|
I think it was a little goofy how quickly Rey picked up on things but I really don't care too much because this is Star Wars and also a 2.5 hour long-ish movie which I enjoyed pretty much all of
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 15:25 |
|
|
Holy poo poo!! Phil Tippet studios came in and re-did the chess scene by hand!!! https://vimeo.com/149357656 EDIT: JJ Abrams is God and its a shame he cant direct the next two.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:21
|
|
|
Vintersorg posted:Holy poo poo!! Haha, that's awesome. I'm actually glad JJ decided not to direct the next one. I feel like jump starting this franchise alone is a huge enough undertaking, and doing another one he might risk burning out and end up making another Into Darkness. He's made his mark on Star Wars and that'll do. Plus, the OT was directed by 3 different individuals and look how that trilogy turned out! 
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:29
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:People might think that she's a Mary Sue because she's a millennial who gets a job offer. Episode 8 is going to open with Luke telling Rey that the position of Padawan requires at least 20 years of meditation experience
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:34
|
|
|
teagone posted:the OT was directed by 3 different individuals and look how that trilogy turned out! A quality hill? 
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:34
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:People might think that she's a Mary Sue because she's a millennial who gets a job offer. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:35
|
|
|
Motto posted:A quality hill? Better a quailty hill than like a steep rear end loving slope going downward into a canyon lol.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:38
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:It's true that is the most unrealistic part of the film by far. No, the most unrealistic part is that she turned it down.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:39
|
|
|
I don't really care this much about other movies to notice, but There seems to have been a lot of interesting lines or shots that were used in the trailer but not in the movie. I understand stuff gets cut for pacing or time or whatever, but the exchange between Maz and Rey I was super interested in and it never showed up. "Who are you?" "I'm no one." I still think it would be great if Rey did not have anything close to a notable lineage, but I guess we'll see.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:45
|
|
|
The foreshadowing on Rey's lineage seems so blatantly obviously tied to Luke that I'm willing to bet her parents are entirely unrelated to any of the main characters. At least, that's my hope. Having her be Rey Skywalker just makes the movie feel smaller to me.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:48
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:People might think that she's a Mary Sue because she's a millennial who gets a job offer. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:48
|
|
|
Rey could be adopted, I guess. She might might not be Skywalker blood, but considering she had visions or dreams about both Kylo's slaughter and Luke's exact location (the island in the ocean), she almost certainly has some link to Luke.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:51
|
|
|
Neurolimal posted:The foreshadowing on Rey's lineage seems so blatantly obviously tied to Luke that I'm willing to bet her parents are entirely unrelated to any of the main characters. To me, the obvious parallel is Luke being Obi-Wan to Rey's Luke: his failure as a teacher led to his pupil turning to the dark side, and Rey being sent off to live in seclusion as a consequence of that. No familial connection required.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:52
|
|
|
Motto posted:This isn't really related to the conversation at hand, but how would you describe the phenomenon where a film fails to line or live up to the version generated in one's mind through praise by other individuals and culture as a whole? I enjoy the OT, but it doesn't live up the cultural ideal of Star Wars as the perfect adventure story, each character an instantly enrapturing, quintessential example of their type, embroiled in unforgettable action. Similar to what you described, I think the flaws stick out more because when watching them, I can't help but be constantly seeking the flawless movies I've been told they (or at least one or two) are. When you're glossing over the flaws of a loved movie/whatever, it's nostalgia. When something feels worse than it is because you/society set the expectations too high it's hype backlash, the nail in the coffin of sequels everywhere and also a big issue when you go back to watch things that got pumped up by nostalgia. It's why when recommending shows to people I try to avoid "oh I LOVE that show!" comments because there's no way it's gonna live up. Bruceski fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Dec 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:54
|
|
|
Motto posted:Rey could be adopted, I guess. She might might not be Skywalker blood, but considering she had visions or dreams about both Kylo's slaughter and Luke's exact location (the island in the ocean), she almost certainly has some link to Luke. It could be something like Quinlin Vos. He can see "memories" of an object by touching it. This wouldn't explain how she could see what she saw exactly, since the visions happened way after he lost the saber, but maybe it's still linked to him somehow? The Force? I think the fact that Lucas isn't in charge is the best change we have of Rey not being a Skywalker. Anakin wasn't related to anyone and he did okay for himself. I'm ignoring the possibility of Plaguis immaculately conceptioning him into existence.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:55
|
|
|
Neurolimal posted:The foreshadowing on Rey's lineage seems so blatantly obviously tied to Luke that I'm willing to bet her parents are entirely unrelated to any of the main characters. The movies haven't ever really been big in that sense. Luke is the son of the Emperor's enforcer, who is also the former pupil of his teacher. He encounters a princess who is revealed to be his twin sister. She later confesses her love to Luke's smuggler buddy upon the floating city owned by the smuggler's best friend, who later becomes the hero of the space battle of RotJ, the other two battles resolved by the previously mentioned characters.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 05:58
|
|
|
The thing about the PT is that it could've led strongly into the sequel trilogy if Lucas had stuck with his original plot for Jar Jar. I know you can't explicitly prove it or he hasn't confirmed or denied it ex cathedra but there's tons of evidence stacking up. The suspicious moments from TPM, Count Dooku being written into Ep 2 out of nowhere, Lucas' and the Best's (the VA) statements give context too even though they're not outright. Darth Binks being used here as a reminder of the creeping nature of the Dark Side would be a great supporting idea in the sequel trilogy. But since Lucas bitched out on it after the backlash from TPM I don't think anyone wants to go near that tire fire of a character. Bongo Bill posted:People might think that she's a Mary Sue because she's a millennial who gets a job offer. Star Rekt
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:03
|
|
This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!
|
zelah posted:I think the fact that Lucas isn't in charge is the best change we have of Rey not being a Skywalker. Anakin wasn't related to anyone and he did okay for himself. While not by bloodline, he was forced into several roles of importance. Both by the plot that necessitated he be Darth Vader, and the forces within the films: the Order that insisted he be the Jedi's Chosen One, and the tempter that desired and groomed him as the perfect Apprentice.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:03
|
|
|
The real reason why some people think Rey is a Mary Sue is because she's about as competent as your average movie protagonist while also having a vagina. It's just not believable, you see.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:08
|
|
|
Timeless Appeal posted:2) I feel like quite a few of the naysayers actually have been people who defend the prequel Could you point to who? The people who immediately jump to my mind are SMg (who hasn't seen the film but has stated that he thinks people are being unfair by not talking more deeply about it), Cnut (who also doesn't seem to have seen the film and continues prequel discussion) and Hbomberguy (who hasn't appeared in this thread). I also have defended the prequels but I loved TFA. This also seems like a really easy way to be dismissive of people (as if they are only being contrarian or just have bad taste in general).
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:08
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:People might think that she's a Mary Sue because she's a millennial who gets a job offer. This is probably the best quote in the entire thread.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:14
|
|
|
I don't have problems with Fin or Rey I have problems with literally everything else. Strange how that goes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:17
|
|
|
quote:Also, Yoda training literally all the Jedi when they were little kids... that's not okay at all. Yoda is wise and awesome, not some elementary school teacher. I'm seeing a consistent theme here. People who hate the prequels tend to really, really, really think poorly of children. What the hell do you have against elementary school teachers? Elementary school teachers are among the nicest, most patient, and most awesome people I know. Taking the time and effort to pass knowledge on to the next generation is exactly what someone as wise and awesome as Yoda would see as his responsibility. Guy A. Person posted:Could you point to who? For the record, I'm seeing it this week when I go home for Christmas. I know, I'm not a true Star Wars fan. I told my little siblings I'd see it with them and I figured I might as well just wait since I pretty much know what's going to happen already. Cnut the Great fucked around with this message at 08:48 on Dec 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:19
|
|
|
CalmDownMate posted:I don't have problems with Fin or Rey I have problems with literally everything else. Strange how that goes. I'm not surprised.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:19
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:The important part about Midichlorians isn't that they existed. It's that the Jedi Order believed they existed. Similarly, how do you think Yoda became wise if not by making mistakes such as brainwashing children and starting the Clone War? Karen Traviss fan spotted.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:22
|
|
|
On rewatch of Return of the Jedi and Empire Strikes Back, Obi-Wan and Yoda are both not only wrong about everything but also incredibly petty. Oh our last hope went out when we said he wasn't ready? Better not pick up the force phone when he calls after surviving the harrowing ordeal we inflicted on him by obfuscating the truth in the hope he'd fix our mistakes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:27
|
|
|
The Jedi weren't the villains, they were just bad. There's a difference.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:27
|
|
|
The only reason they didn't tell him the truth is because they invented the truth for the second film.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:35
|
|
|
A thought that came to me while watching the RLM review of TFA: many of the messages of the prequels were communicated to detractors, just not in the intended fashion. People who dislike the prequels generally believe that they're earnestly presenting their surface or assumed narratives (the Jedi were a great order silenced by cunning trickery, Anakin was a pure, kindly, noble warrior until suddenly seduced), failed in that, and as such audiences reject them, ironically arriving at the correct conclusions: the ways of the prequel Jedi were wrong and the cause of their downfall, Anakin was an unbalanced, broken person, his issues stupidly unaddressed and taken advantage of by Palpatine, etc. I don't personally believe the prequels are good films, but it's interesting that even in failure, the intended messages came across. Motto fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Dec 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:36
|
|
|
Motto posted:A thought that came to me while watching the RLM review of TFA: many of the messages of the prequels were communicated to detractors, just not in the intended fashion. People who dislike the prequels generally believe that they're earnestly presenting their surface or assumed narratives (the Jedi were a great order silenced by cunning trickery, Anakin was a pure, kindly, noble warrior until suddenly seduced), failed in that, and as such audiences reject them, ironically arriving at the correct conclusions: the ways of the prequel Jedi were wrong and the cause of their downfall, Anakin was an unbalanced, broken person, his issues stupidly unaddressed and taken advantage of by Palpatine, etc. Yeah the RLM reviews are fascinating that way. I swear at one point he gets really really close to saying SMg's theory that Jar Jar is the intended protagonist: he points out that there isn't another suitable protagonist, he point out the parallels between the beginning of TPM and ANH, he even has Lucas on camera saying "Jar Jar is the key to everything". He just never takes it that far. There are tons of instances like that, where they basically answer their own questions, or ignore the obvious answer. Another favorite (pointed out in the last thread) is when they ask "why would a trade federation want to block trade" which is roughly like asking "why would a worker's union want to stop working".
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:49
|
|
|
Barudak posted:On rewatch of Return of the Jedi and Empire Strikes Back, Obi-Wan and Yoda are both not only wrong about everything but also incredibly petty. Oh our last hope went out when we said he wasn't ready? Better not pick up the force phone when he calls after surviving the harrowing ordeal we inflicted on him by obfuscating the truth in the hope he'd fix our mistakes. To be fair, they explicitly tell him, "Dude, if you do this you're gonna get hosed up and we can't help you, so don't come crying to us" and then that's exactly what he does. So...not wrong.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 06:54
|
|
|
Barudak posted:On rewatch of Return of the Jedi and Empire Strikes Back, Obi-Wan and Yoda are both not only wrong about everything but also incredibly petty. Oh our last hope went out when we said he wasn't ready? Better not pick up the force phone when he calls after surviving the harrowing ordeal we inflicted on him by obfuscating the truth in the hope he'd fix our mistakes. Obi-Wan is dead tho so he's doing a pretty good job considering. Like don't complain if he's not always the most prompt or accurate mentor, he is doing his best okay? He literally came back from the dead to help out what more do you want?!
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:03
|
|
|
Phylodox posted:To be fair, they explicitly tell him, "Dude, if you do this you're gonna get hosed up and we can't help you, so don't come crying to us" and then that's exactly what he does. So...not wrong. That is fair, but they're not exactly acting in good faith here. They not only tell him to let his friends die, they also won't tell him why they don't want him to face Vader yet. Sure, it makes sense why they'd cut off support given they made it clear what their conditions of support were, but it does nothing but re-enforce that the Jedi are completely wrong in how they perceive and interact with the universe at large. Don't forget, they follow this up with telling Luke in ROTJ that if he isn't willing to kill his father he isn't going to succeed. Which is not only wrong, but literally one of the eventualities the Emperor is completely ok with. Barudak fucked around with this message at 07:07 on Dec 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:04
|
|
|
Cnut the Great posted:I'm seeing a consistent theme here. People who hate the prequels tend to really, really, really think poorly of children. I wound up sitting next to a 4 year old during TFA who asked questions every three seconds while his dad spent the entire movie impotently trying to shush him. Now I understand how Anakin could bring himself to kill younglings, so in a way my disdain for children has slightly improved the prequels for me.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:06
|
|
|
Barudak posted:They not only tell him to let his friends die, they also won't tell him why they don't want him to face Vader yet. Sure, it makes sense why they'd cut off support given they said that, but it does nothing but re-enforce that the Jedi are completely wrong in how they perceive and interact with the universe at large. Actually, they say that his friends might die, but if he goes, he'll endanger everything they've fought for. And his friends escaped just fine without his help, but had to turn back to rescue his dumb rear end. So, again...not wrong.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:08
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:The important part about Midichlorians isn't that they existed. It's that the Jedi Order believed they existed. Similarly, how do you think Yoda became wise if not by making mistakes such as brainwashing children and starting the Clone War? For my part I still don't get why even prequel defenders have such a hard time accepting midi-chlorians. People say it's because it made the Force quantifiable and less mystical, but the Force was already quantifiable. In ROTJ, Luke tells Leia the Force runs strong in his family. What do you think that line means? It means there are families where the Force does not run as strong. There is a greater quantity of Force strength in the Skywalker bloodline than there is in most other bloodlines. And why can't there be some aspects of a system of spirituality that are quantifiable? Ever heard of karma? According to religions which believe in karma, your spiritual standing in your current life is in large part predetermined by the amount of karma you've accumulated in past lives. Every person in the world is born with a certain amount of karma held over from their previous life. If you were a really good person in your past life, you're going to be at a spiritual advantage compared to someone who was kind of a lovely person in their past life. Is this unfair? I don't think it's any more unfair than one person being inherently better at basketball than another person. If everyone gets an infinite number of chances, and everyone is all part of the same universal energy field anyway, why does it matter if some people happen to better at certain things than other people? We're all going to the same place. It doesn't matter. The whole point is that our physical forms are just temporary manifestations of a greater, unified truth. And what about chakras? Chakras are spiritual energy nodes which are located at specific, physical locations within the body, and are believed by yogic practitioners to be intimately connected with the health of various biological systems and bodily organs. They're spiritual energy structures often described in terms of being spoked wheels, which suck in prana (or "life force") from an omnipresent energy field and distribute it throughout the physical body. The chakras act as mediators between the physical body (or "gross body") and the non-physical body (or "subtle body"), and ultimately form part of what is called shakti, or the universal cosmic life force, which manifests itself as a god-like intelligence permeating all of existence. Sounds an awful lot like what midi-chlorians do, huh? This also ties into the distinction Lucas makes between the Cosmic Force and the Living Force in the Star Wars series. Eastern religions, as compared to Western religions, seem to be much more at ease with blurring the lines between the physical and the spiritual. The Force is meant to encompass aspects of all spiritual traditions, not just the ones your own education and upbringing has made you prone to identifying with. None of it's literal or real, anyway (not even the actual religious stuff). It's all just metaphors. Cnut the Great fucked around with this message at 07:23 on Dec 22, 2015 |
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:17
|
|
|
I like the interpretations of the force with karma & chakra, except neither of those are little space bugs that live in your blood. Your chakra nodes do correspond to physical parts of your body, but there is not actually a physical presence there, its more about how your energy flows and poo poo through your body. Its not like they think, when massaging or pressuring some node or putting magnets on it, that an organ is being manipulated. I would prefer it if it were more like chakra, and the force simply 'flows through' people better, ya know? Why does Qui-gon use some sort of sensor to be like 'Wow you're crawling with space bugs' when he, as a jedi master, could have meditated on it and seen his aura. Or simply, upon seeing Anakin, being like 'Woah I need to take a knee, this kids got tons of force flowing all throughout his nodes, jesus christ'
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:24
|
|
|
Cnut the Great posted:For my part I still don't get why even prequel defenders have such a hard time accepting midi-chlorians. There's no problem with midichlorians. But the emphasis on a symbiont that bestows you psychic powers is a character flaw for this reason: they're at best a symbol for, an example of, the actual message of the Force as a philosophy. It's the Order's preoccupation with the fact that they can see the future and do sweet backflips, at the expense of their awareness that all life is bound together. They focus on the part that can be measured empirically, and the power that it can bring them, instead of learning anything from the midichlorians.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:36
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:The Jedi weren't the villains, they were just bad. There's a difference. From my point of view the Jedi are evil.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 15:25 |
|
|
The idea of conscious, sentient beings living inside you is also just kinda icky. Are they watching me in my..........private moments....?
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2015 07:39
|
|
