|
Parallel Paraplegic posted:Also his equating of 4chan's "cute boys / traps" boards vs actual transpeople thing is triggering me so hard right now because the whole "trap" thing is super toxic to actual transpeople and oh my god he's making me critically analyze anime porn types now gently caress you so much This is related to a current discussion on rationalist Tumblr: ozymandias271 suspects a lot of closeted trans people end up there, and figures advertising to them would be a good idea. They did QALY calculations and everything. The trans people in the thread (which includes Ozy) mostly considered this a not inherently terrible idea, on the basis that it would actually have helped them when they were on 4chan.
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 18:28
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 16:18 |
|
|
I know a transwoman who used 4chab when she was young (so did the rest of us i guess) and called herself a trap back then because it was literally the only concept society had presented her for what she felt, so ozy is probably not entirely off base
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 19:52
|
|
|
i was involved with a lambdaconf spinoff that cancelled upon release of that blog post justifying moldbug's inclusion (not my call, but one i support) and twitter has been a delight ever since. i've been accused of forming a lynch mob, advocating criminalizing thought crime, being part of a shadowy conspiracy organizing a boycott of anyone that associates with moldbug, demands that it's amoral for me to any conference that has ever invited someone who practices any religion or is pro life, accusations that no, actually, i am the racist and, of course, infringing upon moldbug's free speech critics of those of us who have decided to disassociate from lambdaconf (consider moonconf, serendipitously also taking place in boulder at the same time as lambdaconf, but with complete disjoint organizers, btw) seem unable to accept that multiple people could make a decision to not be associated with an organization that willingly associates itself with moldbug without being directed to do so by some overarching social justice warrior directorate. as if i take my marching orders from coda hale or steve klabnick or maybe even shanley or bodil stokke even more confusing is those that seem to think i'm obligated to give time and attention to moldbug because not doing so proves that i am the prejudiced bigot. what is the source of these hosed up ideas about censorship and debate? i know a bunch of them like to quote john stuart mill but as he wrote on liberty as a framework you must adhere to to be given a seat at the table (and the paramount principle is that you have to accept that other people also deserve a seat at the table) and it was motivated by his support for universal suffrage i have doubts any of them have ever read him
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 21:49
|
|
|
Is there a group angrily tweeting about how it neither is that big of a deal to have a super obscure insane political blogger talk about something absolutely not his politics on a conference, nor to disinvite him considering he's insane and has repulsive political views and his software is dumb? Cause if not, my opinion is underrepresented on Twitter.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 21:55
|
|
|
Tesseraction posted:Being fair, it's not an anime porn thing, it's just a 4chan thing - they apply it to real people just as readily. The concept is from anime porn, a girl goes to have sex but ~oh no it's actually a cute guy~ and they have sex anyway because porn. But yes, 4chan is where it became a thing applied to real people and that's the big problem because 1) in real life people get murdered in those situations and 2) it's pretty much boiling transpeople down into a fetish. Pomp posted:I know a transwoman who used 4chab when she was young (so did the rest of us i guess) and called herself a trap back then because it was literally the only concept society had presented her for what she felt, so ozy is probably not entirely off base Yeah I know several people like that myself, huh.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 22:17
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:Is there a group angrily tweeting about how it neither is that big of a deal to have a super obscure insane political blogger talk about something absolutely not his politics on a conference, nor to disinvite him considering he's insane and has repulsive political views and his software is dumb? that group doesn't really exist because the talk moldbug is giving on urbit, which is just his politics encoded in a social network
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 22:24
|
|
|
I mean who the conference really cares about is sponsors, and from a sponsors' point of view they just punched "Curtis Yarvin" into google and (assuming all the results about this conference weren't there at the time) got like one idiot at Slate defending him and a bunch of articles pointing out what a horrible person he is. Regardless of what his talk is about if I were a sponsor I wouldn't want "CURTIS YARVIN SPONSORED BY SONY" or whatever to be a thing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 22:50
|
|
|
Parallel Paraplegic posted:I mean who the conference really cares about is sponsors, and from a sponsors' point of view they just punched "Curtis Yarvin" into google and (assuming all the results about this conference weren't there at the time) got like one idiot at Slate defending him and a bunch of articles pointing out what a horrible person he is. Regardless of what his talk is about if I were a sponsor I wouldn't want "CURTIS YARVIN SPONSORED BY SONY" or whatever to be a thing. the talent deficit posted:that group doesn't really exist because the talk moldbug is giving on urbit, which is just his politics encoded in a social network
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:01
|
|
|
Is urbit even like a thing that does anything or matters? I Googled it and the page is basically just 
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:04
|
|
|
Neoreactionaries like Wesley can't defend Moldbug so they're going around "outing" people who cancelled their own conferences as communists. Also, this: https://twitter.com/Outsideness/status/714117427747889156
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:10
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:It's very well encoded then. You have read the whitepaper, right?
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:11
|
|
|
All the whining from neoreactionaries and their friends about moldbug being persecuted for his political views ignores the fact that urbit is worthless and nobody would have paid attention to it if wasn't for his political views. Live by the edgelord, die by the edgelord.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:24
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/nydwracu/status/712085582483230720 If anyone remotely left-wing called 4chan or neo-reactionaries of being "depressive NEET trolls", the vaguely SJ-y wing of Less Wrong would be accusing them of being evil ableist puritans within seconds. But Wesley is their friend, so he doesn't count.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:53
|
|
|
Fututor Magnus posted:You have read the whitepaper, right?
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2016 23:58
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:Yeah, and it's insane, but it didn't argue against democracy from what I remember. it's an identity platform with rules for excluding identities as it's motivation. also identities are bestowed in a hierarchial manner as in feudalism
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 00:02
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:Yes, and that's why this is in no way exciting or meaningful. Specifically I was talking about your first point, that it's not "that big of a deal to have a super obscure insane political blogger talk about something absolutely not his politics on a conference." Because it's totally a big deal to sponsors, and they're totally justified in wanting him kicked out. The fact that they're not kicking him out then makes it a big deal to everyone else. I agree him getting kicked out would not have been a big deal but that's not what happened and here we are.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 00:41
|
|
|
the talent deficit posted:it's an identity platform with rules for excluding identities as it's motivation. also identities are bestowed in a hierarchial manner as in feudalism Parallel Paraplegic posted:Specifically I was talking about your first point, that it's not "that big of a deal to have a super obscure insane political blogger talk about something absolutely not his politics on a conference." Because it's totally a big deal to sponsors, and they're totally justified in wanting him kicked out. The fact that they're not kicking him out then makes it a big deal to everyone else. I agree him getting kicked out would not have been a big deal but that's not what happened and here we are.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 02:06
|
|
|
I don't think Urbit is a reflection of Moldbug's politics so much as it comes from the same traits as the ones that lead him to his politics (contrarianism, obscurantism). Those same traits are also why his poetry is so bad and why he finds Carlyle's writing style tolerable. Silver2195 has a new favorite as of 04:32 on Mar 28, 2016 |
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 04:28
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:So like a web forum? I mean forums have a "hierarchy" but it's only designed for functional permissions - who can delete something, who can manage things, etc. You certainly can build a weird serfdom around that but they're not specifically built with that in mind from square one.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 04:49
|
|
|
the talent deficit posted:what is the source of these hosed up ideas about censorship and debate? A sense of personal aggreivement, and a need to justify it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 05:19
|
|
|
Doc Hawkins posted:A sense of personal aggreivement, and a need to justify it. You know ever since I've read the decoding authoritarians thread I've seen it's psychology more and more in the ppl we talk about here
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 05:25
|
|
|
Twerkteam Pizza posted:You know ever since I've read the decoding authoritarians thread I've seen it's psychology more and more in the ppl we talk about here See also The Authoritarians, a free and well-sourced book about authoritarian personalities. The author often uses "right-wing authoritarian" for historical reasons, but the term applies to a wide range of ideologies.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 08:06
|
|
|
The Vosgian Beast posted:https://twitter.com/nydwracu/status/712085582483230720 There's one Tumblr poster called lord-kitschener, an American living in Berlin, who spends her Tumblr time taunting alt-right and neonazis as "tradneets" (and good Lord does she piss them off, including ones who interact with the rationalists); perhaps that's what he's referencing here.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 09:28
|
|
|
NEET just means unemployed person right?
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 19:31
|
|
|
Patrick Spens posted:NEET just means unemployed person right? Not Employed, in Education, or Training.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 19:31
|
|
|
Patrick Spens posted:NEET just means unemployed person right? Yes. He's calling people basement dwellers, basically
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 20:01
|
|
|
Sometimes I don't even know anymore. Read this on Scott's blog for quite possibly the dumbest  argument I've ever seen.To be fair, Scott ignores it and there's also plenty of good comments (on other topics) around it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 23:05
|
|
|
I kind of wish I was at LambdaConf so I could ask Moldbug to write FizzBuzz in Hoon without looking anything up. I am 99% certain even he would stumble over its deliberate dumbass weirdness.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 23:10
|
|
|
Zemyla posted:I kind of wish I was at LambdaConf so I could ask Moldbug to write FizzBuzz in Hoon without looking anything up.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2016 23:19
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:Sometimes I don't even know anymore. Goddamn is Scott a loving moron. Biodeterminism is stupid, he doesn't understand genetics. But he's fine with linking to someone who understands genetics even less.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 02:28
|
|
|
Fututor Magnus posted:Goddamn is Scott a loving moron. Biodeterminism is stupid, he doesn't understand genetics. But he's fine with linking to someone who understands genetics even less. Also biodeterminism is exactly as stupid as its opposite, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle vOv
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 03:33
|
|
|
Cingulate posted:Also biodeterminism is exactly as stupid as its opposite, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle vOv There are no behaviourists around who're taken seriously so there was no reason for you to bring this up.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 03:36
|
|
|
I thought behaviorism had gotten a fair amount of rehabilitation, or maybe that was more "things which drew inspiration from behavioralism." Assuming you're talking about Skinner et al. and not something else.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 03:39
|
|
|
Fututor Magnus posted:There are no behaviourists around who're taken seriously so there was no reason for you to bring this up. Nessus posted:I thought behaviorism had gotten a fair amount of rehabilitation, or maybe that was more "things which drew inspiration from behavioralism." Assuming you're talking about Skinner et al. and not something else. 2. In a sense, we* are all behaviorists. * psychologists Anybody who believes we're in our behavior entirely determined by their genes is very likely wrong, anybody who believes we're not at all too, the truth is in the middle, this is not hard. Straw man biodeterminists are of course wrong, but that's the thing about straw men.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 03:49
|
|
|
Skinner isn't respected by cognitive psychologists, because these days he just writes pop-science that makes people feel good and tells us nothing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 06:31
|
|
|
Vivian Darkbloom posted:Skinner isn't respected by cognitive psychologists, because these days he just writes pop-science that makes people feel good and tells us nothing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 08:28
|
|
|
Nessus posted:He's been dead for twenty-six years! The ideal age for writing frothy pop-psychology papers, you'll find.
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 08:33
|
|
|
Vivian Darkbloom posted:Skinner isn't respected by cognitive psychologists, because these days he just writes pop-science that makes people feel good and tells us nothing. Also, Nessus posted:He's been dead for twenty-six years!
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 09:04
|
|
|
Parallel Paraplegic posted:Also his equating of 4chan's "cute boys / traps" boards vs actual transpeople thing is triggering me so hard right now because the whole "trap" thing is super toxic to actual transpeople and oh my god he's making me critically analyze anime porn types now gently caress you so much I wonder sometimes if traps are how "political homosexuality" is manifesting in the alt-right. Commentators have wondered for a long time why they won't go gay if women are so terrible, like women went lesbian in protest in the past, and I say, but they are going gay. Just an idea though because I haven't set foot in 4chan or any of its offshoots in years, so I don't know what they have mutated into
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 09:23
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 16:18 |
|
|
hackbunny posted:I wonder sometimes if traps are how "political homosexuality" is manifesting in the alt-right. Commentators have wondered for a long time why they won't go gay if women are so terrible, like women went lesbian in protest in the past, and I say, but they are going gay. Just an idea though because I haven't set foot in 4chan or any of its offshoots in years, so I don't know what they have mutated into
|
|
#
?
Mar 29, 2016 09:36
|
|