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Augus posted:It comes down to poor filmmaking, the prequels convey their intended message but in such a clumsy way that it seems to be due to incompetence rather than design. (Un)fortunately, you do get that development if you watch the Clone Wars shows.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:07
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hiddenriverninja posted:(Un)fortunately, you do get that development if you watch the Clone Wars shows. I liked the Clone Wars cartoon but it barely felt like the same characters TBH, though I still thought Anakin was an annoying piece of poo poo, just in a different way (being a cocky rear end in a top hat instead of a whiny brat)
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Dec 22, 2015 16:18
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Freakazoid_ posted:The force is no longer subtle, but forthright. Gee WHY WOULD THAT BE.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:29
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AndyElusive posted:Hyperspace travel only exists in Star Wars to allow writers to move characters from one location in the story to another location in a cool sci-fi way. There's no actual science behind it. Please don't be the kind of Star Wars fan to use information on Wookiepedia to source reasons for why making the jump to lightspeed and dropping out of hyperspace inside a shield wouldn't work and I wont be the kind of Star Wars fan who tells you to shut the gently caress up about it. I was making a joke about being that guy.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:29
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EL BROMANCE posted:I can see her dividing people, but she won me over quickly i wasn't really into maz as a wacky comedy character until she actually started to say important poo poo to rey and just got on with it, then i was okay with her
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Dec 22, 2015 16:40
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gohmak posted:My 4 year old was awesome and only spoke out "daddy" to remind me to whisper the Raid dudes subtitles. You're a better dad then, good job. One time I had a guy translating an entire movie, both dialog and plot explanations in realtime to his mom. I felt like looking for a remote to hit the SAP button. I noticed that all the Star Wars movies seem to have subtitles for essential alien dialog but then a lot doesn't get it. Is the rest actually able to be translated, like Klingon, or is it usually gibberish like the droid languages? Do the scripts explain the gist any further?
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Dec 22, 2015 16:45
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urseus posted:Fantastic movie. Few things. Eh, it works for me. Obi-Wan Kenobi was an important person to both of them, especially as a couple. They would have never met if not for him, and Leia would be dead. Granted, the same could be said about Luke, but since he's still alive, I can see paying tribute to this nice old man who died to save both of them. ...come to think of it, it would have actually been pretty funny if they'd named him Luke (for the purposes of this movie). Imagine Kylo's real name is Luke (and I guess you cut the scene where he takes his mask off in front of Rey, which you shouldn't do, but go with me), and when Han comes out onto the catwalk, he screams the name "Luke!" instead. Everyone who thought Kylo was Luke Skywalker would have lost their poo poo. Then Han would say, "...the face of my son." And people would have been really confused. I mean, thank God they didn't do that, just funny to think about.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:46
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Hakkesshu posted:I liked the Clone Wars cartoon but it barely felt like the same characters TBH, though I still thought Anakin was an annoying piece of poo poo, just in a different way (being a cocky rear end in a top hat instead of a whiny brat) I found him infinitely more likable. You can disagree on that but him being cocky and a bit arrogant made for a much more interesting downfall and some of the scenes later on that foreshadow his turn to darkness are genuinely heartbreaking. I feel like it gives a much better insight into the character than the movies did. Also Ahsoka becoming disillusioned and leaving the Jedi order did a way better job at showing how the Jedi Order is actually kinda messed up and gives a better understanding of why Anakin would end up turning against them in a worse way. Augus fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 16:46
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Exclamation Marx posted:I saw it today and it was really good, wish it had more politics though. Iko Uwais was right next to him.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:50
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EL BROMANCE posted:I can see her dividing people, but she won me over quickly I feel like I was the only person both showings I went to that laughed at that. Also I counted 3 raid dudes. Small guy talked, main guy was standing directly beside him with devil horn kinda hair, and small knife man from raid 2 was behind them. I think he had part of his face covered.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:50
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I've been reading theories that the planet in the final scene of TFA is Rakata Prime from KOTOR based on cross referencing this map from Disney with R2D2's complete map in the movie This opens up a lot of interesting parallels: - The Starkiller Base draws the sun's energy almost exactly like the Star Forge does in KOTOR. - The Star Forge had to be found by piecing together a star map - Revan had his mind wiped and had to relearn the Force. People are theorizing this could have happened to Rey. - Force Stasis was original to KOTOR and is one of Kylo Ren's prominent powers in TFA. - Bastila is visually very similar to Rey. Obviously there isn't a one-to-one mapping from KOTOR to TFA, but there are a significant amount of similarities which makes me think they used some of KOTOR as inspiration. In KOTOR, Rakata Prime was the home planet of the first known species to develop Hyperdrive technology, as well as being the first force users. This species was eventually wiped out in an unknown event by the dark side of the force. We hear Maz Kanata say in TFA something to the effect of "The enemy is the dark side itself" rather than a specific person. In TFA Rakata Prime is assumed to be the location of the first Jedi Temple. Based on that I think we will get a lot of insight into the nature of the dark side and how it shaped the Jedi/Sith dichotomy we saw in prior episodes. Perhaps we will even see a battle against the dark side itself rather than a specific Sith Lord or evil empire.
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Dec 22, 2015 16:55
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Bargearse posted:I always imagined he'd have a vaguely Latin and pompous sounding first name like Demetrius or something like that. Kit Fisto.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:11
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Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down. Really bummed out. Terrible job, J.J.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:20
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down. Well, that's certainly your opinion to have...but i don't think it's going to be shared by too many other people.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:24
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I don't think I've heard of a group size of 3 people all hating it before. There's a ton of fan service, sure, but did you not notice like... everything else?
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Dec 22, 2015 17:31
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:34
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I know it's practically a meme at this point...but the whole "it's like poetry, it rhymes" really applies here. This is the same Star Wars Galaxy. Similar situations and character archetypes will arise, but they will interact and combine and split in different ways.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:38
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down. So you hated the OT as well I assume?
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Dec 22, 2015 17:38
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:38
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Seph posted:I've been reading theories that the planet in the final scene of TFA is Rakata Prime from KOTOR based on cross referencing this map from Disney with R2D2's complete map in the movie It's not that planet. https://twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/679157923012984834
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Dec 22, 2015 17:41
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Yeah, of all the opinions I've seen around "complete garbage" is a new one on me. Oddly I never really felt pandered to, but I can see how one would. But I mean, it's a sequel to the OT made 30 years later by a whole new director, I can't blame him for playing it a little safe when it comes to reviving the biggest SF/F franchise for a new generation while trying to capture as much of the old one as possible.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:42
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I'm heartened by the callbacks and plot beats to the OT in Episode VII. To me that indicated that VIII and IX will be able to branch out a lot more.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:43
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EL BROMANCE posted:I don't think I've heard of a group size of 3 people all hating it before. There's a ton of fan service, sure, but did you not notice like... everything else? This is the non-spoiler thread so it's hard to express why I didn't like it without giving things away, but the whole movie seemed like Abrams got really excited about making a Star Wars movie and kept putting in things he likes about Star Wars without remembering to write his own story. The response seems to be a weird kind of polarizing where the reviews are overwhelmingly positive and then there's a minority that completely hates it without much between. I think it would have been much better if they had just made their own movie instead of having to constantly remind you that you're watching Star Wars. It felt like a bad fanfiction story that got a billion dollars of movie production thrown at it.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:46
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jivjov posted:I'm heartened by the callbacks and plot beats to the OT in Episode VII. To me that indicated that VIII and IX will be able to branch out a lot more. Definitely agree with this, and I hope VIII and IX are allowed to branch out. Honestly, I think Episode VIII will be a greater challenge to make than Episode VII. They could more or less make Episode VII again and rake in money, but that would be pretty disappointing to watch.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:50
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jivjov posted:I'm heartened by the callbacks and plot beats to the OT in Episode VII. To me that indicated that VIII and IX will be able to branch out a lot more. This is my hope, but that was the same thing I was thinking about Star Trek, that the second one would branch out more and tell its own story, and then that felt even more referential than the first. I'm hoping that won't happen again here and that the first was just using that as a launching pad to get people on board with something familiar. Finn better not get frozen in carbonite.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:50
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Crappy Jack posted:This is my hope, but that was the same thing I was thinking about Star Trek, that the second one would branch out more and tell its own story, and then that felt even more referential than the first. I'm hoping that won't happen again here and that the first was just using that as a launching pad to get people on board with something familiar. Finn better not get frozen in carbonite.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:52
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:This is the non-spoiler thread so it's hard to express why I didn't like it without giving things away, but the whole movie seemed like Abrams got really excited about making a Star Wars movie and kept putting in things he likes about Star Wars without remembering to write his own story. The response seems to be a weird kind of polarizing where the reviews are overwhelmingly positive and then there's a minority that completely hates it without much between. Star Wars: A New Hope was George Lucas going "you know what would be great? The Hidden Fortress but with lasers." It was also his own story. Despite TFA's calling back near-constantly to ANH it is also telling its own story by using the beats from ANH to emphasize and change the events. Kylo Ren is not Darth Vader despite really wanting to be Darth Vader and that alone colors a lot of the story.
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Dec 22, 2015 17:55
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Saw the movie last night, and all three of us agreed that it was complete garbage. Nothing but shameless, pandering bullshit for two and a half hours. Having intentionally avoided any spoilers or really any information about the movie besides that it was being directed by J.J. Abrams, I was going into it without any prejudices and was just completely let down. NoEyedSquareGuy posted:This is the non-spoiler thread so it's hard to express why I didn't like it without giving things away,
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Dec 22, 2015 18:05
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:I think it would have been much better if they had just made their own movie instead of having to constantly remind you that you're watching Star Wars. It felt like a bad fanfiction story that got a billion dollars of movie production thrown at it. At the end of the day though, this is the 7th Star Wars film. It's going to be a Star Wars film regardless.
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Dec 22, 2015 18:28
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NoEyedSquareGuy posted:The response seems to be a weird kind of polarizing where the reviews are overwhelmingly positive and then there's a minority that completely hates it without much between. That's because it is a Star Wars* movie so nobody can just have a lukewarm opinion, they have to either love it or hate it. Nobody's ever like "well I thought it was an enjoyable afternoon at the movies" even though that is 90% of humanity's experience with movies. This includes you and your two pals who thought it was "complete garbage". *I mean, most franchises are like this but SW especially
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Dec 22, 2015 18:48
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icantfindaname posted:Wait a minute was the old guy at the beginning not Luke? lol e: nah you got it, that was Luke and the old guy at the end was Emperor Palpatine, ready to lead us into the gritty second episode of the new tril.
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Dec 22, 2015 18:48
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Just got back. I liked the film and thought it was well-made and good, but it didn't have much of what I personally find interesting about the series thus far. I say 'much of' because there's still some parts that are great and I'm sure I'll remember more with time and probably form a better reading than I have now. The arc of Kylo Ren is 90% of a perfect movie character. There were lots of really great shots, although the slide-cam shots got a little needless and were very un-star wars and the lightsaber fights were shot like your standard Disney Avengers shlock and are worse than any thus far. If you gave a budget to a superior director, or perhaps one who isn't constrained to making a non-12A film for Family Friendly Disney Incorporated, the exact same fight could have looked so much better.
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Dec 22, 2015 18:49
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I think Abrams handles the effects setpieces well, but yeah, his fight choreography is clunky. I couldn't wait for that fistfight in Into Darkness to end.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:14
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I thought the fights were pretty refreshing compared to the spinny acrobatics in the prequels.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:17
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Cacator posted:I thought the fights were pretty refreshing compared to the spinny acrobatics in the prequels. I'm not opposed to something more acrobatic if it's well-executed, the climactic fight in Menace is the best in the series.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:19
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Yeah I liked the fights in TFA. Every instance of hand-to-hand combat looked more like people slugging it out, which is more in line with what we saw in the OT. I mean I liked the fights in the prequels too, but this is supposed to be almost 50 years later, so it makes sense that we don't see much Jedi-like combat.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:20
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Guy A. Person posted:That's because it is a Star Wars* movie so nobody can just have a lukewarm opinion, they have to either love it or hate it. Nobody's ever like "well I thought it was an enjoyable afternoon at the movies" even though that is 90% of humanity's experience with movies. This includes you and your two pals who thought it was "complete garbage". I suppose all the hype is going to lead to that outcome to some extent, but I'm not really all that invested in the Star Wars universe and wasn't looking for it to be ultra-faithful or an instant classic or anything like that. As far as Abrams goes Cloverfield was good and the new Star Trek movies, although typical Hollywood action fluff, were relatively well done. If anything I was expecting to come away with much the same reaction of a 6-7/10, enjoyable film. Instead I got beaten over the head with references to the old movies and all the plot points surrounding those references were weak and poorly paced. Maybe I would like it more if I was seeing it without the context of the original movies. Interesting to see that most people here enjoyed it, if nothing else. There are a whole bunch of people giving it 1-star reviews on IMDB echoing my thoughts for the most part so I don't think I'm alone in thinking it was an objectively bad movie.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:21
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The fight in TFA was Between an untrained non-Jedi wielding a sword like a club and a Stormtrooper, followed by the same untrained dude, a badly injured in-training dude, and a girl whose fighting experience involves beating the poo poo out of people with a staff to survive. It looks exactly how it should. NoEyedSquareGuy posted:Instead I got beaten over the head with references to the old movies I'm really really not clear why you feel it is inappropriate for a Star Wars film to reference old films in new ways. Like a lot of the criticism seems to be "it's a lot like ANH!" Which it is but the references to ANH (and the other parts of the trilogy) largely are because they have something to say about those events. They intentionally subvert or change them even if it's just by swapping the gender of characters involved. It's arguably a fairly hamfisted way to do it but it certainly isn't remotely an objective flaw. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 19:22
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Great movie, unfortunately like others I had the Han thing spoiled thanks to a certain terrible subforum. I was really only super disappointed by the repetitive musical score and the very end with that really corny scene of Rey standing there holding the lightsaber out for Luke while he looks all super cool, I was hoping he would force yank the saber and ignite it and then a smash cut to the credits would've been cool there, but then it does a jarring helicopter spin around them? Other than those couple of things, I genuinely loved every minute. Great action, great humor, and it was just a fine homage to ANH without being TOO egregiously in your face with references. Harrison Ford slipped back into Han's jacket amazingly well and so did Carrie Fisher who did better than I expected with her brief moments in the film. The new cast is super fun too, Boyega and Ridley especially. I can't decide which of them did the best, I feel like they're equal. Oscar Isaac was fun too but he was barely in the movie but I dug his scenes in general. And of course, Kylo Ren is probably the best Star Wars villain I've ever seen in any of the mediums. I'm not entirely sure him being Han and Leia's son added too much to his character aside from having Skywalker blood in him, which I suppose is the point entirely. But, I just loved how human he was. Oh man, the lightsaber fights too. The best in the series, they had so much loving rawness to them and it really felt like they were using weapons and not just waving batons around. I really want to see it again at a regular theater this time, I saw it the imax in 3d and I kind of regret it because I hate 3d but it was my only choice for imax. I'd put it up there as equal to A New Hope which is my second favorite SW movie. Deakul fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 19:22
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I really liked the choreography in the final fight. It did a great job of Contrasting Kylo Ren's admiration of ancient, traditional Sith (and by extension their retarded spinning shadow boxing) with Finn and Rey's inexperienced wild thrashing. It was a great homage to the first Luke-Vader fight, where Luke is fighting wildly while Vader expertly plays with him, but adds to this and Ren's character by having this showmanship (and by extension his admiration of Vader The Legend) backfire on him The camerawork itself was clear and consistent, and the color coordination was gorgeous, as well. Rey and Finn's fighting style being affected by their inexperience and emotion is also way better realized than in the PT; at the end of TPM they dance at each other, Jin gets killed, the young padawan Obi gets really furious and....starts expertly spinning and twirling again. What I can see how someone, especially after the glut of reference-heavy modern schlock, might feel the movie is too fanservice-y, but I felt that they did a great job adding and expanding upon OT moments, like how I already mentioned Han's faith in his son killing him making the same act by Luke to Vader feel like more of a dangerous, faithful, and generally Good act Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 19:25
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