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I cannot fathom playing games without any of the game's sounds or music accompanying it unless it's Solitaire or something for grandmas so kudos to you for being able to stomach them muted
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Feb 23, 2016 17:08
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| # ? May 25, 2024 21:59 |
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Wizard Styles posted:I don't understand the love for Occultists. I mean, Vestals are boring, but they're just so much better. Healing abilities are the last skills I want to be highly RNG dependent. And the Vestal's party heal is amazing. But that ignores the Occultist's most reliable "heal," Weakening Curse. One shot of that drops Treebranch Smackdown from 20-40 to 12-24 and a second (which you can keep cycling with just one Occultist) to 4-8. Throw in a Man-at-Arms to tank and/or an Arbalest to act as an off-healer (who also boosts healing, potentially leading to a one-two punch where the Occultist can crit heal for 45 or something insane), fill the last slot with somebody who can take care of himself like a Houndmaster (who also loves marks) or Abomination (who can't roll with a Vestal anyway) and you have a party that barely gets scratched and that the Occultist can do marking duties for so attackers can just attack. Characters like Grave Robbers, Bounty Hunters, Houndmasters, and Arbalests all love the guy, and a Prot-focused Man-at-Arms isn't too worried about floating a little hurt in the event of a bad luck 0 heal. If you then look at all the other stuff the Occultist can do compared to a Vestal, he just seems much better to me. He can't stun as reliably in his most ideal position (#3), but he does have a stun. He can mark, Sacrificial Stab is massively underrated and extremely competent damage for a healer with nearly as much range as Judgement, Abyssal Artillery is one of the few halfway decent AoEs when used against Eldritch enemies (of which there are plenty), his pull is OK and clears corpses, he's faster than the Vestal and has 10 more Dodge and twice her Crit (and often a damage bonus instead of a penalty) for just 9 less HP. The Occultist-Man-at-Arms combo was just the lynchpin of my DD2 run, which was with Plague Doctor/Occultist/Abomination/Man-at-Arms. In the boss fights I'd go balls out with SacStab and Artillery while everybody dogpiled on either the Hounds/Polyps in the single Templar fights while the Templar was stunned by a PD, or on one of the two Templars to kill him ASAP. After that he rotated to Weakening Curse and the Templar was helpless against a brick wall MaA and reasonably tanky Abom. Pop Holy Water before the fight to eliminate any risk of him Bleeding allies and reduce the risk of getting Blighted and the whole thing was a cakewalk. Had anybody hit Death's Door there was Battlefield Medicine and Absolution for backup (the MaA wasn't likely to be the one hitting Death's Door), so while I did have one instance of two 0 heals in a row on my Occultist it never wrecked my plans and never felt like I was losing momentum. Worst case I had the MaA guard the offender just in case. The Vestal would not have worked in the same circumstances because she can't pile on damage to DD enemies like the Occultist can, then pivot back to healing. She's more a healer who can pivot out to contribute some damage but unless Judgement crits her damage isn't anything more than a chip or finisher.
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Feb 23, 2016 17:13
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This is promising: http://www.darkestdungeon.com/the-march-update-update/ They're delaying Town Events, which is unfortunate, but the good news is: quote:Grind. Losing high level parties can be a big hurdle to come back from, and this discourages some people from continuing with the late game. While we fully intend to keep the overall deadliness in the game, there are a couple things we are looking at and we feel that it is important to take some action on that front prior to introducing new unrelated features. Specifically, we are looking at making some higher level heroes available in the Stagecoach in certain conditions, as well as some other tweaks.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:43
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I think a good dynamic they might try is something like "higher level heroes can appear on the stagecoach under certain conditions, but the level 0 heroes have a better chance of having multiple good positive Quirks." That way you can sort of decide between "I just need a hero with a decent level and level-appropriate gear so I can run this mission" and "I want a hero with good Quirks to build around as a long-term project." It's still all a bit random anyway but that would be a good way to weight things so that both have their place to an advanced player.
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Feb 23, 2016 21:49
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disperse posted:Does anyone else play Darkest Dungeon without sound? I was finding the game very stressful and the awesome sound design has a lot to do with that. I've been playing it without sound while watching season 1 of SNL and am finding it much more relaxing. on a similar note i was finding the lack of eyes distressing so i modded it so all the characters have visible eyes  it's much better e: 
Inexplicable Humblebrag fucked around with this message at 22:17 on Feb 23, 2016 |
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Feb 23, 2016 22:11
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That is disturbing and horrifying, a good fit for the game
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Feb 23, 2016 22:19
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Googly eyes would be much better, on the whole. Make sure to also give them to all monsters.
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Feb 23, 2016 22:44
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:on a similar note i was finding the lack of eyes distressing so i modded it so all the characters have visible eyes
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Feb 23, 2016 23:18
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hurrrk
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Feb 23, 2016 23:22
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:hurrrk Darkest Dungeon, by Rare Entertainment.
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Feb 23, 2016 23:27
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Nakar posted:The thing is, you need a fair investment in +Healing% trinkets in order to guarantee that Divine Grace heals somebody out of range of getting knocked right back to Death's Door. Things tend to hit in the 9-16 range a lot (when they're not critting for >20). The Occultist at least has a pretty good chance of crit-healing for 20+, which if it triggers pushes a person very close to their health cap and often gets them out of the danger zone, allowing the Occultist to not dedicate basically all his turns to keeping someone from dropping dead. The Vestal can more easily prevent people from ever getting so low on health that Death's Door is an issue, though, because she can spread heals out as needed. This is less important if you bring more self-reliant classes, of course. quote:But that ignores the Occultist's most reliable "heal," Weakening Curse. One shot of that drops Treebranch Smackdown from 20-40 to 12-24 and a second (which you can keep cycling with just one Occultist) to 4-8. Throw in a Man-at-Arms to tank and/or an Arbalest to act as an off-healer (who also boosts healing, potentially leading to a one-two punch where the Occultist can crit heal for 45 or something insane), fill the last slot with somebody who can take care of himself like a Houndmaster (who also loves marks) or Abomination (who can't roll with a Vestal anyway) and you have a party that barely gets scratched and that the Occultist can do marking duties for so attackers can just attack. Characters like Grave Robbers, Bounty Hunters, Houndmasters, and Arbalests all love the guy, and a Prot-focused Man-at-Arms isn't too worried about floating a little hurt in the event of a bad luck 0 heal. Also, how often do you need heals in excess of 20 HP? As for the generally higher versatility of the Occultist, I can't argue with that, especially since the Vestal really wants to devote half her move set to healing. But at over 100 hours of play I have lost I think three people outside of the Darkest Dungeon (and that one time when Dismas died during the tutorial), often finishing dungeons with everyone at max health, and to a large degree I attribute that to Vestals.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:28
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Wizard Styles posted:... often finishing dungeons with everyone at max health, and to a large degree I attribute that to Vestals. nice, saves you the cost of restoring their hp back at town
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Feb 24, 2016 00:38
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Kly posted:nice, saves you the cost of restoring their hp back at town
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Feb 24, 2016 00:45
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hp doesn't matter. don't get hit. kill things on turn 1. face to bloodshed.
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Feb 24, 2016 00:47
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Does Darkest Dungeon have a minimum % chance to hit?
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Feb 24, 2016 01:02
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Wizard Styles posted:Also, how often do you need heals in excess of 20 HP? Wizard Styles posted:While those massive savings are certainly the by far biggest reason for bringing a Vestal, keeping health up throughout a run also offers the added small benefit of lovely turns where your group just eats several crits in a row not being too much of an issue. Where I like Wyrd Restoration over Divine Grace against a banged-up hero is that I often know Divine Grace will require 2-3 casts to put a hero at or close to full HP, while Wyrd Restoration might very well fill them up in a single cast. Basically where DG has a single outcome, WR will either: (1) do nothing or actively harm you, which isn't that likely (like 10% at worst depending on the bleed); (2) heal about as much a Divine Grace, which means the Occultist's turn was just as useful as a Vestal's; or (3) heal as much as two or three turns' worth of Divine Grace in a single action. Action economy is a big, big deal, and one-tapping a critted character's HP to full could save you multiple turns and free your Occultist to debuff or do damage. "But he could roll for 0 and lose a hero or something!" is a fair counterpoint, but more likely is that you're just sort of on thinner ice for a turn and you can mitigate that a lot easier than you can not having enough raw output. Like say that you need to heal someone off Death's Door but aren't confident you can push them out of the range to be knocked back down into it. Vestal does this, but so does basically anybody with a heal for even 1 point of damage. The Vestal's very unlikely to do much else and you might still have to use somebody else's turn to pull them off DD if something doesn't go right. The Occultist at least offers the possibility of a lucky super heal, which not only fixes the present problem (need them off DD) but also the longer-term issue of digging them out of the revolving-Death's-Door hole. The Vestal does this by dedicating more healing turns to steadily pull the person to safety, the Occultist has a chance of doing it in one but might fail. It's preference but personally I love it way more when my Occultist full-heals somebody than when the Vestal gets a very rare Divine Grace heal and kind of gets somebody to 2/3 HP. Another thing to consider is max HP. If you run with tons of fragile characters like Grave Robbers then arguably a Vestal is good enough because the higher-end Occultist rolls are overkill. On the other hand, if you're using Lepers, Abominations, Crusaders, Men-at-Arms, etc., those guys can take quite a bit of punishment so you can hold off healing them for a turn or two if something else matters more. That was basically my Templar strategy in DD2: My MaA and Abom are taking much of the heat, but they can take it for a while, so we'll clean up the fight and then heal them, if we even need to once the Templar's on Weakening Curse lockdown. I fully admit that I was kind of gambling there on the prospect that the Occultist could delay healing the Man-at-Arms for a couple turns and SacStab/Artillery instead, but I'd rather have the option to dump damage and then take a small risk in order to have a more manageable fight overall. It could've gone wrong had my Occultist or PD, while already damaged, been hit by the Blight attack and Death's Doored. I was betting that wouldn't happen before I could kill the adds (or first Templar) and bring the fight under control, and I was right. With a Vestal I couldn't have really taken that risk at all as she can't do enough damage to burn and can't neglect healing for as long without falling behind what she can reliably restore per turn. Doesn't necessarily mean I would've lost, but I would be facing more potential damage and basically forcing the Vestal to be healing for most of the fight. Considering I won one fight with a SacStab crit while a Templar had a turn on deck, I definitely dodged at least one attack. As I see it a Vestal is the best pick for a control party that's keeping enemies on heavy lockdown and whittling them down, while the Occultist is the best pick for an aggressive party that wants to drop enemies quickly and recover later when it has an action advantage. Both have some way of being not enough: Vestal if you end up missing stuns and getting critted and taking more damage than she can heal over time, Occultist if he fails you in the clutch to cause a failure cascade. Having off-healers benefits them both but I think it benefits the Occultist more, since as I said you can't really make the primary healers' highs much higher (Arbalest buff's about all you got there) but you can definitely make their lows less low with secondary or self-healing.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:12
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DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:hurrrk Just saying, the little skull on his stomach also needs googly eyes.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:21
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Blooming Brilliant posted:Just saying, the little skull on his stomach also needs googly eyes. You're making my stress level go up
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Feb 24, 2016 01:32
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I like that you can click on any random page in this thread and find people arguing about the occultist versus the vestal.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:47
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rydiafan posted:I like that you can click on any random page in this thread and find people arguing about the occultist versus the vestal.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:55
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dont blame me, i voted for dog
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Feb 24, 2016 01:56
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The main thing dragging the Vestal down is that her accuracy sucks. Judgment and Dazzling light are extremely good otherwise and if it wasn't for the accuracy problem I'd happily take an aggressively oriented vestal over an aggressively oriented occultist.
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Feb 24, 2016 01:59
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The Vestal uses a book, the Occultist uses a skull, how is this an argument
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Feb 24, 2016 02:05
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Node posted:The Vestal uses a book, the Occultist uses a skull, how is this an argument It's his master's skull at that
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Feb 24, 2016 02:11
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AnonSpore posted:It's his master's skull at that You upgrade the skull to make him better at stabbing
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Feb 24, 2016 09:17
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dog is the people's choice
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Feb 24, 2016 13:54
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Gabriel Pope posted:The main thing dragging the Vestal down is that her accuracy sucks. Judgment and Dazzling light are extremely good otherwise and if it wasn't for the accuracy problem I'd happily take an aggressively oriented vestal over an aggressively oriented occultist. Yeah honestly I don't see why her accuracy needs to be so low. Its weird to say "buff the Vestal" since almost everyone uses them a ton but its just to throw around heals. I've seen people that don't even bother upgrading her offensive skills and weapon. I'd still use an aggressive occultist just because he actually works really well in rank two with hands from the abyss. Also that stab crits often and really messes up all the eldritch fuckers lurking in the end game. DOWN JACKET FETISH posted:hurrrk This is good.
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Feb 24, 2016 16:21
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repost from an other thread http://i.imgur.com/UKEJiO4.mp4
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Feb 24, 2016 16:36
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Does Dismas suffer any unfortunate effects from carrying his own head (other than the trinket's normal downsides)?
Floodkiller fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Feb 24, 2016 |
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Feb 24, 2016 16:46
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Internet Kraken posted:Yeah honestly I don't see why her accuracy needs to be so low. Its weird to say "buff the Vestal" since almost everyone uses them a ton but its just to throw around heals. I've seen people that don't even bother upgrading her offensive skills and weapon.
I dunno how exactly to fix this without overpowering her healer role. Best I can think is to buff Mace Bash and Hand of Light (higher ACC and crit, extend the range on at least HoL to the third enemy rank, maybe an Unholy DMG bonus on Mace Bash), which can't be (and if buffed shouldn't be) usable in positions 3/4, and maybe give Illumination a mark (and an ACC boost to 110 or so) and have the Vestal's attacks gain ACC (but not DMG/Crit) against marked targets. That way you keep the whole thing where Judgement/Dazzling Light have their accuracy issues on a healer Vestal, but if you're willing to give up Divine Comfort you can take Illumination and fix that issue or you can run her with another marker to ensure her Judgements and Dazzling Lights connect without giving up a skill slot. And then a frontliner Vestal is at least competent at hitting things, and she has room to run Illumination since she can't use Divine Grace. I'd at least consider her at that point, and it'd be a lot of fun to run Vestal-2 Occultist-3 as a team core (it's already kind of fun as it is, but the Vestal is not pulling her weight).
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Feb 24, 2016 17:21
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Floodkiller posted:Does Dismas suffer any unfortunate effects from carrying his own head (other than the trinket's normal downsides)?
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Feb 24, 2016 18:02
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Harrow posted:This is promising: http://www.darkestdungeon.com/the-march-update-update/ Yeah, this. I just did my first run into the darkest Dungeon and now my best healer can't go anymore. So while I was trying for that cool +5% Crit/+15% DMG for ranged weapons trinket, a disatrous Weald runcost me my new 'best' healer, leaving me no option for the second DD quest. I'm having to grind a new Vestal from scratch.
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Feb 24, 2016 21:30
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Were you just alternating between two teams leading up to the DD?
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Feb 24, 2016 21:51
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Three. Lost my back-up Vestal in a run before that, another Weald run for the Ancestor's pistol, that was going poorly enough already..and then the Collector showed up with two highwayman heads, stacked bleeds on everyone and killed both my Vestal and my single, amazing Bounty hunter. So I went from having three DD-worthy healers to none in 3 runs.
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Feb 24, 2016 23:03
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Fairly deep into Champion dungeons now, just killed my first champ boss (Swine God) but man, "Death waits for the slightest lapse in concentration" isn't a joke when it comes to level 5. One time I had my 0 stress vestal go paranoid in one turn (madman accused her, then a stressful incantation crit followed by the front two guys critting other dudes and the stress spilled over from witnessing those) in the first fight of the dungeon.
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Feb 24, 2016 23:15
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I once had a madman dodge several attacks in a row from heroes with accuracy boosting trinkets. Spry guy.
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Feb 24, 2016 23:39
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AnonSpore posted:Fairly deep into Champion dungeons now, just killed my first champ boss (Swine God) but man, "Death waits for the slightest lapse in concentration" isn't a joke when it comes to level 5. One time I had my 0 stress vestal go paranoid in one turn (madman accused her, then a stressful incantation crit followed by the front two guys critting other dudes and the stress spilled over from witnessing those) in the first fight of the dungeon. In her defense I'd get pretty paranoid too if I had my team eat three crits in one turn.
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Feb 24, 2016 23:54
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Crasical posted:In her defense I'd get pretty paranoid too if I had my team eat three crits in one turn. SOMEONE HAS BEEN TRAINING THEM
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Feb 24, 2016 23:57
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good ectoplasm! you shall have a treat!
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Feb 25, 2016 00:09
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| # ? May 25, 2024 21:59 |
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I feel like the ectoplasm's replication ability should only work if there are corpses present. That's how I assumed it worked the first couple times I fought them, which added an interesting extra layer to the decision-making process, only to discover later that, no, they can just do that whenever they want.
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Feb 25, 2016 00:13
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