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MrYenko posted:C: Can't wait to finish this time based flow metering lesson so that we can never ever use it ever. I had to take that course as well. Even though I don't work in a Center. I kept thinking to myself "Surely this all works exactly as planned, controllers will LOVE it."
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Jan 1, 2016 00:16
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I loving wish we would move to using the departure metering. That way when flow launches three LGA arrivals at once we don't have to look like the incompetent dickholes.
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Jan 1, 2016 00:42
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I wish I knew more about Traffic Management. To me, it seems inevitable that delays will cascade as long as demand is high. Eventually, inefficiencies and unforeseen conditions (weather, winds) will cause all this elaborate metering to fail and result in jammed sectors anyway. Maybe departure metering, as you suggest, is the way to go. But they already do that via ground delay/en route spacing programs, right? It sucks that just too many people want to use the system at the exact same time. There's plenty of free airspace in between the rushes, but that's not where the most profitable ticket sales are, I suppose.
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Jan 1, 2016 00:57
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http://www.foxbusiness.com/industries/2015/12/30/reverse-discrimination-suit-filed-against-faa-hiring-fallout-continues/ Reverse discrimination suite filed on behalf of CTI students. It's basically "bbbbbut they said I would have a job and now I don't!" The FAA's new hiring practices are dumb, but I was never under the illusion that I was guaranteed a job at the end of my degree program. At least I got two for the price of one (dispatch and ATC) regardless of how useless they are. Didn't spend $40k either.
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Jan 1, 2016 17:44
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Pope Mobile posted:http://www.foxbusiness.com/industries/2015/12/30/reverse-discrimination-suit-filed-against-faa-hiring-fallout-continues/ The FAA was kind of shady about the whole thing, but no degree has ever guaranteed anyone a job and there was stuff that said that their hiring practices could change at any time. Most of the  I've seen has been about how it was discriminating against white people. Because we're so sorely underrepresented in the FAA.
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Jan 1, 2016 18:05
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The Ferret King posted:Maybe departure metering, as you suggest, is the way to go. But they already do that via ground delay/en route spacing programs, right? Possible, yes, but it requires our facility manager to actually allow her underlings to attempt to protect their controllers. We had a sup two days ago ask flow for 10MIT from approach for staffing because he didn't have anyone on break, and didn't have enough bodies to put D-sides on both our departure sectors, and instead of doing that, flow not only didn't give us any in-trail, but the OM put a CIC in charge and took the sup in the back to inform him that in-trail for staffing just isn't a thing they're going to do. We had two multiple-red sectors with no D-sides, at the time. Our management and TMU have a long and sordid history of just saying "thank you sir, may I have another," instead of actually standing up and saying "no, fuckers, that isn't going to work," and actually having a plan. The Ferret King posted:It sucks that just too many people want to use the system at the exact same time. There's plenty of free airspace in between the rushes, but that's not where the most profitable ticket sales are, I suppose. Hub-and-spoke connections are a bitch.
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Jan 1, 2016 19:43
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MrYenko posted:Possible, yes, but it requires our facility manager to actually allow her underlings to attempt to protect their controllers. We had a sup two days ago ask flow for 10MIT from approach for staffing because he didn't have anyone on break, and didn't have enough bodies to put D-sides on both our departure sectors, and instead of doing that, flow not only didn't give us any in-trail, but the OM put a CIC in charge and took the sup in the back to inform him that in-trail for staffing just isn't a thing they're going to do. We had two multiple-red sectors with no D-sides, at the time. Shut them off. You'd better have a valid reason because it's going to catch some attention, but multiple red sectors with no D sides available is probably going to be pretty good if there's anything else at all going on. Also, make sure you're ATSAPing that poo poo. Call for a D side, when you're told no, make sure it gets documented, stuff like that. Seriously, ATSAP the poo poo out of it. Also make sure it gets brought up to NATCA. They might just give you the run around or they might actually try to do something. Once again, ATSAP.
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Jan 1, 2016 20:22
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It was my RDO, so I wasn't personally in the crosshairs. Our area rep is hounding people to ATSAP things like that, and is mostly successful, but there seems to be very little movement from the union at the facility level. I have shut MIA off before, and the situation was bad enough that no one ever said a word to me, because they just let it get that bad, instead of being proactive.
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Jan 1, 2016 21:37
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MrYenko posted:It was my RDO, so I wasn't personally in the crosshairs. Our area rep is hounding people to ATSAP things like that, and is mostly successful, but there seems to be very little movement from the union at the facility level. There have been a few things that I should have filed an ATSAP on but didn't in regards to this kind of stuff and I won't let it happen again. Especially if I request a D side and am told no(I've seriously had an FLM tell me "Believe it or not, I'm the one that assigns work"). Gotta have this poo poo well documented for when something bad inevitably happens.
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Jan 1, 2016 22:52
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We ran out of codes.
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Jan 2, 2016 19:18
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MrYenko posted:We ran out of codes. Won't be the only time.
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Jan 3, 2016 08:23
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Yesterday was 10,600. Today's forecast is 11,200.
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Jan 3, 2016 13:06
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MrYenko posted:Yesterday was 10,600. Today's forecast is 11,200. That sounds terrible. Now I'm wondering what our highest count of last year was. Doubt it was anywhere near that.
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Jan 3, 2016 13:50
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According to the numbers management has on the control room info board (I don't know their provenance, and can't say to their accuracy,) Atlanta was #2 yesterday... ...With just shy of 8,600.
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Jan 3, 2016 15:20
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MrYenko posted:According to the numbers management has on the control room info board (I don't know their provenance, and can't say to their accuracy,) Atlanta was #2 yesterday... One of our sups is from Miami and he just had your guys' sector numbers pulled up. One of them had 51 airplanes. Multiple others were red at 10+ over the numbers. How the gently caress does that even work? There's absolutely no way that's safe.
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Jan 3, 2016 19:02
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I don't know what kinda poo poo you center guys are pulling, but 51 airplanes in a sector is criminal. Good for bragging rights, I guess, as long as nobody hits.
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Jan 3, 2016 19:16
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fknlo posted:There's absolutely no way that's safe.
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Jan 3, 2016 20:28
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fknlo posted:One of our sups is from Miami and he just had your guys' sector numbers pulled up. One of them had 51 airplanes. Multiple others were red at 10+ over the numbers. How the gently caress does that even work? There's absolutely no way that's safe. At ZJX, at the "Ocean" sectors (Torry/Metta/Knemo), it is all professional pilots in high performance planes at high altitude. All north and south bound. drat near ZERO crossing traffic. Because of the absolutely lack of complexity you can cram a LOT of planes in these kind of sectors and have your feet kicked up. Like, 30 planes and still approving IAFDOF without a lot of thought. The ultra-high sector this time of year having 50+ planes is a normal thing. I'd imagine the Miami center guys experience the same thing. The Ferret King posted:I don't know what kinda poo poo you center guys are pulling, but 51 airplanes in a sector is criminal. You'd have to see it in action to understand why some sectors can handle it (this isn't a knock at you, it's just a thing, trust me). Thirty planes in the Ocean is basically the equivalent to working the tower during a low-moderate departure push with no VFR traffic. Tommy 2.0 fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jan 3, 2016 |
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Jan 3, 2016 20:44
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It always depends on what the airplanes are doing, sure. MOAs that are full aren't too big a deal either. But 51? What's the radio congestion like on a sector like that?
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Jan 3, 2016 21:14
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The Ferret King posted:But 51? What's the radio congestion like on a sector like that? Our ocean sectors are something like 250mi by 200mi. Airplanes can go a LONG time between transmissions out there. I did just see our eastern high sector get to 28 airplanes. It's ~110mi long by maybe 30mi wide at its widest point.
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Jan 3, 2016 21:44
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The Ferret King posted:It always depends on what the airplanes are doing, sure. MOAs that are full aren't too big a deal either. If the rides/weather are clear you'd be sort of surprised how little congestion there is. If the rides/weather are bad then the sectors become an absolute freaking nightmare with comms. e: what Yenko said. Our ocean sectors are a ridiculous amount of airspace where planes only go straight and only want to go straight.
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Jan 4, 2016 00:05
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I've been seeing some of you posting about coming to the FAA HQ in OKC... If any of you all want an hour or two in a T-1 sim in Enid, Oklahoma, PM me about 7 days in advance (less is doable but not guaranteed) and I can probably make it happen. Not full motion but you can try approaches/formation/in flight refueling. Let me know! xaarman fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Jan 4, 2016 |
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Jan 4, 2016 00:13
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xaarman posted:I've been seeing some of you posting about coming to the FAA HQ in OKC... two_beer_bishes, if you don't jump on this man's offer like a starving cat on a flopping trout, I'm going to drive back to that poo poo-hole and kick your rear end.
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Jan 4, 2016 00:46
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MrYenko posted:two_beer_bishes, if you don't jump on this man's offer like a starving cat on a flopping trout, I'm going to drive back to that poo poo-hole and kick your rear end. wat  xaarman, I'll definitely take you up on the offer! Are weekends or weekdays better? I'm working 7-3:30 Mon-Fri until I'm done here (end of Feb). Can I bring a friend too?
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Jan 4, 2016 01:40
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M-F bankers hours only, the govvy sim operators aren't paid to work otherwise. If they have a valid government ID and are a US citizen, that's fine. It's for base access.
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Jan 4, 2016 03:04
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Does that apply to scummy regional pilots as well? Or only government employees?
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Jan 4, 2016 08:09
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xaarman posted:M-F bankers hours only, the govvy sim operators aren't paid to work otherwise. Well poo poo, that's going to be tough to arrange. I appreciate the offer and I'll keep it in mind if something changes with my schedule.
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Jan 4, 2016 23:12
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The Slaughter posted:Does that apply to scummy regional pilots as well? Or only government employees? You can too, but didn't think regional pilots would be that interested in a Beech 400 non moving sim. two_beer_bishes posted:Well poo poo, that's going to be tough to arrange. I appreciate the offer and I'll keep it in mind if something changes with my schedule. No problem.
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Jan 5, 2016 02:42
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xaarman posted:You can too, but didn't think regional pilots would be that interested in a Beech 400 non moving sim. That I can do aerial refueling and formation in? Sheeit. If I can have a chance at a sim that I can land on a carrier, I'd buy an airline ticket to get there. (If scummy charter pilots can go along with the scummy regional pilots)
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Jan 5, 2016 03:23
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xaarman posted:You can too, but didn't think regional pilots would be that interested in a Beech 400 non moving sim. Oh but it's always fun to gently caress around in a sim. Our sim instructors were far too serious and we didn't get to do poo poo extra. (and non moving sim is way better than moving sim. Moving sim= vomit oh god why is the motion cueing on the ground with the tiller so bad)
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Jan 5, 2016 03:31
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The Slaughter posted:Oh but it's always fun to gently caress around in a sim. And that's on a good day... The fact we get to fly under the bridge at Gatwick has nothing to do with causing the sim to crash...
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Jan 5, 2016 05:35
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 A day late, but: quote:On this day in 1952: The Civil Aeronautics Board inaugurated radar departure control procedures at the Washington air route traffic control center. Use of radar for approach began July 1, 1952. #TBT
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Jan 8, 2016 23:14
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Pictured equipment still in use today.
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Jan 9, 2016 03:40
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The Slaughter posted:Pictured equipment still in use today. This might be true at some of the lower level approach controls...
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Jan 9, 2016 03:44
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We just had a briefing that went over new TMU training procedures. For a while now any Tom, Dick, or Harry from any facility can come be TMU at a type of facility they've never worked at. No checkout or currency requirements outside of TMU. By the end of January they'll all have to get checked out on 2 sectors again for "experience". It doesn't seem like there's going to be any kind of currency requirement. So while I kind of get the "experience" argument, you're basically wasting several months worth of resources to check people out on sectors they never have to touch again. Have fun if you have the easiest sectors in the building? I guess their little experiment to fill TMU positions no one wanted hasn't worked out quite like they'd planned?
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Jan 11, 2016 18:37
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What's a TMU?
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Jan 11, 2016 20:04
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fknlo posted:The FAA was kind of shady about the whole thing, but no degree has ever guaranteed anyone a job and there was stuff that said that their hiring practices could change at any time. Most of the I would be pretty lovely if I'd done a degree in a very specific thing, funded by the only body that can hire me to do that thing (I presume?), and they promptly turned round and said 'nuh-uh don't need you any more'. It's not exactly a general qualification like Comp Sci after all.
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Jan 11, 2016 20:36
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simble posted:What's a TMU? Traffic Management Unit. It's a group of controllers who, instead of talking to airplanes directly, (are supposed to) work behind the scenes to ensure an even traffic flow through their area of responsibility. Centers each have one, and big terminal radar facilities generally have a smaller one. feedmegin posted:I would be pretty lovely if I'd done a degree in a very specific thing, funded by the only body that can hire me to do that thing (I presume?), and they promptly turned round and said 'nuh-uh don't need you any more'. It's not exactly a general qualification like Comp Sci after all. Anyone that is smart enough to go to college is smart enough to do the math between the annual hiring numbers and the number of CTI graduates every year. The program certainly has upsides, but mostly its a scam to funnel student loans into aviation college coffers.
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Jan 11, 2016 21:06
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Controllers working ground or clearance delivery: is it annoying when I ask for a clearance more than 30 minutes prior to departure time? (Assuming that I tell you that detail in the request)
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Jan 11, 2016 22:27
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vessbot posted:Controllers working ground or clearance delivery: is it annoying when I ask for a clearance more than 30 minutes prior to departure time? (Assuming that I tell you that detail in the request) It's not annoying at all. However, your clearance will not be immediately available. The flight data computer assigns a beacon code and prints your flight progress strip exactly 30 minutes prior to your proposed departure time. To get your clearance sooner, a simple amendment must first be made. If you hear "clearance on request, standby," this may be one of the reasons.
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Jan 12, 2016 00:43
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