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madjackmcmad posted:That's a mistake! Sage Grimm posted:I was honestly surprised you didn't end it by killing yourself. Because that would happen with a chain-rocket launcher. 
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Dec 25, 2015 18:42
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If you don't accidentally kill yourself with a new power at least once, it's not a very good roguelike
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Dec 25, 2015 18:44
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alarumklok posted:I recommend Dredmor. Less memes um
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Dec 25, 2015 18:47
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 much dungeon, so mans! The very first time I saw someone pronounce (and spell) "dog" as "doge" I thought it was the funniest poo poo, and didn't realize it was about to be an internet thing. A doge was going to go right in next to the triger because I was on a misspelled animal kick. It wasn't even going to be a shiba, it was going to be some goofy looking dog that dodged all the time. Then like three days later I saw fuckin' doge all over the place and cut it, because memes aren't funny X years later. I think there's a handful of arrested development jokes in the game still, for the dozens of us who watched it.
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Dec 25, 2015 18:55
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it's a thread reference. im a deep comedy guy
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Dec 25, 2015 18:57
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madjackmcmad posted:
I'll get it later myself but i just gifted the Mans-game to a friendmans of mine. Hope he likes it!! 
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Dec 25, 2015 19:14
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Dungeonmans question: did the masters program involving bouncing lines and all that ever get a buff? I haven't played in what feels like most of the year but I distinctly remembering it feeling like the spells in it weren't properly applying the game's equivalent of spellpower or whatever.
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Dec 25, 2015 19:24
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I find it hilarious how none of the other threads I'm following are doing anything today, but the roguelikes thread has like 30+ updates in it. Godspeed, awful goons. 
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Dec 25, 2015 19:51
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Rappaport posted:but I more or less know the game like the back of my own hand. I feel like everyone who genuinely enjoys Nethack and ADOM have been playing them for over a decade. You have to try really hard to get into them after experiencing the more modern offerings. I personally couldn't do it. ADOM in particularly really pissed me off. What the gently caress is that Tactics mechanic. It's the most annoying thing. Just jesus christ. The update helped, but not enough. My top10 would be: 1. Caves of Qud 2. FTL (I negatively judge everyone that makes the RNG criticism. I played this a lot and could very consistently win in the hard difficulty.) 3. Crypt of the Necrodancer (Never quite managed to beat it with every character, but I absolutely love it. It's so tightly designed, and the music is so good.) 4. BoI: Rebirth (Beating it with the secret character burned me out, but I still love it.) 5. Sil (I'm a sucker for tight design. Haven't played it as much as every other game in this list, but I really like it.) 6. Cataclysm (A magnificent mess.) 7. Unreal World 8. Demon (Much more enjoyable since the art update.) 9. Rogue Survivor (Dead too soon.) 10. DCSS Honorable Mention: Dungeons of Dredmor (Poorly designed overall, but gives quite a fun toolbox to build characters with! I didn't realize the humor was that based around references? I just thought it was quirky. Granted, I did not read many of the items descriptions.)
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Dec 25, 2015 19:52
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All of you people submitting late lists are jerks.  I'll probably use them anyway because More Data. (or opinions not data whatever) I'll go through game giveaway stuff later tonight, reminder that you can't take 2 from the "premium" list atm. I'm also giving priority to people who submitted their votes prior to my initial deadline.
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Dec 25, 2015 19:55
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FTL seems incredibly dependent on RNG given the obstacles the final boss presents, and I'm interested in why it isn't. Educate me, thread.TooMuchAbstraction posted:I find it hilarious how none of the other threads I'm following are doing anything today, but the roguelikes thread has like 30+ updates in it. Godspeed, awful goons. Roguelike players are insane but they're also a perfect gamechoice when you have to host crowds/cook mountains on the holidays, since you can put them down and mull over the perfect move while you're doing other poo poo.
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Dec 25, 2015 19:59
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Jordan7hm posted:All of you people submitting late lists are jerks. I THOUGHT it was late, but then I saw a bunch of people still sending them in and couldn't be arsed to go back a few pages to make sure.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:02
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Thoughts on Cogmind after playing for five minutes: 24pt font (on a 15" 3K screen) is not nearly large enough and the options screen won't let me set it any larger. This may be a desktop-only game.  Beeme posted:2. FTL (I negatively judge everyone that makes the RNG criticism. I played this a lot and could very consistently win in the hard difficulty.) Even if winning the game isn't RNG, a lot of the ship unlocks definitely are. The crystal cruiser is the most egregious offender, of course. ToxicFrog fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Dec 25, 2015 |
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Dec 25, 2015 20:03
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Luceid posted:FTL seems incredibly dependent on RNG given the obstacles the final boss presents, and I'm interested in why it isn't. Educate me, thread. You are bad at FTL. 
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Dec 25, 2015 20:04
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Holidays are also the perfect time for vegging hard on a tough game for a week or two. I got a lot of my first wins over the holiday break too  Alternate theory: rogue players are huge anti social nerds. Little column a, little column b probably.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:07
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ToxicFrog posted:Even if winning the game isn't RNG, a lot of the ship unlocks definitely are. The crystal cruiser is the most egregious offender, of course. This I absolutely grant you. The crystal unlock is ridiculous. I didn't terribly mind them, it was fun to have something to shoot for and motivating me to play. But they are RNG. Luceid posted:FTL seems incredibly dependent on RNG given the obstacles the final boss presents, and I'm interested in why it isn't. Educate me, thread. I'm not smart enough to write about this at length, and I also haven't played in a while, but essentially there are various offensive (just brute force, invaders, ion, etc) and defensive (shields, stealth, drones) strategies that you can aim for, and a reasonably long while to develop them. It's not that different from any single-dungeon roguelike with anti-grinding mechanics (such as a foodclock). You have to develop knowledge of the game by losing a lot, first. Then you get to know the events and their possible results, what to expect from the shops, how much to invest in defense and offense, how to properly allocate your ship's power (hint, everything on engines when you know you'll have to dodge a missile), etc. You get better at making the right choices to get you through the game and the challenge at the end.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:26
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FTL, once you know all the encounters, is a game of calculated gambles. Do you pick the encounter option that has a chance to give you a good payout but also a chance to kill a crewmember? Or do you stick with the safe option? Do you target the enemy's weapons to try to neuter them, or their shields/engines to kill them faster? Do you buy a drone system for reliable protection against just missiles, or a cloaking device for perfect protection against a fraction of the attacks you face? Most roguelikes are a bunch of calculated gambles, of course. FTL's gambles have more "swing" to them, I think; the difference between a good outcome and a bad outcome can be huge. Plus of course there's combat: if an enemy ship happens to get some lucky targeting, then there's often basically nothing you can do. I've had runs ended by an enemy ship showing up and precision-targeting my shields, engines, etc; even though I recognized that I needed to flee ASAP I couldn't get away before getting chopped to pieces. Of course that kind of thing can happen in other roguelikes, though you usually get the "compensation" of being told that you got killed by an out-of-depth Angry Kobold God or something instead of just another Rebel Drone Ship. Still, from what I know of the game, the difference between high-level and average play comes down to a) knowing the effects of the different encounters, and b) being a lot more thorough about mitigating risk and optimizing builds. Probably the big problem is that FTL's RNG influence is so noticeable that losing players rage against the RNG instead of figuring out what they did wrong. It's not helped any by the game being willing to put you on a reverse-snowball-effect where you scrape along for potentially many sectors before finally succumbing, so it's not necessarily clear which choices you should have done differently.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:42
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Jordan7hm posted:All of you people submitting late lists are jerks. If you still have one left by the end, I'd like a copy of thread favourites Qud or Dungeonmans. In exchange, here is another lovely list. I basically judged it based on how much time I actually sank into the game and if I liked it enough to actually beat it. 10. DCSS - Was fun, but the constant balance rollercoaster finally drove me crazy. Haven't picked it up in a few versions since I 15-runed some jerk Wizard and called it a day. 9. ADOM - Again, I got a ULE and called it a day, unable to muster the will to shove another big rat in a big box in the Big Room. It's sitting on my Steam wishlist, tempting me. "But you can pick your starsign now! The minotaur maze isn't a waste of time!" I'm onto you, Biskup. 8. Spelunky - A lot of wreckage here at the bottom; after I got the Super Last Secret Ending, I just didn't want to play it again. It suffers from weird floaty controls that I will always hate and a level generator that occasionally just fucks you, but I loved La Mulana and I loved playing it in a bite-sized package. 7. Infra Arcana - This game really does what it set out to do; make a roguelike that conjures the atmosphere of Lovecraft. It's really, really loving hard, though, which annoys me because the decision making in it isn't really all that deep. Maybe this is just sour grapes because I can't beat the loving thing. 6. Elona - Every now and then I get the irresistible urge to reinstall this game and try to do something moronic in it. That's not particularly difficult. The problem is that the urge passes just as inexplicably as it came, so it's kind of like a craving for sushi. Or heroin. All these lovely jokes aside, I don't think any other RL comes close to the ludicrous amount of stuff you can get up to. 5. Binding of Isaac - It's too bad Afterbirth shat the bed so bad, because I liked Rebirth enough to literally get everything it. 3/4. ToME - I happen to like huge walls of text and stats and numbers, and I also like creating some unholy multiplier-based oneshot machine. It also has a pretty cool setting and isn't afraid to put some wacky things into the mix to see if they work. That doesn't mean it won't get really boring at times, because it does. 4/3. Dredmor - Basically the exact same story as ToME. In fact, let's say they tie. 2. FTL - I think pause-based combat is janky and counter-intuitive, but I thought that when I was playing BG2 in middle school, too. It's still fantastic. 1. DoomRL - Oh my god, this stupid game. Everything I want is here. Crafting! Tactical combat! Wacky builds! A basically infinite wellspring of achievements! Game modes that build on your previous experience instead of invalidating it! Doomguy noises! Jupiter Hell is basically hanging over my head like the Sword of Damocles, about to fall down and destroy my life.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:43
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Jordan7hm posted:I sent Zombie Samurai a copy of Caves of Qud, and I'm pretty sure everyone else who posted here is also sorted out at this point. Check your PMs if you have PMs, because rather than rely on steam's terrible messaging app I used those in a few cases. There are more keys to be given away and lots more people posted lists so... yeah free games that I really want to give away to people.
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Dec 25, 2015 20:46
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I want video games. Someone send me tiny gems of video games. http://steamcommunity.com/id/madjackmcmad/
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Dec 25, 2015 20:50
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madjackmcmad posted:I want video games. Someone send me tiny gems of video games. http://steamcommunity.com/id/madjackmcmad/ I like that steam marines is on your wishlist. e: also initial list sent Jordan7hm fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Dec 25, 2015 |
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Dec 25, 2015 20:51
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Jordan7hm posted:The link to the games list is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cLU51h82dxdYWoJFRsKG7ghymXMra3Ehu5dJdjZ_Em8 If you really still have excess copies of Dungeonmans I'd love one of those, but my list was way late. Also, one of you jerks should take Lichdom. It's a really cool game that I am so far enjoying a lot more than I expected to. The levels are too long and you have to be willing to do some trial and error to get the crafting nonsense to click, but combat is more consistently interesting than any other vaguely diablo-y thing I've played. It's not really a great game, but it's got so many interesting elements that I want lots of people to play it anyway.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:03
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I should just do some FTL livestreaming one day. That's probably the only thing I'm good enough in the universe at to make interesting enough to watch.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:08
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Jordan7hm posted:I'm also giving priority to people who submitted their votes prior to my initial deadline. RoboCicero posted:I submitted a list -- could I request Coin Crypt by PM? I've heard some good things about it but I'm pretty skeptical of the premise.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:16
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Jordan7hm posted:I like that steam marines is on your wishlist. What's the goon opinion of steam marines? It looks interesting but the mixed reviews in steam made me refrain from buying it.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:16
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Unormal posted:You are bad at FTL. That's not very educational!
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Dec 25, 2015 21:18
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Luceid posted:FTL seems incredibly dependent on RNG given the obstacles the final boss presents, and I'm interested in why it isn't. Educate me, thread.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:21
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Beeme posted:This I absolutely grant you. The crystal unlock is ridiculous. I didn't terribly mind them, it was fun to have something to shoot for and motivating me to play. But they are RNG. Hacking. Hacking, fire bombs, and the super shield bypass are three of my comfort zone items. I can win without them, but, more easily WITH them. But, hacking, seriously, hacking.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:26
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Well, here's a few tips, these are all general tips that don't apply to every ship, but do mostly apply: * You want to gear towards a loadout that lets you disable (de-crew) instead of destroy a ship. De-crewing a ship gives you more scrap and if you're destroying every ship, you're not going to end up with enough scrap without the rng gods just loving you. The easiest loadout for de-crewing is barely enough weapons to disable the enemy ships damage dealing to the point where your defenses can hold them and give time for a 2 man teleporter with a pair of mantis to dismember the ship. Once you start getting better at gauging combats and weapon use you'll find it becomes more possible to just blow a hole in the ship/disable the O2 generator and let them suffocate. * Therefore: Try to get 2 mantises for a boarding party and a teleporter as a top priority. * It's usually a good idea to take surrenders, though you eventually learn what's a good deal. If they offer you 20 drone parts and you don't need drone parts, don't take it. Surrenders are especially good if they offer fuel, as once you get more efficent, you'll find that running out of fuel in sector 5 or 6 is your most common loss condition. * In general it's a a good idea to level up medbay and sensors to level 2 super early. I sometimes even level them up before level 2 shields. These are very important for granting blue positive options to encounters that are otherwise always negative or neutral. * In general it's a good idea to try to get as racially diverse a crew as possible, also because it gives you a better shot at blue options. * Level 2 doors are insanely good, because they trivialize almost all boarding encounters once you learn to manage vacuum to kill boarders. Get level 2 doors asap. * If you run into a firey sun, vent your whole ship immediately except for the compartments your crew are in. This mitigates most of the danger from the fire bursts. * 1 point in cloak is all you need. It recharges faster than 2 or 3 point shields, and you only need to use it at the very last moment before a big missile is about to hit, or beam weapons hit after your shield has been stripped. * You should only get barely enough shields for the sector your in (try to get 2 points in the first sector, you don't need 3 points till a few sectors in), otherwise engines and a defense drone are better defense. Overspending on shields is one easy way to get undergeared otherwise. The third shield pip is worth upgrades to doors and sensors and medbay, all of which will net you way more scrap than an early 3 point pip. * Don't overspend on your reactor, you don't need to run all your modules at once. * The last boss is a trivial puzzle encounter if you if you go into it with: near max shields/dodge (if your short on scrap and have to pick just one max dodge instead of the 4th shield pip), a one point cloak, a 2-man teleporter and any combination of weapons that can deal even 1 damage to the boss. A defense drone is a nice-to-have because it will shoot down stage 2's boarding drone. If this loadout seems impossible, just practice the scrap-generating techniques above till it seems completely reasonable to arrive at each game (it is) -During each stage of the fight teleport immediately into the triple missile launcher with your boarding team and disable it. This weapon is the primary threat. It will get off one shot against maxxed-mantis boarders, use your 1 point cloak you brought to dodge it. Once it's down the rest of the weapons just suck against a max dodge/shield system. Keep your boarding party moving to the other sealed off weapon modules to kill the dudes in everything but the energy weapon chamber (if you kill them the ship can go into crazy AI mode). Take them out in this order: missle, ion, beam -Once you have the weapons all disabled except the energy weapon, you're immortal for stage 1 with a decently geared ship. Spend the time to try to kill all the crew except the dudes manning the energy weapon. If you can kill them all this trivializes the swarm boarding that happens in the later stage fight. If you don't kill them all the boarding swarm can be a pain in the rear end. -Use the 1 point cloak (which recharges faster) to dodge the first salvo of the triple missiles -Use the 1 point cloak to dodge the super weapon -Use the 1 point cloak to dodge the drone swarm (don't pop it until the moment drone swarms fully strip your shields, sometimes they don't and you don't have to waste it) -Use your nice-to-have defense drone in stage 2 to shoot down the boarding drone. If you don't have one, just spend more energy on disabling the drone control unit. Mostly FTL is about applying a bunch of small tips to each scrape up an extra 5% scrap, if you do them all right, you find it's actually very repeatably beatable, though you can still ocassionally get lolboned in sector 1. Unormal fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Dec 25, 2015 |
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Dec 25, 2015 21:31
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Luceid posted:FTL seems incredibly dependent on RNG given the obstacles the final boss presents, and I'm interested in why it isn't. Educate me, thread. The boss has a few specific obstacles that you have to be prepared for but honestly once you know how to work it it isn't that tough, on the hard difficulty setting just random encounters in the last couple of sectors can be way harder than the boss itself.
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Dec 25, 2015 21:32
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To anyone who has compiled a top 10 list: How many of you who didn't have Crawl on your list also haven't played it? From my point of view, it seems like such a benchmark roguelike at this point that the only reason one wouldn't include it in a top 10 is that the person hasn't actually played it. Or in other words, I'd like to hear why some of you didn't include it despite having played it.
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Dec 25, 2015 22:23
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Awesome! posted:its funny how many people suddenly felt like making a list after seeing the free games I don't want any of the free games.
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Dec 25, 2015 22:52
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Bleu posted:7. Infra Arcana - This game really does what it set out to do; make a roguelike that conjures the atmosphere of Lovecraft. It's really, really loving hard, though, which annoys me because the decision making in it isn't really all that deep. Maybe this is just sour grapes because I can't beat the loving thing. Oh man I forgot about Infra Arcana. I should have put that on my list because that is one of the coolest, most atmospheric roguelikes out there and definitely deserves a look if you've never played it. It also uses the fantastic Oryx tileset which is the best roguelike tileset out there other than the one in Qud, and I think Qud was also based on the oryx tileset initially before they started doing custom tiles.
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Dec 25, 2015 23:43
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SnowblindFatal posted:To anyone who has compiled a top 10 list: How many of you who didn't have Crawl on your list also haven't played it? From my point of view, it seems like such a benchmark roguelike at this point that the only reason one wouldn't include it in a top 10 is that the person hasn't actually played it. Or in other words, I'd like to hear why some of you didn't include it despite having played it. I didn't include Crawl, but I have played. I have six ascensions, three or four of which were 15-rune runs, between versions 0.4.5 and 0.6.something. At one point I wrote a fairly definitive guide to ascending, in terms of zone order, ascension kit, most dangerous enemies, etc. I quit playing Crawl because the devs were committed to making the game more random, removing consistent and powerful options for the player instead of designing enemies that were challenging even with those options in mind, and because the UI kept changing for the worse (circular ranges with square vision really annoyed me, and 0.6 subtly changed how macros worked and broke all the multi-step commands I'd come to rely on). More broadly it just seemed like every new version was cutting things I enjoyed and adding "features" that forced me to relearn aspects of the game for no real benefit. I haven't played since then but occasionally I look at the Crawl thread when a new version comes out and I always see things like "we completely removed controlled teleporting! isn't it great?" and I immediately close it and go back to playing ToME. Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Dec 25, 2015 |
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Dec 25, 2015 23:56
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SnowblindFatal posted:To anyone who has compiled a top 10 list: How many of you who didn't have Crawl on your list also haven't played it? From my point of view, it seems like such a benchmark roguelike at this point that the only reason one wouldn't include it in a top 10 is that the person hasn't actually played it. Or in other words, I'd like to hear why some of you didn't include it despite having played it. If you take a look at the last five years, we're in such a golden age of roguelikes that someone can think Crawl is legitimately great and still like 10 other games better.
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Dec 26, 2015 00:10
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madjackmcmad posted:If you take a look at the last five years, we're in such a golden age of roguelikes that someone can think Crawl is legitimately great and still like 10 other games better. Only if they're crazy.
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Dec 26, 2015 00:11
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SnowblindFatal posted:To anyone who has compiled a top 10 list: How many of you who didn't have Crawl on your list also haven't played it? From my point of view, it seems like such a benchmark roguelike at this point that the only reason one wouldn't include it in a top 10 is that the person hasn't actually played it. Or in other words, I'd like to hear why some of you didn't include it despite having played it. I tried Crawl back when I was first getting into roguelikes and was bored to tears. Nethack at least had interesting interactions and things to run into before killing me, but there was nothing about Crawl that kept me engaged enough to really learn how to play it.
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Dec 26, 2015 00:12
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i have crawl and im not sure ive ever actually launched it e: just checked, i did the tutorial and thats it lol
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Dec 26, 2015 00:15
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Anyone who cares about the genre should play Crawl at least once, to get an appreciation of the things it does right. However the same is also true of Nethack. (But maybe not ADOM, because ADOM's design principles are "there was an old lady who swallowed a fly" in video game form.)
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Dec 26, 2015 00:19
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| # ? May 26, 2024 16:29 |
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I'll try crawl about once a year and it just doesn't click with me. Maybe its that it has a steeper learning curve than i want from a roguelike these days or maybe its how kind of oldschool the mechanics seem to be, i dont know. Also the level gen (early on atleast) seems really boring and i've had the most fun playing the game in that mode where its just all the bosses in sequence.
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Dec 26, 2015 00:28
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