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I thought the Madame Gao scenes from the first season were a lot more interesting. The hints at mysticism were a lot more intriguing than the 8 consecutive ninja fights
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Mar 22, 2016 20:39
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Daredevil Season 2 was a good show tied to a lovely show. The Hand sucks. They are boring, lacking in motivation, and being immortal magic ghost ninjas might be comic accurate but feels out of place and isn't well executed. Elektra became less and less interesting the less she became Matt's hosed Up Foil and the more she became a magical plot mcguffin. Stick is a good character tied to a lovely plot. Also the fights against the ninjas were largely boring. The plot also doesn't really feel like it goes much of anywhere. It's a lot of vague foreshadowing and generic mysticism. On the other hand the Punisher was excellent and everything involving him was infinitely infinitely more interesting than the other major plot of the season. The character was well played and humanized in a way a lot of recent comics tend to avoid. Seeing him upset, angry, even joking around does a lot more to make him at once sad sand scary than the stone-cold never-emotes superkiller version of the character. Everything about the show just seemed more interested when ti was dealing with the Punisher plot than the other one. Being comic accurate doesn't really excuse anything when the show is at its strongest being what it wants rather than when it is being comic accurate.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:40
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mikeraskol posted:This doesn't make any sense. If he knew the Blacksmith's identity, as soon as he got out of prison he would have booked it upstate and shot Clancy Brown in the face. He only figured it out by following Karen. I'm not sure that's the case. They've seemed to be playing around with the notion that Frank wasn't remembering everything that actually happened. Which is partially/totally down to the bullet to the head/repression.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:40
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zoux posted:I imagine next season will be all about Evil Elektra in charge of the Hand and Matt trying to get her back. Kill me now.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:40
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mikeraskol posted:This doesn't make any sense. If he knew the Blacksmith's identity, as soon as he got out of prison he would have booked it upstate and shot Clancy Brown in the face. He only figured it out by following Karen. Clancy Brown said to him 'You could have been a part of it. You could have taken your family to the Bahamas instead of Central Park'. I took that as to imply that he was offered a role in the heroin empire and refused. There's also the stuff with Khandahar that is only implied, so there might be something even more. Not to mention he was shot in the head and a lot of the time he is having trouble remembering a ton of poo poo. He just might not have been able to put it together. Also, just greenlight a Punisher show right now Marvel. Please.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:41
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Has there been any mention of how long Fisk's sentence is?
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Mar 22, 2016 20:42
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zoux posted:I imagine next season will be all about Evil Elektra in charge of the Hand and Matt trying to get her back. Well, I like Electra a lot so that could be good I guess. net cafe scandal posted:I thought the Madame Gao scenes from the first season were a lot more interesting. The hints at mysticism were a lot more intriguing than the 8 consecutive ninja fights Yeah totally. I love silly supernatural martial arts nonsense, it's just the hand were boring.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:46
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Rarity posted:Has there been any mention of how long Fisk's sentence is? I didn't catch one, but my thought is that his control of his prison will allow him to get out early on good behavior (read: unrecorded wrongdoing) in time for whenever Vincent D'Onofrio can commit to another season.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:46
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marktheando posted:I don't really want answers to the mysteries of the hand to be honest, I'd be perfectly happy if the next season just ignores them. I don't want answers either. Not right now. I just wanted to be intrigued. Personally I thought the Hand were good, they just needed a bit more to invest me in the mystery.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:50
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zoux posted:One thing they didn't follow up on, or if they did I missed it, was Matt losing his senses in his apartment for five minutes. Did they ever explain that or go back to it? But yeah after that it was completely forgotten.
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Mar 22, 2016 20:55
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net cafe scandal posted:The Bland. Yeah, what is this Black Guy that ChairDevil keeps talking about
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Mar 22, 2016 20:59
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The multi-season "plots" are the worst part of Doctor Who and MCU poo poo, and it's the worst part of Daredevil S2. Season 1 left a few questions, but it was mostly a self-contained story with a beginning, middle, and end. Too much of stuff that seemed central to S2 was never resolved and the stuff that was resolved barely makes sense. A shorter series that just focused on the Punisher stuff would have been infinitely better. E: I had heard that they didn't know they were getting a Season 2 of Daredevil when they produced Season 1. If that's true, that almost definitely explains why the first season was so much more fun. Long-form stories in episodic shows are fun, but drat do tv show writers abuse the hell out of that poo poo.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:24
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GlitchThief posted:The multi-season "plots" are the worst part of Doctor Who and MCU poo poo, and it's the worst part of Daredevil S2. Season 1 left a few questions, but it was mostly a self-contained story with a beginning, middle, and end. Too much of stuff that seemed central to S2 was never resolved and the stuff that was resolved barely makes sense. A shorter series that just focused on the Punisher stuff would have been infinitely better. Okay, how many of the writers would like Daredevil to deal with real life problems like the ones you face every day? *cheer* And who would like to see them do just the opposite, getting into far-out situations involving ninjas and magic powers. *cheer* So you want a realistic down-to-earth show that's completely off the wall and swarming with magic ninjas? And that is how we got Daredevil Season 2
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Mar 22, 2016 21:26
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ImpAtom posted:Okay, how many of the writers would like Daredevil to deal with real life problems like the ones you face every day? To be fair that is pretty much Daredevil to a T in the comics. Mystism, Ninja's and seeing how lovely we can make this man's life. Matt Murdock is only rivaled by Peter Parker in how much the writers poo poo on him in his personal life. And at least Peter got an extended run being a happily married man before trading in his marriage to the devil. Honestly we are pretty lucky Karen hasn't been killed...yet.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:34
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Dexo posted:Honestly we are pretty lucky Karen hasn't been turned into a smack junkie whore and sold Matt's identity for a fix in Mexico...yet.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:41
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To be fair she only just found out about his identity. That's the plot for S3 obviously.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:46
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Dexo posted:To be fair that is pretty much Daredevil to a T in the comics. Mystism, Ninja's and seeing how lovely we can make this man's life. Based on Daredevil and Jessica Jones, it seems pretty lovely for all the Netflix Marvel characters. I can only assume Luke Cage gets evicted from his apartment after losing his bar, and Danny Rand develops pancreatic cancer. Seriously: Karen, Foggy, and Jessica Jones seem like they're all legit alcoholics, and Matt is only slightly less obsessive and psychotic than Frank Castle. MCU Hell's Kitchen is apparently a sad, terrible place that breeds despair and madness. Not the oasis of New American cuisine and gay bars I understood it to be.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:50
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Xealot posted:Based on Daredevil and Jessica Jones, it seems pretty lovely for all the Netflix Marvel characters. I can only assume Luke Cage gets evicted from his apartment after losing his bar, and Danny Rand develops pancreatic cancer. Luke Cage and Danny Rand are only broke, they really aren't so dour usually.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:52
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Dexo posted:Luke Cage and Danny Rand are only broke, they really aren't so dour usually. I thought Danny was a billionaire?
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Mar 22, 2016 21:57
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Dacap posted:I thought Danny was a billionaire? Didn't Danny lose access(or Forsake) access to his family's money. I could be mistaken about this, I only loosely followed Iron Fist comics.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:59
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Just finished the show last night, and I agree with what seems to be the consensus: the Punisher half of the season was fantastic, and the Hand half was weak. The fact that the title character actually loses interest with the former to focus entirely on the latter (and that that was a plot point) didn't really help. Bernthal was excellent (there's actually not really any weak points in the cast, which is pretty great in itself), and I've gone from being neutral on the Punisher to actually being interested in a series about him. On the other hand, while the Hand plot had some great individual moments - the hole, the ninja attack on the hospital, some of the earlier Roxxon stuff - all the parts the writers seemed to feel were more important, and ended up focusing more on - the Black Sky, the war, the sarcophagus - I couldn't really give a poo poo about. Overall, I think I'd put it on par with S1, with the good and bad parts splitting the difference. S1 felt more cohesive, though.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:04
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Lord Hydronium posted:Just finished the show last night, and I agree with what seems to be the consensus: the Punisher half of the season was fantastic, and the Hand half was weak. The fact that the title character actually loses interest with the former to focus entirely on the latter (and that that was a plot point) didn't really help. Bernthal was excellent (there's actually not really any weak points in the cast, which is pretty great in itself), and I've gone from being neutral on the Punisher to actually being interested in a series about him. On the other hand, while the Hand plot had some great individual moments - the hole, the ninja attack on the hospital, some of the earlier Roxxon stuff - all the parts the writers seemed to feel were more important, and ended up focusing more on - the Black Sky, the war, the sarcophagus - I couldn't really give a poo poo about. I'm not really sure there's a consensus, plenty of people (like me) that loved it the whole way through. But I loved Matt destroying his life for Elektra 
mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Mar 22, 2016 |
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Mar 22, 2016 22:14
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I agree with posters who think the Hand could have been a good story, but they just didn't tie it together in a satisfying way due to how the consequences play out. Daredevil forces them to sever the blood connection to the sarcophagus? Oh well they'll set it up again. No real explanation of what was impacted beyond "send ninjas to get those kids back". The hospital ninja fight's consequences? Claire quits to do...something else? Finding the homicidal ninja clan may be zombies should have a bigger impact than Claire quitting, right? The reasons why Foggy left Nelson/Murdoch were completely understandable, but how it played out between him and Matt never really getting into the whole "death ninja cult killing everyone" as a somewhat reasonable excuse for his absences, and the whole game of telephone between them and Karen, was frustrating as a viewer. Foggy blaming all the vigilantes and mystical poo poo as Daredevil copycats is hilariously refutable, especially given Fisk's ties to the group. Unless Foggy blames Daredevil for causing Fisk or something.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:28
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Oh yeah through that whole Claire quitting segment I just had no idea why in Gods name I was expected to care about the PR of Claires hospital. Such a bizarre scene.. I guess they wanted to give Rosario Dawson some drama to chew on but it was just another break in momentum.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:32
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net cafe scandal posted:Oh yeah through that whole Claire quitting segment I just had no idea why in Gods name I was expected to care about the PR of Claires hospital. Such a bizarre scene.. I guess they wanted to give Rosario Dawson some drama to chew on but it was just another break in momentum. I assume they just need to get Claire to Harlem for Luke Cage.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:35
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net cafe scandal posted:Oh yeah through that whole Claire quitting segment I just had no idea why in Gods name I was expected to care about the PR of Claires hospital. Such a bizarre scene.. I guess they wanted to give Rosario Dawson some drama to chew on but it was just another break in momentum. To explain why she ends up in Harlem with Luke Cage.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:35
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I dont give a rats rear end about Puke Cage!
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Mar 22, 2016 22:42
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This is what I'm saying. I get not everything has to have immediate payoff, but if the only reason for a scene to exist is to set up something in a different series, maybe they're being a little overambitious with this crossover poo poo.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:44
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AtraMorS posted:There was a little bit of follow-up. During the sequence when the DA used the Irish gang member as bait, he gets hyper-sensitive again while he's squaring off against Punisher. It's how Punisher captures him and chains him up on the roof. It wasn't forgotten, he just had a concussion. The next episode's fight was the follow-up, as you mentioned, and the effects went away after a couple days.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:44
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GlitchThief posted:This is what I'm saying. I get not everything has to have immediate payoff, but if the only reason for a scene to exist is to set up something in a different series, maybe they're being a little overambitious with this crossover poo poo. So what you're saying is you don't need immediate payoff just not payoff that comes at a later date?
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Mar 22, 2016 22:47
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Na'at posted:So what you're saying is you don't need immediate payoff just not payoff that comes at a later date? I think they mean that they're okay with payoff at a later date but not taking a good chunk of time from one series for a scene that does nothing but set up why a character is in another series, which effectively means no payoff for Daredevil itself.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:49
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ImpAtom posted:I think they mean that they're okay with payoff at a later date but not taking a good chunk of time from one series for a scene that does nothing but set up why a character is in another series, which effectively means no payoff for Daredevil itself. Oh is that all it did?
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Mar 22, 2016 22:50
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zoux posted:Oh is that all it did? You don't get to make sarcastic little comments implying that you know better when you couldn't identify the symptoms of a concussion and wondered why there wasn't any follow-up.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:51
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Phenotype posted:You don't get to make sarcastic little comments implying that you know better when you couldn't identify the symptoms of a concussion and wondered why there wasn't any follow-up. Lol, yeah it's true that I couldn't diagnose a concussion via watching a TV show. I know that NFL players lose all their hearing and radar sense when they get their bell rung, so I should've known better. http://i.imgur.com/YbfXOTE.gifv Ah yes, textbook concussion. The clinical scream you can't hear yourself and where they bang on a wall.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:53
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zoux posted:Oh is that all it did? The scene set up a basic fact that could have been better integrated into the story using characters relevant to the plot and provided excuse for a character to leave the show for another show. So... yeah? Characters either find out the information in that scene in another way or it doesn't actually contribute to the rest of the season.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:53
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Setting up a plot point for Iron Fist is risky because not everyone who watches Daredevil wants to watch Iron Fist or Defenders. Or the other shows for that matter. IDK who those people would be but I know they exist.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:54
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ImpAtom posted:The scene set up a basic fact that could have been better integrated into the story using characters relevant to the plot and provided excuse for a character to leave the show for another show. So... yeah? A lot of the problems I"m seeing is people rewriting story beats like that's valid crit. HIJK posted:Setting up a plot point for Iron Fist is risky because not everyone who watches Daredevil wants to watch Iron Fist or Defenders. Or the other shows for that matter. Yeah it's certainly failed the MCU movies.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:54
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zoux posted:A lot of the problems I"m seeing is people rewriting story beats like that's valid crit. No? Those scenes don't actually contribute to the story. They provide information which characters find out in other ways (because that scene is mostly disconnected characters) or which isn't relevant to the rest of the season and if it is used next season will have to be reintroduced and reiterated anyway. zoux posted:Yeah it's certainly failed the MCU movies. In terms of being well-written? Oh poo poo yes. Iron Man 2 was badly hurt by all the dumb SHIELD setup.
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Mar 22, 2016 22:56
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zoux posted:Lol, yeah it's true that I couldn't diagnose a concussion via watching a TV show. I know that NFL players lose all their hearing and radar sense when they get their bell rung, so I should've known better. Temporary Hearing Loss and other hearing issues are common with concussions though? And Since hearing is kinda how Matt sees thing, you can see why he would start banging his hand and trying to get sound. Dexo fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Mar 22, 2016 |
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Mar 22, 2016 22:57
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ImpAtom posted:The scene set up a basic fact that could have been better integrated into the story using characters relevant to the plot and provided excuse for a character to leave the show for another show. So... yeah? Characters either find out the information in that scene in another way or it doesn't actually contribute to the rest of the season. You mean like how Foggy is leaving for Jessica Jones and Hogarth is on Daredevil now right? How about this for a prediction, Night Nurse will return in Daredevil S3, Jessica Jones S2, Luke Cage S1, and in the cross over series. This isn't like Frasier moving to Seattle for his own show. It's best to think of each show as a part of a larger show.
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Mar 22, 2016 23:03
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