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Trivia, those pictures are incredible!
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Mar 10, 2016 07:56
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pupdive posted:Unfortunately that misplaced confidence in using a cave diving methods in the ocean has cost some people a pretty high price recently. People die diving for all sorts of reasons, but when you break it down, it's when people think they have a superior system or are superior divers, they lose respect for some basic safety procedures, and the ocean itself. I think they take it too far when you have everyone obsessed with being in the horizontal fins above head position during drift ascents and such. There's no real point to that besides showing off your buoyancy/trim control in that environment. And really why does it matter what cave divers think about recreational setups. To this day I use a jacket BC and single AL80 tank when doing shallow reefs because it works fine and why waste time getting my tech rig set up for a dive that has no need for it. Comfort underwater and basic skills are far more important.
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Mar 11, 2016 00:37
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I shave my head, and sometimes I'd like a little warmth when the full hood isn't required. How about one of these? http://www.amazon.com/ONeill-Wetsuits-Neoprene-Beanie-Black/dp/B0087ZUXXO/ http://www.amazon.com/ONeill-Wetsuits-Thinskins-Black-Large/dp/B0088043NO
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Mar 11, 2016 02:15
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Bishop posted:As far as having a long hose goes, I've never seen a downside. Note that I did not say anything bad about long hoses, other than my wife won't use one regularly, and for good reasons. And when someone has done thousands of dives professionally, and guided thousands, and trained thousands, then they don;t even have to be particular eloquent to be convincing, though she is eloquent about her reasons. I did say something about 7 foot hoses. But long hose of any sort are not particularly useful in the ways that people think they are in actual situations. They are a convenience, not a safety tool, even in the best situations. They make pretending to be in trouble easy to practice, which is kind of a bad thing. If someone comes into a rescue class with confidence in the value of a 7 foot hose, it can take about 5 seconds to make them reconsider their gear choices. By contrast, showing the flaws of a standard length primary hose with an alternate inflator reg is not nearly as convincing. That tends to result in acknowledgement of potential problems, but does not convince people to change their gear setups. pupdive fucked around with this message at 10:19 on Mar 11, 2016 |
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Mar 11, 2016 10:02
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Mrs. Squashy did the first pool session for her open water last night.. and it went poorly. She kept panicking under water, and couldn't get her buoyancy right. She managed to pass all of the skills except for "take your mask off for a minute, then put it back on and clear it". For that one she kept getting water up her nose? We were both totally shocked: she is a strong swimmer, she is super comfortable in the water, and I taught her how to snorkel on our last few trips to the Caribbean. Her instructors told her that what she was feeling is not uncommon, and that she actually did really well. When I think back to my open water training a thousand years ago, I don't remember having any trouble at all, I just got in the water and did all the skills. So, dive instructors, how common is this in newbies? She really wants to dive, has wanted to since she was a little kid. So, she has the motivation, I'm wondering if she just needs more pool time to get used to it?
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Mar 11, 2016 17:13
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Trivia, great post as usually. I just got back from the Philippines and you've motivated me to share some footage. Hopefully I'll get around to it in the next week.pupdive posted:Note that I did not say anything bad about <insert different gear choice here>, other than my wife won't use one regularly, and for good reasons. And when someone has done thousands of dives professionally, and guided thousands, and trained thousands, then they don;t even have to be particular eloquent to be convincing, though she is eloquent about her reasons.  Sure sure. And then another instructor, who has done thousands of dives professionally, and guided thousands, and trained thousands, comes along and says something contrary. It gets dumb fast. In general, arguing about what open water gear setup is better or worse is dumb and people should probably just dive whatever rig they're comfortable with. Using a hogarthian setup is a great way to dive. Using an bcd inflator integrated octo is another great way. gently caress man, even monkey diving is a great way to dive. Each system has its strength and weaknesses and it's up to the operator to know them. Red_Fred posted:The Philippines sounds good as I'm already going to be spending up to a month in Indonesia surfing and I hear Thailand is kind of tapped out. Puerto Galera can probably give you the best training and experience although July-Sept is the rainy season so you might get more rain in that region. So I'd pick anywhere in the Visayas region (Moalboal, Dumaguete, Malapascua, Bohol) to avoid as much rain as possible. Hope that helps.
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Mar 11, 2016 18:38
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Trivia: Awesome pictures, glad you had a great time in Komodo! Out of curiosity, which operator did you guys go with? My girlfriend and I are going on a last-minute trip to Hawaii (Maui and Oahu) on Wednesday. We are planning on doing a day of diving on each island. Anyone have recommendations for operators? We want to do Molokini crater from Maui, but I don't know much about Oahu diving, especially boat-based. I did a few shore dives at Shark's cove in North Shore 5 or so years ago, but that's it. Any recommendations would be awesome. Also, how long would folks recommend waiting after diving before, say, driving up to the top of Haleakala? Is 24 hours enough?
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Mar 14, 2016 00:45
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I believe the shop we went with was Blue Marlin. It had a nice open restaurant to chill in and drink. That's pretty much how I spent my Christmas Day!
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Mar 14, 2016 01:01
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Oakland Martini posted:Trivia: Awesome pictures, glad you had a great time in Komodo! Out of curiosity, which operator did you guys go with? When I was in Oahu I dived with Island Divers and they seemed a decent outfit. Great wrecks off Oahu, would have liked to have done the other islands!
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Mar 14, 2016 01:21
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Squashy Nipples posted:Mrs. Squashy did the first pool session for her open water last night.. and it went poorly. She kept panicking under water, and couldn't get her buoyancy right. She managed to pass all of the skills except for "take your mask off for a minute, then put it back on and clear it". For that one she kept getting water up her nose? From my experience (far more limited than the professional instructors round here) it really isn't very unusual. Comfort in the water on the surface and desire to dive don't immediately equal being comfortable with a load of new equipment and a totally alien environment straight away. Things like mask clearing are something that people can find really awkward at first (this and regulator swapping are the two skills I've seen that cause people to panic and bolt for the surface most reliably). In terms of dealing with it, this was her first pool session in an alien environment with weird new equipment. If she was able to pass almost all of the skills then she actually did do really well. I would hazard a guess that if she's used to the water on the surface she may even be dealing with some ingrained habits regarding breathing and buoyancy that she's not even fully aware of that are making it harder, I don't have the experience or knowledge for that to be more than a pulled out of my rear end guess though. In terms of improving, it sounds like she's got a decent base and motivation for it so I'd say just keep doing the pool sessions, getting more experience with being underwater and using the kit. I think it was pupdive or Bishop who said they get their students to keep the mask on at all times, which gets students used to having it on and helps people get used to not breathing through their nose too. Part of the all of this is the experience of some of the minor discomforts like getting water in your nose, it's not actually a problem you just keep breathing through your regulator and you can hack and cough all you like. If you're a surface swimmer or snorkeller though water in your nose is an issue as there isn't more air coming from anywhere. Natural instinct is to bolt for the nearest air source, the surface. It takes time to get comfortable and aware that your nearest air source is already in your mouth. If she's comfortable with her instructor just keep up with the pool sessions until she's happier. If she doesn't get any happier or more comfortable maybe try some different instructors.
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Mar 14, 2016 13:53
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Tomberforce posted:When I was in Oahu I dived with Island Divers and they seemed a decent outfit. Great wrecks off Oahu, would have liked to have done the other islands! Not a huge fan of wreck diving actually, although it seems like that's the main attraction of of Oahu. Any other well-regarded boat dives (or shore dives, I've done Sharks Cove before) on Oahu? Got 2 days of diving set up on Maui now, one day doing the back wall of Molokini + south Maui, another doing Lanai. Very much hoping to see some humpbacks, seems like there's a decent chance.
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Mar 14, 2016 22:53
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Oakland Martini posted:Not a huge fan of wreck diving actually, although it seems like that's the main attraction of of Oahu. Any other well-regarded boat dives (or shore dives, I've done Sharks Cove before) on Oahu? Didn't see any humpbacks, but we did hear them on one dive! Did a couple of reef dives on Oahu, would have to check my logbook for the names. Not much in the way of coral, but cool rock formations, heaps of turtles, white tips and hanging out in a cave with a Hawaiian Monk Seal was definitely one of my diving highlights. God I would have loved to have seen a humpback though! One of the wreck dives was called the LCU - which is basically one of those military landing vessels flipped upside down so it's basically like a cave with white tips hanging out in it. That was a cool dive!
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Mar 15, 2016 00:56
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Tomberforce posted:When I was in Oahu I dived with Island Divers and they seemed a decent outfit. Great wrecks off Oahu, would have liked to have done the other islands! I'm dive out of here, and I really like them. I'm doing my DM and instructor course through a sister program of theirs, though, in the interest of full disclosure. I would say that the wrecks are far and away the best part of diving here in Oahu. I've seen probably a dozen humpbacks in the last month of diving. Three came and hung out with us for like an hour on a surface interval two weeks ago. Just breaching around the boat again and again. Also, I know that Thailand is like a degree mill for Instructors, but are there jobs to be found there? I'd like to spend some time in SEA, and that seems like a fine place to start.
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Mar 15, 2016 05:59
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Beast Pussy posted:I'm dive out of here, and I really like them. I'm doing my DM and instructor course through a sister program of theirs, though, in the interest of full disclosure. I would say that the wrecks are far and away the best part of diving here in Oahu. Thailand diving is generally agreed to be second rate compared to Indonesia! Not dived Thailand myself so can't say for sure though.
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Mar 15, 2016 06:29
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MrNemo posted:From my experience (far more limited than the professional instructors round here) it really isn't very unusual. Comfort in the water on the surface and desire to dive don't immediately equal being comfortable with a load of new equipment and a totally alien environment straight away. Things like mask clearing are something that people can find really awkward at first (this and regulator swapping are the two skills I've seen that cause people to panic and bolt for the surface most reliably). In terms of dealing with it, this was her first pool session in an alien environment with weird new equipment. If she was able to pass almost all of the skills then she actually did do really well. I would hazard a guess that if she's used to the water on the surface she may even be dealing with some ingrained habits regarding breathing and buoyancy that she's not even fully aware of that are making it harder, I don't have the experience or knowledge for that to be more than a pulled out of my rear end guess though. That all sounds very reasonable, thank you. After showing her this, she said she was most grateful for the following statement: "aware that your nearest air source is already in your mouth".
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Mar 15, 2016 15:39
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Tomberforce posted:Thailand diving is generally agreed to be second rate compared to Indonesia! Not dived Thailand myself so can't say for sure though. This is generally accurate. Though the Similans were pretty cool I must admit (granted this was about 7 years ago). Don't go to Phi Phi or Phuket for your diving.
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Mar 15, 2016 16:41
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Beast Pussy posted:I'm dive out of here, and I really like them. I'm doing my DM and instructor course through a sister program of theirs, though, in the interest of full disclosure. I would say that the wrecks are far and away the best part of diving here in Oahu. Going with Island Divers on March 21 per this thread's recommendations! Thanks guys.
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Mar 15, 2016 17:57
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What dive shop in Roatan is goon approved?
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Mar 15, 2016 18:47
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Ropes4u posted:What dive shop in Roatan is goon approved? If you are staying in Sandy Bay, TranquilSeas is awesome especially if you stay there as well. Small Eco lodge type place, diving there is so easy and good! If you're staying in West End, Sundivers is an awesome choice. They have only been open a few years but the guy that started it, Mal, has freelanced on the island for a long time. They have been posting some ridiculous stuff on Facebook, when I dove with Mal he was a master of finding small obscure things. If you're staying in West Bay, no idea as I have always avoided it! I would be really interested to hear about the safety situation when you go, Roatan was my top choice for checking out to a couple of years ago but it seems to have gone downhill with people coming over from the mainland and causing trouble. You'll be safe as a visitor if you aren't dumb, like most everywhere.
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Mar 16, 2016 00:16
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Anyone here dived much in Melbourne? I'm moving there in a month!
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Mar 16, 2016 00:40
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SuitcasePimp posted:If you are staying in Sandy Bay, TranquilSeas is awesome especially if you stay there as well. Small Eco lodge type place, diving there is so easy and good! If you're staying in West End, Sundivers is an awesome choice. They have only been open a few years but the guy that started it, Mal, has freelanced on the island for a long time. They have been posting some ridiculous stuff on Facebook, when I dove with Mal he was a master of finding small obscure things. If you're staying in West Bay, no idea as I have always avoided it! My wife has been hinting around so maybe we will go this year, but I am simply looking right now. We will be in Florida in May, so maybe Roatan in the fall..
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Mar 16, 2016 01:34
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Tomberforce posted:Thailand diving is generally agreed to be second rate compared to Indonesia! Not dived Thailand myself so can't say for sure though. Any info on the job market in Indonesia, then?
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Mar 16, 2016 03:06
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Trivia posted:This is generally accurate. Though the Similans were pretty cool I must admit (granted this was about 7 years ago). Yeah the Similans are still supposed to be excellent. My gf did her DM in Koh Tao about 10 years ago and apparently it has got significantly worse since then. All the dependable shark diving sites that she dived back then now no longer have any sharks  There seemed like there were dive jobs kicking around in Bali. If you're after somewhere to do your IDC it would be pretty good to do it, though personally since the IDC mainly classroom based, you could do it with a shop at home (if there is one) and then go to Asia afterwards do a bit of guiding and try and get a instructor job that way!
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Mar 16, 2016 07:03
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Squashy Nipples posted:Mrs. Squashy did the first pool session for her open water last night.. and it went poorly. She kept panicking under water, and couldn't get her buoyancy right. She managed to pass all of the skills except for "take your mask off for a minute, then put it back on and clear it". For that one she kept getting water up her nose? Swimmers are not going to make better divers, they are just more comfortable in the water, maybe. But being comfortable in the water is also not in and of itself of particular value when panicking hits. Because by definition, when someone is panicking, they are not comfortable in the water. So they are some good reasons to think than most things (other than being truly scared of water, or serious experience with serious free diving) are not going to affect how someone does with diving, for better or for worse. Divers are violating the basic self preservation rule that has kept them alive in water to the point they started diving: "Hold your breath when your face is in water". As divers, in fact, we have the exact opposite rule, in fact, for diving: "Don't hold your breath when you put your face in the water". So experience in the water is maybe not so helpful to things. Separate from that though, why was your wife not told to pinch her nose to solve the water up her nose problem? That is really the only solution to water in the nose that works. It would be nice is our lizard brain did not take over in panic situations, and we could just remember facts about where the regulator is. But we cannot actually think once panic starts so we have to learn to prevent it. In this case by pinching off the nose. Over time, we reprogram how we do things and we won't inhale in to our nose, but knowing to pinch the nose to prevent problems is basic self rescue that kinds of goes with purge button use. Pinch the nose to get control, then sort things out. When teaching military people, the no mask breathing is stupid easy (because some people don;t have an issue with it at all) or mind-blowingly panic inducing, because people who think they already know how things don't think they necessarily have to take things step by step, and they are shocked by the fact that panic is not even slightly amenable to conscious control. (Panic is how people die in water they could stand up in. It's not something that one can reason one's way out of.) pupdive fucked around with this message at 10:26 on Mar 16, 2016 |
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Mar 16, 2016 09:51
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Tomberforce posted:Yeah the Similans are still supposed to be excellent. My gf did her DM in Koh Tao about 10 years ago and apparently it has got significantly worse since then. All the dependable shark diving sites that she dived back then now no longer have any sharks Thanks for the info. I need to do some certs before I can do my IDC, if I can find something here short term I'll probably stay and knock it all out in Hawaii, otherwise I'm happy to move on from this place.
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Mar 19, 2016 05:19
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I've been reading through the materials that came with Mrs. Squashy's SDI open water course, and holy poo poo, what an improvement over my old NAUI materials. Slickly produced, lots of good information, and it even came with a DVD. One thing is confusing me from the Skills section... what the gently caress is a "Fin Pivot"? After reading the text, it sounds like... basic buoyancy control? Lay prone near the bottom, adjust your BCD, and watch as your breathing effects your buoyancy: I don't understand how the fins are involved.
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Apr 6, 2016 13:03
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Squashy Nipples posted:I've been reading through the materials that came with Mrs. Squashy's SDI open water course, and holy poo poo, what an improvement over my old NAUI materials. Slickly produced, lots of good information, and it even came with a DVD. First, that's why NAUI had their big fund-raising effort. Their newer materials are much better (as are everyone's.) The idea behind the "fin pivot" is the idea that new divers need to be in contact with the bottom to relax enough to notice the slight changes i buoyancy that come with breathing. A diver in some semblance of a dive pose might have their fins lightly touching the bottom and use that point of contact to lever up and down with. The terminology of 'fin pivot' has been removed from the current materials for PADI for various reasons and is just called neutral buoyancy. Some of us never used the term, and never taught it. My Open Water students are not, and have never been allowed intentional contact with the bottom at any point in the class, except while walking in and out of the pool/ocean. Beyond that, straight legs are bad for diving, and the only way to do a fin pivot is with your fins in a non-diving position. (As an instructor dealing with this situation often, let your wife take the class, and don't try and teach her things or evaluate her or her instructor. There is intentionally a set list of content for an open water class, for ....reasons.)
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Apr 6, 2016 14:40
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pupdive posted:The idea behind the "fin pivot" is the idea that new divers need to be in contact with the bottom to relax enough to notice the slight changes i buoyancy that come with breathing. A diver in some semblance of a dive pose might have their fins lightly touching the bottom and use that point of contact to lever up and down with. Ahhhh, an excellent explanation, thank you! pupdive posted:(As an instructor dealing with this situation often, let your wife take the class, and don't try and teach her things or evaluate her or her instructor. There is intentionally a set list of content for an open water class, for ....reasons.) Oh don't worry, I'm not like that, I believe in letting professionals do their job! I mean, what else am I paying them for? Basically, we watched the DVD together before the class started, and that's it. I was reading the textbook for my own curiosity.
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Apr 6, 2016 15:18
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It's amazing what spending some money on materials layout editing and design does for the ability to make books readable. The NAUI books in the 90's were so bad that many NAUI instructors were using PADI materials to teach NAUI open water classes. But that's all part of the difference between a for-profit company like PADI, and a true membership non-profit like NAUI. PADI has a business model that expects income to develop and put out new product, NAUI has to make a concerted fund-raising effort to get the money saved up to do the same. It's kinda like the difference between Open Source Software, and Apple Products. Sometimes the "Interface" matters. I'd even say in the case of Open Water Diver class materials it matters more than the content. People are fighting with so many issues in the Open Water Class anyway. (In your case SDI is a for profit company as well.)
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Apr 6, 2016 16:29
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Given what PADI costs, I find the quality of their materials, at least as of a couple years ago, to be outright robbery. lovely low res video, poor layout, dated information, and antiquated web technology were all over the place when I last trained. Maybe it is better now, I dunno.
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Apr 7, 2016 17:04
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PADI doesn't cost anything, in the usual sense. The money is taken by the dive shop. But beyond that, I am pretty amazed that people hesitate to pay as much for the class to use scuba gear as they do just a high end snorkel set. If you pay less than $400.00-$500.00 for your open water course, you probably got what you paid for. You are forcing people to choose between working for less than minimum wage, or cutting every corner they can, or packing a class with students. Low cost, quality, value. The cheapest thing is often not the best value. Unless you are talking about their PADI's eLearning, in which case, this is just one of those things where large companies bound by liability issues cannot update materials that are translated into literally hundreds of language easily, or at least that has always been their excuse. I don't want people using eLearning because too often students associate to the wrong dive shop, don't associate to any dive shop, accidentally sign up for the table based class, intentionally sing up for the table based class, and lose access to their training materials after some amount of time.
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Apr 8, 2016 09:06
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Yep, I'm talking about eLearning.
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Apr 9, 2016 06:33
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Then PADI has no excuses, and you have every right to be mad, as I am frustrated by it on my end as well. But that's about the oddball quality. The pricing is what it is. As mentioned, I don't like it. For people who absolutely want to get it done beforehand, it's there. But I'd rather send students my DVDs, and have them buy the book, and just administer the tests locally. The new book, and the new DVD are first rate. The eLearning is absolutely not. What's funny is that PADI should just put the new videos up on YouTube since so many people no longer have the ability to use DVDs. It sells diving, and PADI as an organization. But they say that the eLearning and the touch products are there. Which I just don't agree with at all. Serve videos live, but lots of people still like books to write notes in and have as a reference.
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Apr 9, 2016 08:16
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As someone who is required to take an endless number of online courses, and who takes college classes online, PADI delivers the worst elearning experience possible. In the end I relied upon my instructors to fill in the blanks and correct any misinformation but the dads and book sound like an idea moving forward into rescue diver….
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Apr 9, 2016 11:23
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Ropes4u posted:As someone who is required to take an endless number of online courses, and who takes college classes online, PADI delivers the worst elearning experience possible.. I wish PADI would listen to its 'members' about the issues students have with their online experience. Part of the issue is that far too few instructors actually sit down and read through the materials and watch the DVDs when new ones come out for the different courses. And when it comes to the online materials, instructors do not even have the option to audit the online courses, which is a little bit of a weird thing. On the other hand since few instructors actually review the course materials anyway... Another part of the problem is that eLearning students end up with first rate knowledge, so it looks from a black box perspective that eLearning is a good product. I think that has more to do with the fact that most instructors are not terribly effective at the delivery of the PADI materials, more than eLearning is any sort of polished product though. I would always say one thing to remember is that PADI makes its money from publishing (books, log books, DVDs etc.) I think like all publishers they are still trying to figure out the digital realm. One problem definitely is that they are both pushing us to sell continuing education, and making certain aspects like eLearning of such a quality that people are unlikely to want to repeat eLearning for continuing education. eLearning is there, and it is educationally sound. But the books are there, and they are educationally sound as well. If only instructors would insist that students finish the reading and watching before class begins in the same way the eLearning does, the books (and videos) would show themselves to be equally useful. But people are people and they often try to get away with whatever they can.
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Apr 9, 2016 11:47
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From the point of view of a commercial organisation I definitely understand the appeal of getting away from printing. It's a huge hassle to print and ship all over the world and deal with stock keeping for dive centres everywhere. Considering diver centres also have a tendency to be in remote places it avoids delays in getting the materials to people as well and minimises concerns over shops taking students under the counter. Now none of this takes the student's needs or desires in mind but as I said, commercial organisation and they still have an effective monopoly in that any commercial dive operation really needs to offer PADI training. I will say the one thing that it's done is force other agencies to up their game with presentation. The BSAC's materials have improved hugely. They've also got an advantage in having a single languages and small footprint so they can release changes much faster (we recently got guidance published on recommended procedures for diving with GUE trained divers finally). I've also kicked off my dive season with my first dry suit dive in almost 4 years on a weekend with fun gale force winds. Blown out most of the trip but it was great to be back in cold water. No nice pictures as the vis was atrocious. I've also got my open water instructor exam on Sunday, what a time to be alive.
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Apr 11, 2016 10:59
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I'm in Barbados, today i'm going divng for the first time since my LASIK. Totally pumped, going to see some turtles! I went for a snorkle last night to test out my new fins, my first pair of modern vented fins. It requires a different motion! Not quite sure how to describe it, almost like I was using my foot muscles more... More of a rolling motion?
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Apr 11, 2016 11:42
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Squashy Nipples posted:I'm in Barbados, today i'm going divng for the first time since my LASIK. Totally pumped, going to see some turtles! If you're diving with Eco dive, Andrew owns and will happily talk to you about underwater photography. Also check out the books he's published while you're changing in the shop before getting on the boat, his pictures own. E: I ended up with some amazing pictures just based on him talking to me in the shop and when we were on our way out.
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Apr 14, 2016 03:10
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Nope. Staying at the Hilton, so I went with the on-site dive shop, Barbados Blue. Great guys, I've had some excellent dives. Also, mostly very short travel times, the Hilton is right in the middle of some of the best dive sites on the island. Today's first dive had some... anomalies. Nobody got hurt, and I want to discuss what happened, but not until I get home and can use a full sized keyboard.
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Apr 15, 2016 02:00
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Squashy Nipples posted:Nope. Staying at the Hilton, so I went with the on-site dive shop, Barbados Blue. Great guys, I've had some excellent dives. Also, mostly very short travel times, the Hilton is right in the middle of some of the best dive sites on the island. this isn't a dive thing but take the reggae bus to Oistins tomorrow e: get out just short of the fish fry when they pull into a gas station for the locals. You can walk the rest of the distance in a lot less time than riding the van into the center of Oistins let it mellow fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Apr 15, 2016 |
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Apr 15, 2016 03:28
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