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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Gonna laugh at this person on Reddit: Taking out a huge ship like this without having enough money for a rebuy seems like the stereotypical bad decision.
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Jan 10, 2016 17:37
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Sultan Tarquin posted:It'll turn into a bounty in 7 days, and then back into a legacy fine another 7 days after that I believe. Thanks. Libluini posted:Taking out a huge ship like this without having enough money for a rebuy seems like the stereotypical bad decision. I've only been playing for a week or so and I know to keep enough for a few re-buys. Hell, I have 10x more money in the bank than that guy did.
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Jan 10, 2016 17:51
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The Locator posted:I've only been playing for a week or so and I know to keep enough for a few re-buys. Hell, I have 10x more money in the bank than that guy did. Thing is, the ship he lost sans any equipment whatsoever costs something like one hundred eighty million dollars. He probably wiped his bank account to buy it and expected to use it to recoup his investment, which is a shockingly bad idea.
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Jan 10, 2016 17:54
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timn posted:2. Phone posting but it looks like you have the FSD disabled when hardpoints are deployed. This was bad before 1.5 because it caused you to have to wait for the retraction animation to finish before jumping, but is even worse now because of the module boot up times on top of that. This is a big problem if you need to make a quick getaway in an emergency. Quoting part of an old post on the topic of squeezing more power out of a combat ship so you can operate bigger guns and better KWS without shutting off the FSD, click to go to said post for more detail: Sard posted:Just did some testing to see how viable it is (after Horizons boot-up times) to toggle power between the KWS and your (secondary, heavier) guns. Interestingly, weapons do not have boot-up times at all. If you manually turn them off, they retract, but if you set them to a lower power priority and they are denied power as a result, they'll remain deployed but will not otherwise function when you press fire. In short, set power groupings so that you have scoops/interdictors/etc below the biggest guns, and the KWS/smaller (antishield, antifighter) guns above. Turn the KWS on for scans and off for when you need to start shooting your artillery.
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Jan 10, 2016 17:57
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KakerMix posted:Your other comments make sense but this one is pure opinion. Cannons punch up in damage and there is no size 4 multi cannon. I'll take fixed cannons over any same sized multi cannons in most hardpoint positions on most ships because a single high damage pop is more my jam then a constant stream of multis. Medium multicannons punch up quite well for larger ships and can also be used to absolutely shred smaller ships. This is important when tackling wings by yourself where you need to kill the smaller escorts ASAP to avoid getting dogpiled. They also are way more ammo efficient imo but this isn't so important anymore if you have horizons and use the ammo crafting. Medium cannons are usable but highly situational and not even all that amazing under ideal circumstances imo. Seriously, dual gimbal medium multicannons are like god's gift to PVE loadouts. EDIT: I realize what I said in my previous post was a little ambiguous. I only meant that given the choice between a cannon and a multicannon of the same size, definitely go for the multicannon. Don't put a class 2 multicannon in a class 3 or 4 slot. But honestly I'd urge anyone to consider redesigning their build to accommodate PACs before cannons if that's the case. I really wanted to love cannons but they're just very meh.  If Frontier buffed the projectile speed I'd feel way better about them.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:33
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I just want a size 4 multicannon to be like the minigun on the A-10. Make it fixed only and have it absolutely poo poo out bullets with a long reload time.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:41
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I just picked this up from the Steam sale, and while fun I'm getting frustrated. Sometimes the game freezes hard and I have to kill it via the task manager. I can play for a couple hours fine hours, but once it freezes once it seems to continually do it whenever I try to reboot the game. Is there any specific setting I have that are doing this? Searching just pulls up that other people are having the same problem but I'm not finding any answers.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:47
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Libluini posted:Taking out a huge ship like this without having enough money for a rebuy seems like the stereotypical bad decision. The even funnier thing to me is that his rebuy isn't even very big for a corvette. My python had a 10 mil rebuy, my corvette is ~30 mil. He barely had enough cash to buy the hull let alone equip it.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:51
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I would have thought that at the least you need enough money to buy the bare hull back; at least then you can sell that and refit something smaller.
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Jan 10, 2016 18:59
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timn posted:Two particular flaws with your loadouts: My bad, I never use military bulkheads and I actually completely forgot they exist. They cost a shitload of money, add a shitload of weight, and hull reinforcement packages apparently do a similar if not better job for a tiny fraction of the cost and weight. IMHO they're kinda in a bad place with the recent buffs to hull reinforcement packages and there's no real reason to put them in anything but a CZ specific or Strong Source Signal specific build where you will regularly get attacked by 6 or 7 enemies at once. Of course if you want to absolutely maximize your build then yes you're right, bulkheads bump the FdL price way higher since the military ones are almost as costly as the hull (46 for FdL, 17 for FAS) Agreed about the FSD, but since all 3 ships use size 6 power plants, if you just put a 6A in each one you have the same difference in cost, just add 10 millions to the price of all ships. I tend to use bi-weave shields so in my current FdL loadout (which is the one I posted except bi-weave shield) the FSD stays active, only the cargo + fuel scoop get deactivated when I deploy. In any case it's not THAT important, unless you get your rear end kicked often enough that it's a concern not being able to readily escape - especially considering that FdL and Clipper are fast ships, and the FAS has a good boost speed too so you can actually outrun pursuers if you put 4 pips in ENG while the FSD comes back online. For cannons ... sorry man we'll have to agree to disagree. I find that cannons are awesome and punch above their size so there's a real good reason to put them in size 2 hardpoints, they don't suffer damage penalties against large hulls. That alone is worth it since it's all you're going to use them on, no reason for wasting cannon shots on small ships since a couple large beams / 4 medium beams will melt those without trouble. Multicannons on the other hand do piddly damage, have an annoying spin-up time and they're not that accurate either in my (admittedly limited) experience with them.
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Jan 10, 2016 19:09
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uglynoodles posted:Things are going well now that I've had a few friends explain some things to me. I now know, for example, not to accept the Surface Recovery missions asking me to find occupied lifepods on the planet surface in under an hour because it's like trying to find a pin on a literal entire planet, and that is stupid and bad. I've read that the timer on the escape pod recovery missions was sometimes bugged and failing before the allotted time expired. It actually becomes easier and a decent way to earn credits when you are new once you figure it out. Basically what I do is zoom out, look for the blue circle, land, and look for crash signatures. The key is to ignore 'low' bars and rocky metallic sounds which are typically rocks and materials and look for middle and/or high bars and higher pitched sounds. If I find something like a base at the POI I just take off and go to the next one. The thing that makes them bearable is that usually you end up finding 2-4 escape pods which you can save and turn in to instantly complete other escape pod recovery missions. Also, almost every time I've taken both a 'find escape pod' and a 'find the salvage' surface mission they have both been at the same crash site. I've been thinking about taking screenshots of all the SRV returns for some kind of newbies guide to SRVs, but I haven't been playing long enough to feel like I've figured it all out yet.
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Jan 10, 2016 19:52
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timn posted:Medium multicannons punch up quite well for larger ships and can also be used to absolutely shred smaller ships.
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Jan 10, 2016 20:38
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TorakFade posted:My bad, I never use military bulkheads and I actually completely forgot they exist. They cost a shitload of money, add a shitload of weight, and hull reinforcement packages apparently do a similar if not better job for a tiny fraction of the cost and weight. IMHO they're kinda in a bad place with the recent buffs to hull reinforcement packages and there's no real reason to put them in anything but a CZ specific or Strong Source Signal specific build where you will regularly get attacked by 6 or 7 enemies at once. Of course if you want to absolutely maximize your build then yes you're right, bulkheads bump the FdL price way higher since the military ones are almost as costly as the hull (46 for FdL, 17 for FAS) I'd recommend always running military composite on at least the FAS. It's a significant increase in price but it has really high base armor already so the composite adds ~500 armor, which takes the armor from "great" to "ridiculous" and is what makes the FAS such a great hull tank.
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Jan 10, 2016 20:49
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Mercurius posted:When Kaker says 'punch up', what he's referring to is that Cannons do nearly full damage to the hull size 'above' them meaning that class 2 cannons will basically do full damage to large hulls whereas Multicannons have the standard damage penalty you get from using medium weapons to attack a large hull. Unless there was some radical change I missed in 1.5, medium multicannons also have good enough penetration to work well even against condas. That's why they're so universally useful. I'm puzzled because this wasn't a controversial statement at all earlier in this thread. They're maybe less effective with hull tanking more common now, but a pair of medium cannons isn't a magic solution to that problem either. In any case this feels more like a difference in competing philsophies at this point.
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Jan 10, 2016 20:52
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timn posted:EDIT: I realize what I said in my previous post was a little ambiguous. I only meant that given the choice between a cannon and a multicannon of the same size, definitely go for the multicannon. Don't put a class 2 multicannon in a class 3 or 4 slot. But honestly I'd urge anyone to consider redesigning their build to accommodate PACs before cannons if that's the case. I really wanted to love cannons but they're just very meh. Cannons fall into the zone of eternal nerf misery along with missiles and the Viper, because they were all too strong in beta and got gigantic knee jerk nerfs. Like missiles went from "destroy ships the same size of yours from full HP and shields without reloading" to barely even touching shields and don't do anywhere near enough hull damage to make up for it. Cannons were treated to the fine combination of a large damage nerf, a significant projectile speed nerf, and a noticable reduction to the proportion of their damage which is dealt to shields. The viper got its top speed slashed (IIRC it was over or at least very near to 500 m/s) and had its agility reduced as well, making it by far the least manoeuverable small fighter, although its cost saves it from being useless as it's still a huge upgrade from the Eagle etc. It's over a year later and we just recently got part of one of these nerfs partially reverted (missile shield damage) though I strongly suspect that they're still not very good vs shields. I like cannons and do use them occasionally but the projectile speed is really awful and it's something that you can't overcome by playing better, you just have to fly close enough that the target ship can't avoid the incredibly slow shots. RabidWeasel fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Jan 10, 2016 |
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Jan 10, 2016 20:56
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timn posted:Unless there was some radical change I missed in 1.5, medium multicannons also have good enough penetration to work well even against condas. That's why they're so universally useful. I'm puzzled because this wasn't a controversial statement at all earlier in this thread. They're maybe less effective with hull tanking more common now, but a pair of medium cannons isn't a magic solution to that problem either. Pretty sure he's referring to the flat damage penalty, e.g. small do full damage to small ships, but only 66% to medium ships and 33% to large. I have no idea if it's true, but he's saying cannons don't have that penalty (a size 1 cannon will do full damage to any size ship) while multicannons do (a size 1 multicannon will do only a fraction of its damage to anything larger than a small ship). Unless you're saying "multicannons have good enough armor penetration" to mean they don't have that penalty.
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Jan 10, 2016 21:02
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How do frag cannons factor in compared to the others? Should I want to concentrate max frag projectile on power plants etc via gimbals?
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Jan 10, 2016 21:03
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timn posted:Medium multicannons punch up quite well for larger ships and can also be used to absolutely shred smaller ships. This is important when tackling wings by yourself where you need to kill the smaller escorts ASAP to avoid getting dogpiled. They also are way more ammo efficient imo but this isn't so important anymore if you have horizons and use the ammo crafting. I guess we have a fundamental difference in opinion when it comes to PVE. Multicannons do not punch up like cannons do, that's an inherent advantage to cannons (rails just kind of ignore armor all together). If you are taking on wings by yourself your large lasers will easily take out the smaller craft and you wouldn't bother with ballistic weapons on them. Cannons and ballistic weapons in general, to me, are for large targets. That also ties right into 'ammo efficiency' as I never run out of cannon ammo before I need to leave for another reason. Since I'm not shooting my cannons at every target they tend to last quite a while. I haven't actually seen anyone bother with crafting ammo in Horizons, the amount of time you have to delicate to finding the materials (hours, easily) and being a slave to the RNG combined with the 'only good on a single magazine reload' aspect of the ammo crafting punts it right out into the 'lmao not even going to bother' category since I'd rather just take the 5-10 minutes it takes to go reload at a station to repair and also repair if need be. Maybe people are doing this, maybe you are doing this, but you'd be the first person I've seen doing it. Combat and planetary surface exploration are on opposite ends of gameplay style and Frontier doesn't seem to realize that if people want to shoot mans they might not want to dedicate hours of not shooting mans to do it. Actually reminds me a lot of when the game first launched and people would trade in order to have money to play the shooting part as you couldn't actually break even in combat  I knew what you meant, and I disagreed. I would take cannons in the same size over multi-cannons in most builds on most ships. TorakFade posted:For cannons ... sorry man we'll have to agree to disagree. I find that cannons are awesome and punch above their size so there's a real good reason to put them in size 2 hardpoints, they don't suffer damage penalties against large hulls. That alone is worth it since it's all you're going to use them on, no reason for wasting cannon shots on small ships since a couple large beams / 4 medium beams will melt those without trouble. Multicannons on the other hand do piddly damage, have an annoying spin-up time and they're not that accurate either in my (admittedly limited) experience with them. Like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32jILVwBJ5Y KakerMix fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Jan 10, 2016 |
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Jan 10, 2016 21:05
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Dandywalken posted:How do frag cannons factor in compared to the others? Should I want to concentrate max frag projectile on power plants etc via gimbals? I recommend only using fixed frag cannons, because according to Coriolis they do significantly more damage compared to gimbals, and honestly if you're close enough to use a shotgun then you're close enough to not need the aim correction. They're not actually that great for subsystem kills- they do massive damage if you fire them up close to a power plant, but a cannon is more reliable for this- but make up for it with enormous hull damage.
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Jan 10, 2016 21:06
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Dandywalken posted:How do frag cannons factor in compared to the others? Should I want to concentrate max frag projectile on power plants etc via gimbals? Frags completely demolish exposed hull. Get the largest class of frag cannon your ship can mount, get within 400 meters, and fire all three rounds to hit as much of the ship as possible. Precision doesn't matter when you can take 10% or more hull off of most ships the same class as the cannon (medium frags vs medium hull, large frags vs large hull, etc).
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Jan 10, 2016 21:06
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RVProfootballer posted:Pretty sure he's referring to the flat damage penalty, e.g. small do full damage to small ships, but only 66% to medium ships and 33% to large. I have no idea if it's true, but he's saying cannons don't have that penalty (a size 1 cannon will do full damage to any size ship) while multicannons do (a size 1 multicannon will do only a fraction of its damage to anything larger than a small ship). Unless you're saying "multicannons have good enough armor penetration" to mean they don't have that penalty. It's isn't quite like that. Like Mercurius said it's staged. A size 1 cannon will do full damage to medium ships, size 2 cannons will do full damage to large ships, but a size 1 cannon will have a penalty on a large ship.
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Jan 10, 2016 21:18
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KakerMix posted:It's isn't quite like that. Like Mercurius said it's staged. A size 1 cannon will do full damage to medium ships, size 2 cannons will do full damage to large ships, but a size 1 cannon will have a penalty on a large ship. Ah, good to know.
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Jan 10, 2016 21:23
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KakerMix posted:It's isn't quite like that. Like Mercurius said it's staged. A size 1 cannon will do full damage to medium ships, size 2 cannons will do full damage to large ships, but a size 1 cannon will have a penalty on a large ship. From what I've been told it's actually way more complicated than this and depends on the weapon's penetration value so I think it's better to just remember that some weapon types penetrate better than others and higher class weapons also penetrate better than lower class ones. Also unrelated but whoever made  you are a good person.
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Jan 10, 2016 21:44
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KakerMix posted:I guess we have a fundamental difference in opinion when it comes to PVE. Multicannons do not punch up like cannons do, that's an inherent advantage to cannons (rails just kind of ignore armor all together). If you are taking on wings by yourself your large lasers will easily take out the smaller craft and you wouldn't bother with ballistic weapons on them. Cannons and ballistic weapons in general, to me, are for large targets. That also ties right into 'ammo efficiency' as I never run out of cannon ammo before I need to leave for another reason. Since I'm not shooting my cannons at every target they tend to last quite a while. Hey, I wouldn't mind selling the useless crap I'm sure to find as soon as I start massing FSD-booster for my next long trip. As soon as Frontier gives us some kind of player trading mechanism, we explorers will be glad to sell ammo-refills.
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Jan 10, 2016 22:15
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YellerBill posted:I'd recommend always running military composite on at least the FAS. It's a significant increase in price but it has really high base armor already so the composite adds ~500 armor, which takes the armor from "great" to "ridiculous" and is what makes the FAS such a great hull tank. In 1.5 a 4D hull reinforcement gives +330 hitpoints, weighs 16 tons and costs about 200k iirc... And you can fit at least 2 in the FAS for 660 hp, 32 tons and 400k credits. So the 500 hitpoints from the military bulkheads for 87 tons and 17 millions looks like a really bad deal, unless there's something else going on. RabidWeasel posted:Also unrelated but whoever made OH GOD yessssss Libluini posted:As soon as Frontier gives us some kind of player trading mechanism, we explorers will be glad to sell ammo-refills. Hahahaha yeah right. Maybe in patch 77.3
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Jan 10, 2016 22:27
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TorakFade posted:So the 500 hitpoints from the military bulkheads for 87 tons and 17 millions looks like a really bad deal, unless there's something else going on. From the (admittedly small) amount of research I've put into this, it seems like bulkheads do give more than just an extra bit of armour, but armour in general is really difficult to test as damage dealt is very inconsistent and depends on where you hit the ship etc. I would always aim to get the largest bulkheads possible money no object but there's no way in hell I'm doing that on my FDL unless something drastic happens or they actually tell us what they do and it turns out that it's really good On the FAS I would probably make it a slightly higher priority as it gives a bigger benefit and costs less.
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Jan 10, 2016 22:55
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uglynoodles posted:I'm hearing that stuff like naming your ships and actually getting out and exploring the stations is coming? I hope that's a thing. It is a little disappointing to travel billions of miles to get to essentially an identical place with a different label on it. They've been wanting to do "get up and walk around the ship/station" since their pre-release "what's in the future for Elite?" video, but it's not planned for this "season" of DLC, so we won't see it for at least a year. Ship naming doesn't sound like it was a high priority for them, so who knows?
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Jan 10, 2016 23:04
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RabidWeasel posted:From the (admittedly small) amount of research I've put into this, it seems like bulkheads do give more than just an extra bit of armour, but armour in general is really difficult to test as damage dealt is very inconsistent and depends on where you hit the ship etc.
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Jan 10, 2016 23:09
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So anyone joining in on the alien hunt thats apparently happening with one of the developers mentioning that you should search out nebulae and 7 sisters? e- I wonder if they are just leading people on a chase or if things are actually there and needed to progress this.
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Jan 10, 2016 23:09
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So I gave up on the rare trading thing, because boring. Also it's not really that great of money, I timed a full diamond route run and it took 54 minutes in an Asp Explorer which could haul all the rares available on the route (peak run was 43 tons), and shaved about 4 jumps off of what the Cobra was taking. Made about 1.2~1.3 million, which is ok I suppose, it did get me into the Asp and outfit it nicely, but that boredom thing. So I went and traded the Asp Explore in on a Vulture, and then flew over and paid off my fines so they wouldn't become bounty's later, and in the process found a nice little system that has a Normal RES only 0.19ls from a station (Ki). There is also a LowRES and three Speaking of which, this is my current Vulture: http://coriolis.io/outfit/vulture/04A5A4A3D5A4D3C1e1e00000m03B2f428-24.Iw19kA==.CwBhwJjEEYYiBmRNimEA?bn=Current%20Vulture Ignore the big fuel tank, that was thrown on for traveling to pay off the fine, but the station here doesn't have any of these for sale, so I left it on, even though it does add weight, so that I'll have the range if I decide I want to move back to Xihe. Other than adding bulkheads and reinforcements as I get the cash, is there anything glaringly wrong? I am running the pulse lasers because the class 4 power plant really can't keep up well with beams, or even bursts, even with 4 ticks to weapons. Would I be better off with a gimbaled beam and something like a gimballed frag cannon, keeping in mind that I'm just RES hunting while trying to learn how to fly better (and not smash into asteroids). I am still really terrible at flying, so I need the gimbal mounts, and the large pulses chew through even Pythons in the Normal RES pretty well, and I've taken down a flight of three Imperial Eagles without a scratch and no police assist (I waited for the cops to try the Python, but I think I could have taken him too). The large pulses pop the Eagles in about 6 pulses or less, and Sidewinders die hilariously fast. For newbies like myself doing RES hunting, I found a great way to spot the bad guys in order to target them if you are confident taking on solo's without the cops, fly horizontal to the belt and watch for ships coming in from way above or way below the belt. About 90% of the time those have been pirates that I could intercept in the clear. The Locator fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Jan 11, 2016 |
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Jan 11, 2016 02:25
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Mercurius posted:It's actually the other way round (unless you buy the two even more expensive bulkheads that change the damage values of thermal and kinetic) where reinforced/military grade bulkheads multiply the base hull hp value only and hull reinforcements provide additional protection to modules in addition to the armour they give. That said, I've got milspec on my FDL and it's saved me 5 or 6 times in combat zones where everything started shooting me at once and I've just barely snuck out with sub 20% hull left so while it's not as effective as HRP, more hitpoints = better than.  for the amount you pay when compared to hull reinforcements, but yeah I'd definitely still throw it on if you can afford it since you never know when you need that extra health.Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Gonna laugh at this person on Reddit: 
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Jan 11, 2016 03:10
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I'm back from my exile in the elemental plane of mail, so tell me if there is anything that belongs in the OP regarding new stuff in horizons since I only skimmed each of the 40~ pages since I began my seasonal job at the end of November.
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Jan 11, 2016 03:18
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How much will a combat fit FAS compare to a combat fit FDL?
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Jan 11, 2016 03:58
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I've been holding off on playing this game since I both have a bunch of others on my plate and I was waiting for more depth to be added to the game. And now I've pre-ordered an Oculus Rift and will be ready to start playing as soon as it arrives.  I've been waiting for this experience for a long time.
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Jan 11, 2016 04:06
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Annath posted:How much will a combat fit FAS compare to a combat fit FDL? Price-wise, an A-class/milbulk FAS runs about 85,000,000. An FdL runs ~130M. As with every ship in the game, you can capably fit each of them for much less than it costs to A-class and get along just fine. Performance-wise, they are both very good. FAS is basically a bigger, meaner Vulture that turns way better than you'd expect from a ship that bulky. FdL isn't quite as nimble, but it has the big fuckoff C4 weapon slot and is faster. FAS has excellent armor, FdL has excellent shields. You can't really go wrong with either. I prefer the FAS. Inverness posted:I've been holding off on playing this game since I both have a bunch of others on my plate and I was waiting for more depth to be added to the game. Not that Oculus won't be supported, but Elite Dangerous is being touted as one of the premier titles for SteamVR and the Vive. What that ultimately means to the consumer, I have no idea.
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Jan 11, 2016 04:25
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Shine posted:What that ultimately means to the consumer, I have no idea.
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Jan 11, 2016 05:08
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Shine posted:Not that Oculus won't be supported, but Elite Dangerous is being touted as one of the premier titles for SteamVR and the Vive. What that ultimately means to the consumer, I have no idea.
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Jan 11, 2016 05:28
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Shine posted:Price-wise, an A-class/milbulk FAS runs about 85,000,000. An FdL runs ~130M. As with every ship in the game, you can capably fit each of them for much less than it costs to A-class and get along just fine. As far as I can tell the make or break point is you need to grind reputation to get the FAS. For the FdL you just need the $$$$. Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Jan 11, 2016 07:04
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That's true, but it's only like rank 5 that you need for it.
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Jan 11, 2016 07:08
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The Locator posted:Vulture questions
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Jan 11, 2016 07:55
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