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CelticPredator posted:The big space machine sucks the sun into it's hole and then shoots the sun power out of it's hole. It's really quite simple! "You know, sir, for the amount of power we use to initiate the, uh, star-killing process we could literally just Taser all of our enemies from orbit simultaneously." "Will it destroy planets so that we reduce to dust entire civilizations whose infrastructure and resources we desperately need to rebuild our empire?" "Uh, no, si--" "NEVERMIND THEN"
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Dec 26, 2015 22:07
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Delthalaz posted:Oh! Ok. That makes sense. I didn't want Stat Wars to be all political bullshit like the prequels but I wish the movie had established the stakes so I didn't have to ask an Internet forum what the hell was going on in the Star Wars movie. Re: second, no. They can still be bought but they're unofficial, although some elements may leak in (I believe Zahn actually named Coruscant, which had previously been "Imperial Center.") I actually doubt we'll see a Mara Jade or a Thrawn now, not least so they can avoid possibly having to pay Zahn money. re: the third, that was their central command. There were fleets elsewhere so I doubt the New Republic is "defeated" so much as "badly weakened." Leia will probably have to boss folks around. The idea of her becoming an empress is actually surprisingly logical, but may be too nuanced or complex for them to want to do.
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Dec 26, 2015 22:10
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The wikis and such say that Kylo Ren used the dark side of the force in the movie but I didn't really see it. All the powers I saw him using were neutral powers like force pushing, move object, and mind tricking warped to be used for dark side goals. He doesn't even force choke a bitch, instead using move object to pull them to his grip. I guess maybe the mind probe torture stuff. IMO, he's not able to call upon the power of the dark side, no matter how hard he tries which is why he was begging the Vader helmet to show it to him. I'm guessing that will be the last of his training referenced by Snoke at the end, leading to him entering the second movie with an entirely new set of dark side powers.
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Dec 26, 2015 22:14
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The whole "secret Imperial-backed empire controlling undiscovered regions of space" that's apparently part of the First Order's backstory was something in the EU too.
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Dec 26, 2015 22:18
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Victorkm posted:The wikis and such say that Kylo Ren used the dark side of the force in the movie but I didn't really see it. All the powers I saw him using were neutral powers like force pushing, move object, and mind tricking warped to be used for dark side goals. He doesn't even force choke a bitch, instead using move object to pull them to his grip. I guess maybe the mind probe torture stuff. Choke is only unlocked at Level 9 But yeah, it is a good point to show how he is still at the crossroads
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Dec 26, 2015 22:25
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Also force choking isn't even inherently dark-side, since Luke chokes out some piggies in Jedi.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:00
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Nessus posted:Regarding your first, it was bad enough they were probably unwilling to take the risk of four lines between Poe and Finn explaining what the gently caress is happening, because it is unclear how much of the audience were like literal intellectually disabled children and would loudly shut down over ALL THESE POLITICS IN STAR WARS AGAIN. Thanks. How much of the Star Wars extended universe still counts, then?
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Dec 26, 2015 23:01
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Delthalaz posted:Thanks. How much of the Star Wars extended universe still counts, then? There are two Star Wars EUs now. One is called "Legends" and nothing from it counts. Anything that isn't in the Legends line is considered part of the new EU.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:02
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Delthalaz posted:Thanks. How much of the Star Wars extended universe still counts, then? The only canon now is the seven movies, the Clone Wars TV show (the newer 3D animated one), and any novels, comics, or other EU materials made starting on, I think like, April 2014.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:08
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Pakled posted:The only canon now is the seven movies, the Clone Wars TV show (the newer 3D animated one), and any novels, comics, or other EU materials made starting on, I think like, April 2014. LOL wow I heard they cleansed the EU but I had no idea it was everything. Oh well, I guess the fanboys were pisses?
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Dec 26, 2015 23:15
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ImpAtom posted:There are two Star Wars EUs now. One is called "Legends" and nothing from it counts. Anything that isn't in the Legends line is considered part of the new EU. But none of the new EU is going to count if the filmmakers decide that it won't. So it's basically the exact same status quo as before except the new EU stuff doesn't reference the Legends material.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:16
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computer parts posted:But none of the new EU is going to count if the filmmakers decide that it won't. Yeah, this doesn't mean that the EU is going to be any more meaningful than it was before. If the movies want to do something that contradicts the EU the movies win 100% of the time.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:18
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Lloyd Boner posted:Also force choking isn't even inherently dark-side, since Luke chokes out some piggies in Jedi. uh this is sorta framed as Luke being a bit dark side
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Dec 26, 2015 23:20
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ImpAtom posted:Perhaps you should actually pay attention to the film before you go flip out like this. Since like ten people already told you that you are wrong I just want to go back to my first question which was how are people so bad at watching movies?
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Dec 26, 2015 23:27
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ImpAtom posted:Yeah, this doesn't mean that the EU is going to be any more meaningful than it was before. If the movies want to do something that contradicts the EU the movies win 100% of the time. To be fair, a lot of EU stuff becomes canon anyways. Like the name of Coruscant. Swoop Bikes. Heck, Mag Pulse weapons were from the Tie Fighter game, and weren't name dropped in movies until just now, and that's 'Legends' material.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:28
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D-Pad posted:Since like ten people already told you that you are wrong I just want to go back to my first question which was how are people so bad at watching movies? I'm sorry you are bad at watching movies, it is okay. (Edit: Seriously, what precisely do you expect to come from this post? "I am sorry Sir D-Pad! I humbly bow my head to you and beg your forgiveness for this, the most important discussions about the war of stars on the internet!") Dee Ehm posted:To be fair, a lot of EU stuff becomes canon anyways. Like the name of Coruscant. Swoop Bikes. Heck, Mag Pulse weapons were from the Tie Fighter game, and weren't name dropped in movies until just now, and that's 'Legends' material. Well, even beyond that, the current plot is "Luke and Leia's son became an evil sith for reasons he believes are right and justified and struggles with fighting against his family" which is exactly a plotline the EU was doing. A lot of people who work on Star Wars these days are some degree of Star Wars geek so it's pretty likely a lot of elements of the extended universe will either be grandfathered in or similar versions of them will be used. I doubt we'll get Thrawn but I wouldn't be surprised if at some point we get a genius alien tactician leader, possibly played by Beneditch Cumberbatch, as the villain of one of the spinoff movies. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Dec 26, 2015 |
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Dec 26, 2015 23:31
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ImpAtom posted:I'm sorry you are bad at watching movies, it is okay. That doesn't sound Hitlery enough for them. There can be only one bad guy for new movies and that is Hitler: wizard hitler or space hitler. Bad guys must always dress alike and march under red and black banners, raising their arms to shout "hail victory"
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Dec 26, 2015 23:38
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Surprisingly not all of the EU was purged like we assumed last year. KoTOR is apparently still canon to some degree as Rakata Prime is on the official canon map in the new TFA Visual Guide. Whether that ends up meaning anything remains to be seen but the planet Luke was on is very similar to Rakata Prime with the oceans separated by small islands.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:49
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I suspect that the degree of canonicity from here on out is gonna depend a lot on whether the masses like the thing or not. 
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Dec 26, 2015 23:52
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Surprisingly not all of the EU was purged like we assumed last year. KoTOR is apparently still canon to some degree as Rakata Prime is on the official canon map in the new TFA Visual Guide. Whether that ends up meaning anything remains to be seen but the planet Luke was on is very similar to Rakata Prime with the oceans separated by small islands. Certain elements of the Legends EU can be made canon without it meaning that every part of the referenced work is also canon.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:53
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I wouldn't be surprised if stuff from KoTOR gets name dropped. After all Luke was apparently looking for the first Jedi Temple or whatever so maybe thats the temple you gently caress around in during the game on Rakata Prime. Far more people are familiar with KoTORs plot than anything else in the EU as the game sold millions of copies and reached main stream appeal so it wouldn't just be the turbo nerds recognizing the reference.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:55
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Surprisingly not all of the EU was purged like we assumed last year. KoTOR is apparently still canon to some degree as Rakata Prime is on the official canon map in the new TFA Visual Guide. Whether that ends up meaning anything remains to be seen but the planet Luke was on is very similar to Rakata Prime with the oceans separated by small islands. kotor is a massive IP that is potentially profitable and generally well-liked.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:55
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I suspect with KOTOR it'll be a case of "this is broadly canon but not specifically canon." Like Darth Reven exists and stuff happened (because that is popular) but the EU in-references do not necessarily carry over. But honestly it is like I said earlier. They'll acknowledge these things but if it contradicts a movie script they won't care in the slightest and have the movie script take first priority.
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Dec 26, 2015 23:57
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One thing I really liked, thinking about it, is how Kylo is directed. A lot of people say that as soon as his mask comes off they can't stop seeing him as a whining doofus, and it's true. We first see him with his mask on. He stops blaster bolts mid air, he slaughters civilians, he destroys a whole town, and tortures Poe until he got exactly what he needed. This first half of the movie with his mask on, he is the confident badass, laughing at the non-force sensitive admiral. Then he succeeds in capturing Rey, and this is a Big Thing - but then he takes off his mask, and from the point on when the badass Sith was shown to be the petulant child he really was? Everything goes down hill for him. It's when he tries to be human, tries to be intimidating, tries to be more than the faceless mask that he fails and screws up.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:01
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Also you assume they'll just take things that worked and shove them back in, as long as they don't interfere with the main canon ie. the films. Putting a planet on a map that was in a videogame is less saying KOTOR has some relevance and more saying "It hasn't crossed into non canon completely YET"
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Dec 27, 2015 00:02
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In a way, the film did a FAR better job at depicting some Sith as being nothing more than emotionally unstable manchildren with control issues than the PT ever did. It's been that way ever since The Phantom Menace threw out vast chunks of EU lore by having things like Darth Vader building C-3PO. It's there as a placeholder until a movie comes out to establish what could have happened and if the EU and a movie contradict one another it's the movie that takes precedent. Some nerds just take it way too seriously and overthink it and act like KOTOR won't be tossed if Disney ever decides to make films from that era. Justin Godscock fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Dec 27, 2015 |
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Dec 27, 2015 00:03
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As far as I'm concerned the entire EU as we always knew it is gone forever so I don't care if they touch on some stuff only to then throw it out.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:08
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Anyone else read Ben stopping that blaster bolt as a sign of weakness, real or imagined? Vader gets shot at, he raises a hand and bounces the shots away. Ben gets shot at and he has to stop it cold. At first that seems like an impressive feat, but on further examination, doesn't that seem like a huge waste of effort? It gave me the sense, upon second viewing, that he either lacked the power to so easily deflect Poe's shot, or at the very least, lacked the confidence to try.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:21
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It's amusing how KOTOR basically depicts the galaxy in a sort of a technological and scientific stasis, everyone figured out all of the super advanced technological bullshit ages ago, every single planet on the galaxy is terraformed to some a degree and dark siders and light siders just keep going at each other on and on. When you think about it there have probably been hundreds of Death Stars and other similar weapons over the ages. That's why nobody really gives a crap about planetary scale genocide in that universe, poo poo just happens.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:21
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Victorkm posted:The wikis and such say that Kylo Ren used the dark side of the force in the movie but I didn't really see it. All the powers I saw him using were neutral powers like force pushing, move object, and mind tricking warped to be used for dark side goals. He doesn't even force choke a bitch, instead using move object to pull them to his grip. I guess maybe the mind probe torture stuff. I think the light/dark dichotomy comes moreso from intent; things like Force lightning are more considered dark side since they are an extension of evil action (torture). Jedi use the Force for things like knowledge and defense, so you don't need the body frying lightning in your day to day studies or protection. Since Ren is pushing people and mind tricking them to do bad things, he's tapping into the dark side to do so. When Obi Wan uses the mind trick it's to protect him and Luke plus their appliances.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:26
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Adder Moray posted:Anyone else read Ben stopping that blaster bolt as a sign of weakness, real or imagined? Well, to be fair, it also was a giant glowing blue ball of energy where Vader just blocked Han's crappy pistol shot. The blast that Ren blocked made a real big bang when it hit that piller.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:27
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The frozen blaster bolt was clearly meant to be a display of how powerful Kylo was, hence the reaction of Poe and the way the shot focused on it lingering. It was a, "holy poo poo, you guys in the audience never saw this trick before" moment.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:30
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ImpAtom posted:I'm sorry you are bad at watching movies, it is okay. No, it's just how can I have an intelligent conversation about the movie when the person on the other end misses some of the most basic facts the movie lays out? Like you continue to be wrong. It's Han and Leia's son not Luke's, and Kylo isn't a Sith he is the leader of the Knights of Ren.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:35
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emanresu tnuocca posted:It's amusing how KOTOR basically depicts the galaxy in a sort of a technological and scientific stasis, everyone figured out all of the super advanced technological bullshit ages ago, every single planet on the galaxy is terraformed to some a degree and dark siders and light siders just keep going at each other on and on. When you think about it there have probably been hundreds of Death Stars and other similar weapons over the ages. That's why nobody really gives a crap about planetary scale genocide in that universe, poo poo just happens. I largely agree, but it feels like the Death Star is something scary and new in ANH. It's the Star Wars universe entering the nuclear age.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:39
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The light side is rationality and dispassion. The dark side is passion and irrationality. Kylo is fronting when he throws his tantrums- he's trying to work himself up into calling on the dark. But it doesn't really work. He doesn't have the furious emotion necessary to do it. He is continually tempted by the light. But the light isn't good- Mas actually frames the dark as being the good half, but you need both.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:41
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A character in old Republic even warns the player against assuming that technology is stagnant. Even when the bullshit EU tells readers directly not to draw these conclusions they still do.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:42
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D-Pad posted:Like you continue to be wrong. It's Han and Leia's son not Luke's, and Kylo isn't a Sith he is the leader of the Knights of Ren. One was obviously a typo and I enjoy how you completely missed the point of the other. There is not, in fact, a meaningful difference as presented so far between "Han and Leia's son becomes a Sith" and "Han and Leia's son becomes a Ren" especially since we don't know anything about the Knights of Ren except that the master of their order really wants to be like Darth Vader who was a Sith. "Han and Leia's son becomes a dark side force user" is exactly the same thing in everything but name until we're told otherwise. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Dec 27, 2015 |
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Dec 27, 2015 00:44
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Adder Moray posted:Anyone else read Ben stopping that blaster bolt as a sign of weakness, real or imagined? The one time he actually does deflect a blaster bolt he does it in a pretty clumsy and uneconomical way, while kind of stumbling forward, and then he immobilizes his enemy's arm before she can fire another. I think he's just bad at it.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:47
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The EU was trying to do some really neat stuff with the nature of the force during The New Jedi Order series. It basically ends with the Jedi understanding that the force isn't split into two distinct moral types but is actually a lot more nuanced. Hence The Unifying Force. But a couple years later noted hack and Bug Orgy aficionado Troy Denning ruined literally everything.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:50
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Ferrinus posted:The one time he actually does deflect a blaster bolt he does it in a pretty clumsy and uneconomical way, while kind of stumbling forward, and then he immobilizes his enemy's arm before she can fire another. I think he's just bad at it. It also contrasts him with Rey, who uses the Force subtly, to hide and redirect. Or at least until she loses control during the lightsaber battle, at which point a giant chasm opens up between them.
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Dec 27, 2015 00:53
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