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Bottom Liner posted:That's my point, that would still only be $85 total for 3x core and a chapter pack, far from the $120+ the guy was saying 3x core costs. Basing actual cost on MSRP is a bit disingenuous. I'm the guy that said it costs $120, and I stand by it. If you can find 3 core sets on sale for $25, please share. Because the only places with them in stock are the full MSRP. So yes, if I'm willing to wait weeks to hope to find 2 more copies at $25, or I have to drop $80 to actually play the game I supposedly bought.
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Dec 19, 2015 22:34
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I hope FFG stops making LCGs so we don't need to suffer through the same tired old arguments about core set distribution monthly.
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Dec 19, 2015 22:35
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nyxnyxnyx posted:If they printed more copies of alt arts they wouldn't have value any more as a promo. What value do they have as promos now though? I'd say that the majority of players that play in tournaments play because it's the competitive scene and the prizes are icing on the cake. Then there's so many retailers reselling the things that they're not hard to get a hold of unless they're a major tournament prize anyway and even then you and I both know that *certain* retailers will sell extra copies at tournaments. Why shouldn't FFG make that money themselves? Selling them a few months later would still give people who were competitive and wanted to show them off as a badge of skill their time to show off. I do agree with you about the cycle length but people were already pissed off that cards would even be cycled out in the first place because...it's like M:TG!!! EVGA Longoria posted:I'm the guy that said it costs $120, and I stand by it. If you can find 3 core sets on sale for $25, please share. Because the only places with them in stock are the full MSRP. So yes, if I'm willing to wait weeks to hope to find 2 more copies at $25, or I have to drop $80 to actually play the game I supposedly bought. Are you planning on playing in tournaments? If not then just print some proxies while you wait for the price to drop. If you are planning on playing in a tournament then still print proxies to figure out what deck you like and see if you can borrow the missing cards from other players. Unless your scene is a bunch of competitive asshats who'd rather see you not play then let you use cards they aren't using you should be fine. FFG certainly does need to step up their production cycles though. Having their games be out of stock in so many place, a month after release, at Christmas time, is a big problem and a recurring one at this stage as well. PaybackJack fucked around with this message at 23:01 on Dec 19, 2015 |
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Dec 19, 2015 22:52
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If FFG sold promos then there wouldn't be a secondary market. Right now yeah, unscrupulous retailers are earning some money, but the market is still pretty healthy overall if you look at eBay and the other trading threads. I know I would be sad if they sold promos, even though I would probably still play in tournaments as you said.
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Dec 20, 2015 06:44
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Bottom Liner posted:That's my point, that would still only be $85 total for 3x core and a chapter pack, far from the $120+ the guy was saying 3x core costs. Basing actual cost on MSRP is a bit disingenuous. Yeah even for stupidly pricey UK I got my first 2 sets for £24 and last for £18
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Dec 20, 2015 10:28
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A core set is poorly put together if you get any sort of value out of buying a third one as an individual player. An expectation of buying at least two is an insult to the consumer, and only accepted by people with booster-pack stockholm-syndrome.
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Dec 20, 2015 13:27
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The alternative is either a core set with full play sets of 1/3 as many unique cards, which would make for a less varied number of decks that could realistically be made, and certainly would not be able to support 8 factions. That or make the core set cost 100 bucks and then no one would buy it except diehards.
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Dec 20, 2015 17:09
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Don't you just play kingslayer style with 1 core? Fine for casual cards with friends
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Dec 20, 2015 22:44
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sassassin posted:A core set is poorly put together if you get any sort of value out of buying a third one as an individual player. It sounds like you're interested in a different business model from what FFG provides. I suggest trying Ashes, which is a one-core game; note, though, that in playing Ashes you'll notice that there aren't all that many cards in the game, because they allocated their space to printing duplicates of existing cards instead of extra options. Personally, I like the FFG approach a bit better - note also that a single FFG core set is a perfectly respectable board game experience on its own for casual players. I'd say the model goes something like this: One core: Standalone "board game." Limited deckbuilding options. Two cores: Fleshes out deckbuilding options for more of a "Card game" experience. Three cores: Maximum deckbuilding options, allows you to build multiple decks using the same neutral staples at the same time, etc. The important thing to note is that there's a logical progression. If you just like the game and play with other casual players at board game nights every now and again, one core is the way to go. If you prefer to have more deckbuilding and composition, two cores it is - and if you want to have the most options available, go to tournaments, be "hardcore", etc. then the third core set and various expansions are for you. Personally, I've bought one core set of FFG games to try them out, then acquired additional stuff based on whether or not I liked the game enough to get more into it. Netrunner and Conquest passed that test for me - Star Wars Armada didn't, and Game of Thrones is on the edge for me.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:00
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Expansion packs should expand the core set. No reason they couldn't include 2nd or 3rd copies of core cards here and there to flesh out availability. If you can't make two legal decks from the GOT core it's not really a standalone game, is it? And if the standalone decks are poo poo it's a bad standalone game. JoshTheStampede posted:The alternative is either a core set with full play sets of 1/3 as many unique cards, which would make for a less varied number of decks that could realistically be made, and certainly would not be able to support 8 factions. This is a false dichotomy.
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Dec 21, 2015 10:21
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sassassin posted:Expansion packs should expand the core set. No reason they couldn't include 2nd or 3rd copies of core cards here and there to flesh out availability. You can definitely make two legal (although not awesome) decks from the Thrones core (or the Conquest core, or the Netrunner core....) The standalone decks aren't optimized for consistency, they're optimized for variety. This makes them weak competitively but great for showing people what sorts of cards are in the game and easing them into deckbuilding. There are a few flaws with this (the dead pile mechanic is very important in advanced Thrones play but does nothing or almost nothing with one-core decks), but broadly I've found it helpful to play a bunch of "let's see what cards are in this game" type games, figure out which cards and interactions I want to see more of, and then shaping a deck accordingly.
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Dec 21, 2015 11:22
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Is there a thread where Asmodee's announcement is being discussed and they're also not rehashing the multiple-cores-is-stupid-no-it-isn't for the ~75th time? Because already I loathe the same effing argument cropping up when L5R releases and that's already a year away.
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Dec 21, 2015 11:49
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PJOmega posted:Is there a thread where Asmodee's announcement is being discussed and they're also not rehashing the multiple-cores-is-stupid-no-it-isn't for the ~75th time? We should just change the name of the thread : FFG Living Card Game Thread: Stop Bitching About Core Sets
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Dec 21, 2015 13:49
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Can someone clear something up regarding LOTR? I get that you need the big box to play the packs for each cycle. Are the 'Saga' boxes self-contained, though, as in playable with only one core? The first one seems to be, but the others don't always specify. If I have a single Core and I bought the Treason of Saruman, say, could I actually play it?
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Dec 21, 2015 18:10
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Zephro posted:Can someone clear something up regarding LOTR?
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Dec 21, 2015 18:18
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Boco_T posted:Yeah, that's all you need. I think most of the booklets that come with those even have suggested deck lists for just core + that box. (Sorry if these are dumb questions, I think the idea of a co-op LCG kinda breaks my brain) edit for specifics: my friend has the Core and the two Hobbit saga boxes. I only have the Core. Would it be worth investing in my own copies of the Hobbit boxes if I think I'm going to like the game and I want to get into it? I'm guessing yes.
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Dec 21, 2015 18:22
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Zephro posted:OK, thanks! Finally, if I'm planning to play with a friend, we can play with just one Core and one box between us, right? But if we want to start building our own decks to take around we'll want a Core + expansion each so that we can hang on to the player cards? But yeah, the more expansions you buy, the larger your player card pool is going to be. The Postscript section on this page has some tips if you just want to buy a few expansions to improve the quality of a Dwarf deck or just get a themed start to your expansion buying. It also has breakdowns of what kind of cards you get in the expansions to help you decide what order to buy them in.
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Dec 21, 2015 18:28
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Boco_T posted:Well for just a 2-player game, only one person needs the Sauron deck cards, so you wouldn't technically need those for yourself to just play the scenario. Like if you are always Leadership + Lore and he's always Spirit + Tactics, you could theoretically borrow cards out of his sets and split your expansion buying that way, but it would take some amount of time after playing to make sure you aren't taking the other player's cards home with you. Thanks for the link. I'd wanted to buy the packs in order, but it looks like the first couple of cycles are out of print, though FFG shows the reprints as being on the boat. The first big box I can find is the Numenor one, but the buying guide explicitly warns against just buying that if you only have a Core, because apparently it's pretty tricky. Maybe I'll pick up The Black Riders while I wait for KD reprints.
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Dec 21, 2015 18:41
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Buying them in order seems silly when there's no serious progression involved between the encounters. I've just bought the core and expansions with player cards I wanted. Erestor's ability is ridiculous. Elven Spear & Protector of Lorien are amazing when you would be forced to discard your whole hand at the end of the round anyway, and draw 4 every turn.
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Dec 21, 2015 19:18
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Asmodee released another statement. I'm actually thinking this is going to hurt groups like Team Covenant more than CSI. CSI doesn't need to become an authorized retailer, could continue getting their products from distributors and selling them online. Team Covenant however is in an awkward position where they are the exact type of store that FFG wants to authorize due to the amount of events and promotion they do but I think their subscription sales make up a good portion of their business. I'm curious to see what their response will be.
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Dec 22, 2015 11:10
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quote:new policies taking effect on April 1st, 2016 
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Dec 22, 2015 11:22
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New financial year, but yeah. This seems really weird. "We'll help your FLGS [in unspecified ways] and prevent them from selling our products online"  edit: at least it only seems to apply to North America, for now. Though I guess that may well change. Zephro fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Dec 22, 2015 |
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Dec 22, 2015 11:36
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http://dsgcw.blogspot.ca/2015/11/how-it-is.html http://dsgcw.blogspot.ca/2015/12/pray-i-dont-alter-deal-any-further.html?spref=fb&m=1 Interesting articles, even if I don't necessarily agree with everything. People who profess to believe in objectivism always raises flags for me.
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Dec 23, 2015 07:53
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nyxnyxnyx posted:http://dsgcw.blogspot.ca/2015/11/how-it-is.html I don't understand someone who says they want to look at the way things are, not the way they wish they were, telling everyone that it began from their idealistic sense of reality. If you are really objectivist, just give us the facts and let us make our own decisions? In any case maybe it'll work for them, maybe it won't, but it's not a positive mark on their reputation. I think they might move more with games that already have established bases, who knows, but if I can't buy online I won't be getting into new games. We'll see how it plays out.
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Dec 23, 2015 15:23
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nyxnyxnyx posted:http://dsgcw.blogspot.ca/2015/11/how-it-is.html Oh hey, it's my FLGS. I've been in the store exactly twice. That article explains so much about my experience there, and why there were exactly zero Lord of the Rings LCG items in stock. Bunch of Netrunner and Magic and some Star Wars LCG, but no LOTR LCG. If the guy isn't selling much FFG product in his stores due to online retailers selling everything at 30-40% below MSRP, why would he carry anything from FFG that doesn't have an in-person competitive scene to drive traffic? That said, the brick and mortar store model isn't for me. I have no interest in playing a game in a store or playing tournaments. I prefer to play with friends and family at home. Even if you flipped the prices and suddenly the local stores were cheaper and amazon was more expensive, I'd probably still buy most of my stuff online just for the convenience factor. If I was actually spending time in the store, of course I would spend money in the store. It's dickish not to, like packing your own lunch when you go out with your friends to dinner.
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Dec 23, 2015 20:25
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As someone who lives overseas, I can't feel that sorry for people in the U.S. suddenly being forced to pay closer to MSRP. Import taxes plus shipping fees, and local seller price adjustments mean I typically pay 110-120% of MSRP already($17 USD for an LCG pack). When my friend lived in the US and didn't mind carrying games over in his luggage I'd take advantage of CSI a lot so I know that the amount of money consumers stand to "lose" if the price hops is huge. One thing I'll agree with that guy about though is about everything but the cost being window dressing. FFG has an online store already right on their website. When you complain you "can't buy online" what you really mean is that you can't buy online from a seller you've got customer rewards points with, who deeply discounts the price of their goods. FFG has an online store, it ships worldwide, and it's not going anywhere.
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Dec 23, 2015 21:31
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So it turns out I'm playing more Melee in Game of Thrones than Joust, so I need a new Melee deck since I'm tired of playing with my Lannister/Tyrell deck all the time, despite being really fun and winning games in fun ways, including Wildfiring in the last turn to kill my own Tyrion and Marjaery to feed Joffrey. Anyway, I was thinking either Martell/Night's Watch or Night's Watch/Martell, but have no idea which is better. Martell looks like it has much better loyals (Ghaston Grey is a good deterrent and Doran's Game is a good power spike), but Take the Black looks like it could be fun with the number of targets available. And uh yeah that seems like that's that for loyal Night's Watch? Edit: Playing A Game of Thrones (the plot) against someone trying to Sneak Attack the power for the win is super fun and hilarious. GrandpaPants fucked around with this message at 22:20 on Dec 23, 2015 |
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Dec 23, 2015 22:16
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PaybackJack posted:As someone who lives overseas, I can't feel that sorry for people in the U.S. suddenly being forced to pay closer to MSRP. Import taxes plus shipping fees, and local seller price adjustments mean I typically pay 110-120% of MSRP already($17 USD for an LCG pack). When my friend lived in the US and didn't mind carrying games over in his luggage I'd take advantage of CSI a lot so I know that the amount of money consumers stand to "lose" if the price hops is huge. My situation sucks, so I want everyone's situation to suck. Thanks!
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Dec 23, 2015 22:35
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Bottom Liner posted:My situation sucks, so I want everyone's situation to suck. Thanks! I didn't say I wanted your situation to suck, I was trying to point out you'll still have it better than a lot of other places getting it at 80% instead of 60%.
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Dec 23, 2015 23:31
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PaybackJack posted:FFG has an online store, it ships worldwide, and it's not going anywhere. But i agree that this seems unlikely to kill their games. Netrunner is a hit in the UK despite it costing a lot more than in presently does in the states.
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Dec 24, 2015 00:01
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GrandpaPants posted:Anyway, I was thinking either Martell/Night's Watch or Night's Watch/Martell, but have no idea which is better. Martell looks like it has much better loyals (Ghaston Grey is a good deterrent and Doran's Game is a good power spike), but Take the Black looks like it could be fun with the number of targets available. And uh yeah that seems like that's that for loyal Night's Watch? I've been exploring Night's Watch as a faction pretty much exclusively, and am having a hard time with it as a whole. Started with NW / Stark, then eventually tried NW / Martell, and now am just trying NW Fealty. The Martell version had some neat synergies, in theory; I had Maester Caolette (sp?), Confinement, and the 2 and 4 drop non-uniques (and maybe a few other cards I'm forgetting). Plan was to play the defensive version, obviously, and to lean on The Wall to drive power but after a few games it still just wasn't clicking, losing to Targ (no agenda), and Baratheon / Lannister. It all seemed good on paper but I'm still pretty green with this game and might just be making bad marshaling decisions and/or strategic ones. I'm now starting to explore using Banner of the Watch instead, going back to Stark pairing for now. Will hopefully get a few games with that in this week at some point.
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Dec 24, 2015 01:26
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Have a look for a guy on YouTube who goes by the name throne runner. He has been testing a NW/BotW deck that seems to work pretty well. He has a deck building video which goes through his choices and why he chose them plus a bunch of videos of the deck in action which you can watch to get a feel for how you should be playing it. It seems to be relatively successful.
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Dec 24, 2015 08:57
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Throne runners awesome. I've tried his Night Watch/Stark deck and it's a lot of fun.
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Dec 24, 2015 09:35
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So my friend has the two Hobbit saga boxes for LOTR, plus a core. I got a core and then Foundations of Stone and Shadow and Flame, for the player cards (Khazad-Dum is out of print, unfortunately). If I bring a deck made with cards from FoS and SaF (I was thinking Elrond, Glorfindel and Eowyn though i have no clue what in doing when it comes to deckbuilding) will it be usable with his Hobbit quests? Will it be over / under powered for them? Basically I'm worried that the lack of thematicness will have mechanical consequences, and maybe we should just split his cards and play with the "intended" heroes from the saga boxes. Am I just worrying too much?
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Dec 24, 2015 19:53
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Probably worrying too much. I'd say the first time you probably want to just build a good deck to beat scenarios, you can always go back and replay stuff with themed decks later. If you're making a deck focused on questing, I'd say the best tip then is to see if your friend will build a deck more focused on combat.
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Dec 24, 2015 20:59
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My sister got me Khazad-Dum for Christmas  Now if only Return To Mirkwood was back in stock 
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Dec 25, 2015 13:39
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Nice. Khazad-Dum is out of print and £114 on EBay.
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Dec 25, 2015 16:01
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Boco_T posted:Probably worrying too much. I'd say the first time you probably want to just build a good deck to beat scenarios, you can always go back and replay stuff with themed decks later. If you're making a deck focused on questing, I'd say the best tip then is to see if your friend will build a deck more focused on combat.  I was going to go Lore/Spirit, yeah.
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Dec 25, 2015 16:02
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Zephro posted:Nice. Khazad-Dum is out of print and £114 on EBay. I bought it for £19 + p&p two weeks ago. I should probably just sell it. I don't care about dwarves.
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Dec 25, 2015 17:37
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It's on the boat according to FFG's site, so in a month or whatever it'll be back to normal price.
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Dec 25, 2015 17:58
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