Dominions FOUR: Sequel to the Best Game Ever

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dominions FOUR: Sequel to the Best Game Ever

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Mu. posted:

A lot of the time when you have multiple different mod nations they will conflict and not work because both nations will have used the name unit id or some poo poo. This makes it hard to do modnation games, because some poor rear end in a top hat has to go through each .dm file and merge them, making sure that there are no conflicts.

I figured that, surely, it must be pretty easy to automate this process. All you need is a program which: 1.) take a bunch of .dm files as input, 2.) merges them into a single .dm file, and 3.) goes through the newly merged file incrementally overwriting those commands which might cause conflicts.

LordWindy on IRC then agreed to produce such a piece of software, and so I said I would make a list of those commands which may cause conflicts, and find out what their allowable ranges are.

Turns out this poo poo is more complicated than I thought it would be.

http://hastebin.com/raw/wijakuriwi <-- if any fucker retard who mods this lovely game wants to look over this and see if it covers everything, please do so.

OK, some things about this:

- Monsters can be assigned a #montag value in a range from 1000-10000, which is used in the positive form on the monster ID itself, and then the negative form for anything that uses it (I have no loving idea why but this is the case). So if frogs (unit 2222) and goats (2227) were assigned #montag 1001 and you have a #makemonsters type command, you'd summon them with -1001.

I believe different montags cannot include the same creatures but I could be wrong on that, I know there's something weird like that about them (and in general certain things accept them and certain things don't).

- You can use multiples of 1000 between at least 2 and 4 (haven't tried with more or less, probably possible up to 9000 before you get rituals at 10000) to create lingering clouds for X amount of turns, I believe this works with all one-time effect #effect values like summoning and damage.

- Events go between 1 and 3192 by default as of 4.24. Like spells, which go up to 1071, this is very likely to rise with future patches so starting at 3700 or so is probably best practice.

- Modified event codes might be a bitch to reconcile, since they're so interdependent with event numbers and can often string together. Then again computers might be really good at it.

# ? Apr 3, 2016 15:51

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# ? May 10, 2024 03:35

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Extra things: if a mod contains an #xpshape command is it 100% crucial the monster numbers remain consecutive after being reconciled, because the argument is the amount of XP it takes to get to the next monster number, you can't currently define specific monsters to turn things into.

Same goes for #growhp and #shrinkhp.

jBrereton fucked around with this message at 16:07 on Apr 3, 2016

# ? Apr 3, 2016 16:04

Decrepus: May 21, 2008; In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.

Nuclearmonkee posted:

Man posts

I subbed in as Man and clogged my cap gatehouse with a foreveral regenerating red dragon and the enemy pretender who showed up to cast Mass Flight to overrun me got stopped by a Storm and then shot through the heart by a gatehouse killing him instantly since he had 7 hp. He killed me quickly thereafter

Only posters who played Man can now post itt.

# ? Apr 3, 2016 21:19

Enjoy: Apr 18, 2009

jBrereton posted:

I was not expecting that 'facelift' one bit.

They reversed it within hours lol

# ? Apr 3, 2016 22:35

Lord Windy: Mar 26, 2010

jBrereton posted:

OK, some things about this:

- Monsters can be assigned a #montag value in a range from 1000-10000, which is used in the positive form on the monster ID itself, and then the negative form for anything that uses it (I have no loving idea why but this is the case). So if frogs (unit 2222) and goats (2227) were assigned #montag 1001 and you have a #makemonsters type command, you'd summon them with -1001.

I believe different montags cannot include the same creatures but I could be wrong on that, I know there's something weird like that about them (and in general certain things accept them and certain things don't).

Easy enough to work with. If Mod 1 and Mod 2 both use the same montag I can easily give one a different value and update the montag value thoughout the mod. Useful to know the syntax however!

quote:

- You can use multiples of 1000 between at least 2 and 4 (haven't tried with more or less, probably possible up to 9000 before you get rituals at 10000) to create lingering clouds for X amount of turns, I believe this works with all one-time effect #effect values like summoning and damage.

Extra things: if a mod contains an #xpshape command is it 100% crucial the monster numbers remain consecutive after being reconciled, because the argument is the amount of XP it takes to get to the next monster number, you can't currently define specific monsters to turn things into.

Same goes for #growhp and #shrinkhp.

Ok this was super important. Thanks for letting me know! I'll order everything by their ID number over the written order now that I know it's important. That way I don't have to change how I assign IDs.

quote:

- Events go between 1 and 3192 by default as of 4.24. Like spells, which go up to 1071, this is very likely to rise with future patches so starting at 3700 or so is probably best practice.

- Modified event codes might be a bitch to reconcile, since they're so interdependent with event numbers and can often string together. Then again computers might be really good at it.

These two won't be any issue. I already have defines in place that let you choose the range.

As well, 100% of IDs will likely be changed unless they luck into being in the correct ID for their spot. If numbers change I want to have people be able to throw their mod back into the Mod Masher and have the ID numbers updated.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 00:48

akulanization: Dec 21, 2013

Nuclearmonkee posted:

You don't use your real mages to sing. You use idiot tribe n1s.

That's the whole thing. You have RP going from monks and logrians, singers from some random n1 indie and then real mages from your forts. Done properly you get a lot of research and each one of your combat mages is worth more than it first appears since you can go a full 5 rounds and still be at near 0 fatigue at the end.

With the randoms you pull, they will mostly be N spammers but you can easily build a very nasty tstrike stack that can load a full 5 tstrikes per mage. I didn't save screenshots but I subbed in as man and basically obliterated a guy with very few losses just by exploiting songs to their maximum potential.

The high RP means you are able also means you get RoS pretty fast and every e1a1 logrian can do it out of the box.

The key trap people have to avoid is building all longbows and then going obsolete the second someone can arrow fend or drop a battlefield wiper on you. You have to be more creative than that.

edit: You have stealthy mages with 40 leadership and stealthy troops and summons. use those. I have never seen anyone but me do this. Should be pulling pan style shenanigans with them when possible.

Are you passing out gems to get the 5 thunderstrikes? Or is that from a collection of A3 crones?

Also are Cu Sidhe secretly good? I always thought they were a waste of N gems and you screened foresters with foresters.

What's your rational behind using the N1 indies over bards, who can go with your stealth armies, or the E1N1 logrians you'll have anyway? Or do you just need too many singers for that to work? admittedly I've never tried to set up for 0 fatigue with song, since I'm not particularly good at positioning so that the mages will cast useful spells after they go off script. They often use that precious extra fatigue to cast terrible buffs.

Also, at least in my tests, transformation is pretty cool for Man; since it gives a decent shot at S access even if you completely strike out with indies.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 02:54

jsoh: Mar 24, 2007; O Muhammad, I seek your intercession with my Lord for the return of my eyesight

Decrepus posted:

I subbed in as Man and clogged my cap gatehouse with a foreveral regenerating red dragon and the enemy pretender who showed up to cast Mass Flight to overrun me got stopped by a Storm and then shot through the heart by a gatehouse killing him instantly since he had 7 hp. He killed me quickly thereafter

Only posters who played Man can now post itt.

i killed someones earth snake by having a bunch of guys with longbows shoot every arrow they had at him and then run him down and stab him to death. it was really good

# ? Apr 4, 2016 03:59

Sloppy Milkshake: Nov 9, 2004; I MAKE YOU HUMBLE

Enjoy posted:

They reversed it within hours lol

what was it???

# ? Apr 4, 2016 04:35

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Sloppy Milkshake posted:

what was it???

Probably the most crashingly awful design I have seen since my secondary school days on geocities.

Forums background (actual background, behind the broken rear end frames) was some map or other, looked like Streamlands. Extended about two pixels out from the forums itself making it look like your monitor had a problem.

Frames all broken as I said.

Text was minute and light grey-on-light grey.

Huge chunky buttons with garish decor.

Weird pictograms for things being read/unread that made absolutely no loving sense at all to anyone other than the guy who did it to the forums.

jBrereton fucked around with this message at 05:15 on Apr 4, 2016

# ? Apr 4, 2016 05:01

Atlanton: Mar 23, 2013

akulanization posted:

Are you passing out gems to get the 5 thunderstrikes? Or is that from a collection of A3 crones?

Also are Cu Sidhe secretly good? I always thought they were a waste of N gems and you screened foresters with foresters.

What's your rational behind using the N1 indies over bards, who can go with your stealth armies, or the E1N1 logrians you'll have anyway? Or do you just need too many singers for that to work? admittedly I've never tried to set up for 0 fatigue with song, since I'm not particularly good at positioning so that the mages will cast useful spells after they go off script. They often use that precious extra fatigue to cast terrible buffs.

Also, at least in my tests, transformation is pretty cool for Man; since it gives a decent shot at S access even if you completely strike out with indies.

You should probably be casting Storm with a A3 Crone and then using Summon Storm Power to get all your crones to A3 or above.

You use N1 indies because they're numerous and by their nature, don't require a fort turn. You want to be recruiting the Mothers at all of your non-cap forts.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 05:38

akulanization: Dec 21, 2013

Atlanton posted:

You should probably be casting Storm with a A3 Crone and then using Summon Storm Power to get all your crones to A3 or above.

You use N1 indies because they're numerous and by their nature, don't require a fort turn. You want to be recruiting the Mothers at all of your non-cap forts.

You can't script 5 thunderstrikes if you stormpower up, I'm interested to know if the extra firepower can be worth the gems or if there is something else I'm missing.

Man has foreign mages that are cheaper and easier to set up a recruitment center for than the vast majority of N1 indy goobers. And it costs them like 600 extra gold to fort a random province with a lab versus building a temple there, which has the not insignificant upside of allowing you to recruit a better and cheaper N1 while potentially protecting a throne or something. I'd like to know why you would want to build a lab+temple as MA Man so that you can get N1 mages with a hefty research penalty, because the cost seems too steep to me. What first came to mind was that you want a lot of singers, but my math says you need about 4 for the T-strike group which I took to be one of the backup singer heavy ways to deploy your mages.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 06:02

Nuclearmonkee: Jun 10, 2009

jsoh posted:

i killed someones earth snake by having a bunch of guys with longbows shoot every arrow they had at him and then run him down and stab him to death. it was really good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaTJ4ANMA8Q

akulanization posted:

Are you passing out gems to get the 5 thunderstrikes? Or is that from a collection of A3 crones?

Also are Cu Sidhe secretly good? I always thought they were a waste of N gems and you screened foresters with foresters.

What's your rational behind using the N1 indies over bards, who can go with your stealth armies, or the E1N1 logrians you'll have anyway? Or do you just need too many singers for that to work? admittedly I've never tried to set up for 0 fatigue with song, since I'm not particularly good at positioning so that the mages will cast useful spells after they go off script. They often use that precious extra fatigue to cast terrible buffs.

Also, at least in my tests, transformation is pretty cool for Man; since it gives a decent shot at S access even if you completely strike out with indies.

A2N1 + stormpower can tstrike without gems but I've got no problem handing out gems in important battles.

Cu Sidhe are trash. A few foresters with moms or some stealthy summons can own though the owning part is the mom not the troop who only exists so the mom doesn't die to a shortbow.

Can use E1N1 logrians also but you need a lot of singers and N1 shitlords are the easiest way to get enough of them early.

Nuclearmonkee fucked around with this message at 12:26 on Apr 4, 2016

# ? Apr 4, 2016 12:23

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Snake was fated to die to average chaff as soon as they took Dom 9/10 on it. Rekt at the creation screen.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 14:41

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

Something from our running game MoMoneyMoProblems:

Total Annihilation

This is what the end game of Dominions 4 looks like: 800+ units massacred in just about a couple turns. :shepface:

Libluini fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Apr 4, 2016

# ? Apr 4, 2016 15:06

Great Gray Shrike: Oct 22, 2010

I thought Golems, by virtue of being mindless, were immune to magic duel?

# ? Apr 4, 2016 15:31

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Great Gray Shrike posted:

I thought Golems, by virtue of being mindless, were immune to magic duel?

They are, I'm pretty sure he lost the magic duels to the Crystal Mages he got 2 of.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 16:10

Decrepus: May 21, 2008; In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.

Libluini posted:

Something from our running game MoMoneyMoProblems:

Total Annihilation

This is what the end game of Dominions 4 looks like: 800+ units massacred in just about a couple turns.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arZh117iVQs

# ? Apr 4, 2016 16:33

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

Great Gray Shrike posted:

I thought Golems, by virtue of being mindless, were immune to magic duel?

One of the many, many strategic errors that went into planning this battle: I forgot

# ? Apr 4, 2016 16:58

How are u: May 19, 2005; by Azathoth

I had no idea golems couldn't be killed by magic duel. That's my bad too.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 17:38

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

How are u posted:

I had no idea golems couldn't be killed by magic duel. That's my bad too.

Fear not, I'm switching to my alternative plan: Stuffing all my forts with thousands of units so sieging them will take literal years. If I can't beat Atlanton on the battlefield, I'll beat him senseless with boredom!

# ? Apr 4, 2016 17:52

Slaan: Mar 16, 2009; ASHERAH DEMANDS I FEAST, I VOTE FOR A FEAST OF FLESH

The true path to victory lies not in skill and deception, young general, but in making your enemy too bored to care

# ? Apr 4, 2016 17:54

King Doom: Dec 1, 2004; I am on the Internet.

Messing about in dominions 3, is it possible to set up a game with the domkill mechanic disabled? setting a match to have a required number of provinces victory only didn't do it.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 18:44

fool of sound: Oct 10, 2012

I dunno about Dominions 3, but if 4 you could do an event mod that sets your capital province to 10 dominion every turn.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 18:48

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Is this garbage Dominions 4 video technically sound or are there problems with it on your end?

# ? Apr 4, 2016 18:58

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

jBrereton posted:

Is this garbage Dominions 4 video technically sound or are there problems with it on your end?

There is no sound. If that was intended, it's fine.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 19:25

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

None? People were saying it did have sound before and I don't have any copyright/DMCA claim type stuff listed on my channel :/

# ? Apr 4, 2016 19:33

Bug Squash: Mar 18, 2009

I can hear it. Sorry if I'm ruining a troll :downs:

# ? Apr 4, 2016 19:37

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

PHewph I thought my YouTube superstardom was in peril there.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 19:39

SpiritOfLenin: Apr 29, 2013; be happy :3

Hey does anybody know how good Melancholia is at causing enemy units to desert? Trying to figure out whether I want to cast Melancholia at an enemy province full of dudes or just keep sending Earth Attacks at opponent's commanders instead.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 21:08

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

jBrereton posted:

None? People were saying it did have sound before and I don't have any copyright/DMCA claim type stuff listed on my channel :/

OK, so I muted the other crap I was listening too and suddenly I could hear you. The sound is a bit quiet for my taste, but it is there. Sorry, my bad.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 21:16

Mu.: Sep 15, 2003; The thing about Forevereal Modding Mu is that he loves editing files and wants others to download his permanent mods. Fully editing, rich text, altering files and loving it. Download his mods and enjoy it.

Is this all of the goon-made nation mods? ---> SA Nation Mods

# ? Apr 4, 2016 21:37

Culka: May 20, 2007; Nothing

Mu. posted:

Is this all of the goon-made nation mods? ---> SA Nation Mods

You have a really old version of my Doom mod there, the latest is https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/8210580/dom4doom2_01.zip

I also made an (old)xcom alien nation mod a few months ago if that counts https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/8210580/xcom.zip

# ? Apr 4, 2016 21:54

Wolfsbane: Jul 29, 2009; What time is it, Eccles?

You're missing mine, although I'm not sure you'd want to use it in competitive play. It's a bit OP, and I never got around to balancing it properly.

http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?showtopic=1830

# ? Apr 4, 2016 22:32

Mu.: Sep 15, 2003; The thing about Forevereal Modding Mu is that he loves editing files and wants others to download his permanent mods. Fully editing, rich text, altering files and loving it. Download his mods and enjoy it.

ty, I have updated the list.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 22:52

Speleothing: May 6, 2008; Spare batteries are pretty key.

I've got one that just needs sprites, should be ready to play test this weekend.

# ? Apr 4, 2016 22:59

Enjoy: Apr 18, 2009

Mu. posted:

Is this all of the goon-made nation mods? ---> SA Nation Mods

Unlimited powah http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?showtopic=2760

# ? Apr 4, 2016 23:19

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Seo continues to be the best game ever. I really wish I could actually win it :v:

# ? Apr 5, 2016 17:03

Azram Legion: Jan 23, 2005; Drunken Poet Glory

Mu. posted:

Is this all of the goon-made nation mods? ---> SA Nation Mods

I'm not seeing my fantastic and perfectly balanced rap-themed mod here and that angers me.

# ? Apr 5, 2016 17:14

Mu.: Sep 15, 2003; The thing about Forevereal Modding Mu is that he loves editing files and wants others to download his permanent mods. Fully editing, rich text, altering files and loving it. Download his mods and enjoy it.

Azram Legion posted:

I'm not seeing my fantastic and perfectly balanced rap-themed mod here and that angers me.

give me a link m8

# ? Apr 5, 2016 22:48

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# ? May 10, 2024 03:35

Mu.: Sep 15, 2003; The thing about Forevereal Modding Mu is that he loves editing files and wants others to download his permanent mods. Fully editing, rich text, altering files and loving it. Download his mods and enjoy it.

I've bundled almost all of the SA nation mods into a single mod.

Awful Nations.

- I didn't include Sawaiiki because I was told it is broken.
- I didn't include Artea because some of those spells are definitely broken.
- I nerfed some of the Underhome global events because I remember people complaining about them last time around.
- I did minor fixes as I went through.
- Bush did 9/11.

Please test things and see what is broken, etc.

# ? Apr 5, 2016 22:58

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