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khy posted:I know it seems pedantic to mock the Starkiller in a universe with the Force and Lightsabers and such, but the thing that gets me is it's INCONSISTENT. If a show/movie/whatever makes a rule then I want it to play by that rule, and not to change the rules whenever it's convenient. If a stormtrooper dies instantly from a shot from the bowcaster while wearing stormtrooper armor, then I want to know why someone who's visibly NOT wearing that armor is still jumping around swordfighting. Is he using other more effective armor? Why not give all the troops more effective armor? Likewise, in one shot the bowcaster is strong enough to send two people flying through the air so why doesn't a point-blank hit from it at least knock a guy off a catwalk? Because The Force. The dude has the ability to stop laser bolts in mid-air. Maybe he started doing that for the bowcaster, but because bowcaster has a lot more force behind it, he wasn't quite able to. He got hit, but managed to not get knocked back.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:55
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Moose King posted:The thing with this is that almost the exact same thing happened in ST09, which nerds DID poo poo all over. Now that that specific nerdrage has been come and gone, when they see it in TFA they just go, "Eh, that's just JJ." Believe me, I was one of the people making GBS threads over it in ST09. Spock watching Vulcan implode STILL makes me sigh and shake my head. It's a goddamn disgrace and I'm glad Gene Roddenberry isn't around to have seen it. I get overly worked up about my space fiction. Other fiction I overlook a lot more but if it's science-fiction I get a LOT more critical about the science. enraged_camel posted:Because The Force. Also, entirely unrelated : I look at your avatar and keep expecting there to be spittle http://i.imgur.com/TivYd1U.webm khy fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 19:56
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euphronius posted:Leia wasn't on her way to Tatooine to see obi wan at all. Wtc. She's looking for a wise old hermit, Obi-Wan's pupil in fact. She sends a pilot to meet an old man on a desert planet about a secret. That's all I'm talking about. It's a similar mission but it's not the same. khy posted:I know it seems pedantic to mock the Starkiller in a universe with the Force and Lightsabers and such, but the thing that gets me is it's INCONSISTENT. If a show/movie/whatever makes a rule then I want it to play by that rule, and not to change the rules whenever it's convenient. If a stormtrooper dies instantly from a shot from the bowcaster while wearing stormtrooper armor, then I want to know why someone who's visibly NOT wearing that armor is still jumping around swordfighting. Is he using other more effective armor? Why not give all the troops more effective armor? Likewise, in one shot the bowcaster is strong enough to send two people flying through the air so why doesn't a point-blank hit from it at least knock a guy off a catwalk? You're nitpicking now. At least your complains about Starkiller Base was grounded in the story, even if you didn't realize it. These are the kinds of complaints that would disappear with a throwaway line about armor or hyperspace bullshit.
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Dec 22, 2015 19:57
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Serf posted:I think it does work, but it sets Luke up to be a really crappy dad. Leaving his daughter to work as a scavenger for some cranky salvage merchant on Jakku is bad. Then again it could be revenge for Obi-Wan ditching him with his uncle on Tatooine while his sister got to live in the lap of luxury on Alderaan. Ok, after some research it seems that the theory could work because there is at least 10 years difference between the characters.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:00
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Just  if you think that Luke isn't going to say, "I am your Father," at some point in the next two movies.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:02
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Re: distances The movie definitely sacrificed the proper sense of the galaxy's scale in favor of its brisk pacing. People get from star system A to star system B so quickly that the whole movie feels like a minor interplanetary feud rather than a galaxy-spanning war. They could have addressed this with just dialogue. For example, in the scene where R2D2 combines its map with that of BB-8 and they figure out Luke's location, someone could have exclaimed, "that's star system X... it will take us three weeks to get there!" and then Leia could have said, "well, only 2 weeks if you take the Millennium Falcon..." and that would have been sufficient. Instead we see Rey and Chewie jumping into hyperspace, and coming out literally seconds later. Feels pretty lame.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:02
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spacetoaster posted:Ok, after some research it seems that the theory could work because there is at least 10 years difference between the characters. Yeah, if Rey was 4-5 years old when she got ditched on Jakku that means a 15-16 year old Kylo Ren would've been responsible for killing off the new Jedi apprentices. Doesn't seem impossible for a Skywalker, especially if the Knight of Ren are other apprentices that he swayed to the dark side.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:03
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If hyperspace is like wormhole travel then near instantaneous travel is exactly what would happen, and there would also be no time dilation. Boom.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:04
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:"THAT'S not how the FORCE works" was an awesome nod to that. It's great because Finn is absolutely right.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:07
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A planet that sucking out the energy of a sun sounds incredibly stupid on paper but I thought it worked well thematically in this film. The whole film is about the new taking over from the old, some parasitically (Kylo Ren) and some in harmony and taking up their elders' legacy (Poe, Finn, Rey).
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Dec 22, 2015 20:10
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khy posted:I swear to god JJ Abrams takes the phrase "Sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" literally, because both this movie and Star Trek have some of the most goddawful science ever.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:10
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I think hyperspace supposed to be less like a wormhole and more like an alternate dimension that lets you go FTL. The answer to time dilation is, per a poorly explained article on Wookieepedia, relativistic shielding.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:13
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I know I brought up the hyperspace thing but I prefer to imagine that Star Wars happens in a fictional universe that I am watching on a screen and therefore we don't have to care.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:14
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stinkles1112 posted:If hyperspace is like wormhole travel then near instantaneous travel is exactly what would happen, and there would also be no time dilation. Boom. THAT'S not how HYPERSPACE works. Actually I was discussing with my coworkers - as a kid I wouldn't have cared if the science is bad, I would have enjoyed it if star trek teleporters were present and the lightsabers could shoot out beams of light, and if people had force-jetpacks to fly through the skies. The older I get the more I tend to pick at the science.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:19
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enraged_camel posted:The movie definitely sacrificed the proper sense of the galaxy's scale in favor of its brisk pacing. People get from star system A to star system B so quickly that the whole movie feels like a minor interplanetary feud rather than a galaxy-spanning war. Please, tell us how you would have done it.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:20
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khy posted:That's NOT how hyperspace works. How does hyperspace work?
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Dec 22, 2015 20:20
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khy posted:THAT'S not how HYPERSPACE works. It's a shame that you understand fiction and storytelling less as you grow older.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:21
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Empress Theonora posted:How does hyperspace work? Psst that's a quote from the movie FYI
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Dec 22, 2015 20:22
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khy posted:THAT'S not how HYPERSPACE works. There is no science in Star Wars.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:24
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why do you want to see 10 minutes of hyperspace travel every time the main characters go to a different planet
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Dec 22, 2015 20:26
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ThePutty posted:why do you need to see 10 minutes of hyperspace travel every time the main characters go to a different planet It worked in the original trilogy. The transit scenes were a great point to kick back, play chess, practice using a highly destructive energy weapon in a confined area while blindfolded, that sort of thing.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:28
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By that measurement Attack of the Clones is actually the best movie. I think it's the one that has the clearest hyperspace travel time with the mostest going on while the characters are in hyperspace.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:28
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khy posted:It worked in the original trilogy. The transit scenes were a great point to kick back, play chess, practice using a highly destructive energy weapon in a confined area while blindfolded, that sort of thing. Are you sure the Falcon is not intercut with events on star killer base? I'm not sure the transition is really an abrupt as you're remembering you're remembering.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:29
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ThePutty posted:why do you want to see 10 minutes of hyperspace travel every time the main characters go to a different planet It gives you a chance to have characters talk to each other when they're not in the middle of action? Like in ANH. Arglebargle III posted:Are you sure the Falcon is not intercut with events on star killer base? I'm not sure the transition is really an abrupt as you're remembering you're remembering. The movie just moves too fast.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:29
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I think there's expedient ways to add a sense of time & distance (include exterior shots of the ship's journey, or cut to a different scene inbetween departure/arrival) but ultimately I don't think it was that big a problem.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:30
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Serf posted:Yeah, if Rey was 4-5 years old when she got ditched on Jakku that means a 15-16 year old Kylo Ren would've been responsible for killing off the new Jedi apprentices. Doesn't seem impossible for a Skywalker, especially if the Knight of Ren are other apprentices that he swayed to the dark side. So who dropped her off on jakku? I don't think luke would have just abandoned her. I think Luke thought she was dead and Ren (struggling with the light side) couldn't kill his little cousin (so he dropped her off). Remember in the movie when they mentioned Rey and Ren was like: "WHAT GIRL?". OMG Serf. I think we figured it out.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:31
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khy posted:If a stormtrooper dies instantly from a shot from the bowcaster while wearing stormtrooper armor, then I want to know why someone who's visibly NOT wearing that armor is still jumping around swordfighting. Is he using other more effective armor? Why not give all the troops more effective armor? Likewise, in one shot the bowcaster is strong enough to send two people flying through the air so why doesn't a point-blank hit from it at least knock a guy off a catwalk? Umm, one thing that is 100% clear from the movies is that stormtrooper armor does nothing to stop a blaster. In fact all the evidence points to it being way worse than nothing. Plenty of people survive blaster shots in the movies. I don't think they ever were wearing stormtrooper armor.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:33
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hobbesmaster posted:It gives you a chance to have characters talk to each other when they're not in the middle of action? Like in ANH. The fact that half the cast is geriatric as well. Vader is very slow and deliberate in his movements, Tarkin and Kenobi are both OLD DUDES.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:34
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The shot that hit Ren was from a long way and it lost momentum. His force body armor was only half effective because he just killed his dad and was distracted. Who cares.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:35
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Ren also spent like a non-negligible amount of the big final duel pounding his chest and trying very hard to act like he wasn't completely hosed by that shot.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:36
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euphronius posted:The shot that hit Ren was from a long way and it lost momentum. Every time Kylo Ren takes off his helmet I want you to imagine this 
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Dec 22, 2015 20:36
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frest posted:Have you watched ANH recently? The travel times are still very minimal, and it is purely an artifact of the generally slower paced dialogue and more static sets. The fact that Tarkin and Vader basically talk at each other while completely stationary, everyone besides Luke-in-training is stationary on the Falcon, it all lends itself to this more relaxed feeling. The scene on the falcon there establishes that time is elapsing. TFA does not have scenes like that to establish that time elapses between cuts.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:36
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ThePutty posted:why do you want to see 10 minutes of hyperspace travel every time the main characters go to a different planet So that we can have these scenes 
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Dec 22, 2015 20:37
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Bip Roberts posted:Umm, one thing that is 100% clear from the movies is that stormtrooper armor does nothing to stop a blaster. In fact all the evidence points to it being way worse than nothing. Plenty of people survive blaster shots in the movies. I don't think they ever were wearing stormtrooper armor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ym-xHehd4NI
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Dec 22, 2015 20:37
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The movies don't really ever tell us who did or did not die of the nameless characters they just fall down and are never mentioned again. Maybe 90% of the storm troopers ultimately survived every on screen fight. Once they are knocked down and out of the fight the movie generally stops following them and doesn't cut to hospital shots of them treating busted ribs or broken arms or whatever. Maybe the armor changes the death rate from 75% to 63% or something statistical like that.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:38
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hobbesmaster posted:The scene on the falcon there establishes that time is elapsing. TFA does not have scenes like that to establish that time elapses between cuts. JJ made the choice to go go go go go through the whole movie except the last shot hahah. It's just a choice he made.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:40
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Wanna see the Shigeru Miyamoto cut of Star Wars where Luke shakes hands with all the wounded stormtroopers at the hospital.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:40
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In the beginning of the movie, when the village on Jakku has been taken over by the First Order and Kylo Ren is talking with Sydow's character I had a thought: it could be an oblique reference to Ren's parentage. Sydow: You cannot deny the truth that is your family. Kylo Ren: You're so right *chop* I think you could take that scene as Kylo Ren acting out something from his dad's past: shooting Greedo. Ren is exactly the kinda guy who would think that the coolest thing his dad did was shoot a person in cold blood and seek to emulate it in his own way. So a dude mouths off to Kylo Ren and he chops him in half for it. Of course he misses the fact that Han (whether he shot first, second, or at the same time) was totally justified in that since Greedo had a gun on him and was planning to kill him. Kylo Ren just cuts down an old, restrained man and goes "eh, close enough"
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Dec 22, 2015 20:46
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How badly hurt is Kylo Ren at the end of the film? We definitely saw Rey slash his cloak, poke a hole through his shoulder, and slash across his face, not to mention Chewie's bowcaster bolt in his side. Did Rey also chop off his hand? Minimally we saw his lightsabre fall away from his hand - could be a good parallel to Vader if he gets a few mechanical limbs before the next film.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:46
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Serf posted:Kylo Ren: You're so right Am I the only one who heard "Yousa right?" That's not a joke. I actually heard that.
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Dec 22, 2015 20:47
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