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Monaghan posted:I have the comic and I can appreciate Johns take on their construct styles, but Green lantern is a guy with a ring that can make anything. It's a power that just screams to have really creative, visually interesting stuff. One of Marz's best ideas was to make Kyle an artist. This just opened up so much cool things. With Hal, we get really boring constructs that just makes the ring seem like a waste. How about him using it to make a micro machines track?
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Feb 23, 2016 21:12
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Monaghan posted:I have the comic and I can appreciate Johns take on their construct styles, but Green lantern is a guy with a ring that can make anything. It's a power that just screams to have really creative, visually interesting stuff. One of Marz's best ideas was to make Kyle an artist. This just opened up so much cool things. With Hal, we get really boring constructs that just makes the ring seem like a waste. I dislike that because, by carving out Kyle as the exception, the rule defaulted to other Lanterns not making the raddest poo poo the penciller could draw. If an editor had just circulated a memo saying "Boxing gloves are old + busted. Green Lanterns should use their rings make gently caress-awesome wizardvan airbrush monsters, anime muscle robots, and selected bad trips from Erowid", then things would have gotten better for every Lantern, instead of mostly just Kyle.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:26
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I always liked the implication that, because these are supposed to be spur of the moment thoughts, that when John thinks "gun" it's a specific model he used in the military, and Kyle's "robot" is a giant Japanese super robot mecha.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:35
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bobkatt013 posted:How about him using it to make a micro machines track? I clearly said "cool things" in my post. 
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Feb 23, 2016 21:42
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While I'm on a tear anyway: It also sucks because it mistakes repetition for depth. "John is an architect. He uses his ring...architecturally. Guy is passionate. He uses his ring with passion." It's a habit most writers should grow out of when they're still in the fan-fiction/wouldn't it be cool if-schoolyard-conversation phase, but Johns not only uses it over and over and over, across a bunch of works, but he gets praise for it. Like, I know Green Lantern isn't a cornerstone of the western literary canon or anything, but an audience of mostly-adult readers should be able to recognize chronic mediocrity, and demand something at least a little bit better. Nope, turns out we've decided instead to adore this base authorial pee and beg for more of it to jet into our waiting mouths.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:45
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Dude, asking Green Lantern of all things to rise above chronic mediocrity is a pipe dream.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:49
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Squizzle posted:Nope, turns out we've decided instead to adore this base authorial pee and beg for more of it to jet into our waiting mouths.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:50
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Captain America Jr. is my favorite thing to come out of all of Amalgam. He's Captain America merged with Captain Marvel Jr., and instead of drawing his powers from various Greek myths, he has the abilities of all the Presidents of the United States. The strategy of Eisenhower, the fortitude of Lincoln, the cunning of Nixon!
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Feb 23, 2016 23:26
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The trickery of Nixon. Jean Black is a badass name and I feel like Green Goliath could be interesting as a Day The Earth Stood Still kind of alien coming to help the Poor Earthlings. Otherwise they all just feel way more slapdash than the first set of Amalgams.
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Feb 23, 2016 23:34
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You know, in retrospect, Access continually merging dudes with other dudes without really asking first is kinda sketchy.
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Feb 23, 2016 23:55
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Wanderer posted:You know, in retrospect, Access continually merging dudes with other dudes without really asking first is kinda sketchy. It just makes me think of Bwana Beast, the hero with the Freakest Goddamn Power.
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Feb 23, 2016 23:58
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Wanderer posted:You know, in retrospect, Access continually merging dudes with other dudes without really asking first is kinda sketchy. Going by Steven Universe rules, it's rape.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:07
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Squizzle posted:Breaking the only interesting narrative chain they were building between the face-offs, yes. Thor beat Captain Marvel by throwing Mjolnir to intercept the shazaming lightning during a Billy/Marvel switch. It worked, but Captain Marvel's lightning turned out to be so weird and mighty that Mjolnir didn't return to Thor—it just vanished. Wonder Woman found it, picked it up, and got thorred up before her fight with Storm. It was a last-page teaser and everything. That's what happens when one writer writes a cliffhanger, and then another picks it up, and oh poo poo, the fans voted for Storm.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:27
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Wanderer posted:You know, in retrospect, Access continually merging dudes with other dudes without really asking first is kinda sketchy. It's funny to me that Marvel could technically use Access if they felt like it, but probably never will.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:35
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Squizzle posted:While I'm on a tear anyway: It also sucks because it mistakes repetition for depth. "John is an architect. He uses his ring...architecturally. Guy is passionate. He uses his ring with passion." It's a habit most writers should grow out of when they're still in the fan-fiction/wouldn't it be cool if-schoolyard-conversation phase, but Johns not only uses it over and over and over, across a bunch of works, but he gets praise for it. Like, I know Green Lantern isn't a cornerstone of the western literary canon or anything, but an audience of mostly-adult readers should be able to recognize chronic mediocrity, and demand something at least a little bit better. Nope, turns out we've decided instead to adore this base authorial pee and beg for more of it to jet into our waiting mouths. I dunno, the idea that the personalities and mentalities of the various Lanterns show through in their constructs is a clever one that kinda works well, with Kyle being a graphic artist means he gets all sorts of comic booky designs, John being a architect and military man means he gets very precise mechanical constructs, and Hal having the brain of a guacamole means he gets "um...a...jet?" but they don't seem to go far enough with it. Most of the Corps are not even from Earth, I want to see all sorts of wild and crazy alien designs to constructs, I want to see non-earth creatures, I want to see non-euclidean geometry, I want each member of the Corps to feel like their constructs have their own personal identity attached, not just more beams and guns and fists.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:42
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ImpAtom posted:It is because these scenes are from megacrossovers where they don't have the time to really develop an interesting fight choreography. They have 2-3 pages at most and often less. Megacrossovers are rarer in non-American comics but most of them inevitably end up with iconic special attacks being spammed rather than creative trickery. (See: every fuckin' Kamen Rider movie in the past 5 years.) I've been playing Project X Zone 2, the big Sega/Capcom/Namco crossover RPG, and that's very true of it. There's sometimes a lot of creativity to slotting games together story-wise, but most of the attacks boil down to signature moves in flurries of color rather than using them in an interesting or logical way. Kite from .hack's special is Data Drain, despite very little of the game giving him enemies that makes any sense against. And he's a duo unit with Haseo, who doesn't get to do poo poo in his own special.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:58
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I always figured the Wolverine vs Lobo fight went down because Lobo is one of those 4th wall breaking characters like Howard the Duck or Deadpool but the epitome of the EXXTREME 90s thing that was in style at the time. He doesn't have a set power level like "can bench 100 tons" or whatever, he's exactly strong enough that he can give a really good fight to whoever he's up against. Then when you consider that he's the archetype of every biker tough guy who ever knocked over Logan's beer and said, "hey watch it shorty" and the outcome is obvious. Didn't Bibbo give Lobo a decent match one time?
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Feb 24, 2016 01:20
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Network Pesci posted:I always figured the Wolverine vs Lobo fight went down because Lobo is one of those 4th wall breaking characters like Howard the Duck or Deadpool but the epitome of the EXXTREME 90s thing that was in style at the time. He doesn't have a set power level like "can bench 100 tons" or whatever, he's exactly strong enough that he can give a really good fight to whoever he's up against. Then when you consider that he's the archetype of every biker tough guy who ever knocked over Logan's beer and said, "hey watch it shorty" and the outcome is obvious. Didn't Bibbo give Lobo a decent match one time? Nah. Bibbo ineffectually smashed Lobo over the head with a chair, Lobo though he was awesome for even trying, and the two of them got absurdly drunk on alien superbeer before Lobo went to take on Superman piss drunk.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:23
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Monaghan posted:I have the comic and I can appreciate Johns take on their construct styles, but Green lantern is a guy with a ring that can make anything. It's a power that just screams to have really creative, visually interesting stuff. One of Marz's best ideas was to make Kyle an artist. This just opened up so much cool things. With Hal, we get really boring constructs that just makes the ring seem like a waste. Can anyone post this and go into detail about the other ring constructs? I only really saw JL, JLU and some of the movies so my idea of Green Lantern constructs is like, boxing glove, cage, bat, mace. Basically weapons that already exist. I do think Guy Gardner hit someone with a train once though.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:47
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RareAcumen posted:Can anyone post this and go into detail about the other ring constructs? I only really saw JL, JLU and some of the movies so my idea of Green Lantern constructs is like, boxing glove, cage, bat, mace. Basically weapons that already exist. I do think Guy Gardner hit someone with a train once though.  Green Lantern comics are only good when the focus is on Kyle.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:57
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RareAcumen posted:Can anyone post this and go into detail about the other ring constructs? I only really saw JL, JLU and some of the movies so my idea of Green Lantern constructs is like, boxing glove, cage, bat, mace. Basically weapons that already exist. I do think Guy Gardner hit someone with a train once though.   While I was out I was thinking about this earlier and was like "man I really do want to see constructs that are more alien in nature".
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Feb 24, 2016 02:54
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Here's a brief pictorial of Cool Stuff Kyle Rayner Did in Grant Morrison's JLA. These are all from the first 2 arcs:  Robot T-Rex  Chubby Robot  Cartoon Weight  Rock'em Sock'em Robots  Phone Booth  Horde of Gargoyle Monsters Slightly related but man, Grant Morrison's JLA was cool as poo poo.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:15
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My favourite part about the Earth 2 book was Power Ring's constructs looking like 90s comic art and having his signature in a little box floating in front of them.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:22
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Speaking of Green Lanterns, if someone can walk us through the insane journey of Hal Jordan's underage girlfriend, that'd be a pretty good fit for this thread.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:24
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Travis343 posted:
I like to think he just formed all that poo poo around his communicator for the sake of looking flashy.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:25
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graybook posted:
The best part about this is no one else ever stuck to it (not even Johns, I don't think), and it still makes Hal the most boring.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:28
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SynthOrange posted:My favourite part about the Earth 2 book was Power Ring's constructs looking like 90s comic art and having his signature in a little box floating in front of them. Or Kyle holding the moon in a pair of giant green hands.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:33
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Lurdiak posted:Speaking of Green Lanterns, if someone can walk us through the insane journey of Hal Jordan's underage girlfriend, that'd be a pretty good fit for this thread. It's not an overly complex story really. Arisia was a member of the Green Lantern corps. She was defined by being the 'young' member and her plots revolved around that. This included her being taken as the little sister of the team. She had a crush on Hal but it was explicitly supposed to be a "teen having a crush on an adult that nobody really take seriously" thing. Until they started taking it seriously. This culminated in a plot where Hal and Arisia were stuck in a dark place together and Arisia wished so super-duper hard on her ring that she turned into an adult. Hal Jordan, being a gigantic shithead, took this as an okay sign to start making out with her because as long as she magically aged her body it was all cool. Over the years there's been some handwaving at "oh, she was legal in space years" stuff but it is one of those handwaves which makes no loving sense because the character explicitly was defined as being considered a kid and her role in the Lantern corps was reliant on the fact that she was a kid and having to deal with that while also being a Corps member. It's one of those plots that would just be better forgotten instead of the occasional reminder that Hal Jordan dated a teenager but it was okay because she was technically legal/aged her body/who are you to say aliens have the same consent laws/other creepy bullshit.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:34
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Endless Mike posted:The best part about this is no one else ever stuck to it (not even Johns, I don't think), and it still makes Hal the most boring. It's not even that they didn't stick to it, it's that they never referenced any of that beforehand except for Kyle's stuff being more artistic.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:34
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Endless Mike posted:The best part about this is no one else ever stuck to it (not even Johns, I don't think), and it still makes Hal the most boring. No wonder, sticking to the hyper-literalist version Johns displayed there would be a headache for anyone. The art style of the constructs is one thing, that's super cool, but also forcing everyone to stick to specific categories of constructs would be super limiting and force every character into these ridiculous little artistic niches. He probably thought this was some amazingly imaginative insight displayed in images but it's really the opposite. Evil Mastermind posted:It's not even that they didn't stick to it, it's that they never referenced any of that beforehand except for Kyle's stuff being more artistic. Also that thing about constructs never making sounds unless you want them to is just weird.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:38
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Evil Mastermind posted:It's not even that they didn't stick to it, it's that they never referenced any of that beforehand except for Kyle's stuff being more artistic. The parts with Guy's ring leaking and Kilowog's blasts making noise had always been around, hadn't they? Not those specific explanations, but those aspects had always been part of them, I thought.
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Feb 24, 2016 03:39
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YMMV depending on artist/writer.
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Feb 24, 2016 05:13
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Evil Mastermind posted:Well, how else are we supposed to enter his magical realm?
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Feb 24, 2016 05:45
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McSpanky posted:No wonder, sticking to the hyper-literalist version Johns displayed there would be a headache for anyone. The art style of the constructs is one thing, that's super cool, but also forcing everyone to stick to specific categories of constructs would be super limiting and force every character into these ridiculous little artistic niches. He probably thought this was some amazingly imaginative insight displayed in images but it's really the opposite. Only thing that would have made red lantern Guy Gardner cooler would be if his chainsaw shot sparks.
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Feb 24, 2016 06:44
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Apparently there was a one issue JoJo rip off here in the west. Gotta admit, that's a good strategy years ago when barely anyone outside of Japan and some European countries knew about JJBA.
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Feb 24, 2016 07:19
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 I always liked issue #151 from Winick's run, as far as cool constructs went. Dale Eaglesham was clearly having a lot of fun with it.
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Feb 24, 2016 08:49
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ImpAtom posted:It is because these scenes are from megacrossovers where they don't have the time to really develop an interesting fight choreography. They have 2-3 pages at most and often less. Megacrossovers are rarer in non-American comics but most of them inevitably end up with iconic special attacks being spammed rather than creative trickery. (See: every fuckin' Kamen Rider movie in the past 5 years.) Well yeah, what I was trying to say is that there isn't enough creativity, not that it's nonexistent.
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Feb 24, 2016 08:53
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WickedHate posted:Apparently there was a one issue JoJo rip off here in the west. This is amazing. It's like the "What If God was One of Us" scene from Austin Powers 2.
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Feb 24, 2016 10:28
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Seriously. They even use the word Stand despite it making little sense in its OWN context.
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Feb 24, 2016 14:23
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Choco1980 posted:Seriously. They even use the word Stand despite it making little sense in its OWN context. For the record:  
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Feb 24, 2016 14:29
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