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Wait, people have been putting out third party 5e stuff before this. What does this change beyond encouraging another d20 boom/bust?
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Jan 12, 2016 19:36
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OGL 2: d20 harder
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Jan 12, 2016 19:38
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Evil Mastermind posted:Wait, people have been putting out third party 5e stuff before this. What does this change beyond encouraging another d20 boom/bust? Well, this means that anyone can throw together 5e shovelware, which I'm sure will be wonderful for the market.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:38
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That's going to save Paizo a lot of work when they get around to doing Pathfinder 2nd edition.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:45
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Meinberg posted:Well, this means that anyone can throw together 5e shovelware, which I'm sure will be wonderful for the market. I was just thinking it's been a while since the last big RPG boom/bust.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:50
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Evil Mastermind posted:I was just thinking it's been a while since the last big RPG boom/bust. Also, in order to make sure that WotC makes more money off of the boom, you can sell your stuff through what is basically an official WotC OSR inprint. It looks like WotC will take about 15%, OneBookShelf will take 35%, and the remainder will go the writer which isn't terrible for them, but will have long term consequences, almost certainly.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:54
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There's a game store near me that still has a bookshelf full of 3.X stuff it'll never unload. Partially because they aren't dumping it in a dollar bin but are still charging full price, but also because most of it is garbage.
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Jan 12, 2016 19:59
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Evil Mastermind posted:There's a game store near me that still has a bookshelf full of 3.X stuff it'll never unload. Partially because they aren't dumping it in a dollar bin but are still charging full price, but also because most of it is garbage. Seriously? I mean, I know game store owners aren't as reliably equipped with business sense as other store owners, but... seriously? Two editions later, you still charge full price?
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Jan 12, 2016 20:02
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Well, it's one solution to WotC's inability to produce content. gently caress Faerun, though, can I write Planescape material? No? 
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Jan 12, 2016 20:03
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paradoxGentleman posted:Seriously? Honestly, I just find this OGL thing frustrating, particularly how everyone seems to have forgotten the whole d20 bust and how WotC pretty much handed Paizo the ability to make D&D's number one competitor.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:10
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Is 5e even selling that well? Because this seems like either a desperation move for attention, or them dumping it out there because it's not worth making official content for.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:10
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One of the local bookstores here still has The Foundation- A World in Black and White for full MSRP. It will be there long after the shop itself closes.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:10
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Alien Rope Burn posted:That's going to save Paizo a lot of work when they get around to doing Pathfinder 2nd edition. 
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Jan 12, 2016 20:11
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Evil Mastermind posted:There's a game store near me that still has a bookshelf full of 3.X stuff it'll never unload. Partially because they aren't dumping it in a dollar bin but are still charging full price, but also because most of it is garbage. The local game store here has a whole bottom shelf half full of 4E stuff. It's even marked down 75%! The only reason I don't buy it is I already have it. If it was still full price I imagine the shelf would be even more full.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:12
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paradoxGentleman posted:Two editions later, you still charge full price? 3x stuff never really waned when it should have. People bought it to show contempt for 4e, or to kludge into pathfinder. Now they're rare OOP relics of the first edition of D&D (ever played by most brand-loyal enthusiasts.)
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Jan 12, 2016 20:16
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Slimnoid posted:Is 5e even selling that well? Because this seems like either a desperation move for attention, or them dumping it out there because it's not worth making official content for. To me this comes off more as trying to get everyone to move from smaller platforms like Drive Thru RPG to their own D&D exclusive platform. "Don't distribute your stuff on those other websites, use ours and we'll provide you with support!" It's the same basic idea as the 3.X era, get everyone to just make stuff for D&D so it becomes the only game anyone plays. This time they're just fighting that fight online instead of on bookstore shelves.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:21
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From what little I've read in this here webforum it did not work the first time and is the whole reason Pathfinder exists. What makes them think it will be any better this time?
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Jan 12, 2016 20:25
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Misandu posted:To me this comes off more as trying to get everyone to move from smaller platforms like Drive Thru RPG to their own D&D exclusive platform. "Don't distribute your stuff on those other websites, use ours and we'll provide you with support!" It's the same basic idea as the 3.X era, get everyone to just make stuff for D&D so it becomes the only game anyone plays. This time they're just fighting that fight online instead of on bookstore shelves. Well, except Drive thru RPG isn't a 'smaller platform' in any way when it comes to online PDF sales and this is literally just another Onebookshelf specialty site, owned by the same company as owned by Drive thru RPG, so...
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Jan 12, 2016 20:26
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Slimnoid posted:Is 5e even selling that well? Because this seems like either a desperation move for attention, or them dumping it out there because it's not worth making official content for. It's the #1 game on Roll20 and Fantasy Grounds by a long shot.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:29
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A couple of quotes from the DM's Guild blurb that I find interesting:quote:While all types of content are welcome in the Dungeon Masters Guild, there are certain types of content we think are more in demand by players, and we will therefore tend to promote it more prominently on the DMsGuild marketplace. Primarily, we’d like to see short adventures that can be run in a single session, especially ones that can complement larger campaigns already published by Wizards (e.g., Rage of Demons). Also in demand are fifth edition conversions of monsters absent from the fifth edition Monster Manual and new backgrounds for players to use with their characters. Again, we’d like to emphasize content that would be useful for other D&D players looking to expand on existing official storylines, such as a collection of demons useful for Rage of Demons. At the end of the day, though, the best content for you to write is the content you’re inspired to create. The Realms is a big place. We look forward to seeing what you create for it! (my emphasis) quote:Can I distribute or sell my Dungeon Masters Guild title other places? They're outsourcing their shovelware, and they're trying to enforce an exclusivity clause while they're at it. If there's one thing the Tournament of Rapists bollocks taught us, it's that we need less exclusivity in the RPG marketplace, not more.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:30
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Alien Rope Burn posted:Well, it's one solution to WotC's inability to produce content. Yeah, Dark Sun? Eberron? Nope, only Faerun exists.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:33
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I sold my d20 collection for over $1000. There's still a market for it... at the right price. I even dumped dogs like Legends of the Samurai or The Essential Guide to Elves. You just have to know what it's worth, which often isn't much. Still, there were some books, like Ravenloft d20, that I actually made a profit on.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:35
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paradoxGentleman posted:From what little I've read in this here webforum it did not work the first time and is the whole reason Pathfinder exists. What makes them think it will be any better this time? D&D's popularity only really waned near the beginning of the 4e Essentials line. Before then, the D&D was still untouchable especially when 3.5 was the current edition. It worked perfectly until they tripped over their dick near the end, so all Mearls has to do is not alienate fans of 5e if a new edition is released.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:36
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Inkelsspen dug out the the license agreement for the DM's Guild for those that want to take a look at the exact terms in use.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:36
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paradoxGentleman posted:From what little I've read in this here webforum it did not work the first time and is the whole reason Pathfinder exists. What makes them think it will be any better this time?
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Jan 12, 2016 20:40
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unseenlibrarian posted:Well, except Drive thru RPG isn't a 'smaller platform' in any way when it comes to online PDF sales and this is literally just another Onebookshelf specialty site, owned by the same company as owned by Drive thru RPG, so... Didn't realize that! Then I'm going with: potatocubed posted:They're outsourcing their shovelware, and they're trying to enforce an exclusivity clause while they're at it. If there's one thing the Tournament of Rapists bollocks taught us, it's that we need less exclusivity in the RPG marketplace, not more.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:40
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Meinberg posted:Inkelsspen dug out the the license agreement for the DM's Guild for those that want to take a look at the exact terms in use. Wow. I'm not an expert in these things, but what little I know is telling me that is some bullshit.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:45
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People are going to be loving tripping over themselves to publish 5e content and have WotC take a cut, while other OGL games like 13th Age and Fate Core let you release stuff without having to pay them and get maybe two third-party releases a month. I mean, I know 13A and Fate are doing really well, but still.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:52
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potatocubed posted:Wow. You surrender all rights to your material for a promise that they'll pay you if they make a profit from it. However you're forbidden to sue them if they don't. How is that unfair? 
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Jan 12, 2016 20:53
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Also you can't unpublish it once it's done, and if you do just blank everything and stop selling through them everything you made is still open content that other people can use (and republish) if they have the details lying around. E: 'Other people' in this case including Wizards.
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Jan 12, 2016 20:56
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So WotC takes 50% of the PDF and print sales of anything you publish through this whole system? How does that compare to OBS's normal cut if you publish just "on your own"?
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Jan 12, 2016 21:08
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potatocubed posted:Tournament of Rapists bollocks You can't drop a bomb like this without an explanation or a link.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:10
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OBS give you 70-75% (I forget) if you're exclusive with them, or 60% if you're non-exclusive.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:10
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e: ^ ^ Yeah, I forgot I could just go to DriveThru and read about it in plain language. So going by their website the normal OBS payout is 70% of the cost of a PDF product if you sell exclusively through them. So I write something, charge $20 for it, and I get $14 per sale. Going through this program, I only get 50%, so $10/sale. On top of that, it looks like WotC retains a bunch of control over my product, right? Is this the new "we're paying you in exposure"?
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Jan 12, 2016 21:15
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Evil Mastermind posted:Is this the new "we're paying you in exposure"? It's 100% this. They want people to gamble on being able to make more money selling at 50% through their store than 70% on their own.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:17
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Kurieg posted:Yeah, Dark Sun? Eberron? Nope, only Faerun exists. Forgotten Realms needs fanwank material like the sun needs a space heater, but it's the IP they've put all their marbles into. Granted, I don't think letting beloved settings lie fallow makes a lot of sense anymore as it is, given how the market's been changed by PoD and crowdfunding. If Exalted could make over a million, how much could Dark Sun make? But yeah, the Dungeon Master's Guild is a pretty awful deal and only really worth it if you have 60,000 words you're going to write about the Dungdales either way and you may as well get some sandwich change out of it. I have lots of old Planescape material I wouldn't mind warming up and getting some money for because it already exists, but I don't know if even that would be worth every my time.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:18
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Haha oh man I understood barely anything in that contract, know zilch about self-publishing, and still caught that on my own. It really is morally wrong to allow suckers to keep their money. e: I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but they're basically letting you pay them for the honor of being on the "official" D&D webstore. Evil Mastermind fucked around with this message at 21:21 on Jan 12, 2016 |
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Jan 12, 2016 21:18
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Yeah, there's no real point to it unless you just have to use the Realms.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:25
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I wrote up some commentary on the DM's Guild agreement too, in case anyone cares. (Feel free to put that in tweets or whatever.)
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Jan 12, 2016 21:28
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Dr. Tough posted:It's the #1 game on Roll20 and Fantasy Grounds by a long shot. That doesn't really surprise me given that it's D&D, but I mean in terms of sales. I don't know anyone who is actually playing Next--they're all either sticking with 3.PF or doing other, non-D&D games. No LGS nearby is running any games of Next insofar as I can tell. Admittedly I stopped paying attention to Next some months ago so I'm a bit out of the loop.
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Jan 12, 2016 21:29
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