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MrYenko posted:It means a car with no real personality. Probably beige. It's EXTREMELY descriptive of the Volt. The Volt has way more personality than say, the Corolla.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:07
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A Corolla has plenty of personality, it just depends on how hard you drive it. Of course, that personality is mostly "would you please stop doing that?", but it's personality nonetheless.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:37
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KozmoNaut posted:A Corolla has plenty of personality, it just depends on how hard you drive it. I can confirm that a Prius has no personality though, regardless of how it is driven.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:42
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Linedance posted:I can confirm that a Prius has no personality though, regardless of how it is driven. I enjoyed driving a third-gen Prius in Vegas about seven or so years ago on those dusty roads, flooring it everywhere, making the back slip around, only getting 35mpg.
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Mar 16, 2016 22:13
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A year and a half into Leafhaving and even post test driving a Model S, it's still fun as h*ch to smack off Eco Mode and floor it occasionally. I was sad the other day when the governor kicked in and I wasn't able to get ahead of this rear end in a top hat who wouldn't let me into a turn lane onto the freeway, I almost beat that Civic CNG gently caress  Thank you Nissan for preventing my stupid decisions from being even worse. I cant wait to appliance the gently caress out and let the car drive in traffic for me while I watch Broad City reruns and play Pokemon instead of doing dumb poo poo because I'm bored and hate driving. Please have Autopilot in the Model 3 for a reasonable price, Elon, oh please oh please
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Mar 16, 2016 22:35
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I can't imagine why the autopilot package on a 3 would have a different price than the one on the S, unless they think they can get away with obvious price discrimination by charging S buyers more. If anything, I would expect it to get a new gen of autopilot hardware for a lower price than the current S package ($3000 to enable, though the hardware is in everything whether you choose it or not), since it's on a new platform.
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Mar 16, 2016 22:40
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Just out of curiosity, can an S get from the HQ in Fremont to the gigafactory without charging along the way? It's over the mountains and about 270 miles...
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Mar 16, 2016 23:28
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ilkhan posted:Just out of curiosity, can an S get from the HQ in Fremont to the gigafactory without charging along the way? It's over the mountains and about 270 miles... The 100D might be able to, but it would be a squeaker.
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Mar 16, 2016 23:33
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ilkhan posted:Just out of curiosity, can an S get from the HQ in Fremont to the gigafactory without charging along the way? It's over the mountains and about 270 miles... If it’s new and you drove it like a granny, maybe. It’s only 258 miles via I‐680. e: The net elevation change costs something like 9 kWh, no way around that. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Mar 16, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 23:38
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Platystemon posted:If it’s new and you drove it like a granny, probably. It’s only 258 miles via I‐680. Mountains really hurt, though, even with the regen on the way back down.
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Mar 16, 2016 23:38
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Subjunctive posted:Mountains really hurt, though, even with the regen on the way back down. Yeah I added the numbers for that. It’s worse than I thought. If I recall correctly, the grade on I‐80 out of Tahoe isn’t that bad (bad being steep, braking necessary).
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Mar 16, 2016 23:45
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Subjunctive posted:I can't imagine why the autopilot package on a 3 would have a different price than the one on the S, unless they think they can get away with obvious price discrimination by charging S buyers more. If anything, I would expect it to get a new gen of autopilot hardware for a lower price than the current S package ($3000 to enable, though the hardware is in everything whether you choose it or not), since it's on a new platform. If Audi can cram all of that into the new A4 I don't see why Tesla wouldn't put it in the Model 3. And the more cars they have gathering real-world data, the better they'll be able to make their level 3 and eventually level 4 autonomous cars.
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Mar 17, 2016 00:03
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Platystemon posted:Yeah I added the numbers for that. It’s worse than I thought. If I recall correctly, the grade on I‐80 out of Tahoe isn’t that bad (bad being steep, braking necessary). It's pretty flat. Once you get onto 80 proper there are some noticeable elevation changes, but I don't know how bad "bad" has to be to really impact economy. Braking isn't really necessary.
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Mar 17, 2016 00:51
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Godholio posted:It's pretty flat. Once you get onto 80 proper there are some noticeable elevation changes, but I don't know how bad "bad" has to be to really impact economy. Braking isn't really necessary.
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Mar 17, 2016 01:39
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drgitlin posted:If Audi can cram all of that into the new A4 I don't see why Tesla wouldn't put it in the Model 3. And the more cars they have gathering real-world data, the better they'll be able to make their level 3 and eventually level 4 autonomous cars. Yeah, I was thinking of the Audi, which seems to have strictly more hardware (rear radar and optical, plus the 360 parking view which, hmm, is that useful for autonomous?). Do you know what that package costs? I can figure it out from their configurer, and it doesn't look like it's in the base model. At some point it'll be the case that Tesla's best autopilot requires hardware my car doesn't have, which will be sad and/or expensive.
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Mar 17, 2016 02:03
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I thought he meant between Tahoe and the gigafactory. Yeah towards CA is going to be a lot more elevation change.
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Mar 17, 2016 02:03
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Subjunctive posted:Yeah, I was thinking of the Audi, which seems to have strictly more hardware (rear radar and optical, plus the 360 parking view which, hmm, is that useful for autonomous?). Do you know what that package costs? I can figure it out from their configurer, and it doesn't look like it's in the base model. It's an $1800 option for the Prestige trim. The Audi will now do a few things that the Tesla won't; the adaptive cruise control is now location aware so it can handle twisty roads rather well. It won't come when you summon it though.
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Mar 17, 2016 02:44
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drgitlin posted:It's an $1800 option for the Prestige trim. The Audi will now do a few things that the Tesla won't; the adaptive cruise control is now location aware so it can handle twisty roads rather well. It won't come when you summon it though. Someone claimed above that the S did that as well (GPS cuing speed changes), but I didn't watch the Norwegian videos about it and I haven't seen evidence of it myself. Might be something that Tesla can add in firmware though.
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Mar 17, 2016 02:47
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Subjunctive posted:Yeah, I was thinking of the Audi, which seems to have strictly more hardware (rear radar and optical, plus the 360 parking view which, hmm, is that useful for autonomous?). Do you know what that package costs? I can figure it out from their configurer, and it doesn't look like it's in the base model. That reminds me of the Car & Driver article posted a few pages back, comparing the differnt highway autopilots now available: http://www.caranddriver.com/features/semi-autonomous-cars-compared-tesla-vs-bmw-mercedes-and-infiniti-feature They found that the Tesla system offered the best performance despite having only one camera and one radar unit (plus the ultrasonic sensors which only come into play when lane changing and parking). That should speak volumes for what they've achieved software-wise. Though for anything where they could officially endorse taking your hands off the wheel, they probably would require something more. I wonder if the Model 3 will be set up with the intent of eventually upgrading it to at least Level 3 autonomy. After all, its estimated release date roughly coincides with when Elon Musk has been claiming they'll be ready with just about fully self-driving cars.
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Mar 17, 2016 03:00
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Cockmaster posted:I wonder if the Model 3 will be set up with the intent of eventually upgrading it to at least Level 3 autonomy. After all, its estimated release date roughly coincides with when Elon Musk has been claiming they'll be ready with just about fully self-driving cars. Yeah, his level 4 prediction is pretty close to the Model 3 release window. I don't know how they get to 4 without deploying 3 widely, and I'm not sure that the S has the hardware to do level 3. Experimentation with a post-it indicates that the rear camera isn't used in parking; I thought it might be for perpendicular at least. So there's some headroom on inputs at least there. I'm not sure that ultrasonics are enough for lateral sensing. If the console display is any indication, its traffic model is currently blind to about 2 o'clock and 10 o'clock. Does anyone use stereo cameras for depth cues?
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Mar 17, 2016 03:09
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Subjunctive posted:I can't imagine why the autopilot package on a 3 would have a different price than the one on the S, unless they think they can get away with obvious price discrimination by charging S buyers more. If anything, I would expect it to get a new gen of autopilot hardware for a lower price than the current S package ($3000 to enable, though the hardware is in everything whether you choose it or not), since it's on a new platform. Oh no not price discrimination against people who own luxury sports cars  The Model 3 is like 1/3 the price of the S and you're paying for a software license as the hardware is standard, unless it becomes an option for some reason which I doubt because they can still use people without the software licence to collect data anyway and it leaves room to upsell. It'd make sense to only charge $1000-1500 as it'd be about what those of us who are getting a model 3 would more likely throw in with purchase, whereas $2500 is basically pissing away your state rebate. They'd sell more than 2x as many packages at more than half the S price most likely.
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Mar 17, 2016 05:07
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Boten Anna posted:Oh no not price discrimination against people who own luxury sports cars I didn't say it was bad. When you charge different groups different prices, often because of signals that one group is less price-sensitive, it's called price discrimination. It happens a lot, such as with short-notice airline tickets, but it's not usually as obvious as it would be in the case of a major S/3 Autopilot pricing difference.
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Mar 17, 2016 05:40
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The ability to unlock it after the fact is actually genius. Even if it's a more price sensitive market that balks at paying for it upfront, you'll still get a ton of owners paying to enable it a year or two down the line.
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Mar 17, 2016 06:45
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It also reduces the number of SKUs they have to manufacture for a pretty invasive variant, similar to how low-capacity battery models were just software restricted versions of higher-capacity models. "Try Autopilot free for 30 days!"
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Mar 17, 2016 06:56
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Artificial scarcity is stupid and dumb.
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Mar 17, 2016 08:02
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blugu64 posted:Artificial scarcity is stupid and dumb. But works like a loving dream.
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Mar 17, 2016 08:19
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drgitlin posted:The ability to unlock it after the fact is actually genius. Even if it's a more price sensitive market that balks at paying for it upfront, you'll still get a ton of owners paying to enable it a year or two down the line. I mean, I'd rather pay $2500 as a part of a 5 year loan than all at once so I'll probably get it with the car even if it costs that much, but I also have an obnoxious commute right now and it's easy to imagine passing on it for budget concerns then being real tempted to plunk it down after the 4th 45 minute delay this week.
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Mar 17, 2016 15:06
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blugu64 posted:Artificial scarcity is stupid and dumb. Not if you're a job creator.
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Mar 17, 2016 15:24
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Boten Anna posted:I mean, I'd rather pay $2500 as a part of a 5 year loan than all at once so I'll probably get it with the car even if it costs that much, but I also have an obnoxious commute right now and it's easy to imagine passing on it for budget concerns then being real tempted to plunk it down after the 4th 45 minute delay this week. Yeah, they say "activate after delivery" but I bet they can build it into the financed price too, that's a good point.
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Mar 17, 2016 15:24
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blugu64 posted:Artificial scarcity is stupid and dumb. That's why Tesla just loathes that dude that hacks his model S. Wonder when people are going to start rooting Model 3s
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Mar 17, 2016 15:58
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I wonder if selling based on future software features could get Tesla in revenue recognition trouble.
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Mar 17, 2016 16:05
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Jealous Cow posted:I wonder if selling based on future software features could get Tesla in revenue recognition trouble. They dont use gaap so they can report things however they want. They already do some shady accounting in regards to financing
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Mar 17, 2016 16:15
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Boten Anna posted:I mean, I'd rather pay $2500 as a part of a 5 year loan than all at once so I'll probably get it with the car even if it costs that much, but I also have an obnoxious commute right now and it's easy to imagine passing on it for budget concerns then being real tempted to plunk it down after the 4th 45 minute delay this week. e: yeah. $2500 as an option, $3000 later. Mange Mite posted:They dont use gaap so they can report things however they want. They already do some shady accounting in regards to financing ilkhan fucked around with this message at 16:30 on Mar 17, 2016 |
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Mar 17, 2016 16:24
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Well that sounds like a shareholder lawsuit waiting to happen.
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Mar 17, 2016 16:26
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blugu64 posted:Artificial scarcity is stupid and dumb. Mazda sells a $400 microsd card to enable GPS on the 3.
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Mar 17, 2016 16:58
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The GPS option in a Volvo XC60 is 22,000 SEK (~$2,700), which doesn't update automatically, does not have traffic prediction or detour planning, and looks like poo poo. Or you could just buy a $400 tablet with a car mount and run Waze.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:06
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Oh holy hell look at the page number, we forgot to
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Mar 17, 2016 17:29
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Its ok, Tesla's battery capacity is growing faster than the page count of this thread.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:30
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Jealous Cow posted:Well that sounds like a shareholder lawsuit waiting to happen. As long as it's clearly shown as non-GAAP and the differences are clearly defined, what would the grounds be for a lawsuit?
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Mar 17, 2016 17:45
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Was a P90D cruising along beside me on I-10 yesterday. drat I love the look of that car, just no way in hell I can afford one.
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Mar 17, 2016 17:56
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