooine which is presented as a kinda lovely but overall functioning desert planet (in the original films) and a weird slave hub (in the prequel). Jakku is one of the better-defined planets in the Star Wars films. From the time spent there we have a really clear idea of what the hell is up with it and what kind of place it is.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:30
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Zodack posted:It's a sad wasteland full of scavengers, I'm not sure what you expected Just pointing out it's a not too great copy of Tatooine. Both desert planets to start the story, but in the same amount of time that TFA takes to explain essentially nothing, ANH does a good job of conveying frontier farm, on a frontier planet, with the wealth controlled by criminals of various shades. A symptom of Abrams.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:30
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NTRabbit posted:Just pointing out it's a not too great copy of Tatooine. Both desert planets to start the story, but in the same amount of time that TFA takes to explain essentially nothing, ANH does a good job of conveying frontier farm, on a frontier planet, with the wealth controlled by criminals of various shades. Oh. So you're just going to yell "Abrams!!!" and ignore what is actually in the film. Gotcha.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:32
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I loved the movie overall, it's truly what I'd hoped it would be. I must say, I really wanted Greg Gruenwald to be Porkins 2.0. Instead he does nothing and just made me super-aware that JJ Abrams was directing. A really minor qualm, I admit. Also, I'm predicting a Poe Dameron spinoff announcement any day now. They need to fill up one of those Disney-branded dump trucks with mousebucks and drive it on over to Oscar Isaac's house.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:33
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I saw this on Thursday evening, but it's taken me this long to catch up with the thread. Anyway: it was loving amazing. Easily my film of the year. There were a couple of problems. If JJ Abrams has proved one thing in his career it's that he doesn't really care that much about plot, and focuses everything on the characters. This is still true in TFA - the plot moves by extremely, and a little too, quickly, and there isn't much worldbuilding. For instance, on Jakku, we never get any kind of feeling for how big the settlement that Rey works at is, or what it's name is or anything. Compare that to Mos Eisley. However, that's forgiven because - as per JJ's strengths - the characterisation was absolutely fantastic. Boyega was incredible as Finn, I basically want him in every film possible now. He might be the most likeable character in all of Star Wars now. Harrison Ford was surprisingly fantastic - I was ready to see another sleepwalking performance like everything we've seen out of him for the last 15 years, but he really reminded us all of why we all liked him in the first place. His death scene was the absolute highlight of the film, beautifully shot, included an homage to the end of ESB for the whole "poetry" thing, and filled with incredible pathos from Ford and Adam Driver. Like everyone else it seems, I was blown away by Kylo Ren. I wonder if his character is intended as a "gently caress you" to Lucas, because he simply embarrasses George. Ren is everything that Anakin should have been, and it's a revelation to see a similar character actually done well. He makes the reams and reams of insane apologia about Anakin written in this thread and the previous one look laughable. Another thing I liked - the final Ren/Finn/Rey sabre battle in the forest was a call back to SW's samurai roots, and their common setting of a snowy bamboo forest for fights. Only since they had lightsabres instead of samurai swords they could cut through whole trees instead of stalks of bamboo. Oh, and for anyone still having trouble with the relationships between the New Republic, the First Order and the Resistance, here's a useful analogy: First Order = ISIS, New Republic = USA, Resistance = Kurdish fighters or the "good" Syrian rebels, Republic fleet = US drone fleet. Volunteers like Leia have also joined the Resistance, though presumably most of its members are people directly effected by the First Order. I doubt this is an intended allegory (did ISIS even exist when they started writing this film?), but it's useful for understanding the organisation.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:34
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Frackie Robinson posted:Why does the Resistance exist as a distinct entity from the Republic? Maybe I'm being dense because I watched the same movie you did and don't have any grasp of this. The Resistance are the Flying Tigers of WW2. They are helping the poor people getting trodden by Imperial Japan, but not in a big enough way to cause the USA to be seen to be directly supporting the conflict. ...and then Pearl Harbour happens. I suspect the next movie is going to the first 6 months of the Pacific war, ending in Midway. Comstar fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Dec 19, 2015 |
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Dec 19, 2015 09:35
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well why not posted:Also, I'm predicting a Poe Dameron spinoff announcement any day now. They need to fill up one of those Disney-branded dump trucks with mousebucks and drive it on over to Oscar Isaac's house. Even if dude is godawful in X-Mens Apocalypse at least he's got this to forever fall back on.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:35
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Comrade Fakename posted:I saw this on Thursday evening, but it's taken me this long to catch up with the thread. Anyway: it was loving amazing. Easily my film of the year. We do get a sense of the scale, Finn provides an entire aerial view from atop a hill when he arrives. And I really don't think a name is at all important given what it was compared to what Mos Eisley is. Where ever she worked was simply a terrible labor shithole where she went to get food for junk so she could live an extra day inside her AT-AT wreck. I'm not sure that warrants a name, unlike Mos Eisley which is one of the largest cities on Tattooine iirc
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Dec 19, 2015 09:37
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Oscar Isaac doesn't need anything to fall back on he is one of the best actors working in Hollywood right now.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:38
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ImpAtom posted:Oh. So you're just going to yell "Abrams!!!" and ignore what is actually in the film. Gotcha. No I'm not. I didn't think it was a great movie, and it just happens that the reasons are very similar to why I hated the new Trek movies. Prior to these I had no opinion of Abrams, now I feel it's a trend.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:38
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The Middle East existed when they started writing this film. 
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Dec 19, 2015 09:39
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NTRabbit posted:No I'm not. I didn't think it was a great movie, and it just happens that the reasons are very similar to why I hated the new Trek movies. Prior to these I had no opinion of Abrams, now I feel it's a trend. Yes, but you're pretty much objectively wrong. Here are a few things established about Jakku: It was the site of a gigantic battle and the wreckage of that battle still litters and defines the environment to the point where almost every bit of economic power we see on the planet comes from scavanging. There's no real sign of natural growth or farming or anything of the sort and the ration controls appear to be pretty strict The power is in the hands of a few elites who have no problem with oppressing the underclass but it is not a slave culture but something more insidious. The rations are handed out basically based on whatever the rich owners think they can get away with. Because of the combination of the two it's effectively a very predatory culture. Everyone we encounter on Jakku is a scavenger looking for the maximum profit they can turn. We're shown this repeated and every bit of set design emphasizes this. There's direct comparisons to the Jawas to be made but Jakku is effectively a planet where Jawa-style scavenging and trading has eclipsed everything else. There's little in the way of leisure or culture because nobody can afford it. Unlike Tatooine which was a relatively stable planet Jakku is a true shithole. You're not getting anyone going to Toshi Station to pick up Power Converters because instead these people are just eeking out their days in wrecks trying to find something worthwhile enough to survive another day. The ideas are very clearly set up and communicated and you just ignored it. None of this is subtext it is presented plainly onscreen. Pretending like they didn't explain anything because they didn't have a cantina scene is ridiculous. You're free to dislike the film if you don't like it but you're pretty wrong when you claim they didn't develop the planet. Frankly they spent more time on developing Jakku then they did on things they probably should have. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 09:48 on Dec 19, 2015 |
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Dec 19, 2015 09:44
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Mad Max: Fury Road takes place almost entirely on Jakku.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:46
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ImpAtom posted:Oh. So you're just going to yell "Abrams!!!" and ignore what is actually in the film. Gotcha. For real. Learn how to watch movies you nerds. Jakku is one of he better presented planets; loved the imperial ruins, the various scavenger creatures, and the overall desolation. One of my favorite bits was that sequence when Rey gets her first ration and we see her go about the end of her day on Jakku. No dialogue, no action...just a nice quiet moment on a new planet with a new character we've just been introduced to.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:49
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ImpAtom posted:Yes, but you're pretty much objectively wrong. And what's even more interesting is that even the "elites" on this planet are poor as poo poo compared to the rich on Tatooine. The parts barterer needed to save up money to get the Millennium Falcon. There aren't crime lords on Jakku like on Tatooine because there's basically nothing on Jakku worth taking over or exploiting. The labor for what industries (see: scavenging) are still on the planet is so drat cheap, since everyone's working for subsistence pay, that kidnapping and selling slaves probably isn't even worth it.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:51
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Pretending that Jakku wasn't fleshed out enough is pretty dishonest or ignorant. We spend about an hour cutting back to it. We see the economy, the wildlife, the locals, the resources and the mindset of the people who live there. Almost every lead character spends time on Jakku, or has a link to it. Tell me what the people of Naboo, Alderaan or Mustafar are like? Or tell me about the details of any space movie planet that is more detailed? Aside from Pandora in Avatar, I'm drawing a blank.
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Dec 19, 2015 09:55
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We only see one settlement on Jakku, one that was probably built especially for salvagers. There may be more to the rest of the planet.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:12
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Kurzon posted:We only see one settlement on Jakku, one that was probably built especially for salvagers. There may be more to the rest of the planet. We see two settlements, including the one that is attacked at the start.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:14
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I liked that the weird forest temple bar seemed less like it was inhabited by locals and more as though the planet was pretty empty and dudes just came out from space to hang there. They were obviously invoking the Mos Eisley Cantina but it felt more like it was a roadside pitstop than a seedy crime hovel, between the emptiness of the rest of the planet and just the general atmosphere of the place.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:21
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Linguica posted:I love that Abrams took a perfectly understandable bad guy weapon from ANH (big thing that flies around and blows stuff up) and made it totally incomprehensible (even bigger thing that... sits there? And somehow fires a laser shotgun through hyperspace or something? And then recharges by sucking up a star? And then it must have to move at some point because now the star is dead? Idk) I didn't think it was incomprehensible. It can fire multiple lasers capable of destroying planets at the same time. It's a planet turned into a space station (the geological equivalent of a cyborg) that fuels itself with stars. That's why it's called the Starkiller. Well, one of the reasons lol. But yeah it was a really sweet and interesting weapon. Frackie Robinson posted:It seems wrong for the movie to introduce a weapon of that magnitude and have it basically be an afterthought. It blows up a planet that we know nothing about, whose loss doesn't really even register for any of our main characters. The Resistance seemingly has been asleep at the wheel while the massive undertaking of its construction has taken place, and yet the solution falls in their lap and in movie time the destroy it within about an hour of learning of its existence. Plug, the dogfight when they're trying to blow up the shield feels completely divorced from what's going with our main characters. I like Poe, but we really haven't spent enough time with him to care what he's up to while we're switching between him and the other pilots and Rey, Finn, et. al. You really could have taken the whole thing out and not have significantly altered the arc of the movie, since Luke is the real MacGuffin The loss registers a gently caress of a lot more than Alderaan did in ANH. Alderand's instantly vaporized while we watch from high orbit, and we get Obi-Wan's concerned poetry. In TFA you see the surface of the planet and everyone's fear, and we're told why the planet's important, because it's the capital of the Republic or something.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:31
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teagone posted:Adam Driver is a pretty unique looking individual. - Adam Driver's mom
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Dec 19, 2015 10:35
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My favorite part of the movie is probably how it shits right into the expanded universe's mouth. I thought the EU was stupid ever since I was like 12. (That doesn't include Knights of the Old Republic which might as well be one of the movies).
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Dec 19, 2015 10:39
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Jewel Repetition posted:My favorite part of the movie is probably how it shits right into the expanded universe's mouth. I thought the EU was stupid ever since I was like 12. (That doesn't include Knights of the Old Republic which might as well be one of the movies). same I mean, I still read a bunch of the bigger ones just because I was desperate for more star wars at that age but it's almost uniformly bad. I think the Dark Empire comics were my favorite bit.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:45
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I remember at the end of the Yuuzhan Vong arc, the writers decided that the dark side was just an illusion and that everyone could use force lightning.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:52
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teagone posted:Adam Driver is a pretty unique looking individual.
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Dec 19, 2015 10:55
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