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Gilok posted:You know, I haven't heard a lot of talk about it. Was it bad? I mean, compared to Mage Revised? I'm mostly going by the FATAL and Friends review. The main problem seems to be that they got Phil Brucato to write it, and it mostly comes off as "Phil Brucato wants to make an Invisibles RPG without paying Grant Morrison royalties."
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Mar 27, 2016 00:11
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Simian_Prime posted:I'm mostly going by the FATAL and Friends review. The main problem seems to be that they got Phil Brucato to write it, and it mostly comes off as "Phil Brucato wants to make an Invisibles RPG without paying Grant Morrison royalties."
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Mar 27, 2016 05:17
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They've known Brucato is a certifiable nutcase since the 1990's, why the hell did they hire him for this?
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Mar 27, 2016 05:29
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Because a lot of Mage fans tend to blame all the stuff they don't like in Mage on the Revised developers despite Brucato laying most of the groundwork for it or being outright responsible for it. So instead it's like "Look, we got that guy you like back!" Never mind that the -last- thing he'd written for the WOD was...NWOD: Changing Breeds.
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Mar 27, 2016 05:38
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It's really not that bad if you can get past Brucato's asides about his, uh, worldview
long-ass nips Diane fucked around with this message at 05:45 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 05:42
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Is it better or worse than Beast?
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Mar 27, 2016 06:13
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Kavak posted:They've known Brucato is a certifiable nutcase since the 1990's, why the hell did they hire him for this? Name brand recognition for people who stopped paying attention to the license in 2005. Cabbit posted:Is it better or worse than Beast? Better, by a long shot. The worst you can say about M20 is that Brucato loves to do things like talk about the real reason there's conflict in the Middle East, or how chaos magic turns you into a nephandi IRL if you play one in your nerd games. Its more like watching your burnout uncle that never really mentally left 1974 take one too many drinks and ramble at length while your cousins desperately attempt to pretend he's not in the room. Daeren fucked around with this message at 06:41 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 06:38
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It's a terrible intro if you want to get into Ascension as a new player, but I don't think that was a significant number of buyers.
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Mar 27, 2016 06:42
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Ascension is worse than Awakening at any rate.
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Mar 27, 2016 07:33
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DJ Dizzy posted:Ascension is worse than Awakening at any rate. Yeah, but Awakening lacks that sense of wonder, the political aspect of uniting with a group that shares your belief in how the universe works or at least SHOULD work and making it so, wondrous, far-flung realms to explore, and enemies seeking to dominate or destroy everyone and everything in the multiverse. EDIT: Sorry, thought your post said Planescape.
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Mar 27, 2016 07:44
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Brucato's mage insanity is mostly confined to the side bars, the problem is there are a lot of them.
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Mar 27, 2016 15:20
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Kurieg posted:Brucato's mage insanity is mostly confined to the side bars, and the in-character descriptions, the ST advice, the setting description, the entire Nephandi chapter...
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Mar 27, 2016 15:47
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LatwPIAT posted:and the in-character descriptions, the ST advice, the setting description, the entire Nephandi chapter... Well yes, I did say mostly. As opposed to new CB where it was all pervasive and invaded the rules themselves.
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Mar 27, 2016 15:50
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Kurieg posted:Well yes, I did say mostly. Please elaborate. I haven't read CB at all and this is the first I hear of Phil Brucato, so I feel like I'm missing out on a good trainwreck. Terrorforge fucked around with this message at 15:56 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 15:54
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Terrorforge posted:Please elaborate. I haven't read CB at all and this is the first I hear of Phil Brucato, and I feel like I'm missing out on a good trainwreck. http://projects.inklesspen.com/fatal-and-friends/kurieg/changing-breeds/
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Mar 27, 2016 15:56
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That write up uses the literal phrase "he claims that" in regards to something written in a furry superhero splatbook. Not to mention that the histories in all WW splatbooks are from the point of view of their subjects and decidedly untrustworthy. Phil Bruscatto is awesome in the vein of Timothy Leary, Robert Anton Wilson, and Grant Morrison and Mage works better with some of that in its blood.
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Mar 27, 2016 16:10
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Mr. Belding posted:That write up uses the literal phrase "he claims that" in regards to something written in a furry superhero splatbook. Satyros Phil "From the perspective of the omniscient rules narrator in this reference book I am sincerely concerned that playable infernalists and Nephandi will corrupt Blackleaf's soul" Brucato is bad, and not good. Chernobyl Peace Prize fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 16:45
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Mr. Belding posted:That write up uses the literal phrase "he claims that" in regards to something written in a furry superhero splatbook. Yeah, I did use "claims" because he's nuts. Did you get to the point where moral degeneration compels you to strip naked and poo poo in the corner? Or that seeing someone throw a cigarette butt on the ground compels you to pee on their car. Or that they integrate themselves into otherkin communities or go to furcons letting it all hang out with their "highly realistic costumes" despite the fact that the rules state you can't stay in the hybrid form without flying into a murderous rage.
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Mar 27, 2016 17:38
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Is there a rule with FATAL and Friends where your review has to be at least as long as the book you're reviewing?
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Mar 27, 2016 17:41
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No, if the book is dry it tends to get summarized pretty heavily. But ones that are information dense and full of terrible can end up longer once commentary is added.
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Mar 27, 2016 17:45
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F&F reviews are also typically a lot better laid out AND delivered on a more consistent schedule than the products they're reviewing, which is nice.
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Mar 27, 2016 17:53
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Kurieg posted:Yeah, I did use "claims" because he's nuts. Did you get to the point where moral degeneration compels you to strip naked and poo poo in the corner? Or that seeing someone throw a cigarette butt on the ground compels you to pee on their car. Literally all of this would happen if this took place in the universe of the Invisibles (which OWoD more or less is, at least post Mage: the Ascension). I don't know if it makes a good roleplaying game or not (probably not) but most roleplaying games don't make good roleplaying games anyway. edit: As for him being "nuts", probably. The best game about wizards is Unknown Armies and it's literally impossible to write about magic and be compelling without being a potential major NPC in that universe. Mr. Belding fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 19:05
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Mr. Belding posted:Literally all of this would happen if this took place in the universe of the Invisibles (which OWoD more or less is, at least post Mage: the Ascension). I don't know if it makes a good roleplaying game or not (probably not) but most roleplaying games don't make good roleplaying games anyway. I must have missed the issue where King Mob shat on the floor while Lord Fanny showed off her new fursuit.
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Mar 27, 2016 21:35
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Mr. Belding posted:That write up uses the literal phrase "he claims that" in regards to something written in a furry superhero splatbook. Changing Breeds is the sourcebook with a sidebar about how it's totally cool to gently caress dogs and how the love between an otherkin and their pet is a special thing that normies just don't understaaaaand. "Awesome" is not the word I would use to describe someone like that, sorry.
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Mar 28, 2016 03:42
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Phil is an occultist of a neopagan tradition, with all the usual batshittery that entails. Mind you, I'm an occultist of a syncretic Hermetic-Shamanic approach, so I'm probably subject to a lot of the same batshittery.
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Mar 28, 2016 05:57
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Loomer posted:Phil is an occultist of a neopagan tradition, with all the usual batshittery that entails. Mind you, I'm an occultist of a syncretic Hermetic-Shamanic approach, so I'm probably subject to a lot of the same batshittery. ᴛʜᴇ ᴘʀᴏᴊᴇᴄᴛ should be proof enough of that.
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Mar 28, 2016 07:46
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Daeren posted:ᴛʜᴇ ᴘʀᴏᴊᴇᴄᴛ should be proof enough of that. Yeah now I'm worried this is part of an ongoing ritual to make vampires real or something.
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Mar 28, 2016 13:17
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Gilok posted:Yeah now I'm worried this is part of an ongoing ritual to make vampires real or something. All I can think of is comparing The Project to Tremere in that one Gehenna scenario trying to use the Mormon genealogical archives as the True Name of humanity.
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Mar 28, 2016 13:26
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So what I'm getting out of that Changing Breeds review is that Brucato is not only bugfuck crazy, he has no problem co-opting the terminology from an actual real-world belief system for his creepy sex-obsessed weirdness. Well isn't that just peachy. For reference, "nahual" is this spiritual concept: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagual and just yeah. Yeeaaaahhh.
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Mar 28, 2016 14:37
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taichara posted:So what I'm getting out of that Changing Breeds review is that Brucato is not only bugfuck crazy, he has no problem co-opting the terminology from an actual real-world belief system for his creepy sex-obsessed weirdness. Well isn't that just peachy. To be fair, it's a pretty common problem in RPG developers and it's hardly the first time a WoD book has cannibalized real-world spiritual traditions for terminology. Gnosis, jyhad, Great Work, benediction, bodhisattva, the list goes on.
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Mar 28, 2016 14:55
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Hell, in oMage's case - to paraphrase a saying about the English language - it didn't just steal from real-world magical traditions, it actively chased them down alleyways, hit them over the head, and rifled through their pockets for anything interesting.
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Mar 28, 2016 14:57
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Terrorforge posted:To be fair, it's a pretty common problem in RPG developers and it's hardly the first time a WoD book has cannibalized real-world spiritual traditions for terminology. Gnosis, jyhad, Great Work, benediction, bodhisattva, the list goes on. Not all of those have the same level of "virtually identical to the actual usage except made literal and also creepy as all hell", though, at least in my opinion.
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Mar 28, 2016 15:01
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Loomer posted:Hell, in oMage's case - to paraphrase a saying about the English language - it didn't just steal from real-world magical traditions, it actively chased them down alleyways, hit them over the head, and rifled through their pockets for anything interesting. Well, it should be noted that Brucato is on record that he deliberately changed things from real-world magical traditions to prevent players from accidentally doing real magic. Yeah.
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Mar 28, 2016 15:24
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Mors Rattus posted:Well, it should be noted that Brucato is on record that he deliberately changed things from real-world magical traditions to prevent players from accidentally doing real magic. Not changed. Left out the details.
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Mar 28, 2016 15:32
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Simian_Prime posted:I must have missed the issue where King Mob shat on the floor while Lord Fanny showed off her new fursuit. While those specifics certainly didn't occur they wouldn't be terrifically outside the tone of the books. Example scenes would include the extra dimensional sex party where the Marquis de Sade asks a woman if she likes to gently caress "as a dog" and preceding Lord Mob's kidnapping when Lord Fanny brings home a spook with the intention of blowing him, but when she attempts to remove his pants he puts a gun in her mouth. She witnesses this scene from the past as a 12 year old in a drug induced magical trance. I say all of this not to imply that Bruccato is anywhere near as talented as Morrison (because of course he is not), but they are both crazy people who believe in magic and write about it and this particular form of insanity can produce incredible things.
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Mar 28, 2016 16:15
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And Phil Brucato has not been the person to produce those things, other than the sense of wonder that the fact of his drawing a paycheck can inspire.
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Mar 28, 2016 16:52
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When occultism goes right: Aleister Crowley's magnificent poetry about the nature of love. When occultism goes wrong: Phil Brucato writing about loving dogs.
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Mar 28, 2016 16:55
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Not to derail but how long has Chronicles of Darkness been available from DriveThru?
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Mar 28, 2016 19:31
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Mr. Belding posted:the extra dimensional sex party where the Marquis de Sade asks a woman if she likes to gently caress "as a dog" and preceding Lord Mob's kidnapping when Lord Fanny brings home a spook with the intention of blowing him, but when she attempts to remove his pants he puts a gun in her mouth. She witnesses this scene from the past as a 12 year old in a drug induced magical trance.
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Mar 28, 2016 20:12
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Inzombiac posted:Not to derail but how long has Chronicles of Darkness been available from DriveThru? December 12, 2015: http://theonyxpath.com/announcing-chronicles-of-darkness/ So, 3.5 months.
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Mar 28, 2016 20:27
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