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I don't think they are ever particularly competent even at the start. Ok, so they managed to drop the plate on sector 7. But even THAT turned into a clusterfuck. Somehow entering a code into a panel on top of the strut turns into a running gunfight vs. Avalanche with an entire group of Shinra Elite troops there. Even being generous and saying they need to plant the explosives first you just send in a handful of guys dressed like random Shinra workers to do it. They only end up with Aeris after that because she has to protect Marlene. BEFORE that they get defeated by a girl with a stick and a guy pushing barrels from the rafters(If indirectly since he just has the shinra troops do the work).
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Mar 13, 2016 17:18
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I always got the impression that, by the time of FF7, the only really competent members of the Turks left were Tseng and (to a lesser degree) Rude. And Vincent, but he's on Team Cloud the entire game. Of course, then AC came along and made the group into comic relief and that was that.
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Mar 13, 2016 17:34
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Kallev posted:I always thought the Turks got worse because they lost their support structure and also were not coping well with the whole "murderous city collapse" thing. Just a solid mixture of losing good employees in the destruction of Midgard reducing their overall effectiveness as a unit, and the various stress factors coming from slaughtering so many, many people. Question: Why does everyone call it Midgard? Is that how it's supposed to be in Japan? Also, Price of Freedom is a good track. Just wish that 90% of this game wasn't rearrangements of it.
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Mar 13, 2016 19:35
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My guess is the fact that Midgard is an actual Norse term is the main reason. You did make me briefly panic and wonder if I had been typing it wrong the whole time and check every update haha. Nashun fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Mar 13, 2016 |
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Mar 13, 2016 20:04
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It's kind of odd seeing Sephiroth like this. Being... situationally the good guy? Of course, Professor Gast and Ifalna are probably long gone.
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Mar 13, 2016 23:18
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As Nashun said Midgard is the Norse mythological term, but I'm fairly sure the Japanese FF7 intentionally drops the "d", similar to how Nibelheim is an intentional variation on Niflheim(r).
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Mar 14, 2016 06:11
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AlphaKretin posted:As Nashun said Midgard is the Norse mythological term, but I'm fairly sure the Japanese FF7 intentionally drops the "d", similar to how Nibelheim is an intentional variation on Niflheim(r). Neither of them is the completely correct "Miðgarður" of course. 
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Mar 14, 2016 17:14
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Deceitful Penguin posted:Nibelheim is actually just another equally valid way to spell it; the various Germanic languages shift things about. Does that mean the midgar zolom is ouroborous?
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Mar 15, 2016 02:14
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Silegna posted:Does that mean the midgar zolom is ouroborous? It's a bit of a mutilation of Miðgarðsormr, sometimes known as Jörmungandr or the "world serpent". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B6rmungandr Edit: Which, yeah, is an example of an ouroborous.
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Mar 15, 2016 03:02
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Deceitful Penguin posted:Nibelheim is actually just another equally valid way to spell it; the various Germanic languages shift things about. Wait, really? ð is pronounced 'th' so I've been saying this name super-wrong forever. Edit: For what it's worth, Midgard is supposed to be the world of man, while Niflheim is the world of the dead. So... that's the symbolism of these place names. Clarste fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Mar 16, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 02:01
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Chapter 10: This Guy Are Sick You may be thinking “Oh ho! He means that weirdo Genesis” but you would in fact be 90% wrong. I ACTUALLY mean the demented monster that came up with the FMV in this update. It is..well...you’ll see. Even if you haven’t heard this game you may have heard about it because it is so loving silly. This update kind of turned into a biggun, but mainly this drat FMV is to blame! In general it is super cutscene dense compared to most of the game.  We have been magically teleported into Mako Reactor 5 from Sector 8.  Zack immediately gets jumped by some loving goon hiding in the ceiling again. What is with these monsters and ceilings?  These new guys are the Sahagin. They may look like albino ninja turtles but they are not loving around. If you don’t block or dodge their Jump attack it hits as hard as most of the boss fights up to this point. Somewhere around 350 damage. They also come packing a poison attack but mainly they stick to stabbing you or jumping on you. Relatives of these guys were found in the sewers under Don Corneo’s mansion, though bearing a more normal color scheme.  Click to Ride This Crazy Train All The Way Down After knocking it down Zack goes in for a closer look. This will henceforth be known as a mistake. Jesus Angeal copies are way more creepy than Genesis copies.  Apparently Sephiroth has just been hanging out at the entrance waiting for us. How considerate!  Maybe he’s been standing here because he had a stroke or something?  We used to sneak in there for fun, when the 2nds were out… Genesis, Angeal, and I. You guys were pretty tight. Hmph. I wonder…Really, guys, you should just click the drat video. I’m going to be putting words below pictures but honestly you can just watch this insanity and catch back up when the video ends.  And you thought VR training would spare you from Loveless. Music: The Price of Freedom  I don’t know why Sephiroth looks so deathly pasty in FMV. He looks totally normal in cutscenes skin tone wise but half a step above a corpse any time it’s a video.  Looks like Genesis sprang for the premium copy. Also Jesus that must be a long play or the text is very big. Genesis is a bit touched so maybe the latter.   You remembered. Music: Theme of CRISIS CORE ''Truth Behind the Project''  Don’t take Sephiroth lightly. Hmph. Noted.  From here on out it descends into a DBZ clusterfuck with swords.  One thing I never noticed before that makes Masamune even more outrageous is that Sephiroth wields it one handed. He’s also left handed. As dumb as this sounds take note of that.  If nothing else it’s a dramatic scene for a fight. Way more exciting than the Scarlett x TIfa slap fight.   Well, I think he has a right to be smug when he’s fighting off both of you literally one handed and grinning while doing it. Angeal, stay back. I’ll handle Sephiroth alone. Genesis!  Sorry, Zack had that line 9 updates ago. Hmph. Come and try. So smug. But for how long? Music: Theme of CRISIS CORE ''Chaotic Battlefield'' Genesis engages fire mode and kicks it up a notch. Also for those keeping track this is the third song of the FMV.  Genesis presses the attack with his new lightsaber.  But Sephiroth’s first offensive blow has him backpedaling….oh, about 200 feet in the air. Sure why not. They then proceed to have a flying sword fight because gently caress gravity in this post Advent Children world. It’s way overrated.  Genesis decides to try some magic on for size since his sword sure isn’t getting him anywhere.  Sephiroth is cool enough just to bat fireballs out of the sky.  Sheer quantity eventually surrounds him though.  Angeal is also capable of sustained flight. You’ll destroy us all! That’s no way to talk to a hero! Genesis shows his disagreement by blowing Angeal up.  Sephiroth has not really been inconvenienced by being on fire for the last 10 seconds and Blade Beams out of the inferno.  Genesis can guard himself but RIP the Sister Ray’s barrel.  Sephiroth lands on the far part of the barrel which is kind of drifting downwards at blimp landing speed. Music: The World's Enemy (from FFVII ''One-Winged Angel'') Song 4!  As the grievous misuse of One-Winged Angel declares Sephiroth is done loving around and instantly slices about 8 parts off the cannon tip.  These ones fall more in line with gravity.  More dramatic sword blocking!  Genesis is promptly knocked back on his rear end at about 60 mph.  Enough! Angeal…Angeal has to catch Genesis’ sword with his SOLDIER sword. No need to block from Sephiroth’s direction! Sephiroth just stops his blade completely before it even makes contact with Buster Sword. Even in the midst of a furious fight he has perfect control of what’s going on and knows this isn’t Angeal’s fight. Out of my way! And then Angeal’s SOLDIER blade explodes. Busted SOLDIER sword in VR count: 2   Genesis ends up on the losing end of this with a nasty cut to his shoulder and he drops his sword. Man, big talk but first real injury and can’t even hold his weapon.  OH GOD THE FLASHBACKS  Oh it’s just the VR room being completely hosed. I wonder if that comes out of their paycheck or they get to go “SUCK IT, WE’RE FIRSTS!” Also what the hell is this made out of it can take full on shots from two of the strongest people in the world. Also they are frequently further away from each other than the size of the physical space of the VR room. You know, I’m just going to run away before my head explodes. Logic need not apply.  I’ll be fine, don’t worry. Sweet freedom. That whole FMV clocks in at just under five minutes. Total plot value: Genesis is a prick to his best friend, jealous of his second best friend. Got injured. FIVE MINUTES.  Yes, as far as Genesis was concerned. But, as for Angeal…  Later, I received one of his famous lectures. About what? Always the same. Discipline, dreams, honor, et cetera.  I’m beginning to believe he is just incapable of leaving the VR room without giving a speech.  So it’s true...they’re in league with Hollander. how could this happen?-End Video-  So now we are hopped up on both Angeal and Cissnei on the DMW.  I have to look for clues. And by that we mean crank some levers and do some low grade Resident Evil stuff moving ladders and walkways around. Music: The Skyscraper of Iron and Steel (from ''LAST ORDER FFVII'')  This seems like a pretty legit deal. We should get right on this after dealing with Angeal and Genesis.   OH yeah everyone’s favorite. CRANKS AND LADDERS.  This is about the point I remember that they use poison too.  Thanks Cissnei.  Welcome to Wrecked Town. Population: Me So I got stuck in an attack string when the first Sahagin Jumped and got stabbed by him. Before I could recover I got Jumped by the second one.  Then I stood up and ate a fireball to the face and keeled over. Thanks potion lady for reraise count: 2  Screw you Ahriman that got the killing blow on me.  At the end of the walkway we get another Shinra Alpha and 2x Hi potions. Our vitality can be HILARIOUS if we so desire.  We also turn on the power to a door. Why the door needs a crank turned at the place where we place bombs in FF7 is beyond me.  Sephiroth has just been standing there, staring at this door while we run around getting jacked by albino sewer turtles. THANKS, BUD.  Partially forgiven.  I have yet to actually mention this fact but you can escape from battles. It’s a little bit weird, but basically just run at the edge of the battle area and you probably will get out? Maybe you will run in place like a doofus while enemies pound on you. Either way I refuse to hang out to fight Ahriman’s because they are outside of melee range and take quite a few Fires to die.   The reward for wandering across three levels of scaffolding and ladders and poo poo is a hidden away lab! IMagine about 10 more random battles inserted in there as well.  A wretched sight. Click to Watch] A bit less talky than most clips I link, but this room has a few shorter voice clips as we read the notes across the room. I’m feeling woozy…Me Zack. me only smash. Thinky thing hurt. It was before Genesis deserted. Music: Scars of Friendship This chapter is definitely the king of unique music tracks so far.  I’m going to note, we’ll be in this room later and it’s actually the jail cells in Shinra tower from when the whole gang got locked up in FF7. Weird place for this conversation The man who treated him was...Hollander.  The problem is the Mako energy that seeped in through the wound.Most of the voice acting in this game is solid enough at least. But man I hate Hollander’s voice in this. Is it treatable? First, he’ll need a transfusion.  Sephiroth tries to step forward but Angeal stops him. You aren’t viable.  Jeeze, Sephiroth. Maybe you just aren’t his blood type. No reason to get so dramatic over it.   Ugh… The result was a normal child. Which meant he failed. However… There’s a monster inside. Is this where they make the copies?We actually couldn’t check this tube originally. But checking it now is kind of weird on the flow of the Genesis background. Also goddamn is Sephiroth a quick reader. I’m not really sure how much of this Sephiroth has been privy to earlier. The video about the transfusion gave the impression that Angeal knew he and Genesis had something in common, but maybe not the full extent of it.   Although we know this is actually BS. At this point in time they haven’t figured out that Jenova wasn’t a Cetra, or at least Hollander isn’t privy to it. I think Gast knew but i’m not positive Hojo or anyone else did. Project G gave birth to the man we know as Genesis. Project G… Contrary to this report, Genesis showed clear signs of change. Degrading? Not only that. Copies? TLDR: There was another Jenova project running concurrent to the one that produced Sephiroth. Through being not as good or just unlucky Hollander hosed up. He got someone with skills well above average(though less than Sephiroth) but who is prematurely aging and can’t heal well. Somehow though his traits can be copied onto people who have undergone SOLDIER treatment.  Hollander. I thought I’d find you here. The degradation process...only I can stop it.  I had to gif this because, seriously, who does that sort of dramatic flair(A wannabe actor/poet/whatever)   You won’t take Hollander. Zack! You go after Hollander. Yeah! Apparently Zack doesn’t get enough respect to be included in “you” because Genesis does absolutely nothing to stop Zack from chasing him.  Hero of the dawn, Healer of worlds. Even Genesis’ best friends are tired of this poo poo after who knows how many years. Three friends go into battle.   It’s kind of a blurry mess but this one says “Alone”  A common story.   Indeed. After all, your glory should have been mine.  In hindsight, perhaps.  -End Video-  Aaaand before we see what those two get up to back to Zack. This chapter really does do a ton for making Sephiroth a much better character. You really should watch the video for the last section. Sephiroth has a lot great animation and pretty good delivery that really sells it. Sephiroth honestly couldn’t give a poo poo what most people think. He really doesn’t care that he’s the hero of Shinra. He’s a professional soldier and he knows he’s the best but not in a egotistical way. He’s just the best, but that’s kind of the long and short of it. He has pride in his skill and will gladly take on a challenge to prove it, but at the end of the day he’ll easily give up the notoriety if it placates someone important to him.  Music: Combat Chasing hollander largely consists going an FFX like path. Bonus fun time random encounters. Not like he can get away or anything though.  Highlight includes a three stooges bit where Zack runs past because Hollander is hiding behind a door. He then waddles off.  Seriously how does this pudgy 50 year old scientist keep staying ahead of Zack.  We briefly detour to grab a Circlet(+10 mag). This is a good time to check your gear and health because:  Click for Boss Fight That jerk face has been running towards three Sweeper variants: Pile Machine, Shot Machine, and Cutter Machine. Woah the naming skill here.  I think I nearly died the first time I saw this line. It’s just so ridiculous and I love it.  So this fight is not really that hard. We need to run around like a jackass a lot to not get shot but the enemies aren’t that scary. If they wanted a REAL boss fight it would just be six Sahagins. So the main strategy is if they cluster up shoot them with lightning, otherwise just stab them in the back for 700 damage criticals.  Occasionally going Superman on these guys helps. The Pile Machine is target #1. It has a charge attack that really smarts if you get hit by it. Cutter machine is just kind of annoying.  About the only thing Shot Machine has going for it is the usual Sweeper stun bullets.  The Chopper Machine can also shoot poison gas at you.  I don’t actually have the Esuna I bought equipped(You can use healing magic from the menu like in FF7) so burn a remedy.  This is ostensibly Shot Machine’s big fancy attack but it is hilariously easy to avoid. Just walking away from the missiles casually is enough. Shot Machine should be the last to die.  Thanks Pile Machine! Everyone loves strength bonuses.  Now that Pile Machine is dead you can pretty much stunlock Cutter Machine to its death, rolling away from missiles if necessary.  Cutter Machine’s special is Chainsaw which it takes a few sweeps in front of it with its blades. This has a bit more reach than you would think but isn’t that scary(at least in this fight. It can hit hard in side missions)  This is kind of unnecessary since I already have two and presently only two equip slots!  And Shot Machine dies quickly afterwards. Chocobo Armlet is AP +20% and will never be used. -End Video-  Click to Watch Through end of Chapter Finally we have cornered the pudgy discount Hojo.  Nothing ever goes according to plan though. Hollander takes advantage of a Buster Sword to peace the gently caress out. Working for Hollander now? What is it you’re after?Music: The Price of Freedom  That’s not even funny, man.I dunno, I laughed. How about...revenge? Man Angeal looks like he has seen some poo poo in the last few weeks, months, uh some time period? I honestly have no idea how long it’s been since Wutai or Banora via in game terms. Ultimania says Wutai was November, Banora was in December and the attack on Shinra Tower is in April. None of this is ever stated at all in game. Angeal! At this point in the game literally and metaphorically it is not really that surprising that Angeal also has a dumb angel wing. The whole Angeal copies was a pretty big hint. Woah! I’ve become...a monster.  You’re wrong. Those aren’t the wings of a monster! Well then, what are they? Zack is so calling Cissnei after this is over and giving her thanks for getting his rear end out of this sling. I see. Then what should an angel fight for, Zack?   Angeal, for a guy talking about caring for your gear you shouldn’t slam your sword tip through steel plate flooring. Angeal… Angels dream of one thing. Please, tell me. To be human. Zack possibly deserved this following him slamming Angeal into walls and punching him in Banora.  drat can Angeal throw a punch. Zack can learn a lesson there.   Defend yourself!  Oh poo poo he called our bluff.     Guys. What sector reactor were we in again? Oh. 
Nashun fucked around with this message at 03:53 on Mar 18, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 02:59
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I have indeed seen that FMV before, but I did not remember Genesis literally using Hellzone Grenade on Sephiroth or blasting his BFF in the face with magic. Genesis is really coming across as a petty, entitled rear end in a top hat and I'm finding it harder to believe that this was meant to be a tribute to a guy that Nomura liked. Also, they used the One Winged Angel remix for this? He's not even evil yet!  I can't recall, but I'm assuming Sector 8 is the one that's partially broken in VII, right? Good work, Angeal. I do like Zack's "Get the gently caress out of here.  " response to Angeal's world domination comment, though. 
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Mar 16, 2016 03:15
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Another nice bit about the three-way fight which just emphasizes Sephiroph's character. Angeal blocks Genesis with the SOLDIER sword, and it breaks. He turns his back to Sephiroth and uses the Buster Sword to block Masamune (actually, it looks like the hilt of the Buster Sword) - and Sephiroth stops his sword dead in its tracks. Sephiroth stopped his swing mid-fight because Angeal got in the way. He may cheerfully beat Genesis' face in, but he's isn't going to touch Angeal for trying to put a stop to something that has - from an outside perspective - gone out of control.
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Mar 16, 2016 03:57
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thanks for reminding me. I noticed when I was making my screenshots but forgot to put that in the post. 
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Mar 16, 2016 04:00
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berryjon posted:Another nice bit about the three-way fight which just emphasizes Sephiroph's character. Angeal blocks Genesis with the SOLDIER sword, and it breaks. He turns his back to Sephiroth and uses the Buster Sword to block Masamune (actually, it looks like the hilt of the Buster Sword) - and Sephiroth stops his sword dead in its tracks. It could go further than that: Sephiroth likely knows the importance of that sword to Angeal and doesn't want to damage it. Though, it does speak on his relationship with Genesis, too, given that Genesis wasn't afraid to blast him in the face or through his SOLDIER sword. He didn't trust Genesis enough not to damage the Buster Sword, I guess?
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Mar 16, 2016 04:16
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I find it interesting that Sephiroth doesn't even have to try to defend against baseline Angeal and Genesis OR firesword Genesis, but then the second he goes on the offensive Genesis goes flying. It really shows that he's on a separate league from the other two. Also, Price of Freedom is still a proclick.
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Mar 16, 2016 04:22
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This whole chapter is just loving amazing as far as writing and delivery is concerned. Between Sephiroth, Angeal, and Zack's varying ways of interacting with both of them, it's done a really great job of providing some legitimate characterization. Genesis is coming off more and more like a whiny prick, though.
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Mar 16, 2016 04:57
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Of course they've both got wings now. It's not like Sephiroth got one in the first place because he was a freaky end boss bein' a freaky end boss, no, it has to be part of the syndrome. And most of our opposition is probably going to wind up being clones of those two chuckleheads, so the mooks will start sprouting wings soon enough. By the end of this all we'll be finding single wings as prizes in cereal boxes, mark my words.
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Mar 16, 2016 05:23
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You know at first I thought these evil villain plans were all pretty silly, but then I figured out they were all just winging it.
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Mar 16, 2016 05:34
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I'd say one of the more impressive aspects of this game is how they handle Sephiroth. In less competent hands, it'd be easy as hell to mary sue the poo poo out of the character, but it's nice that they showed some restraint and gave him a bit of a proto-saitama vibe
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Mar 16, 2016 05:35
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I won't lie, I still love that FMV for the sheer spectacle of it, logic be damned. It even has some nice character touches too! Genesis will never not be terrible though. For as well as they handle Sephiroth, Genesis is awful. Not that they had much to work with but he's less threatening and more whiny and lame and you just end up wondering why nobody has punched him in the throat yet.
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Mar 16, 2016 05:51
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I love it, because all signs point to it being intentional digs presumably wherever staff members other than Nomura could sneak them in. E: Genesis being terrible, that is.
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Mar 16, 2016 05:53
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FoolyCharged posted:You know at first I thought these evil villain plans were all pretty silly, but then I figured out they were all just winging it. 
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Mar 16, 2016 05:54
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berryjon posted:Another nice bit about the three-way fight which just emphasizes Sephiroph's character. Angeal blocks Genesis with the SOLDIER sword, and it breaks. He turns his back to Sephiroth and uses the Buster Sword to block Masamune (actually, it looks like the hilt of the Buster Sword) - and Sephiroth stops his sword dead in its tracks. I think that one moment says a lot about the three: Genesis is all about raw power. He wants to be the hero, he wants to be the cultured badass, he wants. But when you get down to it, he's a brat who throws a tantrum when he thinks he's not getting the respect due to him. Angeal, meanwhile, he's all about control: he's stoic, he keeps himself (and Zack, to an extent) in check, and in the middle of Genesis' bitchfit, he steps between the pair of them to keep them from doing proper damage to each other. His actions throughout the scene are to stop everyone from fighting, placing himself in danger, if need be. Then there's Sephiroth, who is both power and control: Genesis is busy blowing up poo poo like it's going out of fashion, while Sephiroth doesn't waste any movement. It's clear to the viewer, even without knowledge of future events, that he could turn Genesis into paste if he wanted, but he holds back, to the point where, as noted, he stops his sword mid-swing when Angeal intervenes. Slicing up the barrel of the Junon Cannon is arguably his way of saying 'knock it off, or this'll be you next' to get Genesis to step back. And when it doesn't work, oh well, time to teach the kid a lesson. The direction of the cutscene is silly as hell, but it also reveals all you really need to know about each character.
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Mar 16, 2016 12:48
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You know it's the humanizing bits that really shine through Genesis's bullshit and the AC style philosophizing. And it's one of the few things that remain of FF7's smartassed sassiness, that contrast, although in FF7 the contrast wasnt so stark like it is between play-quoter and honor-stroker. And why couldnt we have this Sephiroth in other games.
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Mar 16, 2016 16:27
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Rigged Death Trap posted:And why couldnt we have this Sephiroth in other games. Seriously, this is the best Sephiroth.
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Mar 16, 2016 17:03
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Rigged Death Trap posted:And why couldnt we have this Sephiroth in other games. Probably just a straight-up limitation of FF7: the game is already pretty drat long, and adding not-crazy Sephiroth to it would have made it even longer, to the point of needing another disk. And since all we really needed to know was that Sephiroth was: 1. Crazy Strong and 2. Crazy Because SCIENCE, there simply wasn't a reason to add a humanizing element to him. Making a prequel to humanize him is really for the best. Anyway, let's see here: Genesis wants to live, presumably so he can continue pretending to be in LOVELESS, Angeal wants to be human, which isn't going to end well for him, and Sephiroth doesn't really want anything yet, because he doesn't know that he wants to be a monster until a bit more in the future. And All because people thought that injecting people with monster cells was a good idea.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:13
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thetruegentleman posted:And All because people thought that injecting people with monster cells was a good idea. To be fair, it worked out pretty well with Cloud. Aside from the whole Black Materia thing, of course.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:22
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I do love that, ostensibly, the reason they are reviving a super powerful ancient race is because "they dig real good ". Also, pretty subtle when Zack says the trio are really tight and Sephiroth questions that. Guy must be feeling bad if his two bestest buds didn't invite him to their defection.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:24
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thetruegentleman posted:And All because people thought that injecting people with monster cells was a good idea. Hojo and Hollander missed the memo, it seems. Or they got it, and decided that SCIENCE! was more important. Now, you know what would be fun based on this discussion? A Dynasty Warriors styled game where you play as Sephiroth, Angeal or Genesis against Wutai soldiers, rebels and monsters.
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Mar 16, 2016 21:32
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thetruegentleman posted:Probably just a straight-up limitation of FF7: the game is already pretty drat long, and adding not-crazy Sephiroth to it would have made it even longer, to the point of needing another disk. And since all we really needed to know was that Sephiroth was: 1. Crazy Strong and 2. Crazy Because SCIENCE, there simply wasn't a reason to add a humanizing element to him. Making a prequel to humanize him is really for the best. I mean in KH and dissidia.
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Mar 16, 2016 22:26
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thetruegentleman posted:Probably just a straight-up limitation of FF7: the game is already pretty drat long, and adding not-crazy Sephiroth to it would have made it even longer, to the point of needing another disk. And since all we really needed to know was that Sephiroth was: 1. Crazy Strong and 2. Crazy Because SCIENCE, there simply wasn't a reason to add a humanizing element to him. Making a prequel to humanize him is really for the best. In the flashback in FF7 he seemed human enough. He chatted with Cloud, a completely generic mook, about his hometown, and started chuckling to himself when the topic turned to his father (who we know is Hojo, a complete joke of a scientist). I mean, it wasn't much, but it humanized him to me, even way back when I was 10 or whatever.
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Mar 16, 2016 22:27
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Clarste posted:In the flashback in FF7 he seemed human enough. He chatted with Cloud, a completely generic mook, about his hometown, and started chuckling to himself when the topic turned to his father (who we know is Hojo, a complete joke of a scientist). I mean, it wasn't much, but it humanized him to me, even way back when I was 10 or whatever. They didn't really humanize him in the flashback so much as they set a baseline. "This is what he was like before ANNNNNNND NOW CUE THE OMINOUS LATIN CHANTING CAUSE HE'S GONE EVIL AND CRAZY!" was pretty much all we got. Rigged Death Trap posted:I mean in KH and dissidia. Unfortunately, the hardcore wankfans actually enjoy Sephiroth as a psycho who likes to engage in homo-erotic wordplay with Cloud whenever they're in the same zip code as one another, and those are the ones that SE were writing for. To them, people who like the idea of a legitimately well-written character who isn't just tween-bait are weeeeiiiirrrrrrddddd.
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Mar 16, 2016 23:00
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Rigged Death Trap posted:I mean in KH and dissidia. Dissidia's Sephiroth is literally on Team Evil, so it's only natural he's crazy. As for Kingdom Hearts, it's stuck with Sephiroth as he was portrayed in FF7 for the simple reason that he's been around since the first game, which was made in 2002. Even so, it's hard to be certain that Sephiroth is even "real" as of Kingdom Hearts 2, as his talk with Cloud implies that Sephiroth was actually born from the dark part of Cloud's heart, and he exists mainly to tempt Cloud into forsaking everyone else so he can go full Grim Dark. Then again, Kingdom Hearts is also dumb as hell, so it's better not to think too hard about all the crap that goes on in it.
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Mar 17, 2016 00:55
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thetruegentleman posted:Dissidia's Sephiroth is literally on Team Evil, so it's only natural he's crazy. Also, Cloud is an extremely minor character in KH. Like, even more than the other FF characters. He barely even leaves an impression compared to the enjoyably stupid mess the ten million original characters are. idk it's true that my first exposure to Cloud was in KH1 because I was a baby when FFVII came out, but he's not what I think of when I think of Cloud, personally.
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Mar 17, 2016 01:01
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hopeandjoy posted:idk it's true that my first exposure to Cloud was in KH1 because I was a baby when FFVII came out, but he's not what I think of when I think of Cloud, personally. Thank goodness for that. Can someone confirm/deny the Internet Fact that up until just before release, "Cloud" was actually Vincent in Kingdom Hearts, but they swapped at the last minute to draw more sales and Cloud has been loaded with all of Vincent's moody gloomy baggage ever since as a result? And yeah, a lot of people have said it, but as dumb as Genesis is I'm glad he's in this game, because if he wasn't here being him it'd be Sephiroth getting the treatment. He's actually kinda fun in all his scenes so far!
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Mar 17, 2016 04:14
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So far the scenes with Sephiroth and Genesis are great because it's Sephiroth getting irritated putting up with basically what he becomes in the rest of the EU.
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Mar 17, 2016 04:31
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AlphaKretin posted:So far the scenes with Sephiroth and Genesis are great because it's Sephiroth getting irritated putting up with basically what he becomes in the rest of the EU. .....You're totally right. That's brilliant.
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Mar 17, 2016 05:38
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AlphaKretin posted:So far the scenes with Sephiroth and Genesis are great because it's Sephiroth getting irritated putting up with basically what he becomes in the rest of the EU. This is startlingly true. That kinda sucks. I get the impression that Sephiroth here is the kind of guy who holds back because he doesn't enjoy excessive force, especially not against his friends. And villain Sephiroth is a guy who COULD beat everyone easily, but decides not to because... it'd be a bad ending otherwise? Seriously, how many times does Cloud have to kick his rear end before he takes him seriously?
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Mar 17, 2016 06:00
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:This is startlingly true. Twice? Bizzaro and Stranger Sephiroth are the only two times he ever beat the real Sephiroth.
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Mar 17, 2016 07:40
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