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Firstborn posted:Is it okay to think the prequels are awful loving movies regardless of their importance to Star Wars? That's where I'm at. The movies are bad. I give you my permission to believe this, but I encourage you to make the effort to reconsider.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:29
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Your response is totally expected, but at least the rest of the thread can peruse those quotes. As an aside, here's the scene where the Jedi arrest Palpatine(the conceit is that this is an audio recording from Palpatine's office):RotS Novel posted:PALPATINE: Really, Master Windu, you cannot be serious. On what charge?
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Feb 3, 2016 22:29
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Waffles Inc. posted:now do one where mace is angry and anakin is thinking Palpatine used the Dark Side to create the Dark Side cloud and was using Force Clouding to make the Jedi total idiots who can't see he's evil. I know how stupid this sounds. I am not defending it. It is however far more canonically established than prequel fanboy apologism. I am sorry about your emotional investment in hackneyed garbage, but this is the case
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Feb 3, 2016 22:31
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Beeez posted:Your response is totally expected, but at least the rest of the thread can peruse those quotes. As an aside, here's the scene where the Jedi arrest Palpatine(the conceit is that this is an audio recording from Palpatine's office): Yeah let's take loving Palpatine's word for it
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Feb 3, 2016 22:32
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Tezzor posted:Palpatine used the Dark Side to create the Dark Side cloud and was using Force Clouding to make the Jedi total idiots who can't see he's evil. I know how stupid this sounds. I am not defending it. It is however far more canonically established than prequel fanboy apologism. I am sorry about your emotional investment in hackneyed garbage, but this is the case 
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Feb 3, 2016 22:32
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I can't believe I have to post facts from Wookiepedia, but that's just the situation on the ground!
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Feb 3, 2016 22:33
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Beeez posted:Your response is totally expected, but at least the rest of the thread can peruse those quotes. As an aside, here's the scene where the Jedi arrest Palpatine(the conceit is that this is an audio recording from Palpatine's office): Holy crap this novelization does sound good. I should give it a read someday.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:33
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Tezzor posted:Words Why did Yoda have to lead the army? In fact, why did the Jedi have to lead the army at all? The US military doesn't have elite special forces soldiers doing the generaling. Why do the Jedi? Tezzor posted:Palpatine used the Dark Side to create the Dark Side cloud and was using Force Clouding to make the Jedi total idiots who can't see he's evil. I know how stupid this sounds. I am not defending it. It is however far more canonically established than prequel fanboy apologism. I am sorry about your emotional investment in hackneyed garbage, but this is the case hahahahaahhaha
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Feb 3, 2016 22:33
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Beeez posted:Your response is totally expected, but at least the rest of the thread can peruse those quotes. As an aside, here's the scene where the Jedi arrest Palpatine(the conceit is that this is an audio recording from Palpatine's office): This is hilarious and he 100% should have said "check the constitution rear end in a top hat freedom of religion  " in the movie.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:33
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MUH RELIGIOUS FREEDOM :qqpatine::
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Feb 3, 2016 22:34
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~the dark side cloud~ roll 2d6 and deal damage equal to the result WILL save DC20
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Feb 3, 2016 22:35
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Waffles Inc. posted:Why did Yoda have to lead the army? In fact, why did the Jedi have to lead the army at all? The US military doesn't have elite special forces soldiers doing the generaling. Why do the Jedi? Because the Jedi are the heroes of the films and unless they get involved the Republic will lose to the army commanded by a Sith Lord and tons and tons more living things will die
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Feb 3, 2016 22:36
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where in the movie is the dark side cloud, tezzor should we have gotten a scene of sheev casting this spell
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Feb 3, 2016 22:36
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oh hey guys just checking out my favorite thread oh its tezzor again
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Feb 3, 2016 22:37
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Waffles Inc. posted:~the dark side cloud~ Force Lightning: roll 4d6 and deal ongoing damage equal to the result. Cannot be saved against. Force Life Create: Check Book of Erotic Fantasy
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Feb 3, 2016 22:37
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Waffles Inc. posted:~the dark side cloud~ Yes, it is a comically awful RPG plot device that makes the prequels bad. Why do you think mocking it is helping your point?
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Feb 3, 2016 22:37
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Tezzor posted:Yes, it is a comically awful RPG plot device that makes the prequels bad. Why do you think mocking it is helping your point? Because there is nothing in the movies themselves that suggest that that's whats happening?
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Feb 3, 2016 22:39
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uhh rpgs are good tezzor
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Feb 3, 2016 22:39
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Tezzor posted:Yes, it is a comically awful RPG plot device that makes the prequels bad. Why do you think mocking it is helping your point? show us the scene where sheev casts this spell tezzor show us the dark side cloud
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Feb 3, 2016 22:41
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Waffles Inc. posted:where in the movie is the dark side cloud, tezzor Well in the movie itself the cause is never clearly explained because it's just a vague plot device to keep the characters from noticing obvious things because the writer is a hack. In the offically-licensed books, it is a Dark Side Cloud created by Palpatine and Darth Plaeguis and Palpatine is actively using Force Clouding whenever he interacts with Jedi. Again: I know how stupid this sounds so mocking it is pointless. it is nevertheless the most official explanation and the one that makes the most sense. I am so sorry
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Feb 3, 2016 22:41
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Tezzor take back what you said about RPGs
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Feb 3, 2016 22:42
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Waffles Inc. posted:show us the scene where sheev casts this spell tezzor Palpatine ate too much space taco bell one night and, well, the force was strong with that one.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:43
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Tezzor posted:By fighting at all, the Jedi lost. Tezzor, do you believe that each prequel movie is equally bad or that there are ones that are better than the others? For all I find the love for Phantom Menace and Clone Wars insane and find a lot of the deeper meaning ascribed to them as bullshit, I think RoTS isn't nearly as bad. Specifically, I think Anakin's heel turn on Mace is pretty well done and most of the movie subsequent to that is pretty cool. It's entirely morally justifiable for Mace to kill Palpatine. He's resisted arrest, murdered three people in plain view, is incredibly likely to have control of the courts and claims to be helpless when he can loving FIRE LIGHTNING FROM HIS FINGERS. It's loving crazy to claim that he's defenseless when he has the equivalent of a loaded loving machine gun pointed directly at his opponent that he can fire the second he isn't being physically threatened. I buy Anakin being presented with a situation where he perceives Palpatine to be helpless and then has his friend appeal to his personal needs to make him heel turn. I do think it's a loving huge jump for him to just go out and murder defenceless children who look to him for trust when literally five minutes ago he was claiming that he needed to arrest people. But gently caress it, he's under the influence of the dark side at this point so who knows what the gently caress he'll actually do. From there I find it pretty tragic that a bunch of pretty cool dudes who are trying to defend democracy just get the poo poo murdered out of them because they present a threat to a Nazi dictator. Like, I think enough work has gone into the Jedi actually trying to do good things that makes me feel sad at Order 66. So I feel like, at least in the back half of the movie Lucas accomplishes at least some of what he's trying to do.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:43
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El Burbo posted:Because there is nothing in the movies themselves that suggest that that's whats happening? There is nothing in the movies that suggests the Jedi are going Eval either yet you fall all over yourselves to kitbash any sidelong look from Yoda into interpretation in an attempt to pretend at depth in this asinine shlock
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Feb 3, 2016 22:44
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Tezzor posted:Yeah let's take loving Palpatine's word for it I imagine the Chancellor of the Republic knows the constitution pretty well. The Sith did a bunch of damage 1000 years ago, that's not really enough cause for the average Joe Spaceguy to turn on their beloved Glorious Leader. People have done heinous things in the name of religion in real life, much more recently than a thousand years ago, yet we don't ban those religions.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:46
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Tezzor posted:There is nothing in the movies that suggests the Jedi are going Eval either yet you fall all over yourselves to kitbash any sidelong look from Yoda into interpretation in an attempt to pretend at depth in this asinine shlock in fact the entire prequel trilogy is about the jedi failing the most simple showcase of this is: why else would yoda decide to go from big shot general to "wars not make one great" and "the force is used for knowledge and defense, never for attack" if the jedi hadn't fundamentally failed? how else would you explain how yoda was not only defeated and exiled but jaded
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Feb 3, 2016 22:47
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Bongo Bill posted:I give you my permission to believe this, but I encourage you to make the effort to reconsider. I want to revisit them, but first I want to see those "despecialized editions" of the original trilogy. Just for fun.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:47
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http://hinonekart.tumblr.com/post/137892167275/haha-yeah-i-did-the-same-fuckin-thing-luke  
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Feb 3, 2016 22:53
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RBA Starblade posted:It sounds like it handles what is in there better. It's just explaining things that were already implicit - or even explicit. It's like when fans saw all the expository dialogue that Ridley Scott cut out of Prometheus. The novelization explains that the kids who studied dianetics with a bucket on their head for ten years were, in fact, being indoctrinated. These are things you shouldn't need to be told.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:53
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quote:It's just explaining things that were already implicit - or even explicit. I'm not sure what you think that has to do with what I said.
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Feb 3, 2016 22:58
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Re: the dark side clouding the Jedi's vision:George Lucas posted:"It's not that they can't see the dark side coming, it's just that the dark side begins to envelop everything. It's like walking into a fog. The Jedi's ability to see lessens as the dark side grows." It's not some sort of dark side ability being used by the Sith. It's the fact that the dark side is growing in influence everywhere, and within everything and everybody, which is making everything....you know, dark. The Jedi cannot see through the shroud of darkness that's fallen over everything. The Jedi say this in the movie multiple times. On a symbolic level, it's very intuitive. Where's the confusion coming from? And what's this? Why, look at all the blatant cloud imagery which manifests itself in the various environments surrounding the characters all throughout the film! (Notice how the cloud imagery ramps up drastically toward the end with the onset of the Clone War.)                     I wonder if there's a connection? Kind of weird that Lucas would go through all this effort just for a soulless cash-in. Lucas's terrorized yes-man underlings must have been working overtime in order to slip all this stuff in under his nose. But seriously, again, just look at all those rich color palette shifts. AOTC is a gorgeous film (and yes, I said "film" specifically in order to troll people).
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Feb 3, 2016 22:59
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Someone should get around to blowing up the Cloud City planet, that'd help clear the air.
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Feb 3, 2016 23:00
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Cnut the Great posted:Re: the dark side clouding the Jedi's vision: Oh my god lol you're literally reading clouds for hidden meanings
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Feb 3, 2016 23:01
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BrianWilly posted:http://hinonekart.tumblr.com/post/137892167275/haha-yeah-i-did-the-same-fuckin-thing-luke The light saber is truly one of the mysteries of physics.
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Feb 3, 2016 23:01
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Tezzor posted:Oh my god lol you're literally reading clouds for hidden meanings Pretending to be retarded is the laziest form of trolling, Tezzor.
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Feb 3, 2016 23:03
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Tezzor posted:Oh my god lol you're literally reading clouds for hidden meanings It's not hidden. It's pretty obvious.
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Feb 3, 2016 23:04
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Tezzor posted:Oh my god lol you're literally reading clouds for hidden meanings is this a refutation of his point in your mind if so, let's compare statements You: Sheev Palpatine cast a magic spell ergo the dark side?????????? Cnut: Allow me to demonstrate a thesis regarding the clearly illustrated and deliberate motif if clouds and obstructed vision present in the film where an orchestrated war begins Tezzor isn't your big gripe that you don't think the prequels are good at telling a story visually? you're ostensibly a fan of film posting in a film subforum and you're going to insist that Cnut's examples don't visually tell a story and expand on a motif of cloudedness and obstruction?
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Feb 3, 2016 23:04
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SHISHKABOB posted:It's not hidden. It's pretty obvious. On that note, I wonder how you'd make the cloud imagery less obvious? Would you hide it behind another cloud?
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Feb 3, 2016 23:05
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I'd like to try an experiment. Tezzor, please describe for me what you see in this image:
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Feb 3, 2016 23:05
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Cnut the Great posted:Re: the dark side clouding the Jedi's vision: This is A Good Post. I think it was you who also made the earlier point about both the clone and droid armies being obscured by clouds of dust, which is really interesting to me. Aside from the mirrored shots of Vader and Windu looking down their lightsabers at beaten enemies, do any other parallel shots between the Jedi and Sith spring to mind?
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Feb 3, 2016 23:08
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