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Combat Pretzel posted:I think it was the Revelation Space series that tried to explain it away with a subsurface cooling system and central heat storage? Or was it in The Expanse, too? My memory's kinda flaky. Mass Effect also did the whole heat storage stealth thing for the Normandy, IIRC.
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Jan 24, 2016 22:48
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Zeris posted:I felt surprised when I noticed his Martian Texan accent. Like he was suddenly making it really obvious and noticeable. Was I just not paying attention for the first few episodes? I would bet you a penny you didn't start noticing this until after he's shown in his Martian Navy uniform and you realize he's not actually semi-Mexican, the cap and headphones he was wearing up to that point really obscured that. VVV I think a big part of Alex's character is that he's a very fake person, the accent is part of that. VVV Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Jan 24, 2016 |
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Jan 24, 2016 23:03
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I don't recall any of the other Martians speaking with anything but a neutral accent. I thought he was just playing it up to sound like a friendly folksy gas freighter pilot.
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Jan 24, 2016 23:16
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Professor Shark posted:So far the pacing is glacial: it makes Game of Thrones feel fast paced, and that show gets a lot of criticism for being slow. I think the pacing is perfect, the show is built on some very strong metaplot so it doesn't have to distract the viewer from the lack of such with a bunch of colorful fast-moving fluff. CQB (the battle on the Martian ship Donnager) was the fastest-paced episode and while it was great to watch, I actually thought Windmills (the Donkey Balls episode) has been the most satisfying for me even though there is practically no action. Even in the slow parts the production team takes a lot of trouble to make everything interesting to look at, cool camera angles, really well-done sets. Yes it's a weekly television serial so I don't expect Goodfellas for every second of running time but the show tries a lot harder and succeeds much more than pretty much every other show out there. Can you point to any serialized shows that you actually do like? Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Jan 24, 2016 |
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Jan 24, 2016 23:20
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Re: Amos actor, appearance-wise I can't stop seeing him as a ten-years-younger Chief Tyrol from BSG, surely I'm not the only one?
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Jan 24, 2016 23:21
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Pompous Rhombus posted:Re: Amos actor, appearance-wise I can't stop seeing him as a ten-years-younger Chief Tyrol from BSG, surely I'm not the only one? Yeah there's a weird resemblance. Coincidentally Tyrol just appeared as The Turtle on Flash: 
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Jan 24, 2016 23:25
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Pellisworth posted:I don't recall any of the other Martians speaking with anything but a neutral accent. If I remember right it's only the Mariner Valley settlements on Mars that speak with a Texan accent since the the settlers mainly came from Texas and India.
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Jan 24, 2016 23:33
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Oh or that I guess.
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Jan 25, 2016 00:11
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johnsonrod posted:If I remember right it's only the Mariner Valley settlements on Mars that speak with a Texan accent since the the settlers mainly came from Texas and India. Cool thanks, I haven't read the books. Makes sense that he would play it up thinking it'd make the Martian patrol less suspicious or something. also lol at him looking "semi-Mexican"
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Jan 25, 2016 00:11
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Flesh Forge posted:Can you point to any serialized shows that you actually do like? The Leftovers and The Affair were my two favorite shows this year, Mad Men as well, but I liked the mid seasons better than the early and later ones. johnsonrod posted:If I remember right it's only the Mariner Valley settlements on Mars that speak with a Texan accent since the the settlers mainly came from Texas and India. I think it was mostly Chinese and Indians, as well as a group of Texans? I remember specifically some talk of how the Chinese lived really lovely, cramped lives for several generations on Mars before they were able to create more open spaces. Oh wait, you mean a specific regions of Mars. I don't know, the books just refer to a Martian drawl every time a Martian is introduced, I thought Professor Shark fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Jan 25, 2016 |
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Jan 25, 2016 00:25
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The wiki says Mariner valley was settled largely by Chinese, Indian, and Texan colonists and are known for speaking with a Texan drawl. I guess it's kind of weird for a non book reader since I don't remember hearing any of the other Martians with an accent. It's pretty much just generic American English and Belter-speak.
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Jan 25, 2016 00:34
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I can't figure out what accent Anderson Dawes has but it owns.
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Jan 25, 2016 00:39
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Professor Shark posted:The Leftovers and The Affair were my two favorite shows this year, Mad Men as well, but I liked the mid seasons better than the early and later ones. And you think the pacing is too slow in Expanse?  Boing posted:I can't figure out what accent Anderson Dawes has but it owns. The actor is straghtforwardly British but I'm pretty sure a lot of the "Belter Accent" is patterned after Africa/Congo type speech accents in English-speakers. I don't know the books at all so probably there's another explanation because I am always, always wrong about this stuff.
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Jan 25, 2016 00:46
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Flesh Forge posted:The actor is straghtforwardly British but I'm pretty sure a lot of the "Belter Accent" is patterned after Africa/Congo type speech accents in English-speakers. I don't know the books at all so probably there's another explanation because I am always, always wrong about this stuff. It's belter creole meaning it's basically an absolute mismash of a giant amount of Earth languages. Chinese, German, Portugeuse, Spanish, Hungarian, etc have all shown up so far.
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Jan 25, 2016 00:50
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Grand Fromage posted:There are reasons, they just haven't gone into it in the show. I'll spoiler tag anyway but there's no plot info in here, just setting: Basically, Earth is a resource depleted husk with 30 billion people, more than half of which subsist on what they call Basic. They do nothing useful for society and are just kept alive by the government though a kind of welfare system. So Earth gets a lot of its resources from the Belt--the reason it was colonized in the first place. Mars is in the middle of trying to terraform the planet and for that purpose they mine the asteroids for the resources they use for the terraforming. The Belters started as miners for the inner planets and now they want to be free. Colonies wanting to break away from the home country essentially. The Belt isn't really self-sustaining though, so that adds a level of complexity to the whole thing. They hate Earth and want to be free but also rely on Earth more than they're willing to admit. Well that seems to be information that would be very valuable to show when they are trying to build up the oppression that Belters suffer. I wonder why they haven't gone there. So far I've pegged the main conflict between Earth and Mars that Mars is primarily a survivalist culture where every resource is valued and recycled, nothing is wasted and they take pride in this. Whereas on Earth people live off Basic in their billions and contribute nothing. Mars resents Earth but there doesn't seem to be any real cause for Earth to actively hate Mars so it seems they are the main antagonists in the cold war. Again however the asteroid belt is vast and there's no reason both planets can't have the resources they need if they scale up production. The fact that belters subsist off ice mining from another planet is weird to me since there should be tons of ice in the belt too. A lot of the plot presented in the show falls apart under scrutiny unless you assume massive incompetence from all sides.
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Jan 25, 2016 01:06
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Demiurge4 posted:massive incompetence from all sides This is the story of human civilisation and, by extension, a core part of the setting of The Expanse
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Jan 25, 2016 01:17
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Demiurge4 posted:The fact that belters subsist off ice mining from another planet is weird to me since there should be tons of ice in the belt too. This is brought up by one of the rioters in the first couple episodes; Ceres had enough water on it for hundreds of years of consumption by its inhabitants but that was mined away decades before and sent to Mars and Luna. Earth resents Mars because they have a better equipped and armed Navy (which is why the Donnegar getting blown up is such a shock to the system); Mars resents Earth because it has an all around bigger Navy. Outside of piracy there's pretty much no war in system because the ease in which humanity could be destroyed is known by all parties. Party Plane Jones fucked around with this message at 01:49 on Jan 25, 2016 |
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Jan 25, 2016 01:47
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Demiurge4 posted:A lot of the plot presented in the show falls apart under scrutiny unless you assume massive incompetence from all sides. I am totally fine with elements of the story being cinematic hogwash, it's a very good Space Gumshoe show. I can't think of anything quite like the Miller subplots, maybe it's a bit similar to Outland (a really bad movie with some very cool things in it).
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Jan 25, 2016 03:00
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Party Plane Jones posted:This is brought up by one of the rioters in the first couple episodes; Ceres had enough water on it for hundreds of years of consumption by its inhabitants but that was mined away decades before and sent to Mars and Luna. Earth v Mars really isn't about the military, in the big picture. Earth set up the Mars colony, they declared themselves independent not too long before the events of the show. Earth in general is angry that they spent all sorts of money and resources setting up a colony that they don't even own anymore, and can't reap any potential benefits (tech falls in here). Mars is pissy because Earth has a whole livable planet, and all we can do is trash it and take it for granted.
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Jan 25, 2016 03:13
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xsf421 posted:Earth v Mars really isn't about the military, in the big picture. Earth set up the Mars colony, they declared themselves independent not too long before the events of the show. Earth in general is angry that they spent all sorts of money and resources setting up a colony that they don't even own anymore, and can't reap any potential benefits (tech falls in here). Mars is pissy because Earth has a whole livable planet, and all we can do is trash it and take it for granted. Mars is also a society with the utopian vision of terraforming the whole planet while Earth is basically a vast stagnating welfare state.
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Jan 25, 2016 03:14
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You'd think that Mars and the Belters would be natural allies then, considering their colonial roots. I'm also really enjoying the detective story but like I've said earlier anything that goes on down on Earth is just completely meh, not just because the plot is boring but also because I don't like any of the actors.
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Jan 25, 2016 03:25
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Earth politics would feel a little more relevant if there was any influence on the protagonists' plotlines by earth actors. I'm sure once the season is done, it will be easier to appreciate, but at the moment I watch the earth politics unfold and mostly don't care (within the episode). Also, two moments of hand-waving I could have done without: -In the UN room: the Sherlock-Holmes style deduction that Mars couldn't have destroyed the ice freighter, simply based off tracking the info leak. The writing was too didactic, and unrealistic that the whole room of characters immediately accepted the leader's hunch. For a room of diplomats, there should have been a bit more squabbling, especially considering the consequences of opposing conclusions. -In the docking tube between OPA's Cuddy (from the Wire, forgot his name) and skinny italian captain (James whatever) and homeboy - Cuddy immediately deducing the total combat power of the Martian ship, and TALKING US THROUGH HIS LINE OF THOUGHT ON THE COMPOSITION AND DISPOSITION OF THE SHIP CREW POINTING GUNS AT HIS HEAD, STAY WITH ME BOYS, was again too didactic, lazy, and worst of all -- unnecessary(!) for resolving that conflict while showing a little of his character. Despite minor nitpicks (this is really all I have to bitch about so I am making the most of it) I feel this is on track to upset BSG as the best Sci Fi series.
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Jan 25, 2016 03:58
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Started the show and caught up this week. Had never heard of the books so i'm coming to it fresh. Liked it a lot. If you're interested in reading some authors' thoughts on Hard vs Soft SF: quote:Ten Authors Weigh In On ‘Hard’ vs. ‘Soft’ SF
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Jan 25, 2016 03:58
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Zeris posted:-In the UN room: the Sherlock-Holmes style deduction that Mars couldn't have destroyed the ice freighter, simply based off tracking the info leak. The writing was too didactic, and unrealistic that the whole room of characters immediately accepted the leader's hunch. For a room of diplomats, there should have been a bit more squabbling, especially considering the consequences of opposing conclusions. As far as the deduction being implausible, it's clear that Avasarala planted the information with the ambassador specifically hoping to provoke the response she got. If the Martians aren't supplying tech to anyone, then informing them (through what looks like an innocent slip of the tongue) that earth thinks that stealth materials were stolen will cause them to investigate to find out if something is missing. She saw the thing she was looking to see, and made the conclusion she was ready to make. quote:-In the docking tube between OPA's Cuddy (from the Wire, forgot his name) and skinny italian captain (James whatever) and homeboy - Cuddy immediately deducing the total combat power of the Martian ship, and TALKING US THROUGH HIS LINE OF THOUGHT ON THE COMPOSITION AND DISPOSITION OF THE SHIP CREW POINTING GUNS AT HIS HEAD, STAY WITH ME BOYS, was again too didactic, lazy, and worst of all -- unnecessary(!) for resolving that conflict while showing a little of his character.
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Jan 25, 2016 04:34
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akulanization posted:That is supposed to be a big reveal, to drag out the scene with squabbling would have ruined the impact they were going for. Suddenly we've gone from a dangerous, but familiar, problem to one where everyone is completely in the dark. Someone is still out there trying to start a war, but now they are a complete mystery. Yeah you're not wrong in either case, I just found them over-written. Whereas the show's strength is knowing when to under-write the serious moments to let us figure it out ourselves, rather than spoon-feeding it and going full on George Lucas Midichlorians, I felt these two scenes were missing that particular strength.
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Jan 25, 2016 04:51
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Boing posted:This is the story of human civilisation and, by extension, a core part of the setting of The Expanse Yep. A lot of the plot is driven by groups of humans being self-serving, short-sighted idiots, but realistically so.
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Jan 25, 2016 05:34
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Demiurge4 posted:You'd think that Mars and the Belters would be natural allies then, considering their colonial roots. I'm also really enjoying the detective story but like I've said earlier anything that goes on down on Earth is just completely meh, not just because the plot is boring but also because I don't like any of the actors. The reason Mars and Belters wouldn't naturally get along is because Mars requires massive outside resources to build their vision and pays a high price for anything lost. There's an internal pressure there to get as many resources as they can from the belt for as little "paid" as possible. They're also a colony of scientists, engineers, and soldiers and, like Earth, they probably consider the belt to be a trashy collection of outcasts who are necessary trading partners for now. As soon as they have complete self-sufficiency, they'd basically only partner with the belt if they could get their poo poo together and offer something beyond natural resources. I imagine Earth is supposed to be "stereotypically American." Blissfully unaware of what is going on beyond their own affairs and trusting to their government and military to do whatever is necessary (ethical or otherwise) to keep them comfortable. As the Persian UN rep and her buddy show, their leadership is definitely willing to cross whatever lines are necessary to keep Earth in a good state of affairs.
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Jan 25, 2016 05:42
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Demiurge4 posted:Well that seems to be information that would be very valuable to show when they are trying to build up the oppression that Belters suffer. I wonder why they haven't gone there. The asteroid belt is vast in terms of space covered but actually not that massive. The entire belt has 4% the mass of the moon with half of that being in just 4 asteroids (Ceres, Vesta, Pallas, and Hygiea).
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Jan 25, 2016 06:06
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CalvinandHobbes posted:The asteroid belt is vast in terms of space covered but actually not that massive. The entire belt has 4% the mass of the moon with half of that being in just 4 asteroids (Ceres, Vesta, Pallas, and Hygiea). The other thing they haven't really gotten across in the show is the whole OPA thing. That's the "outer planets alliance" which is more than the asteroid belt. The three factions are more realistically: Earth, Mars, Everything from the belt on out. Granted, that still isn't a ton of people, but it is more than the lovely little station on Ceres and the ice in Saturn's rings that has been the entire backdrop so far.
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Jan 25, 2016 07:29
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CalvinandHobbes posted:The asteroid belt is vast in terms of space covered but actually not that massive. The entire belt has 4% the mass of the moon with half of that being in just 4 asteroids (Ceres, Vesta, Pallas, and Hygiea). The big difference between asteroid resources and a planet/moon is that you don't have to drill through a thousand miles of rock to get to the good stuff, or move it in and out of major gravity wells.
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Jan 25, 2016 11:42
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They haven't really mentioned it yet but there are also major colonies around Jupiter and Saturn. Uranus and Neptune are so far away that not much is going on out there. I think there's a science station at Uranus but that's it.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:03
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Flesh Forge posted:The big difference between asteroid resources and a planet/moon is that you don't have to drill through a thousand miles of rock to get to the good stuff, or move it in and out of major gravity wells. I've been reading up on the asteroids and Ceres really does seem like a great spot for mining. Probably not worth colonizing it but until now I was under the impression that the asteroid belt was pretty dense with rocks and a hugely volatile area of space.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:07
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If you're sending people there at all to do stuff then they'll be a colony in every practical sense, you don't really commute across the solar system.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:11
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Demiurge4 posted:Probably not worth colonizing it but until now I was under the impression that the asteroid belt was pretty dense with rocks and a hugely volatile area of space. Yeah the way asteroid belts are shown in most sci-fi is totally wrong. It'd be rare to be able to see any other asteroid if you were on one, they average around a million kilometers apart. Planetary rings, on the other hand, are dense and dangerous and similar to the classic asteroid belt. They're ridiculously thin but if you tried to travel through Saturn's rings you'd probably get obliterated. Certainly if you were going lengthwise through them you'd be hosed. They're so thin you might make it going from top to bottom.
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Jan 25, 2016 12:13
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Grand Fromage posted:They haven't really mentioned it yet but there are also major colonies around Jupiter and Saturn. Uranus and Neptune are so far away that not much is going on out there. I think there's a science station at Uranus but that's it. They alluded to "Ganymede Station" at one point is all I can remember, but I feel like I heard something that rang a "Saturn" bell at one point too. Kind of wondering if the timing/positioning of the different bodies orbits will have any plot relevance, or if the Epstein drive stuff makes it irrelevant. That's me thinking out loud and not asking for spoilers, book readers 
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Jan 25, 2016 14:08
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Demiurge4 posted:You'd think that Mars and the Belters would be natural allies then, considering their colonial roots. I'm also really enjoying the detective story but like I've said earlier anything that goes on down on Earth is just completely meh, not just because the plot is boring but also because I don't like any of the actors. Mars still has billions of people and is even more dependent on the Belt's resources then Earth. It was colonizedc by scientists and soldiers, not low-class workers.
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Jan 25, 2016 14:09
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Pompous Rhombus posted:They alluded to "Ganymede Station" at one point is all I can remember, but I feel like I heard something that rang a "Saturn" bell at one point too. Yeah the episode before last mentioned Phoebe, which is a moon of Saturn. Ganymede is a big settlement since it has a magnetic field. The Epstein drive is basically just a super efficient fusion rocket engine, it still follows reasonable physics. Getting out to Neptune is a multi month trip. So it's good but space is still really big.
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Jan 25, 2016 14:48
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Something else that's sort of neat is the presence of the sun - if the orbits between two points are opposite the sun, obviously you need to go around it, avoiding flares and managing heat.
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Jan 25, 2016 15:25
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Was it mentioned in the show what year it is? I can't remember, but billions on Mars is a real eye-popper for me. EDIT: not in the "pfffft yeah right" sense, just in the "OH, this show is a bit further in the future than I realized"
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Jan 25, 2016 16:07
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The books studiously do not make any mention of the year but the show said 200 years in the future, which I'm ignoring because it seems absurdly short. I've mentally been assuming like 25/2600s in the books. Edit: The only time reference I can find is the Epstein drive was invented 150 years before the beginning of the series. And it was invented by a guy from Mars, when Mars was already heavily colonized, so the 200 year timeline on the show is even more weird. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Jan 25, 2016 |
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Jan 25, 2016 16:11
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