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El Hefe posted:You'd miss that and be excused, but not an actual team of doctors treating professional drivers in a worldwide sport. If he doesn't say anything is wrong there why would they look. Like I said I only noticed it the next morning when it hurt to breath deeply.
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Apr 1, 2016 21:39
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1500quidporsche posted:If he doesn't say anything is wrong there why would they look. You don't have to say anything, doctors are the ones who have to say what you have to do not the other way around. He had just been in an accident so it was the doctor's job to put him through all the tests regardless if he said he was feeling fine or not..
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Apr 1, 2016 21:44
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El Hefe posted:You don't have to say anything, doctors are the ones who have to say what you have to do not the other way around. He had just been in an accident so it was the doctor's job to put him through all the tests regardless if he said he was feeling fine or not.. Oh come on. So if he rolled it and a Brazilian mosquito got in the cockpit and bit him I suppose you'd be calling for their heads because they couldn't instantly guess he has the Zika virus. Medical testing is hella expensive and unless he presents with a symptom there's no reason they'd go looking for broken ribs.
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Apr 1, 2016 21:48
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Putting him to every possible medical scan you can do on a human probably costs less than what he spent on the private jet that took him to Melbourne, so yes, I expect them to actually do a full set of tests after such a hard crash.
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Apr 1, 2016 21:51
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learnincurve posted:Yes. The timeline is being a bit warped in this thread. We know he went to the medical centre after the crash, but was out in the paddock 20 mins later. He flew back home to Abu Dhabi sunday night but the pain in his ribs was getting worse so he went to the hospital on the Monday. They detected the pneumothorax (collapsed lung) and rib injuries on x ray. He was told to rest and went back the next (this) Monday and was told his lung was cleared but his ribs were still fractured. Fractured means snapped and does usually show up on x-rays, cracked means they are split and weakened which is the more common injury as ribs are quite bendy and can easily be missed. He was then very surprised on Thursday when the FIA said no you can't race with fractured ribs. Still 4 - 6 weeks though regardless
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Apr 1, 2016 21:54
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They won't give an x-ray unless a patient complains about pain in an area , is unable to complain about it, or has bruising/anomaly in the lung. The problem here is that he was high on adrenaline which is a natural painkiller so he may not have known if he was in pain or not. The massive problem I have with this is that in any medical examination after a crash the patient has to remove their shirt so that you can listen to heart and lungs with a stethoscope. A fractured rib should display significant bruising in the rib area and a pneumothorax will be clearly audible as your lungs will be gurgling. Lungs are not supposed to gurgle. Is this a problem with a driver telling the medical staff gently caress off I feel fine and the staff not feeling that they can stand up to him, or just complete idiocy.
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Apr 1, 2016 21:58
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Pretty sure you only hear a gurgling when it's tension pneumothorax, which is a sucking chest wound. I'd think a collapsed lung would just be really labored breathing.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:01
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Did the Canberra Milk Kid race with a broken leg for half a season or am I misremembering #aussiegrit?
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Apr 1, 2016 22:03
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In actual news: Magnussen managed to miss being signalled to go to the weigh bridge, and then the team worked on the car instead of noticing and sending him back there, so he's required to start the race from the pitlane. Oops.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:09
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Volkerball posted:Pretty sure you only hear a gurgling when it's tension pneumothorax, which is a sucking chest wound. I'd think a collapsed lung would just be really labored breathing. Yeh your right, I only hear tension so auto went there, thankfully not in my job description to do actual diagnosis, I deal with the patients unable to describe pain side of things. Traumatic is hyper-resonant percussion/diminished breath sounds with a stethoscope.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:13
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Even though it's another lovely energy drink, I'm getting a kick out of HYPE on the Force India rear wing.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:19
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simplefish posted:Did the Canberra Milk Kid race with a broken leg for half a season or am I misremembering #aussiegrit? Yeah a broken leg and rib possibly puncturing a lung are totally the same.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:29
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is everyone itt a medical professional? not a sarcastic question
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Apr 1, 2016 22:43
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be nice wicka posted:is everyone itt a medical professional? not a sarcastic question I was pre med for half a semester
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Apr 1, 2016 22:44
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I would have thought people in the engineering field would be more common. Being serious, a lot of medical professionals stopped watching F1 after the footage from Jules' accident was leaked on the Monday. If you haven't seen it, don't google, if medical professionals couldn't handle it then you know it's indescribably horrible. I don't think I even looked at any F1 sites/forums until he actually died.
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Apr 1, 2016 22:56
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learnincurve posted:They won't give an x-ray unless a patient complains about pain in an area , is unable to complain about it, or has bruising/anomaly in the lung. The problem here is that he was high on adrenaline which is a natural painkiller so he may not have known if he was in pain or not. The massive problem I have with this is that in any medical examination after a crash the patient has to remove their shirt so that you can listen to heart and lungs with a stethoscope. A fractured rib should display significant bruising in the rib area and a pneumothorax will be clearly audible as your lungs will be gurgling. Lungs are not supposed to gurgle. Is this a problem with a driver telling the medical staff gently caress off I feel fine and the staff not feeling that they can stand up to him, or just complete idiocy. This is pretty much what the hospital said to me they don't normally xray, but sent me for one due to the impact area... thankfully nothing too bad
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Apr 1, 2016 22:56
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Norns posted:Yeah a broken leg and rib possibly puncturing a lung are totally the same. I wasn't trying to turn this into Incapacity Olympics, I was just drawing a parallel between the two, because unless I'm wrong (not sarcastic, I could well be) a broken leg should get you medically disallowed from racing, surely? And so posters are sitting in this thread like "oh yeah they should have seen the ribs thing" but apparently track docs can manage to miss a friggin broken leg? Which should be rather more apparent
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Apr 1, 2016 23:00
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He broke his leg before the season started and raced with pins/plates in his leg, and the doctors determined that in the event of a crash the pins/plates would not effect the outcome . With ribs you have to let them heal on their own and until they are fully healed they are very weak to the point that even a sudden stop in a road car with a seatbelt on could re-break that rib and cause it to puncture your lung. It's the secondary impact thing all over again.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:08
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simplefish posted:I wasn't trying to turn this into Incapacity Olympics, I was just drawing a parallel between the two, because unless I'm wrong (not sarcastic, I could well be) a broken leg should get you medically disallowed from racing, surely? And so posters are sitting in this thread like "oh yeah they should have seen the ribs thing" but apparently track docs can manage to miss a friggin broken leg? Which should be rather more apparent Well for one you would have difficulty walking
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Apr 1, 2016 23:09
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simplefish posted:I wasn't trying to turn this into Incapacity Olympics, I was just drawing a parallel between the two, because unless I'm wrong (not sarcastic, I could well be) a broken leg should get you medically disallowed from racing, surely? And so posters are sitting in this thread like "oh yeah they should have seen the ribs thing" but apparently track docs can manage to miss a friggin broken leg? Which should be rather more apparent Alex Zanardi wasn't disallowed from racing for having two missing legs, so I don't think one broken and pinned leg should be a barrier. Tsaedje fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Apr 1, 2016 |
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Apr 1, 2016 23:17
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Chuck Yeager and Niki Lauda did their job with cracked ribs. Alonso ain't poo poo.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:19
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:Chuck Yeager and Niki Lauda did their job with cracked ribs. Alonso ain't poo poo. Both of these men were and are insane.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:21
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:Chuck Yeager and Niki Lauda did their job with cracked ribs. Alonso ain't poo poo. Pansies! None of them ever won the FA Cup with a broken neck, which is the ultimate playing on through injury achievement.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:22
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Thanks for the details everyone, for some reason I thought he was hiding it actually being broken (like in a cast I suppose). Maybe he said 'hiding the pain' or something and I misremembered. But yeah, pinned and plated makes sense.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:29
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learnincurve posted:Fractured means snapped and does usually show up on x-rays, No it does not. Stop making poo poo up. Fractured just means that there's a crack and they will not always show up on x-rays.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:54
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Tsaedje posted:Broken ribs are really hard to spot sometimes, especially if you're more concerned about more potentially serious injuries. When I smashed my shoulder into a million pieces I had lots of x-rays and CTs and they only realised I'd broken some ribs on a follow up x-ray a month later. The only reason "they" "detected" it is that Alonso felt pain while in Spain (probably under the rain) and asked a Spanish doctor about it
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Apr 1, 2016 23:56
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:Chuck Yeager and Niki Lauda did their job with cracked ribs. Alonso ain't poo poo. I've said this time and time again. The era of Lauda, Prost and Piquet was great, you had people crashing out of cars with a million horsepower and huge amounts of turbo lag and just jumping out of flaming cars like its nothing. It was also insane and if you think for a second we're ever going to get remotely close to that kind of racing ever again you're just being unrealistic. Times have changed and nobody in their right mind would put their stamp to that level of danger being in the sport ever again.
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Apr 1, 2016 23:59
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The Channel 4 F1 intro features Claire Williams and is good https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvkMg60wMc8 poty fucked around with this message at 00:23 on Apr 2, 2016 |
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Apr 2, 2016 00:05
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Volkerball posted:Pretty sure you only hear a gurgling when it's tension pneumothorax, which is a sucking chest wound. I'd think a collapsed lung would just be really labored breathing. Correct. I had spontaneous pneumothorax twice when I was 17. The main early symptoms are pain in the shoulder area (because the upper corner of the lung is pulling away from the inside of the chest cavity), nausea (from the pain) and extreme shortness of breath.
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Apr 2, 2016 00:11
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I'm an economist and think it is totally fine to drive a super fast race car with cracked ribs.
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Apr 2, 2016 00:19
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As a medical professional, all the tests and symptoms point to the same diagnosis: F1 is dead
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Apr 2, 2016 00:23
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ImplicitAssembler posted:No it does not. Stop making poo poo up. Fractured just means that there's a crack and they will not always show up on x-rays. I knew I should have added to that post that I am aware that fractured and cracked can be interchangeable and but when someone says fractured to me they mean a clean break and cracked as a split or minor break. When Fernando said fractured and collapsed lung I assumed clean break. As I said, I'm not a orthopedist, I just repeat what they tell me, and this is one of the many reasons I don't like talking about medical stuff on the internet, especially when it's my own field, as when I do I can just hear the frantic googling from people trying to pick my posts apart, I would imagine lawyers feel the same. 
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Apr 2, 2016 00:23
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learnincurve posted:I knew I should have added to that post that I am aware that fractured and cracked can be interchangeable and but when someone says fractured to me they mean a clean break and cracked as a split or minor break. When Fernando said fractured and collapsed lung I assumed clean break. As I said, I'm not a orthopedist, I just repeat what they tell me, and this is one of the many reasons I don't like talking about medical stuff on the internet, especially when it's my own field, as when I do I can just hear the frantic googling from people trying to pick my posts apart, I would imagine lawyers feel the same. So, you spoke to an orthopedist about this? Really?. I didn't have to do any googling to know that it was bullshit.
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Apr 2, 2016 00:27
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ImplicitAssembler posted:So, you spoke to an orthopedist about this? Really?. I didn't have to do any googling to know that it was bullshit. You are quite right, I shall have a word with our boss and tell them that ImplicitAssembler thinks that our current system is bullshit and we should get a half hour lecture on the exact nature of injuries instead of saying one of two words, and also that no one should have contact outside of work. Yay the NHS is saved! Thank you ImplicitAssembler!
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Apr 2, 2016 00:44
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Tsaedje posted:Alex Zanardi wasn't disallowed from racing for having two missing legs, so I don't think one broken and pinned leg should be a barrier. You can't hurt/damage what's not there  learnincurve posted:He broke his leg before the season started and raced with pins/plates in his leg, and the doctors determined that in the event of a crash the pins/plates would not effect the outcome . With ribs you have to let them heal on their own and until they are fully healed they are very weak to the point that even a sudden stop in a road car with a seatbelt on could re-break that rib and cause it to puncture your lung. It's the secondary impact thing all over again. I remember the leg thing, but did I imagine something about him racing for half a season with a hosed up back? and he just kept quiet about it or something? Also, morbid curiosity has gotten the better of me but I can't find any Jules Bianchi post-crash horror photos / videos
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Apr 2, 2016 01:09
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I will not be looking for Bianchi crash pics and gently caress you if you post them here
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Apr 2, 2016 01:12
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I have briefly seen a couple of them and they are etched on my memory forever and I have no desire to go searching for more. 
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Apr 2, 2016 01:16
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Helicon One posted:I have briefly seen a couple of them and they are etched on my memory forever and I have no desire to go searching for more. Ok that's enough for me, morbid curiosity has mysteriously vanished
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Apr 2, 2016 01:18
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Only one more day till we have the glorious drama after new quali is shite again. 
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Apr 2, 2016 01:37
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poty posted:The Channel 4 F1 intro features Claire Williams and is good
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Apr 2, 2016 01:42
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